Haven't Read the thread yet but here are three of my favorite type of combos.
Monk/Sorcerer(or Wizard)
Monk/Oracle(or Cleric)
Fighter(Mobile Fighter)/Monk
@Run, Just Run: No, They share the same ability at the same levels which means you only get one of them.
Now if it was 3.5 you could have a Rogue/Scout who nearly always got Sneak Attack/Skirmisher damage and occasionally got both at once for 20d6.
On the other hand, alchemist/rogue can sneak attack with bombs! >:]
Umbral Reaver wrote: On the other hand, alchemist/rogue can sneak attack with bombs! >:] That is true, but it falls into a similar thing as the Rogue/Scout.
You will always have Bomb damage but you will only get Sneak Attack occasionally.
i'm currently running a campaign where every character is gestalt with 1 pc class (which they can multiclass) and one npc class (which they can't change). so far its been really interesting but not as hard to balance as full gestalt. but thats off topic.
for good combos:
- barb/lame oracle (in and out of rage with no fatigue after lvl5, so casting is no problem)
- barb/martial artist, with dragon style (lots of charging and high dmg punching, also no fatigue after 5th)
- fighter/master of many styles (you won't miss flurry with full BAB and you'll have plenty of feats to master styles- if you go Unarmed fighter you could have elemental fist and all 3 feats for one elemental style by 6th level)
- ranger/inquisitor (skill monkey with full BAB, all good saves, and tons of feats and special abilities- not to mention a handful of spells)
- any combo that gets a lot of mileage from a single stat: pally plus sorcerer or oracle, or summoner; wizard or witch plus sage sorcerer; cleric plus empyreal sorcerer; etc.
cool combos:
- gunslinger/alchemist (what's better than guns or bombs? guns and bombs!)
- sensei/empyreal sorc (lots of mileage on Wis, and a real yoda type dude)
- pally/draconic sorc (dragon knight- need i say more? ok, great Cha synergy)
- heavens oracle/starsoul sorcerer (i just love the close thematic bond- there's actually a lot of oracle/sorcerer combos i like...)
- pally/bard (the hand and mouth of your god)
weak combos...
there aren't any truly weak combos imho- you always end up better than a regular base class... weakest combos i can think of right now:
- fighter or cavalier/wizard or sorcerer (hard to benefit from armor/shield proficiency and economy of actions often limits benefits)
- rogue/vivasectionist (sneak attacks don't stack)
- gunslinger/zen archer (this may be legitimately bad- very little cross-over due to conflicting weapon requirements!)
- monk of the empty hand/weapon master (you can't take 'improvised weapons' for your weapon of choice, so this is pretty bad too)
Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Right now I'm working on a Aasimar gestalt fighter/oracle of battle. He's an oracle of a Le god and wields a scorpion whip & shield. He's going to be focused on cmb's and support spells.
lets see, i like monk/druid as its the first thing i did.
i also like the flavor idea of a ranger/inquisitor (i did skirmisher/inquisitor) and buffing your companion out with teamwork feats so your like a coordinated duo, and if he gets put out its no biggy, cuz you can still use your other allies for your solo tactics ability. spend but with skirmisher/inquisitor you get a inquisition/domain, a animal companion. free teamwork feats, free combat feats. higher HD and BAB and all good saves. inquisitor has divine spells that skirmisher gives up so its like getting those tricks for almost for free. at level 9 i can run a fauchard at 15-20x2 crit range and enemies will have a helluva time getting AoO on me.
monk druid i have different ideas. but all of them revolve around using wild shape as a stat stick (so specializing more into elementals) for mnks. save for 2. 1 takes feral combat training and goes lion/tiger forms. capable of stupid damage.
the other is more recent, and if i must say, very unique! required a smidgeon of homebrewing tho (but within the realm of making sense.)
Serpent Shaman/Tetori-level 6, huge size snake, +6STR, -4DEX(im STR based anyways) and +6 AC. 15 foot reach. trickery domain. mini mirror image 7 times a day and invisiblity, or deception subdomain, surprise shift and mirror image spell.
the homebrew part is with final embrace, tetor gives you constrict at a much higher level then snake form (level 6 for serpent shaman) so here comes level 7, change final embrace so that you can use your monk unarmed damage when constricting (instead of standard huge snake constrict damage, which is pretty weak).
we also considering homebrewing flanking bonuses for CMB (invisible snake says hi). so at 13th level with final embrace master, ill do unarmed damage (4d6 at huge size)x2 AUTOMATICALLY on a grapple check...and i can do it to ghosts.
combine qinggong, and replace slowfall with truestrike to make that bite>grab hit.
hell to the yes
granted CMB still scales really poorly compared to CMD plus i still have to decide on a lot of other feats. probably make my own thread asking tha tone
Most things can be pretty cool when combined with Elocater. Some notable examples, with very brief descriptions:
Psion/Elocater|Kensai - Int is king. You get access to several arcane-only spells in addition to all the psionic goodies and excessive mobility.
Psion/Elocater|Gunslinger - Add in the Dimensional Agility line of feats (with a houserule that they work with the psionic stuff). Xigbar wishes he was this awesome.
[Gifted Blade]Soulknife/Elocater|Psion/Metamorph - A flying, teleporting, rapidly shapeshifting monster right out of some kind of horror movie.
And a few other psionic combos:
Aegis|Soulknife - Kind of like Wizard/Cleric, there's a theurge option for this, but going straight to level 20 in both makes it even more awesome. Your mind is your weapons and armor.
Tactician|Vitalist - Action economy and various redundancies put a bit of a damper on this combo. Still, if the team needs it, you have it.
Salovs wrote: Hey all,
I was just sitting at work and my brain was wondering and i started thinking about gestalt characters. I thought of all of the core classes. Then I started to add in all of the Advanced Players guild new classes and wanted to know what everyone's ideas were on the "coolest/best/worst/overpowered" combos there are. I really like the Witch/Rouge
What a lot of people don't seem to realise in applying gestalt rules to Pathfinder is that the core classes don't suck the way they did in 3.5. The gestalt option as a result is considerably more powerful if used in Pathfinder the same way it was in 3.5.
My lore warden/paladin is pretty fun to play. Heavy armor for the thing you cant trip, and smiting with a double weapon and a mess of two weapon fighting feats...
My fav... As always, paladin/ ninja. If I played a caster, it would be ranger/ wizard.
Gunslinger / Fighter (Weapon Master)
I have always thought that Paladin/Inquisitor would be incredible. Combine a paladin's saves with Stalwart and not much is going to stop you. The utility of the Inquisitors spells and judgment tacked on top of smite is going to be sick as well!
I'm a huge fan of Halfling Paladin/Cavalier. Smite and Challenge stack, the cavalier already gets a great mount so you pick up the Paladin's weapon bond, you get the halflings great bonuses and great charisma to all saves, you get bonus feats and the mounts strength added to your own on a charge, you become the party's best face short of a bard, and you get some decent utility magic. It's an all around sick build. Barring that I'm also a huge fan of any full caster plus any full caster. Forget about extra perks, just the sheer number and diversity of spells is a game winner. I suggest Wiz/Sorc or Wiz/Oracle.
Monk (Zen Archer)|Soulknife/Soul Archer
AC, bow to-hit and bow damage goes off your Wisdom. Yes.
Best gestalt combinations I've seen yet:
Monk/Inquisitor
Wood Elementalist (ultimate magic)/Witch
Oracle/Sorcerer
Two-weapon warrior/Rogue (the amount of feats you can have)
Ranger/Druid
Ranger/Inquisitor (nasty attack bonus and damage in combo with instant enemy ranger spell (APG)and judgement.
I chose weapon adept monk and inquisitor and he is more like a super hero rather than a D&D fantasy character.
I'm currently trying out the Two-weapon warrior/soulknife combination. Weather or not its as effective as the others... I am having a lot of fun with the potential and feel of the character. The possibilities are making the character more like an anime hero.
Teberous wrote: My lore warden/paladin is pretty fun to play. Heavy armor for the thing you cant trip, and smiting with a double weapon and a mess of two weapon fighting feats... That sounds like an interesting combination.
Paladin 2/Magus 6/To-Be-Filled-In-Later 12// Sorcerer 20
LazarX wrote: Salovs wrote: Hey all,
I was just sitting at work and my brain was wondering and i started thinking about gestalt characters. I thought of all of the core classes. Then I started to add in all of the Advanced Players guild new classes and wanted to know what everyone's ideas were on the "coolest/best/worst/overpowered" combos there are. I really like the Witch/Rouge
What a lot of people don't seem to realise in applying gestalt rules to Pathfinder is that the core classes don't suck the way they did in 3.5. The gestalt option as a result is considerably more powerful if used in Pathfinder the same way it was in 3.5. True but as long as you have a good GM and your having fun... it doesn't matter. Making the possibilities and greater versatility makes for a fun game. Most characters I read about in novels are truly gestalt characters and I just want to give my players a chance to feel like the heroes in the novels. (i.e.) Lirial from Daughter of the Drow by Elaine Cunningham is clearly a gestalt character (Wizard/cleric) or Artemis Entreri (Fighter/Rogue). These characters are set apart from the rest of the world. Sometimes we want to play a character that has that potential. Gestalt gives us that potential. Again its always dependent on the skills of the GM.
Halfling Barbarian wrote: I'm a huge fan of Halfling Paladin/Cavalier. Smite and Challenge stack, the cavalier already gets a great mount so you pick up the Paladin's weapon bond, you get the halflings great bonuses and great charisma to all saves, you get bonus feats and the mounts strength added to your own on a charge, you become the party's best face short of a bard, and you get some decent utility magic. It's an all around sick build. Barring that I'm also a huge fan of any full caster plus any full caster. Forget about extra perks, just the sheer number and diversity of spells is a game winner. I suggest Wiz/Sorc or Wiz/Oracle. The Paladin/Cavalier is a great combination... and your points are excellent points. However you could be missing out on the potency of your spells when having to split between Intelligence and Charisma. Maybe if you focus on your attack spells with the Sorcerer and using your support spells with the Wizard... I guess it could work. The Cleric/Druid is very potent for a spell caster because they both go off Wisdom plus it helps with your will saves without having to worry about your other mental stats so much. In a forest with a druid at higher levels plus the survivability of a cleric... it can get quite scary. Imagine a forest growing twice its original size in your area and attacking you...
But you are right... a caster/caster can deffinitely be the game changer that saves the party time and time again. Just ask my Witch/Wizard(Wood Elementalist).
nate lange wrote: i'm currently running a campaign where every character is gestalt with 1 pc class (which they can multiclass) and one npc class (which they can't change). so far its been really interesting but not as hard to balance as full gestalt. but thats off topic.
for good combos:
- barb/lame oracle (in and out of rage with no fatigue after lvl5, so casting is no problem)
- barb/martial artist, with dragon style (lots of charging and high dmg punching, also no fatigue after 5th)
- fighter/master of many styles (you won't miss flurry with full BAB and you'll have plenty of feats to master styles- if you go Unarmed fighter you could have elemental fist and all 3 feats for one elemental style by 6th level)
- ranger/inquisitor (skill monkey with full BAB, all good saves, and tons of feats and special abilities- not to mention a handful of spells)
- any combo that gets a lot of mileage from a single stat: pally plus sorcerer or oracle, or summoner; wizard or witch plus sage sorcerer; cleric plus empyreal sorcerer; etc.
cool combos:
- gunslinger/alchemist (what's better than guns or bombs? guns and bombs!)
- sensei/empyreal sorc (lots of mileage on Wis, and a real yoda type dude)
- pally/draconic sorc (dragon knight- need i say more? ok, great Cha synergy)
- heavens oracle/starsoul sorcerer (i just love the close thematic bond- there's actually a lot of oracle/sorcerer combos i like...)
- pally/bard (the hand and mouth of your god)
weak combos...
there aren't any truly weak combos imho- you always end up better than a regular base class... weakest combos i can think of right now:
- fighter or cavalier/wizard or sorcerer (hard to benefit from armor/shield proficiency and economy of actions often limits benefits)
- rogue/vivasectionist (sneak attacks don't stack)
- gunslinger/zen archer (this may be legitimately bad- very little cross-over due to conflicting weapon requirements!)
- monk of the empty hand/weapon master (you can't take 'improvised weapons' for your weapon of choice, so this is...
Very good points and impressive ideas. Makes for interesting story behind the build. And whats the point if we're not making a good story?
They need to make a book detailing the gestalt characters like the Unearthed Arcana WotC put out. Or at least Hero Lab should put out an option like that so I can generate and level up my characters using that tool. Either way... come on Paizo... its more money to be made. Make it happen.
StabbittyDoom wrote: For a real hell of a sneak attack try this:
Rogue/Sorcerer to 4
Rogue/Arcane Trickster until 14th level
Rogue/Assassin until 20th
This nets you the ability to walk through an area unseen and leave a silent-still delayed blast fireball which (not long later) explodes, hitting everyone in the room for 14d6 + 18d6 sneak attack, forcing those hit to make a fort save versus death and take 18 bleed (fire bleed?). One of those targets may have to make TWO saves against death (death attack).
Meanwhile, you've teleported safely home.
So much for that would-be elite squad.
Actually according to the rules in Unearthed Arcana in 3.5 (the only publication of gestalt characters I could find) I quote from the book:
* A gestalt character can't combine two prestige classes at any level, although it's okay to combine a prestige class and a regular class. Prestige classes that are essentially class combinations-such as the arcane trickster, mystic theurge, and eldritch knight- should be prohibited if you're using gestalt classes, because they unduly complicate the game balance of what's already a high-powered variant.
So I probably would not allow the Arcane trickster in a gestalt game. Cheese is fun but too much cheese and it gets old quick.
But arcane trickster is the only way to get sneak attack on non weapon like spells
Whenever I build a gesalt character I look for 3 things, versatility, synergy and theme
On to the actual builds
I'm a big fan of inquisitor, bard (arcane duelist) or magus/paladin or soulknife
Magus, and rouge/ninja/vivisectionist mix well with everything
Barbarian 9/oracle1/rage prophet 10/witch (scarred witch Dr.) 20 is not bad, thanks to rage prophet you can cast while raging and the bonus to con helps your main casting
You can do similar with alchemist and scarred witch Dr
Now you really want some fun with those two classes, make the hulk,
Take alchemist (rage chemist/vivisectionist) 10 master chemist 10 barbarian (drunken brute) 20 possibly with the rage prophet as above
i think its kind of funny that there have been several new gestalt threads the last week but somehow this one still got necro'ed, lol
in honor of that- oracle[bones]/sorcerer[undead]
I just started a group with Gestalt Characters:
Catfolk - Rogue/Sorcerer
Aasimar - Bard/Ranger
Human - Oracle/Sorcerer
Human - Fighter/Barbarian (NPC fill in till our 4th player gets back from traveling)
They are going up against tougher critters
i'd love to play a barbarian/vivisectionist ;) barbarian + mutagen + full sneak attack progression and a boatload of natural attacks on top of two-handed iteratives
I know I am having fun building...
Monk/Soulknife(Deadly Fist):
At level two with Focused Offense he is completely SAD Wisdom and all the features compliment each other very well. Also I don't think there is a better way to Enchant a monks fists.
Salovs wrote: Hey all,
I was just sitting at work and my brain was wondering and i started thinking about gestalt characters. I thought of all of the core classes. Then I started to add in all of the Advanced Players guild new classes and wanted to know what everyone's ideas were on the "coolest/best/worst/overpowered" combos there are. I really like the Witch/Rouge
I haven't played with it yet, but I've been working on a gestalt build centered around Arcane Archer for about two weeks now. It's leveled with Magus(Eldritch Archer archetype)20/ Arcane Archer10/ Bloodrager5/ VampireHunter1/Fighter4. The damage potential is pretty good I'd reckon with full BAB, full caster level, and spellcombat. With Traits and Background/Occupation bonus feat it works like so.
Race:Human (for the bonus feat alone)
Traits: Magical Lineage (Shocking Grasp), Spellpiercer
Feats:Racial Heritage (Orc), Weapon Focus Bow, Precise Shot, Point Blank Shot, Snapshot, Combat Reflexes, Rapid Shot, Weapon Specialization, Point Blank Master, Agile Maiden, Intensify Spell, Clustered Shot, Combat Casting, Spell Penetration, Quicken Spell, Improved Snapshot, Manyshot, and Storm of Arrows.
At level 20 with a round of setup of Enlarge Person (make sure you have large arrows) and Gravity Bow, you can do 4d6 per arrow plus any other enhancements to arrows you get from Arcane Archer or Magus Arcana (Pool Strike, flaming burst, holy, unholy, etc), and you get to cast a spell in the same action. If all your attacks land it would be (30+)d6 not really sure the exact amount. And with Agile Maiden and Gray Maiden Plate you get all class bonuses granted you in medium armor (fast movement, etc). With Storm of Arrows you'll eventually be able to hit 20 targets with one attack each in a round. Pretty nice?
Why such a necro? There are more recent threads on the topic.
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