Which Spells To Add? Spellblending Arcana, Your Magus, and You.


Advice


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The Spellblending Arcana seems like one of the potentially strongest the Magus class can take, if the right spells are selected to be added to the Magus list.

I am somewhat curious, at the various levels from cantrips to 6th level spells, what other Magus players consider "Must take" spells from Spellblending, or at least what spells if taken feed so well into the Magus's role they're best to have in your own book and not just left to hope a more dedicated casting class has and can cast on you.

I've read Walter's guide and this is one area it seems to sort of glance over, and while Trentmonks guide is all but a holy text, it's written from the perspective of a class staying out of combat and controlling it, where as the Magus is more of a get into it and be a part of it [let's face it, Ghoul Touch and Touch of Idocy alone from just the 2nd level spells have far more use to a Magus then a Wizard]

So... what spells do Magus players feel are "Must Have", "Want To Have", "Somewhat Useful To Have", or "Seems Useful But Really Useless To Have" from those gained via the Spellblending Arcana?
[Edit: Or, to a lesser related extent, via the Greater Spell Access ability, if you're one of the few games that plays that high level]


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I spellblended some spells with Magus and I can tell you some of the strongest are:

0 Touch of Fatigue,
1 Protection from Evil, Touch of Gracelessness
2 Ghoul's Touch, False Life, Communal Protection from Evil, Magic Circle of Protection, Resist Energy
3 Heroism (Wand), Twilight Knife, Communal Resist Energy
4 Enervation, Dimensional Anchor, Bestow Curse, Touch of Slime, Boneshatter, Hellfire Ray
5 Feeblemind, Contingency, Permanency
6 Summon Monster VI/Planar Binding, Cold Ice Strike (swift action), Greater Heroism,

If you have the Close Range Arcana, Touch of Fatigue translates into a free extra attack that stacks with Haste and Enervation becomes very handy. Other than that Heroism is a hard to beat buff to almost everything. Touch of Fatigue and Touch of Idiocy can crit through Spellstrike for they are damage as the rules mention, also they are very handy when fighting casters or creatures that have low desterity (dragons can be toned down a lot by Touch of Gracelessness and Ray of Enfeeblement in concert).

Also remember that you get to add spells from your Magus 19 level ability and you certainly want some Summon Monster VI for utility, Cold Ice Strike for its hiper cool swift action casting and Greater Heroism as it is one of the greatest buffs of the game. Also remember at level 5 Contingency is a game saver if planned correctly.

I dont recommend that you Spell Blend more than once in your career because most of those spells buffs you can easily do with Use Magic Device and a handy Wand (heroism and resist energy are great candidates for those).

Hope that helped your desition :)


Twilight knife has some nasty potential with spell combat...each round, you add another knife to the number of pointy things stabbing at him...


Twilight knife? You mean your flanking force flankers flank with your former force-flanking flankers?


Twilight knift should stack with itself since the effects do not need to stack. Usually when you cast, say, bull strength twice on a target, the effects don't stack because you have 2 spells giving the same bonus type. You still need to dispel both spells to remove the effect, though.

Twilight knife is different. The effects do not overlap, because each spell creates a new knife. So all your knives will be flanking with you (and it seems potentially each other since they don't need to be flanking with you). By round 5, you could stab a guy once, and have another 5 force knives stabbing him (with sneak attack) from the other side. The visual effect strikes me as rather cool too.


Flank force five? wasn't that the progenitor of the "kill bill" movies?


Can't go wrong with calcific touch.


Touch of Gracelessness + Calcific Touch is a Dragon Killer

Try Maximized/persistent Touch followed by Calcific Touch, downside is that you make a mess to get the character loot items because they get petrified :(


Vasantasena wrote:


0 Touch of Fatigue,
1 Protection from Evil, Touch of Gracelessness
2 Ghoul's Touch, False Life, Communal Protection from Evil, Magic Circle of Protection, Resist Energy
3 Heroism (Wand), Twilight Knife, Communal Resist Energy
4 Enervation, Dimensional Anchor, Bestow Curse, Touch of Slime, Boneshatter, Hellfire Ray
5 Feeblemind, Contingency, Permanency
6 Summon Monster VI/Planar Binding, Cold Ice Strike (swift action), Greater Heroism,

Excellent replies so far. I think this one from Vasantasena was the closest to what I'd had in mind from responders when I thought it would be nice for Magus players to have a thread like this to look to on the forums, specifically for this topic. However I'm not knocking the more spell specific replies. They weren't what I had in mind but i think they're a positive addition so far to this thread.

So far from the list I'd made, Touch of Idocy is the only spell I had down that's not on yours above, although so far I've only made it through the Core and APG, not UM or UC yet. I've found it useful against certain casting creatures that Ghoul Touch is unlikely/unable to land on.


I would add a few spells to Vasantasena's list.

level-0:
Root- Not Pathfinder society legal but, useful for a 3/4ths BAB class with low CMD against trippers.

level-1:
Liberating Command - Cast as an immediate action and can be done while grappled. A 3/4ths BAB class has below fighter CMD and grappling screws a caster very nice to have when you need it.
Ear Piercing Scream- Sonic damage is nice for resistance purposes, dazing your foe is the icing on the cake.
Disguise Self - Great utility Magi's need more utility spells.

Level-2:
Touch of idiocy - Circumstantial but good. When fighting a caster a 2nd level spell and a failed save removes spells he can cast per day. Hold the charge and combine it with spell strike with a readied action to stab when he's casting for a nice effect.

Level-3:
Invisibility Sphere - As good as invisibility, but fun for the whole party. Nice utility and worth a 3rd level spell slot.

There's probably more, but at a glance that's all I can think of. Calcific touch + Touch of Gracelessness is also a pretty amazing combo.


Touch of Gracelessness seems almost too good to be true - clarify how it works?

Spell Combat with a level 2-7 Magus (presuming only 1 attack normally).
Cast ToG, get free attack and deliver through spellstrike. Your 2nd regular attack also delivers it because your weapon is charged with the spell still?


Resinous Skin is a solid 3rd-level spell for a magus. Long duration, DR 5/piercing, +4 to resist disarms, some grapple resistance, plus any weapon striking you can get stuck. Free disarms on your opponents' turns based on their Ref saves is worth a 3rd-level spell slot, the rest is just icing.

Fleshworm Infestation is a solid pickup for 4th level if you're looking for more touch attacks. Potential Dex damage and staggering every round after you hit with it.


dunebugg wrote:

Touch of Gracelessness seems almost too good to be true - clarify how it works?

Spell Combat with a level 2-7 Magus (presuming only 1 attack normally).
Cast ToG, get free attack and deliver through spellstrike. Your 2nd regular attack also delivers it because your weapon is charged with the spell still?

Aren't you referring the Calcific touch? As far as I can see, touch of gracelessness does not have multiple charges, so it would get discharged on the first successful hit (and that's it)

Calcific touch clarifies that you can only do Dex damage once per turn. But that is still amazing to me. "congratulations, for the next 11 turns you get an extra attack with your melee weapon that deals damage and DEX damage. go ahead and enjoy"

(11 would be the earliest you could get this through feat->extra arcana->spell blending)

Can you use spell combat to cast other spells while you are holding multiple charges from a previous spell? Does it matter if the new spell does not have a touch attack?


Drothmal wrote:
dunebugg wrote:

Touch of Gracelessness seems almost too good to be true - clarify how it works?

Spell Combat with a level 2-7 Magus (presuming only 1 attack normally).
Cast ToG, get free attack and deliver through spellstrike. Your 2nd regular attack also delivers it because your weapon is charged with the spell still?

Aren't you referring the Calcific touch? As far as I can see, touch of gracelessness does not have multiple charges, so it would get discharged on the first successful hit (and that's it)

...
Can you use spell combat to cast other spells while you are holding multiple charges from a previous spell? Does it matter if the new spell does not have a touch attack?

I'm reading it differently - anything that discharges after a single attack usually has a duration of Instantaneous, while ToG has a duration of rounds/level.

And as soon as you cast a spell (whether it's a touch spell or not) you lose a held touch spell. I get around it by having frostbite pre-cast for an initial hit, and then use Spell Combat in the 2nd round and I cast Shocking Grasp last.


Touch of Gracelessness give 1 penalty that lasts for rounds/level.


galahad2112 wrote:
Touch of Gracelessness give 1 penalty that lasts for rounds/level.

this was also my interpretation


FiddlersGreen wrote:

Twilight knift should stack with itself since the effects do not need to stack. Usually when you cast, say, bull strength twice on a target, the effects don't stack because you have 2 spells giving the same bonus type. You still need to dispel both spells to remove the effect, though.

Twilight knife is different. The effects do not overlap, because each spell creates a new knife. So all your knives will be flanking with you (and it seems potentially each other since they don't need to be flanking with you). By round 5, you could stab a guy once, and have another 5 force knives stabbing him (with sneak attack) from the other side. The visual effect strikes me as rather cool too.

As a GM, I wouldn't allow more than 1 knife per square. Multiple knives, sure, if you want to burn your slots on that, but only one gets sneak. Maybe 2 if you're enlarged and fighting a bigger enemy.


Just a comparison of Calcific Touch vs Fleshworm Infestation:

CT is going to be doing 1d4 Dex damage once per round with a touch attack, potentially slowing if the target fails a Fort save. FI is going to be doing 2 Dex, 1d6 hp and staggering if the target fails a Fort save, sickening the target even if it succeeds. CT probably comes ahead on that point because its Dex damage is no-save.

However, the big difference between the spells is that CT is one you must hold the charge while using whereas FI is a fire-and-forget touch attack. FI will continue to chew at your opponent every round after a successful hit, while you cast other spells etc. CT has the better spell economy because you can use it with spell combat for many rounds, but if you're going nova then FI is a better opener to use.


All this talk of Calcific Touch has thrown me for a loop when I re-read Calcific touch.

PRD Calcific Touch wrote:
Your touch progressively transmutes the substance of creatures you touch into stone. Once per round, you may deliver a touch attack that inflicts 1d4 points of Dexterity damage and slows the target (as the spell) for 1 round. A successful Fortitude save negates the slow effect but not the ability damage. A target reduced to 0 Dexterity is petrified permanently. Break enchantment, restoration, or stone to flesh can reverse the effects of calcific touch.

The part that doesn't sit well with me is the DEX damage.

PRD Ability Damage, Drain, and Penalty wrote:

Diseases, poisons, spells, and other abilities can all deal damage directly to your ability scores. This damage does not actually reduce an ability, but it does apply a penalty to the skills and statistics that are based on that ability.

For every 2 points of damage you take to a single ability, apply a –1 penalty to skills and statistics listed with the relevant ability. If the amount of ability damage you have taken equals or exceeds your ability score, you immediately fall unconscious until the damage is less than your ability score.

So reading as RAW calcific touch would never reduce an ability score to 0 and thus never petrify a creature on it's own without a source of ability drain. I did a little digging and supposedly RAI from the developer who wrote the spell from a post made a little over a year ago implies it should petrify targeted creature in the same manner that damage that exceeds an ability score causes a creature to fall unconscious.

Probably something to keep in mind.


Fleshworm infestation is pretty beastly. This is the first I've heard of that spell. What is the general concensus on the summon monster spells? Obviously a magus's summonings can't compete with those of casters with all 9 tiers of spells, but a meat shield that can help set up flanks is always handy. I was also debating golden lion figurines.


Summon Spells can be very good, but as a Magus you'd give up a round of spellcombat to cast them.

The lvl IV, V and VI lists are all pretty nice, though the direct combat creatures will fall quickly at the levels you can get them. But you can get some use of the SLAs, I guess - especially if you have time to summon just before combat starts. And you can even summon a Bard.


Corlindale wrote:

The lvl IV, V and VI lists are all pretty nice, though the direct combat creatures will fall quickly at the levels you can get them. But you can get some use of the SLAs, I guess - especially if you have time to summon just before combat starts.

I don't think anyone will argue with VI, but IV and V, I'm not disagreeing, but do you think that's worth an Arcana? Can I inquire your logic behind that? [I guess maybe V I could see, for 1/2 the reason I list below]

Corlindale wrote:


And you can even summon a Bard.

That's what Vas and I were thinking earlier when we both had it on our seperate lists, also using it to summon multiple Bralani's is some damn fine healing to a class that normally goes without (2xCSW a day per, avg of 2 summoned).

One other 1st level spell I almost always take is Charm Person. While a Magus is certainly not a "Face" character, I've found it so useful for RP reasons it never hurts to have, and to be honest the times I've been seperated from my group are the times I've needed it most (and the times I can't depend on someone else to have it).
I'm not big on taking utility spells... I feel that's pure casters role, unless it's a combat utility spell... but I make a personal exception for CP (though I won't argue it's logicial, just to me, useful given my regular GM's and groups.)


Lillend Azatas (healing bards) are devastating for the buffs, the combat healing and Bardic Performance.

But also summoning 1d4+1 Bralanis rocks the house. Not to mention they can be a bothering flanking ally.


ShoulderPatch wrote:

also using it to summon multiple Bralani's is some damn fine healing to a class that normally goes without (2xCSW a day per, avg of 2 summoned).

Vasantasena wrote:

Lillend Azatas (healing bards) are devastating for the buffs, the combat healing and Bardic Performance.

But also summoning 1d4+1 Bralanis rocks the house. Not to mention they can be a bothering flanking ally.

I believe it's d3 (d6/2, ru) not d4+1 isn't it?

Summon Monster (X) to summon from (X) list = 1
Summon Monster (X) to summon from (X-1) list = d3 [Bralani via SM VI]
Summong Monster (X) to summon from (X-2 or lwr) = d4+1


Oh right right yes 1d3, very optimal still, and helpful when in need of healing.


0-Level: I play at a Table with a GM who allows the Arcane Mark option, so I never really looked at any of these as being worth a feat or arcana slot.

1st Level: Protection from Evil- Because a dominated Magus is almost as bad for the rest of the party as a dominated barbarian, and you're likely to be closer to the barbarian when it happens than the wizard. Also Unprepared Combatant, for those high init enemies, or as preparation for hurling some fireballs.

2nd Level: Resist Energy for when your enemies are throwing fireballs. Touch of Idiocy but it might be a group specific thing that my magus is always the one expected to close with and kill the enemy casters before they ruin our day. Ghoul Touch is another fun one, as the default magus list is a bit shy on things which can take an enemy out of the battle as quickly.

3rd Level: Communal Resist Energy but only if I didn't take resist energy above. BlackLight is always fun to cast on yourself, or better yet your sword sheath or something similar you can drop and pick back up, particularly if your concept calls for a stealthy sort of magus. Call the Void is another one I'm a fan of. Duration based damage over time and limitations for the enemies within melee range of me? Yes please! Channel the Gift is another one I like, if I'm in a party with full spell caster. It's excellent for a magus to take, because it lets you basically extend your spell recall class feature to everyone's 3rd level and lower spells. Excruciating Deformation is also very good, and virtually tailor made to work with spell combat. Touch Attack that does HP, Con, and Dex damage all over time? Yeah, I like the sound of that. Sands of Time if my GM is a fan of Constructs for enemies (since it's a touch attack that can specifically damage any of them).

4th Level:Named Bullet because you should always have a plan for ranged fighting (in case you can't avoid it), and being able to turn the cheap dagger on your belt into a ranged touch attack that ignores DR and deals +10 damage (that is multiplied on a critical) is a better back up plan than most. True Form is kind of campaign specific, but in a campaign where you're facing a lot of shape changers it can be worth it. Dimensional Anchor. Monstrous Physique II

5th Level: Hostile Juxtaposition, Suffocation[i]

6th Level: I'm a fan of [i]Disintegrate here, because it's useful for getting out of all sorts of force effects (which are one of the best ways to trap a magus), removing walls that are put in your way, and generally making your enemies cry. Sure, it wouldn't be recommended for a wizard, but your spell choices are informed by different concerns. Greater Named Bullet for all the same reasons as it's little brother. Circle of Death.


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Okay...*raises dead thread*

Been a couple years, any new gems that you folks would add with Spellblending? :)


Most the time, you'll get more varied spell use out of taking Close Range, and enjoying spellstriking with the multitude of awesome ranged touch spells already on the magus spell list.
0 - Acid Splash - 1d3 Acid Damage
0 - Disrupt Undead - 1d6 vs Undead
0 - Ray of Frost - 1d3 Cold Damage
1 - Ray of Enfeeblement - 1d6+(1/2 lvl) Strength damage
2 - Acid Arrow - 2d4 + (2d4/3 lvl lingernig)
2 - Scorching Ray - 4d6 Fire Damage (criting this is insane)

and so on. ranged touch spells, because of the to hit 'penalty' are insanely powerful for their level. To be able to apply them through a easy-critting keen scimitar is insane.

Also, the addition of the extra rays at 0 level gives the extra attack benefit every round of combat. This makes Close Range likely one of the best magus arcana available.

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