Zabraxis's page

Since Fighter/Barbarian are your metric there's no point to discussing things further. The summoner will never fit your focus. You simply do not value what other classes bring to the table.

2) Can we make it excellent at skills in a way that the Champion, Oracle, and Cleric are not?

It feels like the most likely path is going to be #1 since "good at skills" is not thus far associated with any magical tradition, you can make your rogue/investigator religious, fond of nature, or interested in the occult, or whatever you want. Since I know Paizo doesn't do box checking, but if we do a divine class that's good at skills that does raise the question of "why not an arcane/primal/occult class that is likewise skilled". The only times we've seen classes split the difference between the rogue/investigator "all the skills" approach and the pot every other CRB class is in is when you have classes whose features ensure they're good at the one thing they need to be able to do (e.g. the Inventor and Crafting), and I'm not sure there's a singular skill that defines the Inquisitor.

While there is no singular skill that defines the inquisitor, deities have divine skills. I think giving the inquisitor the swashbuckler's Stylish Tricks for religion or their deities Divine Skill could be a flavorful way to bring in some of the skilled aspects w/o pushing the skill curve too much. Auto increases in the Divine Skill would be nice but I don't mind dropping them if there's no class defining skill. I'd be fine with an either/or as long as there's some boost to skills in some way.

I would much rather they just make it a class archetype for the ranger where they give up the edge and the random class stuff they get for wave casting and feats to add riders on hunt prey.

You can do very close to this right now, Bounty Hunter dedication on a Magus. And that is nowhere near what has been asked for in an inquisitor.

I originally leaned on ranger in my inquisitor wish list but things have changed. Hunt Prey w/ edges is a good fit mechanically. Take edges away and Hunt Prey, while flavorful, is borderline useless. The Monster Hunter feat line was good but then Thaumaturge stepped in, said "Hold my Chalice" and showed what a real monster hunter could be. The Ranger is Primal not Divine with zero interaction with even the primal anathemas like druids. There's just way too much that doesn't work with an archetype.

I'm likewise frustrated with being talked past.

A Eldritch Rogue with cleric as their selected magical source is a divine empowered spy/trickster. It just is. This is not to say that you should be happy with that, but I was directly addressing the point that the space is completely unfilled when there's at least one option that: is in the "Core set" of rulebooks, requires no reflavoring or bending of rules, and doesn't even need an archetype to work.

It might not be what you're asking for but ...

Mechanically, Eldritch Trickster is quite possibly the worst subclass in game and one of the few true trap options IMO. The class actively encourages sneak attack w/ spells with the variable KAS and early access to Magical Trickster but does nothing to actually make spell attacking worthwhile (regardless of spell list.) After 4th level, you're 3-5 attack behind when factoring in Potency Runes for 12/20 levels. You can choose to ignore the spell sneak attacking but the subclass turns into a Ancient Elf that anyone can take at that point. And it's utterly uncalled for in a free archetype game.

edit: added spoiler for ninja'd comments :)

I think it needs faith in "something" ( an idea, a concept, a goal, a god ) rather than a real existing god.

The god being real or not won't affect them from doing their job after all.

That was paladins & clerics in 1e but they hard coded a deity to both classes and layered in anathema and tenets in the switch to 2e. I doubt Paizo will give inquisitors a pass.

How okay would folks be with a new Shaman absorbing the Medium’s schtick, the way Spiritualists were folded into the 2e Shaman? “I commune with and host ephemeral beings” seems like the thematic foundation of both.

While I like both concepts, I'm mixed on combining them in the same class until we have more details on transactional spell slots.

It has been recently stated by Mark Seifter (iirc) that they aren't avoiding Wisdom as a key stat. When they push out a class that the team feels is appropriate to use Wisdom, they will. Fans might think/want certain existing classes to be Wis, but the team did not share the sentiment.

If this is true then their words and actions are at odds in addition to being at odds with player expectations, which is cause for concern. I find it impossible that there were no ideas for wisdom based classes/subclasses in the past 3 years given the Inquisitor is a fan favorite. Doubly so when Paizo designers release psychic wisdom paths on Pathfinder infinite.

I'm not opposed to an Arbiter or Intercessor, so long as it lets me play the characters I want and gets into my hands soon. I never would've thought Gunslinger, Kineticist, Magus, and Psychic would all beat the 2e Inquisitor out the door.

I agree and the fact that there's still no talk of Inquisitor (or whatever name it'll be) kinda confirms my concern that Paizo is avoiding designing anything with wisdom. No new wisdom classes and no wisdom subclasses in 3 years of releases. With Rage of Elements it seems like it'll be at least 4 years. I chalked it up to design plans but after they excluded Wisdom from the Psychic for some weird reason it's kind of getting a bit silly at this point. [/soapbox]

I don't see why the evil aspects and good aspects can't coexist in the same class. There are good and evil Champions and I haven't seen arguments about evil Champions (with some pretty repugnant tenants) ruining the class or having no place in the game. I don't see why there can't be a Holy Assassin subclass and a Divine Negotiator subclass at the same time.

I am so sick of all the arguments about the name. Call it Floofenatrix for all I care, just give me a skillful, divine striker w/ limited spell casting and a social skill mechanic. Maybe a wisdom based Social Graces lore to cover the social skills to make up for Thaumaturge stealing Monster Knowledge & Bane (if they can switch Knowledge checks to Cha for Thaum they can switch social skills to wis for Floofenatrices.) There's still plenty of design space to work in mechanically to fill that role.

The complaints about the flavor of the class I get but I never saw anyone play an inquisitor anywhere close to the zealous edgelord flavor text. I saw more Paladins by far play Lawful Stupid to an asinine degree.

Assume Earth's Mantle is cool as an idea but the implementation comes way too late in game. It feels disconnected/ disjointed to spend 13 levels boosting dex to maintain AC in light/unarmored then switch to STR. It packs so much into a feat it feels like it's overcompensating for being so late game.

They need to add granularity to it's progression like the Armor Inventor/Mountain Stance. Start w/ something useable and appropriate for 1st level to compensate for the STR focus and maintain baseline ac then add feats to boost it as you level up.

Additionally, with a 3 action cost the action economy is wonky. If you're walking around Gathered you literally waste your 1st turn donning your armor and then have to spend another action on turn 2 to Gather to use any of your class abilities. No other class has this action tax to operate at baseline. The closest is Mountain Stance and it's 1 action.

If you're caught unGathered, you can't even don your armor in the same round and end up waiting until the 3rd round to do much of anything. That just feels horrible when compared to every other martial.

This is my biggest complaint so far.

The STR options & lack of Med armor are a poisoned carrot. The damage increase is not worth the increased hit & crit chance.

Assume Earth's mantle is ridiculously too late in game. Sure it gives a lot of bonuses but it seems silly to focus on dex for 14 levels for survivability then suddenly switch to str. They need to tone it down & make it an option @ level 1 similar to Armor Inventor then fill it out via feats as you level.

As others have said, being forced to take an archetype to maintain baseline ac as a str kineticist feels bad.

Am I the only person who thinks that knowing what is in the AP has absolutely no bearing on what characters I bring to the table.

Most of the time, it has no bearing for me. It really depends on the theme of the AP and how appropriate my current "wanna-play" character is. I have so many character ideas I'm not gonna contort backstory all to hell to play a something that just isn't a good fit.

For example, I'm playing a Ratfolk Construct Rider Alchemist in an Iron Gods game. Construct Rider is banned in PFS and is anachronistic enough that it was frowned on (effectively banned) in my home group. IG was probably the only chance I had to play one and not ruffle any feathers.

Everyone keeps talking about how strong wisdom is but no one has said anything about how adding another Wis class/sub-class is going to break the game or why they should be avoided. The potential of breaking the game is not a valid reason. Any poorly designed class can break the game regardless of stat. Listing all the things Wis does just shows why everyone wants wisdom but gives no explanation for why Wis classes/sub-classes are the systems kryptonite.

We have 2 Wis classes already. They work fine and the system is still balanced. People just aren't complaining about them being OP. That alone shows Wis can be used and the system can survive.

It's not like I'm asking something unreasonable either. I see plenty of posts about Inquisitor and Shaman. I just want Paizo to work past whatever issue they have with Wis classes/sub-classes.

I'd like to see Aberrant, Elemental, & Twin eidolons ported over.

Ideally, Twin would focus on the tandem fighting concept more so maybe a class archetype. It might step on the Synthesist a little but I really like the idea of a fighting duo.

Everyone wants to see a Synthesist. I'm pretty sure they're going to be disappointed in whatever 2e Synthesist Paizo releases in the same way Magic Lineage, Intensified, Shocking Grasp spamming Magus fans hated the 2e Magus. In my personal experience with the 1E Sythesist (about 15-20 in various online games) every single one of them was the dictionary definition of ridiculously min-maxed OP power grab. We're talking dumping Con, Dex, Str base form stats to 7 (or lower depending on race.) There's no way the 2e Synthesist is going to be anywhere close to that, it just wasn't balanced.

I haven't put much thought into the class paths I want but I have strong opinions on what I don't want to see in class paths.

I do NOT want to see an Inquisitor as a class path (or archetype for that matter.) While an Inquisitor has elements of Ranger, Rogue, Cleric, and Champion to some extent, it deserves it's own class rather than tacked onto an existing class chassis. I admit my bias since Inquisitor was my favorite 1e class, however, my disappointment with warpriest has left me wondering if the designers and I are looking at the same book, much less on the same page.

I do not want another charisma focused class path. I'm getting frustrated with the charisma heavy focus of PF2 so far. 9/20 classes are charisma key stat or heavy charisma focused class paths, 8 if you ignore a Champion's Divine Smite & Litanys. Dark Archive is bringing at least 2 more charisma classes. Int is almost as bad with 7/20 key stat or int focused subclasses. Wisdom has 2 key attribute classes, Cleric & Druid, with Monk & Ranger *IF* they go offense focus spells otherwise they can ignore it. I get that Wisdom is important to every class and I don't expect the mental stats to be in perfect balance but the class/subclass key stat lineup is out of hand. I dunno if this is because of a lack of planning or if charisma is the only design space they feel free to work in but it's looking less and less like happenstance and more like a core design choice.

I hate that PF2:

- has Sorcerer/CHA and Witch/INT for tradition picking but nothing for WIS. I dream of a tradition picking Shaman.

- only has Cleric as a viable WIS caster multiclass for armored classes. Druid anathema for the multiclass requires Dragonhide but it's expensive and 12th level. PF1 at least had Stoneplate.

- Racial Weapon feats get all sorts of wonky with proficiency. EG. Dwarves are trained in Battleaxe, Pick, & Warhammer but because they aren't DWARF weapons they don't qualify for the lower tier proficiency. You have to eat an additional feat. All of the other racial weapon feats are the same way.

- Human ancestry early feat access is the only way to make certain Archetype/Class combos work. If the intent was to limit access find a better way to hard lock it than "you can be this Archetype/Class combo in a reasonable time but only if you're Human/Half-xxx."

- classes have a fixed/limited choice Key Ability boost. This seems counter to the whole "Options" design mantra and redundant as a limiting tool since that's what proficiency is for.

I'll second Ventnor's Swashbuckler suggestion. I'll add go Human or half-human and take Cooperative Nature to boost your One for All aid rolls.

Dwarven Sparkling Targe w/ Witch dedication for the Living Hair line.

Not optimal but if a dwarf beard-striking from behind a boss shield doesn't bring a smile to your face we can't be friends.

Getting access to unlimited fast healing would make for a terrifying fighter or barbarian.

The Soulforged essence abilities are once per day per item. Are there some infinite loop shenanigans I'm missing?

Don't get me wrong, 1/2 level Fast Healing for 1-3 min/day and 1-3 auto heightened Heals are nice but far from infinite and kinda bland if you go all Healing Grace.

Thanks for the replies. I just wanted to make sure I hadn't missed a buried rule or something.

And here are my Alchemist Dedication tables in case you might find them useful.

Thx. I made my own crude version already but it's nowhere near as thorough or color coded.

I don't think we will see partial casters in PF2.

It might be a pipedream but I REALLY hope this is not the case. They need something between Full Caster and Archetype casting that doesn't eat up 4 feats and have an odd, stunted progression. I'd gladly give up the single 7th & 8th level spells to cast from 1st w/ a smoother progression. Or grant 7th & 8th spells as a capstone the same way Full Casters get 10ths. Spellcasting for a Partial Caster archetype would be the tricky part. Maybe cap it at Expert Spellcasting.

A Martial w Cantrips only and Focus might pull off an Inquisitor. A self only version of the Bard's Composition cantrips would be a good starting point for Judgements. If they have Wis as a Key Ability they'll need a boost to keep them up in the math. Start w/ a base Justice Judgement cantrip and pick up the other Judgement options w/ class feats. Throw in Bane as a Focus Spell with options for Discern Lies/Zone of Truth.

Casters don't actively attack with their key stat. Cantrips use DEX and most damage spells aren't boosted by CHR or WIS or INT for the various casters.

No clue where you're getting this but it's just plain wrong. Targeted Spells, including Cantrips make a Spell Attack which uses the casters casting stat. The attack Cantrips add the spellcasting ability modifier.

MCing Monk and picking up a stance feat opens up some unarmed weapon choices with both Agile/Finesse and some useful bonuses too:

Crane: 1d6B +1AC(Circ) w/ Jump bonuses
Fire Talon: 1d4F +1AC(Status) 1/2LVL Fire Resistance
*Lashing Branch: 1d8S reflex save lockdown effect
Tiger Claw: 1d8S 10ft Step
Wolf Jaw: 1d8P gains Trip when flanking

Wolf seems strong for a Gymnast w/ the item bonus to Trip checks and Backstabber trait for +1 dmg vs flat-footed (+2 dmg @ 16th w/ +3 weapon.)

Fire Talon is pretty weak but the AC is Status so it stacks w/ Shield/Buckler/Parry. Might work for a tanky control character.

*Lashing Branch comes online @ 16, way too late for most MC builds to consider.

Can't wait for the Witch Archetype so I can finally have a proper Dwarf Beard Fighter!

Sanctified Slayer Inquisitor: It fits the roguish-clergy niche I've wanted for years. No sneak attack till 4th is a little annoying (Precise Strike @ 3rd helps off set it.) Throw in Accomplished Sneak Attacker @ 5th and your even with a Rogue till 10th. Studied Target doesn't have the versatility of Judgements but it's infinite use and saves time & calculation @ the table.

Phantom Blade Spiritualist: A dip in monk is practically mandatory but it makes for a monk w/ psychic spells and magus spell combat that actually works with the psychic magic rules (unlike the Ectoplasmatist.)

Kinetic Knight Kineticist: The elemental warrior/knight done right that doesn't lose the core fun of the class (side-eyes Elemental Annihilator) Sword & Board is mandatory but the scaling weapon damage & tricks/riders to add to it make for a fun spin on the fighting style.

Spirit Guide Oracle: Depending on the Mystery this is a no brainer for day to day versatility on a a spontaneous caster.

If you only want to invest one feat there's always Improved Dirty Trick for 6 different debuffs in one.

Personally I'm not a fan of Trip in SF unless you have a melee heavy group. Prone w/ +4ac vs ranged kinda screws the rest of the party.

Andoran is Pathfinder America, and that's cool, but I couldn't tell you who they were friends or enemies with, any real notes of their relations with other nations.

Using your example, Andoren foreign relations has exactly the information you're complaining is missing. It's nicely footnoted so you can go read the information. Just because you or your DMs haven't done the homework doesn't mean Paizo hasn't given their setting some depth. It just wasn't all in the core book. It happened over time, just like Shadowrun and the other settings you like.

If you don't go w/ Umonk, you're at the right level for another pretty good druid multi-class option that might be worth it: Ranger w/ Shapeshifting Hunter as your 7th level feat. You trade 1 caster level for full scaling Favored Enemy & don't lose anything for Wild Shape.

As far as Favored Enemy in RotRL, I've seen Giant suggested as primary with a toss-up between Goblin & Human.

Outflank has a BAB +4 requirement. How are you taking it at 3rd?

UMonk//Life Shaman Speaker for the Past of Irori has a good bit of synergy w/ all the touch spells Shammys get. D10, Full BAB, all good saves, lots of utility w/ Hexes, and mostly SAD if you don't focus on channel. You're not the damage dealer but a mobile melee debuffer.

- Guided Hand/Channel Smite for Wis atk w/ unarmed strikes
- Hex Strike to deliver a Hex w/ unarmed strikes (Slumber for KO, Evil Eye for debuffs)
- Magical Lineage(Frostbite) & Rime Spell for unarmed strikes that entangle & fatigue (Magus light)
- Enforcer if you want to add Shaken to your unarmed strikes
- Stunning Fist add-ons for more debuffing and you'll have a high Wis to land it more often
- Pickup Spirit Shield through the Speaker for the Past archetype for a scaling armor bonus that isn't armor and gives a 50% miss vs ranged (including rays) @ 13th
- Wisdom in the Flesh trait for Stealth
- Easy access to style feats (Monkey Style for Wis to Acrobatics, Crane for AC etc.)
- Flying Kick to make you mobile as hell so you can debuff multiple targets w/ a full attack once you're holding a charge. Sadly only 1 hex a round but you can throw out a Stunning Fist instead.

Lots going on there.

I've been told in a few PFS games that you can't Aid Another on Knowledge checks but no one has ever said where the rule came from. The only restrictions to AA I can find is trained only checks but you can still AA on those if you're trained in the skill.

Is there a rule against using Aid Another for Knowledge checks? Is it a PFS thing? Are there scenarios/adventure paths etc. that explicitly restrict AA on Knowledge checks?

There are a few options:

Spellslinger Wizard for enhancement bonus to DCs and burn a spell to add enchantments to your gun. Witch doesn't have to worry about the banned schools.

Seige Gunner Gunslinger for Int based Grit and quick clear.

Havocker Witch if you reflavor Kinetic Blast as a gun. Giving up Hexes is a little rough but a scaling blast you can use all day long could fit the gunslinger motif w/ a little reflavoring.

Personally I only think a Shaman is MAD if you're a Life Shaman w/ a heavy channeling focus. Cha mostly affects daily uses of secondary abilities and some of the Spirit hexes. Most of them are throw away abilities that you might use as a last resort or to have *something* to do in a round but they're not something that should be built around.

same problem for Spirit Guide Oracle trying to do this, by the way

Oracles have a bigger problem than MAD trying to use Arcane Enlightenment....

The shaman can add a number of spells from the sorcerer/wizard spell list equal to her Charisma modifier (minimum 1) to the list of shaman spells she can prepare.

Oracles are spontaneous casters with spells known from the cleric spell list and don't prepare spells. Nothing in the archetype changes that.

Just passing it along because I built an Oracle around Arcane Enlightenment and had it pointed out to me before I played it in PFS.

Fighter/Occultist(Battle Host) could be interesting.

You get a good will, 2 more skills(more with int for spells,) 6th level casting in armor, and extra combat feats.

Flavor the armor/weapon from Panopoly Bond as an heirloom from a long line of defenders for the wizard's house/family. For implement schools, Abjuration & Transmutation have a lot of focus powers that are solid for a bodyguard: Aegis, Energy Shield, Globe of Negation, Legacy Weapon, Size Alteration.

Go with a reach weapon, combat reflexes, pushing assault, bodyguard while enlarged to have a 30ft diameter area of Nope. Pickup Phalanx Formation and people can stand next to you while you push enemies away.

Well, that seems like it needs a FAQ/Clarification. Wasn't there something about adding spells known meaning you can also cast them last year or so?

Sadly, the FAQ for New Spells Known only addresses adding spells known to your spell list. There's nothing about adding to spells prepared. Arcane Enlightenment would need to be FAQ'd directly due to the language it uses.

I agree it could use some clarification but I wouldn't hold my breath for a FAQ on it anytime soon. For an open-ended archetype like this some aspects just don't work and Paizo isn't likely to address every nuance (Id Rager not working w/ a large portion of the Emotional Foci is another example.)

Blood of Shadows is pretty new. It seems d20pfsrd isn't finished adding it to the site.

As far as Spirit Guide oracle w/ Arcane Enlightenment goes ...

The shaman can add a number of spells from the sorcerer/wizard spell list equal to her Charisma modifier (minimum 1) to the list of shaman spells she can prepare.

Since Oracles are spontaneous casters with nothing to prepare they can't actually use the spells they add.

Gnomes are a solid choice since their racial works on Ilusion(shadow) spells. You can swap out Gnome Magic for Shadowplay if you want to cover darkness & shadow spells.

If you go Wayang, Shadow Stencils are a must for a cheap +1 for shadow spell DCs.

The Shadow Mystery from Blood of Shadows has a revelation that lets you add cha mod (1/2 oracle lvl max) Illusion(shadow)/Darkness spells from the sorc/wiz list to your spells known and turns them Divine. You can trade out spells too as you level. The Shadow Mastery revelation adds 1% reality/oracle lvl that stacks w/ Solid Shadows. The Army of Darkness revelation is flavorful as hell for summons.

When making a full attack action, a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon.

That kills an extra attack from Haste w/ Mystic Bolts.

If they really wanted to use a 2/3 BAB, 6 lvl caster for the chassis, then Hunter is a much better choice: strip out the AC, spells and teamwork feats, add in shapeshifting and keep Animal Focus and bam, you have a martial shapeshifter that doesn't suck.

That exists already: Feral Hunter. It's just limited to medium Wild Shape and keeps 6th level spells.

Just a note about the build.... Spell Specialization requires 13int

I haven't compared dirty tricks to feinting but if you have Blood of Shadows you might look into Underhanded Trick. It gives Improved Dirty Trick, qualifies you for Greater Dirty Trick @ 6th (still have to pick it) and your blind can't be removed the 1st round.

It'd take DM handwaving but a Bladebound Magus with a Chainsaw for a BlackBlade screams fun.