The somewhat anecdotal sales data and the huge emphasis on modularity in Legends & Lore articles are what lead me to believe that 5E will be aimed on reuniting the fan-base of the various editions.
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Things change. All things.
Pathfinder itself will change. They won't stay good forever and one day they'll make a big mistake and people will leave in droves, particularly if something new and good has just arrived.
I will look at D&D5 and see if it's any good, and if it is and if Pathfinder is getting tired, then I'll probably move back to D&D. Most people will despite their professed loyalties. They'll play what their friends play.
I was with you right up until that last part.
That really sounds like what a fair amount of the rabid pro 4E people were saying to people like me who were still playing 3.5 (pre-Pathfinder). I find it a little offensive that the implication there is close to "you'll play D&D and like it because it's the 800lb gorilla and everyone else is going to be playing it so what choice do you have?"
I have plenty of choices, including walking away from RPG's altogether, which is what I almost did if not for Pathfinder.
If Pathfinder 2.0 is bad, I'll keep playing Pathfinder 1.0. I'll probably keep buying map packs and cards and such.
But WOTC gets none of my money unless what they come up with is simply AMAZING. While I'm a huge fan of Monte Cook's I'm not a huge fan of Mike Mearls or 4E. There are parts of 4E that I like but there's more that I dont and if 5E (or whatever they'll be calling it) is still using the 4E chassis then I can tell you right now that I'll take a pass.
WOTC did a great job of alienating a fair amount of their fans. While I dont hate them or have the rabid anger toward them that a few people do, I'm not eager to give them my money anymore. It's gonna take a lot for me to come back into the fold and honestly I dont think they'll be able to get me to come back.
I trust the leadership at Paizo and they havent let me down in a big way so far. On the contrary WOTC has disappointed me quite a bit, on a few occasions. So there's that.
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I have avoided much of the 4e discussions thus far, but I feel obliged to make some points that haven't been hit upon yet.
Paizo isn't going to lose customers when or if 5e comes out. When I was a youth and spent tons of my money on RPG's, it didn't matter which one I was playing, I still bought many others. If it was a good game, it got my income. There may be a slump in sales as people try out the new edition, but ultimately there are a lot more incentives to stay playing Pathfinder. Too many in fact to mention here. 5e really needs to roll up an amazing product to earn my dollars again.
As a business owner and third party publisher for Pathfinder (TPK Games), I have zero incentive to switch to any WotC product because of their ridiculously draconian internet sales policy and lack of OGL support. One of our business goals is to travel the convention scene and *create* new gamers. We don’t just go to game conventions, we travel to all of the Midwest anime, gaming and sci-fi cons that we can. We are demoing roleplaying games and getting people interested in the hobby, and of course our products.
So, while WotC might not care, I suspect Paizo does as we are making hundreds of new Pathfinder fans every year, and exposing a lot more people to tabletop gaming – taking away the mystique and taboo that some people thought about tabletop gaming. Believe me, when people come back to play in our games and skip the Magic tournaments that they paid to play in… it means something.
Don't get me wrong, I understand the need to support your FLGS. But they could have easily just mandated a MSRP limitation as opposed to a zero sales policy. It's just about the dumbest policy I have ever seen.
I also think that 4e fans are going to feel suckered. They spent a lot of money on that edition, only to have it drowned and a new pseudo edition put forth (Essentials). Then, we will scrap both and attempt another new edition, that may or may not even be a real edition? I’d not be very pleased no matter what in that scenario.
Paizo makes great material. It really is a good game. The company also obviously cares about and supports their fans and fellow publishers. They are not likely to lose any customers at all. People may double dip, but that is *if* and only *if* WotC can produce a game of equal or better quality. The odds are stacked entirely against WotC in my opinion. Still, I loved D&D for ages and I wish them well.
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This thread should be closed as ridiculous and unproductive.
My guess is that WoTC will go heavily digital with the next version, and that they'll go a DIVX-like route of DRM, where you subscribe to the material rather than purchasing it, and they can take it back.And people would trust them enough to subscribe to something like this?
I know I wouldn't.
In fact, I probably wouldn't trust Paizo if they did something like that. But then again, it would be unlike Paizo to do something like that.
Heck WoTC is pretty darn close to that NOW. That was why I wrote to them and demanded a refund of my Insider subscription - they went from an app you could download and use to that online only thing. And in the major local con we used to run, there was no 'Net access, making it worthless for the very thing I subscribed to it for.
This thread should be closed as ridiculous and unproductive.Truer words never spoken.
Oh, I'm sure it is pointless ... but I'd rather have one thread than have new threads sprouting up endlessly.
Actually they changed the app when they realized that people were only subscribing one month out of three or four to download the updates and then canceling thier subscription until the next book info that they wanted came out.Heck WoTC is pretty darn close to that NOW. That was why I wrote to them and demanded a refund of my Insider subscription - they went from an app you could download and use to that online only thing. And in the major local con we used to run, there was no 'Net access, making it worthless for the very thing I subscribed to it for.
Don't care why they changed it. My point is that essentially it's a form of DRM. You only have access to the tools and content while you have a subscription, after which they all just go away, regardless of how much money you poured into it.
No thanks.
Heck, I don't even trust Dropbox, and in theory that's on MY disk.
This thread should be closed as ridiculous and unproductive.
I'm wondering why someone would: 1)Take the time to tell people that their banter was ridiculous and unproductive (if it's so ridiculous just leave) and 2)say that, and subsequently respond to posts in that same thread. If it's ridiculous and unproductive, then your response to anything past the point of calling it ridiculous and unproductive only labels you yourself as a participant in something that is ridiculous and unproductive. Why not just call it ridiculous and unproductive, cut your losses for reading however much you read, and never come back? Unless you like arguing the ridiculous and don't care whether or not your arguments are unproductive. Besides, there are thousands of threads on these forums that are designed to be ridiculous and unproductive. Pointing that out like it's new information is itself a little ridiculous and unproductive. Ahhh, the palpable irony.
This thread should be closed as ridiculous and unproductive.I'm wondering why someone would: 1)Take the time to tell people that their banter was ridiculous and unproductive (if it's so ridiculous just leave) and 2)say that, and subsequently respond to posts in that same thread. If it's ridiculous and unproductive, then your response to anything past the point of calling it ridiculous and unproductive only labels you yourself as a participant in something that is ridiculous and unproductive. Why not just call it ridiculous and unproductive, cut your losses for reading however much you read, and never come back? Unless you like arguing the ridiculous and don't care whether or not your arguments are unproductive. Besides, there are thousands of threads on these forums that are designed to be ridiculous and unproductive. Pointing that out like it's new information is itself a little ridiculous and unproductive. Ahhh, the palpable irony.
Except this clearly is NOT designed to be ridiculous and unproductive. It just IS. Furthermore, it inherently leads to the inciting of the editions flamewar that is constantly smoldering. And also, I'm pretty sure it is in the wrong forum.
And if there are threads designed to be ridiculous and unproductive (ie, known to all within), how is it an insult to accuse someone of involving themselves in something ridiculous and unproductive?
This thread should be closed as ridiculous and unproductive.I'm wondering why someone would: 1)Take the time to tell people that their banter was ridiculous and unproductive (if it's so ridiculous just leave) and 2)say that, and subsequently respond to posts in that same thread. If it's ridiculous and unproductive, then your response to anything past the point of calling it ridiculous and unproductive only labels you yourself as a participant in something that is ridiculous and unproductive. Why not just call it ridiculous and unproductive, cut your losses for reading however much you read, and never come back? Unless you like arguing the ridiculous and don't care whether or not your arguments are unproductive. Besides, there are thousands of threads on these forums that are designed to be ridiculous and unproductive. Pointing that out like it's new information is itself a little ridiculous and unproductive. Ahhh, the palpable irony.Except this clearly is NOT designed to be ridiculous and unproductive. It just IS. Furthermore, it inherently leads to the inciting of the editions flamewar that is constantly smoldering. And also, I'm pretty sure it is in the wrong forum.
And if there are threads designed to be ridiculous and unproductive (ie, known to all within), how is it an insult to accuse someone of involving themselves in something ridiculous and unproductive?
I'd have to disagree with you. The OP asked for speculation. All speculation is ridiculous and unproductive because you're making guesses about what might happen in the future. I might win the lottery, of course I'd have to buy a ticket first.
Also I never said it was an insult. I just said pointing it out is likewise ridiculous and likewise unproductive. I personally love things that are ridiculous and unproductive, so I would never want to see something squashed (or closed) purely based on those two premises.
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Personally I dont think paizo has to do anything specific. They have succeeded because they had a good model (relatively slow release of rpg material with lots of 3rd party support and a large collection of setting and adventure based material).
They dont need to alter this to compete with a 5th edition of dnd by wizards of the coast. In fact I think they are better served to wait and see what happens. Paizo doesn't have big hasbro execs breathing down their necks. They have Lisa, who from what I heard in a recording of a seminar she gave does this primarily because she loves it. She is producing the product she WANTS to produce, not the one she NEEDS to produce.
There really isn't a need for edition wars anymore. Whatever the outcome of 5E the reality is theres alot of room in the rpg world. I at least am confident that paizo can succeed in the face of changes in the industry because they are good people, and they have built a loyalty with their customers.
Not sure when 5E would come out but I've spent lot of money on PF, going to continue with that assuming the books are thier.
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Removed a post. Let's not be crude, and this is another reminder to not turn this thread into another pointless discussion about which edition is better.
Personally I dont think paizo has to do anything specific. They have succeeded because they had a good model (relatively slow release of rpg material with lots of 3rd party support and a large collection of setting and adventure based material).
They dont need to alter this to compete with a 5th edition of dnd by wizards of the coast. In fact I think they are better served to wait and see what happens. Paizo doesn't have big hasbro execs breathing down their necks. They have Lisa, who from what I heard in a recording of a seminar she gave does this primarily because she loves it. She is producing the product she WANTS to produce, not the one she NEEDS to produce.
There really isn't a need for edition wars anymore. Whatever the outcome of 5E the reality is theres alot of room in the rpg world. I at least am confident that paizo can succeed in the face of changes in the industry because they are good people, and they have built a loyalty with their customers.
+1
There really isnt a need for the edition wars. Tere' room for everyone,currently Paizo exhudes the aura of "a local store around the corner" where WOTC is seen as a distnt corporate entity. Both can and have put out good products.
Paizo has about 30 employees, eans a little over $200k a month(most months) and serves a niche in a niche hobby. Lets just enjoy it show our kids, nephews and nieces and see if we can help grow the game.
Paizo has about 30 employees, eans a little over $200k a month(most months)everything posted in here is going to be pure speculation, based on pure speculation.
LOL! This is why i love U guys!!
Dunno if 5th edition D&D is anywhere close or not, but I would hope for the sake of those who like 4th edition D&D that it is an evolution of that system and not an attempt to recapture the old guard.
One of the nice things about the current market is that there are two big fantasy RPGs that each have their merits but appeal to different audiences (although I'm sure there's a good amount of crossover appeal as well). And at this point, even if a new edition of D&D went back to the style and gameplay feel of 3rd edition, it wouldn't be enough to lure me away from Pathfinder unless it was significantly better. Even if Paizo suddenly lost their marbles and created a 2nd edition of Pathfinder that was totally abysmal in terms of quality, I wouldn't automatically hop back to D&D, because all the old Pathfinder stuff is still there and playable.
I went from basic D&D to 2nd edition AD&D because I saw the latter as an improvement. I went from AD&D to 3rd edition D&D because the latter was an improvement. When 4th edition came out, I saw that it wasn't for me and whiled away my time with 3rd edition under Pathfinder came along and was a marked improvement. I'm not going to jump to a new edition of anything unless it's a lot better than what I'm playing right now or unless it fills a new niche. Given that, I'd actually be more likely to try out a 5th edition D&D if it continued being a significantly different experience rather than if it tried to muscle in on what is now Pathfinder's territory.
Whatever is going on at WotC or Paizo, I hope each one continues doing their thing. Let 3rd edition be the fork in the road, and let's see where each path takes the two top RPGs in the industry.
Without having read the entire thread, here are my thoughts. I doubt there would be much conflict.
WotC is focusing on digital content, and I suspect that 5E would enhance that focus even farther, quite possibly to the point where the only printed material they have is a starter box, a very basic book for players and use at the table (that contains races, classes, equipment, and other basics like common combat rules, feats, and skills), and accessories like tokens, minis, dice, map tiles, and other support materials. Everything else will likely be just online or, at most, on controllable pdfs.
Paizo, on the other hand, is focused on quality print material, with the online PRD as being important, but not the focus. To them, the ruleset isn't what makes them money, its the presentation of quality material based on the ruleset, so printed or pdf adventures, supplements, and other books will continue to be critical to Paizo's success.
The only place the two companies might intersect would be if WotC rethought their stance on pdfs. Otherwise, I suspect that Paizo will continue to build off of PF, and WotC will continue to build off of 4E. If either company did anything else, it would just hurt them. While the idea of reuniting the fractured player base under a single banner sounds good, it's not really ultimately in WotC's best interest to reopen up the license to the degree that most former supporters would be looking for. Nor could Paizo thrive under the kind of licenses required to protect the ruleset itself.
I wonder if I should just start making wild, illogical predictions that sound reasonable if you don't think about them too hard.
I wonder if I should just start making wild, illogical predictions that sound reasonable if you don't think about them too hard.
There you go! That's the spirit! :-)
Since Paizo plans to do new editions about once a decade, we really don't have to worry about what Pathfinder 5E is going to look like in 2050. The real question is, will we finally have flying cars by then?
;)
Anybody else think that '5e' just looks wrong? 3 is a magical number, 4 is a symmetrical number, 5 is just... odd.
A new edition of D&D? Boy did I learn my lesson with the last one. I spent all the time leading up to the announcement of 4e denying any chance of a new edition, then gobbled it up and sold all my 3.5 books just to learn that I hated 4e...
This time around, 5e would get my money so I can have the core books and say I have checked it out but Pathfinder has revived my inner child and I am more than happy to hang on their pant leg and call them Papa.
The only way that WoTC could get me back would be to erase what they did with 4e, keeping a few things from it that I enjoyed (savings throws, minions, movement, auto max damage on crits) and replaced the rest of it with an updated version of 3.5. I would welcome a collaboration with Paizo to make the product, and the rebirth of Dungeon and Dragon magazine, which was great cause it was more frequent than Kobold Quarterly. Other than that, WoTC should just bring D&D to a glorious end and go back to focusing on things they do well, like Magic the Gathering. RPG's are just not their strongest area.
Things change. All things.
Pathfinder itself will change. They won't stay good forever and one day they'll make a big mistake and people will leave in droves
Wrong. Not everything turns to s#*~ eventually.
Until they do a mistake big enough to cancel out their excellent track record, I will hold off on the condemnations.
I will look at D&D5 and see if it's any good, and if it is and if Pathfinder is getting tired, then I'll probably move back to D&D. Most people will despite their professed loyalties.
Again, until that happens, I remain entirely unconvinced.
But if D&D5 is good, then Paizo had better be at their peak. They'd probably want to release their 2nd edition AND make it better than D&D5.
That would be a good attempt to wipe out that track record, because they have stated repeatedly that they don't want to do that for some time yet. And people have stated repeatedly that they like it that way.
But even then, they may have to one day choose between an old and cheap fan base, or a new and rich fan base. I hope that day doesn't come too soon.
So we're cheap, eh?
Paizo has about 30 employees, eans a little over $200k a month(most months)everything posted in here is going to be pure speculation, based on pure speculation.
So you are going to deny that last month, you netted $207388.98?
So you are going to deny that last month, you netted $207388.98?Paizo has about 30 employees, eans a little over $200k a month(most months)everything posted in here is going to be pure speculation, based on pure speculation.
Where are you getting this kind of information on a private company??!!!
Or is that the joke?
I'm convinced that anything from Hasbro won't be OGL and will be overly-draconian in trying to protect it's IP.
That makes them a non-competitor and non-worry to Paizo in my opinion.
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I think Paizo is fine with their decision making process, and I find it hard to believe that if D&D made an excellent edition with easy access to 3PP, Paizo wouldn't be publishing D&D X material as well.I really REALLY doubt it. Paizo isn't just going to dump the Pathfinder RPG because WotC puts out a 5th edition. And why would they publish support for someone else's product when they could be supporting their own product instead?
You don't see Pepsi marketing Coke glasses and coasters.
Except Paizo is still using WotC's OGL as a business and publisher model. I don't think Paizo would abandon Pathfinder or stop publishing adventure modules, but if there was a place in the market for them to publish content under a new edition I don't see why they wouldn't. They certainly have the capacity. Let me put this a different way.
I am positive a large chunk of Paizo has played 4e, and they concluded to pursue the Pathfinder brand. If and when something new comes out from a publisher like WotC which significantly impacts their fan base, then the Paizo staff will play it, consider it, and make decisions at that time. I certainly don't think in the minds of any of Paizo's heads that Pathfinder is somehow now completely D&D exclusive.
If the opportunity presents, I strongly believe the two brands would be willing experience some kind of reconciliation. At least in terms of complimentary content if nothing else.
This would sound reasonable back when Paizo announced Pathfinder but I think times are quite different now. There has been a lot of effort put into Pathfinder and the fans love it. I dont know why they would want to spend the resources making products for two different games or even more resources to make different products for two games. Doesn't sound reasonable to me unless 5E somehow dominates Pathfinder after release and Pathfinder goes away. I find that unlikely but hey stranger things have happened.
I don't think Paizo would abandon Pathfinder or stop publishing adventure modules, but if there was a place in the market for them to publish content under a new edition I don't see why they wouldn't. They certainly have the capacity.
I disagree. Paizo has been struggling to stay on schedule since beginning the RPG line. Any resources they would apply to producing content for a hypothetical 5E would have to be taken away from one or more of their already existing lines.
I don't think Paizo would abandon Pathfinder or stop publishing adventure modules, but if there was a place in the market for them to publish content under a new edition I don't see why they wouldn't. They certainly have the capacity.I disagree. Paizo has been struggling to stay on schedule since beginning the RPG line. Any resources they would apply to producing content for a hypothetical 5E would have to be taken away from one or more of their already existing lines.
Yeah, the only reason I could see it making sense for them is if they decided to drop the RPG line completely (presumably meaning they all fell in love with 5th edition and decided they couldnt match it with PF2 which seems...unlikely).
I'm convinced that anything from Hasbro won't be OGL and will be overly-draconian in trying to protect it's IP.
That makes them a non-competitor and non-worry to Paizo in my opinion.
Not to mention you'll likely see the same books yet again:
Manual of the Planes
Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting
Draconomicon
Etc...
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The thing is Wotc is not the only company to do something similar. How many versions have we seen of Spycraft. Chaosium is releasing a new version of CoC next year. I'm not defending Wotc and dislike it when they release a new edtion yet lets not just point fingers at one company and attribute certain behavior to just one rpg company. And what do some expect of course they are going to rerlease the same books with a new edition. Look at Paizo. The Bestirary are not that differet from the 3.5 MM. They plan to release Epci and Psionic rules at a later date which will most likely have some material from the 3.5 versions. Micorsoft does the same thing whenever they release a new version of Windows. It makes no sense for a company not to promote products that will work with their new product. Sometimes I wonder if some on this board understand how business works. Or at the very least developing a new product.
As to 5E will keep an open mind until I see the finished product if a 5E ever comes out. I swore to have nothing to do with Paizo and PF and I not only have the core book and most of their supplements. I'm also running the Council of Theives AP. I also predict that a PF 2E will more than liekly be a new game. It makes no sense to have not 1 not 2 but three rpgs that fundametally the same. As your not going to sell as much imo.
I'm convinced that anything from Hasbro won't be OGL and will be overly-draconian in trying to protect it's IP.
That makes them a non-competitor and non-worry to Paizo in my opinion.
Not to mention you'll likely see the same books yet again:
Manual of the Planes
Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting
Draconomicon
Etc...
Yep. Which is to say, they aren't selling new stories & ideas (like they should be), but a new rules system. Most people don't place "Great Rules" as a top priority (Otherwise Hero Games would be in the top 3, IMO), just "Functional/Workable Rules" and a "Great Concept" (or story/'feel'/dynamism/etc).
Rehashing old concepts, without new story content/creativity, is what's killing WotC. A large portion of their latest better selling items have their non-mechanical roots in Greenwood's & Gygax's work decades ago (Neverwinter/Tomb of Horrors/et al).Do you think people were drawn to the Firefly/Serenity RPG because of its great rules? Or because of Whedon's work?
I've never heard Shadowrun praised for its better rules system, though I have met a person who converted Shadowrun to run on 3.x DnD.
I also hear praise for systems that have sheared away many of the rules and made their worlds/games more freeform.
Monte Cook is WotC's Whedon, brought in to inject new 'creative/campaign' life into the DnD line. I doubt he's there to inject 'new rules', except as they accentuate new creations. His 3.0 rules amplified the feel already in place, perhaps reflecting the shift from Tolkien fantasy to Feist/Salvatore fantasy (both based on DnD, both more action driven).
4.0 deviated from that in a misinterpretation that 'rules are primary', 'DnD has no contenders', 'locking out 3rd parties will amplify OUR customer base' and 'abandoning the core mythos is fine'.
Well, those have all proven false, and they've even fought to reclaim the mythos abandoned. Now, they pull in Monte, both rival and hero, essentially admitting defeat.
But I don't see how a 'DnD recharge' requires altering 4.0 and abandoning another set of customers. (How many of their own systems do they want to contend with?)
Nobody's going to believe any of the hype about a wonderful new '5.0', but a new campaign world by Monte Cook...I think even non-4.0 players will take notice. A new DnD module series...yep. I have some of his old Hero Games work, and the remarkable creativity still shines today.
With limited marketing, he has a strong following. Amplified by WotC's business arm, he may just pull off something we'll all like, not for its rules, but for its wonder. We may be drawn to 4.0 despite resenting it, simply to play in a great story. Or we just may adapt it over to PF too. :)
First, a disclaimer: I play and enjoy 4E (though not nearly as often or as much as 3.X and Pathfinder)
As far as Wizards of the Coast goes... they've treated me pretty badly, in terms of customer service. As a customer of theirs I've attempted to get help (through the official channels) multiple different times for multiple different things and been blown off for it.
With Paizo, though I don't get everything and I don't always get it right away, I get most of my questions answered... personally... and get them answered pretty quickly. That's incredible customer service.
I mean, it's kind of like going shopping at K-Mart verses Target (at least all of them that I've ever been to). In the one, they've got some good stuff and decent prices, but their service is just so awful that it's hard to continue to be a patron of theirs. The other is always so helpful that, even though it can be a bit expensive, you want to go to shop there, as everything is of a higher quality and cleaner.
In terms of any 5E that may-or-may-not be-forthcoming: I'd look at it, probably poke it a bit, see if it's any good. I'd almost certainly continue to play Pathfinder, regardless. 5E'd have to really surprise the daylights out of me, and, honestly, I just can't envision it happening. Besides, playing Pathfinder (and the company Paizo) allows me to be much more free, vocally, about my hobbies around some of my family who generally disapproves of the "devil-worshipping" dungeons and dragons stuff (I've given up on changing that track).
Hopefully, whatever happens, it'll be good for the industry as a whole, and bring more gamers into it!
I'm pretty happy with Paizo.
I don't see going back to WotC D&D unless they do an incredible job that includes bringing back the D&D magic system and designing adventures as well done as Paizo's adventure paths. I love adventure paths.
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Wrong. Not everything turns to s!@~ eventually.
Until they do a mistake big enough to cancel out their excellent track record, I will hold off on the condemnations.
That mistake need not, and if they handle it well, will not be the end of them. But they aren't perfect. And the fans who build Paizo up to be perfect will also be the ones to leave when they find out Paizo is fallable.
I will look at D&D5 and see if it's any good, and if it is and if Pathfinder is getting tired, then I'll probably move back to D&D. Most people will despite their professed loyalties.
Again, until that happens, I remain entirely unconvinced.
Gamers have been jumping ship since RPG's were invented. Just because PF is the best thing so far, does not preclude them jumping ship yet again in future.
But if D&D5 is good, then Paizo had better be at their peak. They'd probably want to release their 2nd edition AND make it better than D&D5.
That would be a good attempt to wipe out that track record, because they have stated repeatedly that they don't want to do that for some time yet. And people have stated repeatedly that they like it that way.
Again, PF isn't perfect. If D&D5 was Pathfinder but better, players will start using it. In this case, Paizo would want to get in a PF2 first. But missing this in no way means the end of Paizo and they could continue to produce sterling supplements and adventures.
But even then, they may have to one day choose between an old and cheap fan base, or a new and rich fan base. I hope that day doesn't come too soon.
So we're cheap, eh?
I'm unlikely to buy a third core rulebook off them :-)
Unless they (or someone else) brings new players into PF, their fan base will eventually die out. Paizo are currently having their time in the sun. If they're smart, they'll be prepared for when that time is up.But, ultimately, how should Paizo respond to D&D5?
By being better. :-)
Hypothetical 5E certainly gets my money for core, but they have to fit somewhere into Paizo release schedule, for I'm not going to miss AP, Setting or companion PDF that catches my eye (getting printed books in here is rather expensive because of shipment and customs). And of course I want my subscription core books sent here.
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"I don't know what kind of dices or cards D&D5E will be played with, but D&D6E will be played with sticks and stones"
-Some silly guy
That mistake need not, and if they handle it well, will not be the end of them. But they aren't perfect. And the fans who build Paizo up to be perfect will also be the ones to leave when they find out Paizo is fallable.
Wrong. Not everything turns to s!@~ eventually.
Until they do a mistake big enough to cancel out their excellent track record, I will hold off on the condemnations.
Sure, that might happen. So they will jump ship. All five of them. Paizo won't even notice.
The rest who doesn't think they're "perfect" but thinks they did well enough to allow for a blunder or two will just keep playing the game they still like best - Pathfinder.
The concept that hordes of people think Paizo is perfect and will immediately and forever stop buying when they make some error is beyond laughable.
Gamers have been jumping ship since RPG's were invented. Just because PF is the best thing so far, does not preclude them jumping ship yet again in future.
More roleplayers have been extremely loyal to their game and have sticked to it even when it turned bad. Some people are loyal to the point where it's not healthy any more - and even that crowd is probably bigger than the ship jumpers.
Again, PF isn't perfect. If D&D5 was Pathfinder but better
If cows laid eggs, they would be the best animal ever.
, players will start using it. In this case, Paizo would want to get in a PF2 first.
Yeah, sure, they want to break their promises (and lose a lot of their current customer base) and make a rush job of the next game just to get there first.
If cows laid eggs, they would be the best animal ever.
I don't know... bacon still comes from pigs.
I don't know... bacon still comes from pigs.If cows laid eggs, they would be the best animal ever.
I agree, ham, bacon and blood sausage > milk, eggs and beef
Bacon without eggs would be a tragedy but I prefer ham.
I don't know... bacon still comes from pigs.If cows laid eggs, they would be the best animal ever.
Beef Bacon!
Beef Bacon!I don't know... bacon still comes from pigs.If cows laid eggs, they would be the best animal ever.
No. We need some some sort of egg-laying moo-pig creature.
Just my .02c, (Oh BTW first post)
My table is fiercely loyal to Paizo and PFRPG. We all feel that WoTC abused our trust with 4E. We were all heartbroken at the release of 4E. We were honestly a little scared at what the future of our table would be. Then Pathfinder came along and all was well.
For the style that we play Pathfinder hits on all cylinders. It is "pitch perfect". We used to be hard core "Forgotten Realms" players. But we had to edit out allot of the silly crap that saturated FR products for a long time. We wanted a "gritty, realistic" feel to our games. pathfinder has us brushing the dusts off our clothes after each game.
In our eyes Paizo is doing everything right. A feat WotC has yet to do.
Short of Monte coming over and running 5E games at our table for a month, I don't see us switching.
3.5 Alive
-Blixterphon Maloisious Tankerton Oddwish