Zabraxis's page

The demon eidolon is a weird one. The 7th level Visons of Sin actually has a bonus vs evil but the 17th level Blasphemous Decree is just bad for a good party.

I'd definitely play the lazy Alchemist/Marshal but they'd have to add a feat/class ability equivalent to Poultice Preparation (minus the rider effect) for Alchemists and make an exception to the trained in Martial Weapons requirement for it to work at a reasonable pace unless you're human.

I think a lot of the grief Alchemists get is they shift the action economy to other players to make use of their buffs yet they have the warpriest's stunted proficiency progression. A war priest can buff more efficiently with no drawback to the receiver, heal better, and swing a better weapon depending on their god. I know it's not the only reason but its a big factor for why I can never bring myself to play one.

Since Fighter/Barbarian are your metric there's no point to discussing things further. The summoner will never fit your focus. You simply do not value what other classes bring to the table.

2) Can we make it excellent at skills in a way that the Champion, Oracle, and Cleric are not?

It feels like the most likely path is going to be #1 since "good at skills" is not thus far associated with any magical tradition, you can make your rogue/investigator religious, fond of nature, or interested in the occult, or whatever you want. Since I know Paizo doesn't do box checking, but if we do a divine class that's good at skills that does raise the question of "why not an arcane/primal/occult class that is likewise skilled". The only times we've seen classes split the difference between the rogue/investigator "all the skills" approach and the pot every other CRB class is in is when you have classes whose features ensure they're good at the one thing they need to be able to do (e.g. the Inventor and Crafting), and I'm not sure there's a singular skill that defines the Inquisitor.

While there is no singular skill that defines the inquisitor, deities have divine skills. I think giving the inquisitor the swashbuckler's Stylish Tricks for religion or their deities Divine Skill could be a flavorful way to bring in some of the skilled aspects w/o pushing the skill curve too much. Auto increases in the Divine Skill would be nice but I don't mind dropping them if there's no class defining skill. I'd be fine with an either/or as long as there's some boost to skills in some way.

...except that once you say "they're a wave caster, and they're using their spell list for utility" then you're no longer building someone who's focused on combat and damage over utility. I mean, it's not unreasonable to imagine a wave caster who uses spells mostly for utility and lets the martial side handle most of their "I can still contribute in combat" needs, but that's really not fitting the image of the Intercessor that we've been throwing around thus far.

Strongly disagree. Spells for utility & Bane/Judgements for damage was exactly what the 1e inquisitor was. It's spell list pulled spells from other classes to beef up it's utility not it's damage potential. You could take spell casting away from 1e version and it'd still be a heavy hitter just a lot less useful.

I would much rather they just make it a class archetype for the ranger where they give up the edge and the random class stuff they get for wave casting and feats to add riders on hunt prey.

You can do very close to this right now, Bounty Hunter dedication on a Magus. And that is nowhere near what has been asked for in an inquisitor.

I originally leaned on ranger in my inquisitor wish list but things have changed. Hunt Prey w/ edges is a good fit mechanically. Take edges away and Hunt Prey, while flavorful, is borderline useless. The Monster Hunter feat line was good but then Thaumaturge stepped in, said "Hold my Chalice" and showed what a real monster hunter could be. The Ranger is Primal not Divine with zero interaction with even the primal anathemas like druids. There's just way too much that doesn't work with an archetype.

I'm likewise frustrated with being talked past.

A Eldritch Rogue with cleric as their selected magical source is a divine empowered spy/trickster. It just is. This is not to say that you should be happy with that, but I was directly addressing the point that the space is completely unfilled when there's at least one option that: is in the "Core set" of rulebooks, requires no reflavoring or bending of rules, and doesn't even need an archetype to work.

It might not be what you're asking for but ...

Mechanically, Eldritch Trickster is quite possibly the worst subclass in game and one of the few true trap options IMO. The class actively encourages sneak attack w/ spells with the variable KAS and early access to Magical Trickster but does nothing to actually make spell attacking worthwhile (regardless of spell list.) After 4th level, you're 3-5 attack behind when factoring in Potency Runes for 12/20 levels. You can choose to ignore the spell sneak attacking but the subclass turns into a Ancient Elf that anyone can take at that point. And it's utterly uncalled for in a free archetype game.

edit: added spoiler for ninja'd comments :)

I understand Paizo wanting to keep their options open but a "We have no plans for a 2e Inquisitor at this time. That may change in the future." seems better at setting player expectations than the responses so far.

Given the valid points against alternative names I don't think a 100% appropriate in all situations name is possible. I do think some of the suggested names are fitting for subclasses tho.

Devotion Summoner w/ Redeemer Paladin devotion. You want most of the devotion feats so it's best w/ free archtype ...

If something hits your eidolon: negate or reduce the damage w/ Glimpse of Redemption.
If something hits you: hit them with Dutiful Retaliation

Full Plate, Healing Touch, & Resiliency all add to survivability in close combat.

Flavor the spirit being devoted because you granted them a chance at redemption in life. They stick around to help you continue doing the good work.

Haven't had a chance to play or see it in play bit it sounds fun & flavorful. Though, the AE problems mentioned upthread now give me pause.

I think it needs faith in "something" ( an idea, a concept, a goal, a god ) rather than a real existing god.

The god being real or not won't affect them from doing their job after all.

That was paladins & clerics in 1e but they hard coded a deity to both classes and layered in anathema and tenets in the switch to 2e. I doubt Paizo will give inquisitors a pass.

How okay would folks be with a new Shaman absorbing the Medium’s schtick, the way Spiritualists were folded into the 2e Shaman? “I commune with and host ephemeral beings” seems like the thematic foundation of both.

While I like both concepts, I'm mixed on combining them in the same class until we have more details on transactional spell slots.

I think there are valid arguments to be made for Divine, Occult, or Primal spell lists given the existing lore. Someone mentioned changing your signature spells based on the spirit you channel, maybe list access based on the spirit instead? Might be too much day-to-day versatility.

Spell slots as currency has me intrigued but I get a spell/power points feel so far. That could just be what I default to when I think of spell currency tho. Bartering with spirits for power hews close to 5e Warlock (and witch patrons to a lesser extent) in thematics to me but could work out well if done right.

As for Golarion specific lore to see more off, as a dwarf fan, I'd really like more info on Rivethun. IIRR Shardra was one and she's the iconic but there was really little info on the practice.

I see no issue with other classes being able to use judgement stance given that any class can use rage, any class can use monk stances, any class can use fighter stances, etc.

Judgement definitely do not fit as focus spells. Given how they would be going from X per day to 1/combat I already suspect they would get powered down any way. But I don't know, just seems like what they would do given Panache and stances in general are exactly what Judgements were.

I'm definitely in favor of judgement being a stance after remembering magus' Arcane Cascade isn't available via magus dedication.

The problem is what the language being used implies. Talking about eroding trust and a loss of goodwill creates the suggestion that you were somehow owed or promised something in particular.

Likewise the use of phrasing like "human and fallible" again suggests that Paizo not publishing the specific class you were looking for is somehow a failure on their part.

It's reasonable to dislike a design choice, or be disappointed, even frustrated or a little upset, but imo it gets problematic to code that frustration in language that implies some personal betrayal or moral failing.

Since you seem more concerned with a tonal ad hominem attack and arguing semantics than any discussion of the points I've made I respectfully ask that we leave this at "agreeing to disagree."

If you feel I have violated forum rules feel free to report me to the moderators.

I definitely want a skilled agent of a deity feel to the class and one of the social skills (whichever their subclass leans towards) covered w/o reliance on charisma. Martial & spell proficiency equal to a magus but I keep waffling on Wis KAS or Str/Dex by subclass. Combat-wise, they don't have to be DPS machines but should be respectable.

We've seen a few "roll for damage boost" classes maybe it's time to explore another "roll for accuracy" class on a non attack stat KAS class. Consistent damage per target rather than the investigators 1/rnd d6 burst w/ limited weapons. Call it Divine Focus or Guided Hand or some such.

I lean towards wave casting with the magus' Studious Spells mechanic. Initially I thought of limiting it to the deities cleric spells too but agree those can vary greatly both in number and usefulness. I think it might be better to have a fixed selection, perhaps based on the subclass selection (Spy: Disguise Self, Enforcer: Blistering Invective etc.)

Judgements might be class cantrips or a focus spell w/ a choose your own buff list w/ progressive class feats to expand their use . I do like the idea of class specific stances but worry how watered down they might have to be to prevent cherry-picking w/ inquisitor dedication.

For the skilled aspect, I was thinking a variation of the swashbuckler's Stylish Tricks with auto scaling based on the deities divine skill or religion (instead of acrobatics) though it might not work well for some deities. It's fewer skill feats than a rogue so it doesn't step on toes.

Same disclaimer as AnimatedPaper. Just a rough wishlist of things for the class.

"erosion of trust" "finally deign to" "draining good will" seems like very loaded and intense language for something like this.

Paizo's only published ten new classes since PF2 came out. There are a lot of things they haven't done.

I'm not sure such an ascription of malice toward any one of those things is really warranted.

*sigh* Intensity was intentional and reflects my frustration, ascribing malice was not.

Designers are human and fallible, even the good ones (which I consider the Paizo team to be despite my intense language and wisdom soapbox.) They can have blindspots and pointing them out does not constitute "ascribing malice."

snipped

I agree with most of your points. I admit my bias towards wisdom classes/characters but I've operated in good faith that eventually the design team will get around to it. However, goodwill and patience has been chipped away with each passing year of being passed over. This is not a case of "a sense of instant gratification" as you put it but a slow drain of confidence and an erosion of trust.

With the current timeline of products and assuming they finally deign to work on wisdom appropriate classes the year after, it'll be 5yrs after release before anything wisdom related hits the streets. That's half the lifespan of 1e. That seems a blindspot far beyond the "wisdom doesn't seem appropriate" and designers desires defenses.

You're not wrong, but just pointing out Luis is not part of the main design team. That's not a slight on his skill, but merely saying that he's on a different team and when someone says "the design team" decided this or that, they probably aren't talking about him.

A valid point. Maybe they should bring Luis on "the Design Team" to cover their wisdom mental block :)

Snipped

Well said. This kind of sub-classing is exactly what I had in mind when I said the good and evil aspects could coexist in the same class, except way more thought out and in-depth.

I'm mostly fine with Champions as is but they definitely lean heavily into an alignment class feel. The extra tenant restrictions from causes are the root problem (and in conflict with some valid deity's own edicts.) A class archetype that foregoes the deity and just works with the causes could cover the agnostic alignment warrior concepts.

I was holding out hope that the Shaman would be the pick your spell list for wisdom. Shamans & their analogs encompass a wide array of concepts across cultures from divine to occult to primal so choosing a list seems appropriate. The 1e class was an oracle/witch hybrid after all. Not so sure this will ever see the light of day given everyone's aversion to wisdom.

On the warpriest: I think it suffers a bit from the name associated baggage similar to the inquisitor. If they had called it something else I don't think it would see as much hate. This isn't to say I think it's good but I've softened on it being as bad as I originally thought.

It has been recently stated by Mark Seifter (iirc) that they aren't avoiding Wisdom as a key stat. When they push out a class that the team feels is appropriate to use Wisdom, they will. Fans might think/want certain existing classes to be Wis, but the team did not share the sentiment.

If this is true then their words and actions are at odds in addition to being at odds with player expectations, which is cause for concern. I find it impossible that there were no ideas for wisdom based classes/subclasses in the past 3 years given the Inquisitor is a fan favorite. Doubly so when Paizo designers release psychic wisdom paths on Pathfinder infinite.

I'm not opposed to an Arbiter or Intercessor, so long as it lets me play the characters I want and gets into my hands soon. I never would've thought Gunslinger, Kineticist, Magus, and Psychic would all beat the 2e Inquisitor out the door.

I agree and the fact that there's still no talk of Inquisitor (or whatever name it'll be) kinda confirms my concern that Paizo is avoiding designing anything with wisdom. No new wisdom classes and no wisdom subclasses in 3 years of releases. With Rage of Elements it seems like it'll be at least 4 years. I chalked it up to design plans but after they excluded Wisdom from the Psychic for some weird reason it's kind of getting a bit silly at this point. [/soapbox]

I don't see why the evil aspects and good aspects can't coexist in the same class. There are good and evil Champions and I haven't seen arguments about evil Champions (with some pretty repugnant tenants) ruining the class or having no place in the game. I don't see why there can't be a Holy Assassin subclass and a Divine Negotiator subclass at the same time.

I am so sick of all the arguments about the name. Call it Floofenatrix for all I care, just give me a skillful, divine striker w/ limited spell casting and a social skill mechanic. Maybe a wisdom based Social Graces lore to cover the social skills to make up for Thaumaturge stealing Monster Knowledge & Bane (if they can switch Knowledge checks to Cha for Thaum they can switch social skills to wis for Floofenatrices.) There's still plenty of design space to work in mechanically to fill that role.

The complaints about the flavor of the class I get but I never saw anyone play an inquisitor anywhere close to the zealous edgelord flavor text. I saw more Paladins by far play Lawful Stupid to an asinine degree.

Assume Earth's Mantle is cool as an idea but the implementation comes way too late in game. It feels disconnected/ disjointed to spend 13 levels boosting dex to maintain AC in light/unarmored then switch to STR. It packs so much into a feat it feels like it's overcompensating for being so late game.

They need to add granularity to it's progression like the Armor Inventor/Mountain Stance. Start w/ something useable and appropriate for 1st level to compensate for the STR focus and maintain baseline ac then add feats to boost it as you level up.

Additionally, with a 3 action cost the action economy is wonky. If you're walking around Gathered you literally waste your 1st turn donning your armor and then have to spend another action on turn 2 to Gather to use any of your class abilities. No other class has this action tax to operate at baseline. The closest is Mountain Stance and it's 1 action.

If you're caught unGathered, you can't even don your armor in the same round and end up waiting until the 3rd round to do much of anything. That just feels horrible when compared to every other martial.

This is my biggest complaint so far.

The STR options & lack of Med armor are a poisoned carrot. The damage increase is not worth the increased hit & crit chance.

Assume Earth's mantle is ridiculously too late in game. Sure it gives a lot of bonuses but it seems silly to focus on dex for 14 levels for survivability then suddenly switch to str. They need to tone it down & make it an option @ level 1 similar to Armor Inventor then fill it out via feats as you level.

As others have said, being forced to take an archetype to maintain baseline ac as a str kineticist feels bad.

A Powerful Ancestries book with ancestry based class feat powered archetypes. Dragons are already done with Battlezoo, but I'd love to see something like Giants, Angels, Demons, Fey, Dogs, Drow, and maybe even weird things like Oozes and Aberrations.

I like the idea of racial exemplar archetypes for all races that allows for more racial feats (with some kind of limiter.) They all have cool/flavorful racial feats that get passed over for the "best" @ level and are rarely picked @ later levels.

As far as focusing on schools magic, I'd love to see all magic schools get some version of the Captivator (minus the level wonkyness.) I like the slightly faster/higher MC casting progression in exchange for a more limited focus.

I'm also a fan of more party synergy archetypes like Overwatch and Sniping Duo.

Now, 3.x had this with the psychics, plus the wacky bit that basically every power could be heightened to max. It worked, and some people liked it, but it hasn't made it into either 5e or PF2.

So... why didn't it? I mean, it didn't even make it in as an alternate rule. It allows for a lot of interesting frobbing for class differentiation. (How big is your max pool vs what causes you to recover mana/psi and how much vs how much can you spend on each spell vs how many spells do you have access to.)

No, seriously. I'm sure there must be a reason. Does anyone know the reason? I'm honestly curious.

I honestly have no clue why they didn't carry over or evolve the Psionics power point system. They left it to 3p for 1e and it went a little off the rails on the power curve but the basics were solid. I loved the mechanics (more than the psionics lore.) Spheres scratched that itch a little but it basically threw balance out the window. The only complaint my 3.5 group had w/ psionics was casting in armor but that sacred cow has been put out to pasture.

I'd love to see it brought back. There has to be something they can salvage into new and interesting spell mechanics.

I've looked at the elementalist spell list, but it's a bit too anemic for this character unless they wanted to use all four...

The Elementalist was a huge disappointment for me. I don't really understand what they were trying to do with the archetype. I mean you take classes with access to the widest selection/variety of elemental spells (Arcane & Primal traditions) and the remove most utility spells and all healing spells to access some meh feats. The familiar feats might have been fun if they hadn't turned familiars into pet rocks. There's a few cross tradition spells that are nice but nothing that comes close to what you give up.

Elementalist needs to be thrown on the Unchained wish lists that pop-up occasionally.

Am I the only person who thinks that knowing what is in the AP has absolutely no bearing on what characters I bring to the table.

Most of the time, it has no bearing for me. It really depends on the theme of the AP and how appropriate my current "wanna-play" character is. I have so many character ideas I'm not gonna contort backstory all to hell to play a something that just isn't a good fit.

For example, I'm playing a Ratfolk Construct Rider Alchemist in an Iron Gods game. Construct Rider is banned in PFS and is anachronistic enough that it was frowned on (effectively banned) in my home group. IG was probably the only chance I had to play one and not ruffle any feathers.

Sun Wukong would probably understand a follower usurping his power. He snuck into the Boneyard and erased his own name from from Pharasma's ledger to gain immortality so I don't think he'd have a problem if you tricked him. He's also a god of fightin' & drinkin' so taking power by force is an option that falls w/in his tenets.

I agree w/ Claxon, I doubt any god would accept a follower that want's to outright kill them tho.

Everyone keeps talking about how strong wisdom is but no one has said anything about how adding another Wis class/sub-class is going to break the game or why they should be avoided. The potential of breaking the game is not a valid reason. Any poorly designed class can break the game regardless of stat. Listing all the things Wis does just shows why everyone wants wisdom but gives no explanation for why Wis classes/sub-classes are the systems kryptonite.

We have 2 Wis classes already. They work fine and the system is still balanced. People just aren't complaining about them being OP. That alone shows Wis can be used and the system can survive.

It's not like I'm asking something unreasonable either. I see plenty of posts about Inquisitor and Shaman. I just want Paizo to work past whatever issue they have with Wis classes/sub-classes.

So yeah, Wisdom is down towards the bottom. I don't know that I buy "fear" here, though. I'm also not convinced by "not good". I mean, it's true. Wis classes seem to be limited to those that are channeling their abilities from a friendly higher power (as opposed to Oracles, who are stealing power from unfriendly higher powers). Paizo hasn't printed any of those since Book 1. So... this is an issue how? How does it make the game significantly worse that it is so?

Fear might be a strong word. I don't mean it derogatorily. They just seem to be avoiding wisdom like the plague and I'm not sure why. Poor planning? Core design principles? Simple oversight? The comfort level doing interesting things w/ Int/Cha vs Wis? No idea. Whatever their reason wisdom is due for a little love.

How does it makes the game worse? For most it doesn't but for me it does. The majority of the classes I leaned towards in PF1 are wisdom based and do not exist yet in PF2. However, Paizo ignoring wisdom while inventing cool new classes(Inventor) and elegantly refining the classes they port has eaten up my "I can wait my turn" good will. I want to see what they do w/ wisdom but if its weighted so heavily they won't use it, why have wisdom as a stat in game at all?

The "Everyone wants wisdom so we're not going to give it any additional perks" argument is flawed because stats are not mutually exclusive this edition. 4 ability boosts are enough to cover Con/Dex/Wis + Primary stat giving everyone big3 benefits on top of their primary stat benefits. Wisdom doesn't get much in that way a Cleric can pump Cha for extra healing and that's about it.

AnimaterPaper clarified already, the "not good" was about the Eldritch Trickster as a subclass regardless of stat picked.

As far as thematic ideas go: a detective that uses intuition as well as intellect seems a good subclass for Investigator. An observant forward lookout fits rogue/ranger. (The Scout archetype kinda covers this but is almost exclusively stealth focused.) Hunter is a prime wave-caster candidate for PF2 conversion behind Inquisitor. A wisdom subclass of whatever the Shifter ends up being seems thematic too. Combat Meditation/Focus (3.5) are concepts that could explore wisdom in combat. An Herbalist that isn't exclusively about healing and 1/2 as effective in town.

While I'd love to see a PF2 Inquisitor, Shaman, & Shifter, I just want Paizo to get over their fear of Wisdom.

After Dark Archive there will be 2/22 classes that are Wis primary. As of now there is 1/3 of a subclass (Eldritch Trickster) that is Wis primary/secondary and it's ... not good. Forensic Medicine Investigator doesn't really count due to Medicine's fixed DC, the skill-ups Investigators get, and Assurance being a thing. Rangers can make good use of Wis w/ the Monster Hunter feat tree but it's not really a subclass. Ranger & Monk casting are Wis based but work w/o wisdom unless you're a monk focusing on offensive spells.

I get that every class wants wisdom but Paizo needs to quit pumping-up Cha/Int. Wisdom doesn't have a pick your list or spontaneous class (fingers crossed for Shaman.) Caster multiclassing w/ Wis is limited to Divine unless you go full Dex thanks to the Druid anathema. There is no way to use Wis for innate casting, Int at least has Eldritch Researcher. There are no good Wis subclasses, even ones that seem obvious like a Detective subclass for Investigator/Rogue.

I just feel like wisdom is treated like a red-headed stepchild w/ omegacron Covid that's been quarantined since the edition came out given how little they've done with it. (/end hyperbole)

FoB is good, but you need to find something useful for the rest of your turn. MADness hurts here, manuevers are useless, skirmishing denies allies a flanking partner, so that leaves Raise a Shield.

Maneuvers aren't useless if you grab Assurance(Athletics). It ignores MAP and scales fine if you keep Athletics proficiency up. Extreme saves might be borderline depending on encounter difficulty but if assurance fails, target a different save.

Whatever route you go, enjoy your solid damage, mobility, and saves while snacking on the enemies actions and controlling the battlefield...

Stunned(Stunning Fist): eats 1 action
Prone(Trip): eats 1 action (stand to remove -2 attack penalty & Flat-footed) and will make any class w/ AoO happy (Stand is a Move action)
Grapple: eats 1 action to Escape if they want to move and remove Flat-Footed and the mild caster debuff from Grabbed

I'd like to see Aberrant, Elemental, & Twin eidolons ported over.

Ideally, Twin would focus on the tandem fighting concept more so maybe a class archetype. It might step on the Synthesist a little but I really like the idea of a fighting duo.

Everyone wants to see a Synthesist. I'm pretty sure they're going to be disappointed in whatever 2e Synthesist Paizo releases in the same way Magic Lineage, Intensified, Shocking Grasp spamming Magus fans hated the 2e Magus. In my personal experience with the 1E Sythesist (about 15-20 in various online games) every single one of them was the dictionary definition of ridiculously min-maxed OP power grab. We're talking dumping Con, Dex, Str base form stats to 7 (or lower depending on race.) There's no way the 2e Synthesist is going to be anywhere close to that, it just wasn't balanced.

I haven't put much thought into the class paths I want but I have strong opinions on what I don't want to see in class paths.

I do NOT want to see an Inquisitor as a class path (or archetype for that matter.) While an Inquisitor has elements of Ranger, Rogue, Cleric, and Champion to some extent, it deserves it's own class rather than tacked onto an existing class chassis. I admit my bias since Inquisitor was my favorite 1e class, however, my disappointment with warpriest has left me wondering if the designers and I are looking at the same book, much less on the same page.

I do not want another charisma focused class path. I'm getting frustrated with the charisma heavy focus of PF2 so far. 9/20 classes are charisma key stat or heavy charisma focused class paths, 8 if you ignore a Champion's Divine Smite & Litanys. Dark Archive is bringing at least 2 more charisma classes. Int is almost as bad with 7/20 key stat or int focused subclasses. Wisdom has 2 key attribute classes, Cleric & Druid, with Monk & Ranger *IF* they go offense focus spells otherwise they can ignore it. I get that Wisdom is important to every class and I don't expect the mental stats to be in perfect balance but the class/subclass key stat lineup is out of hand. I dunno if this is because of a lack of planning or if charisma is the only design space they feel free to work in but it's looking less and less like happenstance and more like a core design choice.

I hate that PF2:

- has Sorcerer/CHA and Witch/INT for tradition picking but nothing for WIS. I dream of a tradition picking Shaman.

- only has Cleric as a viable WIS caster multiclass for armored classes. Druid anathema for the multiclass requires Dragonhide but it's expensive and 12th level. PF1 at least had Stoneplate.

- Racial Weapon feats get all sorts of wonky with proficiency. EG. Dwarves are trained in Battleaxe, Pick, & Warhammer but because they aren't DWARF weapons they don't qualify for the lower tier proficiency. You have to eat an additional feat. All of the other racial weapon feats are the same way.

- Human ancestry early feat access is the only way to make certain Archetype/Class combos work. If the intent was to limit access find a better way to hard lock it than "you can be this Archetype/Class combo in a reasonable time but only if you're Human/Half-xxx."

- classes have a fixed/limited choice Key Ability boost. This seems counter to the whole "Options" design mantra and redundant as a limiting tool since that's what proficiency is for.

I'll second Ventnor's Swashbuckler suggestion. I'll add go Human or half-human and take Cooperative Nature to boost your One for All aid rolls.

Dwarven Sparkling Targe w/ Witch dedication for the Living Hair line.

Not optimal but if a dwarf beard-striking from behind a boss shield doesn't bring a smile to your face we can't be friends.

Getting access to unlimited fast healing would make for a terrifying fighter or barbarian.

The Soulforged essence abilities are once per day per item. Are there some infinite loop shenanigans I'm missing?

Don't get me wrong, 1/2 level Fast Healing for 1-3 min/day and 1-3 auto heightened Heals are nice but far from infinite and kinda bland if you go all Healing Grace.

Thanks for the replies. I just wanted to make sure I hadn't missed a buried rule or something.

And here are my Alchemist Dedication tables in case you might find them useful.

Thx. I made my own crude version already but it's nowhere near as thorough or color coded.

How does Alchemical Sciences Investigator interact w/ Alchemist dedication?

"If you gain infused reagents from more than one source, you use the highest number of reagents to determine your pool rather than adding them together."

Alchemical Sciences gives "versatile vials" instead of "infused reagents" even going so far as to give Quick Tincture instead of Quick Alchemy. So it reads like they should stack since they're named different but function similarly (even if it is a bit lawyer-ball-y.)

What gives me pause is that Pathbuilder doesn't stack them (I know it's not an official rules source.) Is there a ruling/interaction I'm missing?

A disagreement over the Space Pirate theme level 12 Sword and Pistol ability came up in a discussion after my Starfinder game today. I searched the forums w/ Google search and the forum search and didn't find anything. Point me in the right direction if this has been hashed out before.

Sword and Pistol (12th Level)

You are well trained in a traditional piratical fighting style dating as far back as the antiquated ages before the Gap. When you are wielding at least one one-handed melee weapon and at least one small arm, you can make two attacks against the same target with one of each type of weapon as a standard action. Each attack takes the same –4 penalty as a full attack action.

Given the ambiguity of English this could be read 2 ways, either 2 attacks (1 per type of weapon) or 4 attacks (2 attacks with each type of weapon.)

What is the consensus on how many attacks this ability allows?

I don't think we will see partial casters in PF2.

It might be a pipedream but I REALLY hope this is not the case. They need something between Full Caster and Archetype casting that doesn't eat up 4 feats and have an odd, stunted progression. I'd gladly give up the single 7th & 8th level spells to cast from 1st w/ a smoother progression. Or grant 7th & 8th spells as a capstone the same way Full Casters get 10ths. Spellcasting for a Partial Caster archetype would be the tricky part. Maybe cap it at Expert Spellcasting.

A Martial w Cantrips only and Focus might pull off an Inquisitor. A self only version of the Bard's Composition cantrips would be a good starting point for Judgements. If they have Wis as a Key Ability they'll need a boost to keep them up in the math. Start w/ a base Justice Judgement cantrip and pick up the other Judgement options w/ class feats. Throw in Bane as a Focus Spell with options for Discern Lies/Zone of Truth.

Casters don't actively attack with their key stat. Cantrips use DEX and most damage spells aren't boosted by CHR or WIS or INT for the various casters.

No clue where you're getting this but it's just plain wrong. Targeted Spells, including Cantrips make a Spell Attack which uses the casters casting stat. The attack Cantrips add the spellcasting ability modifier.

MCing Monk and picking up a stance feat opens up some unarmed weapon choices with both Agile/Finesse and some useful bonuses too:

Crane: 1d6B +1AC(Circ) w/ Jump bonuses
Fire Talon: 1d4F +1AC(Status) 1/2LVL Fire Resistance
*Lashing Branch: 1d8S reflex save lockdown effect
Tiger Claw: 1d8S 10ft Step
Wolf Jaw: 1d8P gains Trip when flanking

Wolf seems strong for a Gymnast w/ the item bonus to Trip checks and Backstabber trait for +1 dmg vs flat-footed (+2 dmg @ 16th w/ +3 weapon.)

Fire Talon is pretty weak but the AC is Status so it stacks w/ Shield/Buckler/Parry. Might work for a tanky control character.

*Lashing Branch comes online @ 16, way too late for most MC builds to consider.

It seems like there could be something done to bring styles a bit closer in effectiveness/use:

Fencing is the stand-out since it's only weak vs Mindless and has no MAP, size restriction, or 10-minute immunity. You can basically Panache cycle with this all day long as long as you steer clear of mindless things. No feat tax, it just works from level 1 on.

Braggart is pretty limited w/ 1/target and weak vs Constructs/Mindless/special training (whatever that means.) The language-dependency makes Intimidating Glare/Prowess a must.
Fix?: Allow re-use of the Intimidate skill to "harry" an opponent w/o out the Frightened condition? Or limit it to Frightened 1 only on a crit after the 1st Demoralize?

Gymnast has quite a few options but all of them are MAP based and size restricted. Titan Wrestler is an obvious choice to minimize the size restriction. I get that Gymnasts can target a specific save as needed but I think -5 (-4 w/ Agile) on your Attack after gaining Panache is a bit steep.
Fix?: Allow a non-MAP use of Athletics or reduce MAP?

Anyone have any other ideas/thoughts?

Can't wait for the Witch Archetype so I can finally have a proper Dwarf Beard Fighter!

The big issue with attack cantrips is that, unlike finesse melee/thrown weapons and ranged weapons, attack cantrips don't trigger your sneak attack bonus damage so they do start to fall behind weapon attacks (which can also additionally be using runes and/or poison) in pure damage output quite quickly. But it's all based on the exact conditions.

Magical Trickster lets you attack w/ spells (cantrips included.)

Not sure about other activities but RAW you can perform the Refocus activity while doing something else appropriate to your spell source.

Sorcerers get the best deal on this since they don't have to do anything in particular to regain focus.

I've looked at a similar build using 1 level of Far Throw Monk and loading up on the Startoss feats for extra damage & almost full attack as a standard. Probably Multhuni Arsenal on the Warpriest side.