There is a samurai archetype that trades the mount in. Other than that I would get a two handed weapon I can use when not mounted. I am assuming you will have power attack anyway so you should be ok. You won't compete with barbarians and fighters, but you will be respectable when it comes to damage.
I haven't checked out that new dragon empire companion book with swordsaint yet, looking forward to checking it out.
There's the Musketeer archetype that trades it in altogether, and I believe the Emissary gives some unmounted options.
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Musketeer gets rid of the useless horse.
In my house rules, the standard bearer archetype gets a weapon bond similar to the paladin's weapon bond but with a subset of martially themed weapon properties (also, its an Su power) at 4th instead of a mount. I also allow cavalier's charge to work unmounted.
I'm really not trying to be a jerk, but I'm confused...
If you don't want a mount, why are you playing a cavalier?
Isn't that like the whole point of the cavalier?
That's almost like saying I want to play a wizard that doesn't use spells. Ok, maybe not that extreme, but still.
I find that the Transformative weapon property is good for circumstances like these. Turn your Lance into a Greatsword when you're not mounted. You also don't loose any weapon bonuses for the most part, and it doesn't count toward your total enhancement bonus since its a flat cost to add to the weapon.
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I'm really not trying to be a jerk, but I'm confused...
If you don't want a mount, why are you playing a cavalier?
Isn't that like the whole point of the cavalier?That's almost like saying I want to play a wizard that doesn't use spells. Ok, maybe not that extreme, but still.
The reason I want to play a cavalier is for the banner, the tactician ability, and all the teamwork feats. I want to be able to inspire my party to feats of martial prowess and wallop enemies while waving my patron's sigil. I want to be able to use all the cool powers of belonging to a chivalric order. Those are my points for playing a cavalier. Having a large sized creature that is useless indoors or in subterranean or extraplanar or steep mountainsides being a core component of your class is crap.
A paladin can summon his mount from anywhere, magically. "Patsy, wait here while I climb this sheer cliff." 3 Hours later "*Magic Whistle*" *clop clop clop* "Welcome to the top of the cliff Patsy!"
A cavalier's mount is just a smart horse. It can't climb the mountain side, it can't cross the rope bridge, it can't squeeze in the 3' x 3' hole where you need to go to rescue the princess. Having 1/2 of your class being tethered to a useless feature is counter intuitive to all the smart design choices that Paizo employs.
I'm really not trying to be a jerk, but I'm confused...
If you don't want a mount, why are you playing a cavalier?
Isn't that like the whole point of the cavalier?That's almost like saying I want to play a wizard that doesn't use spells. Ok, maybe not that extreme, but still.
The reason I want to play a cavalier is for the banner, the tactician ability, and all the teamwork feats. I want to be able to inspire my party to feats of martial prowess and wallop enemies while waving my patron's sigil. I want to be able to use all the cool powers of belonging to a chivalric order. Those are my points for playing a cavalier. Having a large sized creature that is useless indoors or in subterranean or extraplanar or steep mountainsides being a core component of your class is crap.
A paladin can summon his mount from anywhere, magically. "Patsy, wait here while I climb this sheer cliff." 3 Hours later "*Magic Whistle*" *clop clop clop* "Welcome to the top of the cliff Patsy!"
A cavalier's mount is just a smart horse. It can't climb the mountain side, it can't cross the rope bridge, it can't squeeze in the 3' x 3' hole where you need to go to rescue the princess. Having 1/2 of your class being tethered to a useless feature is counter intuitive to all the smart design choices that Paizo employs.
Hey, there. One of the things we've done is given the cavalier an item gifted to them through their order. The item may be most anything, so long as it's significant to that group. This item acts otherwise identically as the paladin's mount-summon ability.
The aim of this is to provide some flexibility, while also:
- Providing some incentive to stay within one order (if you change orders, you would need to get a new item with a new insignia)
- Offering the cavalier some flexiblity
- Doing so in such a way that does not turn the cavalier into a "magical" class; the item performs the magic
If this is not for PFS, it might be an item you could float by your DM.
Yes, cavalier really needs an option to trade in the mount. He has lots of fine abilities that are not mount-related.
I would say trade in the mount abilities for shield bash feats.
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I play a cavalier and have had good success 'without' a mount.
I do in fact use the mount.. it's just rarely riding it. I took the trait to make UMD a class skill & have a few scrolls of spider climb and reduce animal so that the horse is able to join me effectively even on underground expeditions (not sure how often that happens in CR, though)
Once you get enough levels to boost the mount to int 3, you can teach it Teamwork feats and synergizes rather well with your tactician ability. (mount is flanking and knows same tmwk feats you do, don't need to burn a use of the ability!)
One doesn't have to invest in the mounted combat/ride by atk/spirited charge feats in order to play a cavalier. The class abilities you get for free already make you a viable mounted combatant.. and if you pick feats that work whether mounted or not, you're not hamstrung in the majority of time it is impossible (or inappropriate) to ride. I went with the power attack chain.. two handed weapon hits with cavalier's challenge.. things don't stay up for long and I'm not built around a mounted charge.
I also like the amount of skill points. My cavalier is equal parts melee combatant and 'face' character for a party.
Kudos to you for not wanting to play a halfling or gnome cavalier ;) Down with cheese! Play regluar sized cavaliers at every turn!
Here's an idea: give cavaliers the option of taking a bonus combat feat instead of the mount-related abilities.
I don't see a halfling cavalier as cheese. When I think halfling, I think slingers and outriders. That fits quite well.
As LazarX hinted at, you aren't just giving up a horsie. You're giving up 3 attacks a round (huge at early levels), enhanced mobility, the possibility of other mounts, free storage, and some other things. Plus, it doesn't have to be a horse. It can be any other ride-able animal companion, with GM's permission.
But...If your GM allows it, this PDF has a mount-less cavalier that's all about helping allies out (and can get into Battle Herald with levels in just one class). As a disclaimer, I wrote it. But it was made for the very reason you mentioned, Kyle.
Super Genius Game's War Master does a very similar thing to what you want, just without challenge. The guy who made that, Owen KC Stephens, has done a lot of work for Paizo and SKR recommends that stuff.
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There is a samurai archetype that trades the mount in. Other than that I would get a two handed weapon I can use when not mounted. I am assuming you will have power attack anyway so you should be ok. You won't compete with barbarians and fighters, but you will be respectable when it comes to damage.
Samurai do not forfeit mount.
As a PFS samurai who is dismounted about 90% of the time (due to the nature of PFS modules, and me being short of the level necessary for easily purchasing wands of Reduced Animal and Spider Climb), I'll take that Challenge is extraordinarily effective when combined with crit-fishing tactics (i.e., TWF with high-threat weapons). Around 7th or 8th, you'll eclipse a fighter's output even though you have fewer feats.
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The Sword Saint Archetype does not have a mount. Instead, it practices iaijutsu, which is a reasonable ability as well. Ridiculously underpowered compared to an animal companion, but some people just can't stand the mount.
Not even when one can just take beast rider and pick from one of the cheesy druid options. No need to ever be mounted either, since some of the stuff on that list works better without a puny rider messing with their thang.
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The Sword Saint Archetype does not have a mount. Instead, it practices iaijutsu, which is a reasonable ability as well. Ridiculously underpowered compared to an animal companion, but some people just can't stand the mount.
Not even when one can just take beast rider and pick from one of the cheesy druid options. No need to ever be mounted either, since some of the stuff on that list works better without a puny rider messing with their thang.
A mount class with a four-level dip into Sohei (for Monastic Mount) can do some really awesome stuff.
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A cavalier's mount is just a smart horse. It can't climb the mountain side, it can't cross the rope bridge, it can't squeeze in the 3' x 3' hole where you need to go to rescue the princess. Having 1/2 of your class being tethered to a useless feature is counter intuitive to all the smart design choices that Paizo employs.Actually it's an extremely durable smart horse which gets more powerful as you level up. Remember it's not just a nag it's the equivalent of an animal companion as per a druid of your level.
But the difference is a druid who does not want an animal companion (read: any druid I and a lot of folks I know play) can still take a nature theme domain instead. A paladin who does not want the annoying magic horse can get a wicked weapon booster instead. A wizard can take a bonded item instead of a easy to kill +2 skill bonus. A summoner can make himself a mecha (synthesist) instead of adding the extra party member. A ranger can form a close bond with his allies instead of gaining a delayed follower.
A witch and a cavalier are the only two 'pet' classes to be shoehorned into having to have their pets. A witch can buy a familiar pocket or some other similar familiar hiding item, and still function perfectly. A cavalier, however, loses 1/3 of his main class abilities if he's not riding his horse.
Paizo has added a way for folks who hate 'pet' classes (like myself) to play those classes without the pets, but with the cav, I can't do that w/o going to house rules or a 3rd party publication.
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A witch and a cavalier are the only two 'pet' classes to be shoehorned into having to have their pets. A witch can buy a familiar pocket or some other similar familiar hiding item, and still function perfectly. A cavalier, however, loses 1/3 of his main class abilities if he's not riding his horse.
As mentioned already, the Musketeer archetype trades mount for a firearm/ It also grants freebie archery feats (for guns), and stacks/counts with/as fighter for purposes of weapon spec, etc.