Oddman80's page

per the rules of duration (CRB pg 304)

Some spells have effects that remain even after the spell’s magic is gone. Any ongoing effect that isn’t part of the spell’s duration entry isn’t considered magical. For instance, a spell that creates a loud sound and has no duration might deafen someone for a time, even permanently. This deafness couldn’t be counteracted because it is not itself magical (though it might be cured by other magic, such as restore senses).

If a spell had "Duration: Permanent" listed in its spell block, then I suppose the effect of the spell could then still be dispelled... but I don't know any spells that have such a listing.

being an ability, though.. and not a spell.. it doesn't have a spell block format. But i did notice, that the Focus Gaze ability of the Medusa's does not actually have a duration itself - it just says that the target has to roll anther Fort Save vs the Medusa's Petrifying Gaze ability, which has a 1 minute duration.
However... if the target fails their save and had already been slowed by a previous Petrifying Gaze, the result is they become Petrified Permanently... which is an effect that remains after the Petrifying Gaze's listed 1 minute duration.... so i THINK... that means the petrification itself is NOT considered magical, and therefore cannot be dispelled.

Dispel Magic can't dispel effects despite the first sentence, as effects are no valid targets.

Considering the number of magical effects in Pathfinder, I think it's safe to keep it that way. Unless you want to see Barbarian's Rage being dispelled.

well.. rage has no trait that would make it magical to begin with...

One other thing i noticed about the Rogue (Kaako Ashfeather)- she has 3 "Primal" Cantrips listed, but she should have 3 Primal and 1 Occult.

She gets Electric Arc as an innate Primal spell from the Storm's Lash Ancestry Feat.
She gets Guidance as an innate Occult spell from her Pendant of the Occult
So it seems that Know Direction comes form the Minor Magic Rogue feat, but she should get a second cantrip with that as well. And since Know Direction is on every spell list - the 2nd cantrip could theoretically come from any spell list too...

That said - I love the flavor of Kaako. And I really look forward to playing her in my upcoming game.

hmm... 8 characters long

Anyone guess Luchador?

I am hoping for Kineticist and a new Martial/Tactician class... something kind of like the 3.5 Marshall that can grant movement and actions to its Allies

well - this is my first game with Frankie, so i am assuming that's where the 4 fame and reputation came from

I did not notice that the other Outpost games I signed up for were both quests... whoops - that was quite a surprise when the GM said "...as you make you final posts..." after a single encounter.

hey - there is a ton of OOC chat in the gameplay thread. can we keep that sort of thing over here?

thank you GM Numbat that was super helpful.
When trying to figure things out, prior to that advice, i accidentally made an alias instead of a character, and dotted the gamepaly with it. Not sure if it can be deleted. if not - apologies.

i think the issue is that the Flight Hex (su) is one single hex that gives a bunch of benefits.

If it was Flight Hex (Su) provides the following unique abilities:

oooohhh... i had been eyeing a few of those dangerous delves modules a few weeks ago. My procrastination is rewarded once again!!!

Thanks for the sale. I look forward to my future purchases.

Well, you can discount it all you want, but in the text on curses it says: "The oracle’s curse cannot be removed or dispelled without the aid of a deity" which seems pretty straight forward to me.

As Divine casters, don't oracles get their spells from deities?

The Aboleth curse gives a -2 penalty to saves vs mind affecting affects. The first level oracle spell "Rite of Centered Mind" would halve the penalty or negate it completely depending on the specific effect the oracle is saving against. Can I assume nobody has an issue with an Aboleth Cursed Oracle using this spell?

The Legalistic curse causes one to become sickened for 24 hours if you ever break your word about something. The first level oracle spell "Remove Sickness" suppresses the sickened condition. It doesn't remove it, it just suppresses the effects for the duration of the spell. Can I assume nobody has an issue with a Legalistic Oracle using this spell?

The Plagued curse causes one to take a -1 penalty against diseases. Once again, the level 1 oracle spell "Remove Sickness" would not only counter the -1 penalty, but also give an additional +3 bonus beyond that.

For extra fun - what about a dual cursed Legalistic + Plagued Oracle? The base Plagued curse still makes the oracle immune to the sickened condition - which is pretty much the only downside of the legalistic curse. They can gain the level benefits of Legalistic, without suffering anything besides the -1 to saves vs diseases and infestations.

None of these examples remove or dispell the curses from the oracles - they simply counteract the curse sufficiently, that the penalty of the curse is not as noticeable.

Wait until the target does something remotely impressive in combat and then say:
"Damn! I know we're fighting, but that was pretty sweet what you just did. Up top, bro! I give praise where praise is due!"

Then Roll Bluff as you hold your hand up and wait for him to give you the high five.

88. GM: Your ship has been sailing in calm seas for the past two days. the weather looks good. You should be able to to get back to your village in time to save them.
-
five minutes later after some benign interactions with npcs on the ship...
-
GM: A dark mist settles around your ship. The man in the crow's nest shouts "HARD A PORT! HARD A PORT!" and the captain shouts to the crew "Drop the starboard main brace! Haul the port! Do it now, ya gobs!" as he turns the ships wheel to to the left and the entire ship lurches around. "Land Ho!" the Barrelman hollers. The caltain yells back "Check yer eyes ya bloody cockroach - we's a 5 miles off a the nearest shore!". As the ship finishes its hard turn, you hear a horrifying grating sound of wood scraping against rock, and the constant swaying feeling of the oceans waves cease. The black mist begins to lift, and you find your ship is perched atop a black stone mountain. As the mist clears further, all you see are mountains... range after range... as far as your eyes can see.
-
This happened to me last night. We all said "Oh F--"

Isonaroc wrote:

River of Sticks wrote:

79. GM: There's a door ahead.

Rogue: I check for Traps. ... Looks like a 34 after bonuses.
GM: You look the door over, but do not FIND any traps. Do you want to open the door?

I usually go with "see" as it's slightly more paranoia inducing.

if you go with see then that opens the player up to asking if they can smell/hear a trap if you say they cant see one

GM: Do you have any bonuses to hearing-based or smell-based perception checks?

Player: <in a sad voice> No.

GM: <with a slight tilt of the head> Then no.... you don't.

Nice job with the 7 year Thread-Necro.

;P

61) GM: "Hey guys. Sorry I had to miss the last couple sessions. Speaking of which, I want you to meet my girlfriend - she's going to be joining us from now on. Nown she's never played before, so be patient, but I've helped her make a character that I think she will enjoy playing. Its an awakened pony packlord druid... what did you say her nane was, sweetie? that's right, Fluttershy"

they might not say it out loud. but i guarantee they will be thinking it.

58) "after inspecting the closest statue,
you look up and find that a number of the angelic statutes on the far side of the alter now appear to have moved closer to you.... focusing back at the statue you were just inspecting, it seems as if it must have raised one of its arms while you weren't looking.... roll your various knowledge checks, please! okay - Billy, i need you tho make a fortitude save right now, to NOT BLINK."

Lady-J wrote:

an awakened gorilla is cr2 so it would be level 2 the awakened spell doesn't add cr to the animal

Unfortunately, Lady-J is correct: awaken, although it adds 2 additional hit dice (for a total of 5HD and BAB+3), does not increase the CR by RAW, and thus an awakened gorilla is CR2 and counts as a 2nd level cohort, upon which class levels can be added.

So a 7th level PC with a leadership score of at least 7 will attract a 5th level cohort, allowing you to add 3 class levels onto the gorilla, who would then have 8HD but count as 5th level. The stat array of a gorilla is not actually far off that of a 15pt gen human.... disturbingly.

Pros: Large sized, 3 extra HD, +1 BAB over a normal NPC
Cons: Skill points are not gained retroactively for an increase in Int (looking at the base 3 HD); Large sized; -2 class levels; and unlike a regular NPC Cohort it doesn't come with its own gear (awaken doesn't magically create NPC wealth).

** spoiler omitted **...

But the npc wouldn't have a 15 point by pc stat array. they would have an npc stat array per the rules of creating npcs.

Also - an awakened gorrilla is a magical beast and is therefore not a standard cohort - but rather a Monstrous Cohort. Paizo advises GMs to look at other monstrous cohorts from the list in order to properly determine what level the proposed monstrous cohort should be.

the 4 hit die (intelligent large magical beast) giant eagle is considered a level 6 cohort.

the 5 hit die, (non-intelligent large animal) giant vulture is a level 7 cohort

the 6 hit die, (non-intelligent large magical beast) sea cat is a level 8 cohort

none of these creatures have SLAs - they all have basic natural attacks, and two modes of movement (like the gorilla).

given all of this, i would think the awakened gorilla would fall more on the level 7-8 side of things.

What if you polymorph into a dolphin or a whale?

Neither of those creatures have the ability to breath under water, and the Hold Breath (Ex) ability is not granted by any of the polymorph spells as far as i can tell.

I'm not really familiar with West Marches - but the idea of a group of 12-20 people trying to play a role play game together seems insane to me...

Do you have female friends who have actually played Pen & Paper Table Top Role Playing Games?

Are your female friends also close friends with one another? If so, have you offered to run a dedicated campaign for just them? It could be a matter of not wanting to have to learn the game alongside more experienced players.

Honestly - you should just talk to them about it and ask them for their input. If you have already done this, and they have told you that they just aren't interested, then you are probably S.O.L.

in the home game i ran i just made up a list of about 20-30 new materials that just were new or just combined what 2 or 3 already existing materials did i think i also changed how mithal worked for weapons to make it actually worth wile made it so it could be wielded at either what the weapon was marked as or one weapon category lighter wielders choice so a 2h weapon could be used as a 2h or a 1h, a 1h could be a 1h or light and but i forgot what i gave light weapons was probably just a +2 to hit or something

++

Care to share? I have a friend that was going to start a game that was completely focused around unique material properties for weapons and armor - A sort of Monster Hunter game, where the Adventuring Party is sent after unique creatures that yield hides, etc with special properties for armor-crafting, as well as to dangerous, hard to find places for unique mineral/metal resource collection. We are funded by wealthy nobleman who wants to open franchise weapon/armor shops throughout the land.

Knowing my friends socio-political leanings... i am pretty sure our benefactor will eventually become the BBEG of the campaign... but we can just pretend we don't see it coming... :)

the problem with the Rhoka example is - even if you allowed it, only half of the sword's damage would be the type you need. So,, if you do 40 damage against something with hardness 13, only 20 of the damage fully bypasses the hardness, and the other 20 gets knocked down to 7.... so its like none of the weapon is made form adamantine... Same thing goes for DR 10/Cold Iron or silver, etc...

I do like the idea of lucerne hammer idea... it would be pretty niche, as only a small handfull of weapons are built likt that:

• Boarding Axe
  
• Bec de Corbin
  
• Lucerne Hammer
  
• Planson (though is bludgeoning is wood-based, and therefore less versatile)
  
• Dwarven Maulaxe
  
• Gnome Hooked Hammer
  
• Kyoketsu Shoge

Isn't this the Paizo-hosted Subforum for the Mutants and Masterminds RPG?

Also - ask you GM if you will be using Unchained Background Skills.
You may have a couple of extra skills ranks per level that you could invest in non-adventuring skills, that correspond to activities you like doing during your free time, such as:

• Appraise
  
• Craft
  
• Handle Animal
  
• Knowledge (engineering)
  
• Knowledge (geography)
  
• Knowledge (history)
  
• Knowledge (nobility)
  
• Linguistics
  
• Perform
  
• Profession
  
• Sleight of Hand

@King_Namazu - i'm sorry the feedback hadn't been more helpful. knowing, now, that this is a horror-type campaign is actually quite helpful.

i think most people were trying to get as much info as possible, not only to visage how severe a consequence they thought appropriate, but also because they couldn't imagine the events (as you first wrote then) and the seemingly desired backlash to ever fit into any of their own games...

That said... why not just have them be haunted? if they aren't getting good night sleep due to nightmares every night, they will be fatigued and even exhausted. that is a huge debuff to martial players.

create an actual haunt as well - one they will need to destroy - but the method of destruction will only be discovered through some non-combat investigation (may even lead them to the crazy evil witch grandma along the way). maybe they need to track down whoever forced then to fight or whoever was mentally controlling them (assuming these are different people) and bring them to justice.

if they ignore the haunt they remain exhausted, and people in town keep getting injured and maybe even killed each day when the haunt resets.

the town can either view them as heroes for trying to save them from the haunt or as the worst of the worst - plaguebearers that brought the haunt to their town. they may even have to deal with an angry and vicious mob

What happens if I want to make 20 Sleight of hand checks to hide something upon my person?

Well - if it is for the purpose of hiding 20 different items, it shouldn't be a problem. roll 20 individual SoH checks and keep track of which roll belongs to which item. Then - later - when you are frisked, anything that was hidden with a SoH less than the target's frisk-based perception check would be discovered.

If you are asking "what if i want to try to hide a single item 20 times?" Well, then I (as the GM) would say "Okay, sure. Give me one roll to represent the final attempt, and you can have a +3 circumstance bonus from your previous attempts shredding some light on a few hiding spots you now know really won't work"

Undead are immune to NL, just to point out.

It took all my will not to post this earlier, out of fear i would just derail the thread...

@Chess Pwn- I take it you also think that acid - then, does not deal acid damage? per the top entry in the Environment Rules:

Acid
Corrosive acids deals 1d6 points of damage per round of exposure, except in the case of total immersion (such as in a vat of acid), which deals 10d6 points of damage per round.

It doesn't say it deals acid damage, so it must deal untyped damage, right? and creatures that are immune to acid or resistant to acid will still take full damage while in acid.... right?

Chess Pwn wrote:

If it doesn't say it does cold damage it isn't cold damage and resit and protect don't apply

At some point, I think it's necessary to apply reasonable assumptions to the game to prevent it from breaking. If the damage wasn't due to cold, then every cold-resistant creature that lived in the arctic would be dead from the inevitable natural 1's on their 24x7 saving throws.

THIS x 1000.

In the Cold Environment rules, what is meant by "Protected"?

Other than being indoors with a healthy fire burning in the hearth, does "protection" only refer to magical means such as Endure Elements, Protection from Energy (Cold) and Resist Energy (Cold) spells, or can mundane things such as cold weather outfits and campfires also provide "protection" from cold weather?

...you have utterly failed to point out where the Sleight of Hand rules, or the opposed check rules for that matter, explicitly states that you can't take 20.

Ok - let me try again.

when a task has no penalty of failure, and you have no time constraint n you can take 20. this assumes you take 20x as long as normal amd one of the 20 tries will result on a 20. this does not mean that the very last try results in a 20.

imagine programming a robot to do the task to times... if the task is getting out of bindings, regardless of wnen the 20 occurred, the end result after those 20 tries, is that the robot will have escaped the bindings so long as the roll of 20 beat the DC.

same with looking for traps. same for jumping high enough to grab the bag of gold from the high up ledge. after 20 tries, the objective will have been acomplished so long as whenever the 20 was rolled, the result beat the DC.

However - this is not the case with opposed checks. If the robot hid something 20 times, well sure, one of those times may have been great, but the final try may have actually been horrendous - and THAT is the check that will be used vs the opposed roll.

Taking 20 is not "taking 20 times as long as normal to ensure that the one time you do something, you do it your very best"

Taking 20 is literally doing the task over and over again 20 times. but the chance that the 20 roll is the final roll is no greater than for it to be the first roll.

in game - you don't actually know how well you do on a 20 point range. knowing the numeric result of a roll is just metaknowledge, and using it to determine your next actions is meta gaming. In game, your character only knows if they succeed or if they fail (and in some cases fail extra bad). but every time they try a skill they are trying their best - it's just that results may vary.

so when you make a disguise for yourself, or you hide something on your body, or you try to hide yourself from people that you know will be coming by in a few minutes, you just roll the skill - because until the opposed roll is made, you haven't completed the first attempt

I know quoting 3.5 rules or 3.5 FAQ answers is for the most part irrelevant when determining rules for Pathfinder. However - the language for Taking 20 did not change at all between 3.5 and Pathfinder. Additionally, the text regarding hiding objects through sleight of hand only changed in so much as it references Perception now in stead of Spot and Search skills. SO - I am just going to leave this hear to add to the discussion:

How can I tell whether or not I can take 20 on a check, and what constitutes “failure” on a check?

Taking 20 is simply a time-saving short-cut that avoids requiring a player to roll and roll until he gets a 20 on a check that everyone knows he’ll simply retry until he either succeeds or is convinced he can’t.

Ultimately, whether or not you can take 20 relies on only three criteria:

• The check allows you to try again. Each skill has a “Try Again” entry that lists whether you can attempt the same task again. If you can’t retry the task, you can’t take 20 (since taking 20 involves retrying the task). You can’t retry a Decipher Script check, so taking 20 is out of the question.

• Failure does not carry an inherent penalty (that is, a consequence). If something bad happens when you fail a check, you can’t take 20, since the DM needs to know exactly when or how often failure occurs. When you’re halfway up a wall and fail a Climb check, you might fall and take damage. That’s an inherent consequence, so you can’t normally take 20 on Climb checks.

• You have available time equal to making the check 20 times. If you have only 1 minute until the walls of the room slide together and crush you, you obviously can’t take 20 on a Search check to find the hidden off switch (since that takes 20 rounds).

There’s no perfect list of which checks do or don’t allow taking 20. For example, you can retry Spot checks, and it doesn’t seem like a failed Spot check carries any inherent consequence. Does that mean you can take 20 on Spot checks when keeping watch for monsters sneaking up on your campsite?

Well, yes and no. If you stare at the same sight for 2 minutes, you can absolutely take 20 on a Spot check to get a really good look at it. But if an assassin is sneaking through the shadows toward you, he’s probably not there for that whole 2 minutes. Thus, you couldn’t take 20, since you don’t actually have available time equal to making the check 20 times against that enemy. You’d have to roll your Spot check normally (opposed by the assassin’s Hide check) to notice the enemy.

Similarly, if a check’s success or failure depends on another character’s opposed roll, both sides have to roll when that opposition occurs—you can’t take 20 and “save up” the maximum result. If you hide in the bushes to attack a group of orcs that will walk by later, you can’t take 20 on the Hide check, since the success or failure of your Hide check isn’t resolved until the orcs make their Spot checks. You can’t take 20 on a Use Rope check to tie someone up, since you don’t really know how successful you’ve been until that enemy tries to struggle free.

i think the problem is that most magic users are aware of these strong spells as a solution to most of their problems, and plan on learning such spells accordingly - while most martial characters focus so much on just doing the most damage to the most things as possible...

The end result is - they are screwed when facing high level intelligent magic users.

That does not mean - though - that PAIZO has not provided the necessary resources for martial character to be able to shut down these magic users and prevent them from getting away... it just means the players playing them are choosing to use there resources for other things.

Having a high enough UMD for things like scrolls of Dimensional Lock may not be reasonable...

But Step Up as well as Step Up and Strike feats can put a real hamper on a mage's escape plans. They might need to stick around and cast defensively - in which case, the Disruptive feat makes if far more difficult for them to get their spells off in the first place. Drinking a potion of Silence before closing in on the wizard shuts down most of the escape spells (e.g., emergency force sphere, dimension door, and teleport). Now it seems that their only hope of escape is to get 25' away from you and cast. They could choose to take the Attack of Opportunity from moving away from you, but they know you could trip them and they would be screwed, so they chose to full withdraw, and HOPE that your armor will slow you down enough that they can get away to a place they can cast next round. What they didn't account for was PIN DOWN - and now they are stuck - right in front of you and it is your turn... FULL ATTACK TIME.

Them. The word you're looking for is 'them'.

Interesting... http://grammar.about.com/od/rs/g/Singular-They.htm

When I went to school, doing this was always marked as incorrect. I found it terribly frustrating, given how awkward it was to write speak about a generic, hypothetical person without using the singular "They".

It's a relief to hear that this has become more widely accepted, and no longer just colloquial.

Anyway.... WOOHOO! I Won!

That was the craziest Roll-Off i have ever seen. I feel bad for Trekkie9090... i am almost inspired to make my own 3rd party product, just to give to [insert gender-less personal pronoun here].

Looks like it's

JosMartigan

For the Lucky 13 win as the RNG seems to think giving Lathiira and Oddman80 13's again is funny.

I'll let the inimitable Rick Kunz know to gift you all six FGP PDFs JosMartigan.

That's cool... I'll just download them a second time, for posterity. :)

I am interested. Count me in. Also, a heart felt thank you to Taig and all of the other contributors.

They banned Monk for being Overpowered.

I seem to have slipped into the bizzaro realm. Any pointers on how to get out?

The GM is always right.
That said, right in the CRB, in the combat section, within the rules for charging, it
says:

If you don't have line of sight to the opponent at the start of your turn, you can't charge that opponent.

I just attempted to run the game "The Gobbler" with my kids as a Thanksgiving day treat. it was fun, but pretty simple. Any one want to share any other Thanksgiving themed adventures you have run?

for reference:
Here is The Gobbler

"Whatever you do, don't look into my friend's eyes..." you tell the enemy fighting your party's rapier-wielding rogue. Enemy cannot help but glance at the ally's eyes as the rapier is driven into the enemy's gut.
"...his glance is rather PENETRATING"

"Are you familiar with Tordok's music?" you ask a guy fighting the party barbarian, just as Tordok bring's his earth breaker down on the enemy.
"He's had smash hit after smash hit!"

and so on, and so forth...

meh none of the fighters i make would touch combat expertise with a 10 foot pole...

The Combat Expertise thing applies to all melee classes that plan on doing anything beyond straight damage. there are 40 different combat feats that have Combat Expertise as a prerequisite. Tripping, Throwing, Stealing, Disarming, Feinting, Dirty Tricks, and more all key off it...

so, yeah - does not just benefit the Wizard.
It would probably result in the reduction of Big Dumb Fighters and a an uptick in Tactician-styled ones. Though i suppose if you want that and are willing to homebrew feats, you may be also willing to homebrew that Combat Expertise is a bonus feat granted whenever you take one of the feats that require it as a prereq...

Here are some UNIQUE RACES MY GM HAS MADE

Whenever we play a game he runs, these races are available. I am on my second flower-type plantfolk (one a nature oracle, the other a leshy-warden druid). I have also recently played ahalf-orc slayer, a panthor-varient catfolk monk, a were-tiger two-handed ranger, a half-undead graveborn skald, a halfling filtcher rogue, a goblin feral gnasher barbarian, a gnome heavens shaman, an ifrit oracle, a half-orc wizard, an orc dirty fighter, an elf witch, a halfling barbarian, and a half-orc barbarian.

@ Kaliel Windstorm - All your calculations were based off of lions as you know them. In the world of Golarion, The lion is not only the size of the Clydesdale, but also slightly stronger than the Clydesdale.

In our world, No one would try to put a saddle on a lion and attempt to ride it.

In Golarion, while not common (due to the difficulty of commoners training them) Lion Mounts are well known and symbols of prestige.

Yeah, well... last session my druid died one round after the party cleric died. The rest of the party considerred seppuku, cause they were in the middle of the dessert. "How on earth are we going to make it back to civilization without healing???"

what he needs is "Gaseous Form"

What do you think should happen if you have something else, like Witch's White Hair or an Alchemal Tentacle, 1 hand free and the other using a Shield (or something)? Do you think the Hair or the Tentacle should count as a "hand" with respect to having 2 hands free? I think it should, but I don't think it officially, technically does.

White hair which allows you to grapple the opponent with hte hair without ever gainning the grappled condition - as such - you never gain the restriction of only being able to perform actions that do not require two hands.

the alchemist discovery Tentacle says the tentacle actually has the grab ability - which means that it can, on its own (i.e. without any hands free) make a grapple check without penalty.

Well you could buy an actual book, or PDF. Rulebook PDFs are cheap. If you rely exclusively on the PFSRD (which isn't even Paizo's site!), Paizo don't own you anything. If you don't want to pay, you can't expect to be allowed to make demands.

You realize there are people who focus their spending on Adventure Paths, Modules, and non-PRD splatbooks (Since these things are notfreely provided on the Paizo PRD). These people still have a financial investment in Pathifnder, and it is perfectly reasonable that they feel their voice should be heard as well.

I remember being shocked by how drastic a price change they had made the Mask of Stoney Demeanor a few month ago. Yes - it had been underpriced, but it was a sweet and powerful item. And due to their affordability, on numerous occasions had worked them into my vharacter builds. When the price change occurred, with the exception of one character (a really shady Halfling Filcher Rogue) it no longer made sense to have the item. But the item stil did the thing I had grown to love. Which makes sense - as there was never any confusion as to what the item did in the first place.

So it is peculiar that Paizo would take such a different approach for all of the other items in Ultimate Equipment. Why change the items when nobody was confused about the items. The only complaint by GNs was that the items were too cheap for what they did. So why not just adjust the price?

For a number of these items, they changed what the items do so drastically, that there are other, cheaper/better items out there that do the same thing.

What was done here would be the equivalent of Tesla first putting their car on the market for the same price as a Dodge Dart. Everyone wil pick the Tesla - it's unbelievably better at that price point. But then, when Tesla was made aware of this, rather than adjusting the price of their awesome vehicle that people wanted, they instead replaced each of their amazing vehicles with a foot powered beach surrey.
WTF!?!

It sounds like you are trying to make real world assumptions and inject them into a game with stat-block based rules.... This is kind of ironic. It's like the twist ending nobody was expecting