Eyraphel Teralyn's page

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Eyraphel lifted his arm to inspect the fresh dent in his armor. It wasn't badly damaged, thankfully, but still it taunted him. He never would have taken that hit if he had his old bastard sword. He drew his longsword from the dead ogre's chest as it lay bleeding on the ground.

It just doesn't have the same range or weight, he thought.

He bent to one knee and rested his forehead on the sword's hilt.

"General of Vengeance, Angel of the Crimson Wing, I declare this foul beast slain in your name. The innocent of Brighthaven will sleep soundly that we have ridden the town of this skulking predator. I pray that you hear me now, as I beseech thee, Ragathiel, to guide my hand in my endeavor to further your mission while I am prevented from marching on the demons of the Worldwound. May your eyes be ever upon us and your wings shield us."

As he stood, he could feel the nagging in the back of his mind. He won't answer you. Mendev burns while you waste time here, and you've even given up his holy weapon. He stared at the longsword in his hand before sheathing it. It wasn't his fault the weaponsmiths have failed to produce a weapon with the right size and weight. For those trained to use it, the bastard sword was a marvel of balance and power, but the smiths keep claiming "the longsword is faster" or "you want a greatsword for powerful strikes." Few understood the bond Ragathiel's followers have with his faith's weapon, but then few are capable of wielding it as he does.

Perhaps the will of the goddess of fate bars the power of demigods from reaching this place.

Eyraphel paused, staring out from the edge of Brighthaven's cliffs. It was an interesting thought, but it felt almost blasphemous. Could he turn to a god who can reach their follows here? How could he, a paladin and devout soldier in the General of Vengeance's army desert his patron?

You have allies. You'd be a fool to do nothing while you seek guidance from an angel who may never answer you.

It was true. Even the Hand of the Inheritor, Iomedae's herald, had originally served Ragathiel, and though Eyraphel found himself without orders, he was far from useless. He drew the longsword once again and lifted it to the sun. The light gleamed off the sword, the trusted weapon of Iomedae's faithful, dimming only for the spots of fresh ogre blood.

I will offer my sword to the Inheritor. She will guide me back to Ragathiel.

He turned back toward Brighthaven and began the hike back. He wondered how the other Empyreans would treat his new resolution. He had recounted so many of Ragathiel's tales to them that he'd heard rumors of the men calling him the angel's son. Perhaps it was unfounded, but he'd be lying if he said he didn't like that rumor, and with the other talk of "hobgoblins" and bandits about, the Empyreans needed a battle herald of their own.

I may be cut off from you now, General, but one day the son will return to his father's side.

Lahasha wrote:
your actions cannot be described as Good.

Wanting to protect innocent gatherers and new players is Good. Wanting to provide our players with the equipment and support necessary to effectively fulfill our mission is Good.

By AGC's actions of farming in that hex, you take resources from our alliance that could have been used to further that Good purpose. We act in defense of that Good. Good does not mean that we'll bake you a cake to take with your shiny new T2 drops on your way home.

As mentioned previously, farming that escalation in our territory is an affront to the EBA and intention to refuse our other agents of Good the tools they need to be effective. It is just as harmful to our cause as attacking our gatherers or killing our players and damaging their gear.

Forgive me, but it seems much of this thread's issue may be that they equate Neutral Good with "Goody Two-Shoes" priests and monks who preach Good, but shudder at the thought of getting their hands dirty.

Boy, I can't wait for my Paladin to hit this scene.

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Lahasha wrote:
when I was first down in the southeast fighting the Ustalavs with the AGC we got no polite request to leave.

Though I don't believe I was present for the initial meeting on that occasion, I wouldn't be surprised if AGC didn't get a warning for farming a valuable escalation in a hex we claimed. We're not Lawful, and we don't feel bound to following a specific procedure when there is sufficient reason to believe it's not necessary.

When dealing with a new player or someone who simply may not know better, then sure. We'll make sure they know we've claimed the area and even offer them help with the game if they're unaffiliated. An introduction and warning is helpful in these circumstances.

A warning given to a previously-hostile company farming in our territory despite (and likely in spite of) it being claimed would fall on deaf ears. Organized activity in our territory led by prominent members of a hostile company is an affront to the alliance's sovereignty, not an accidental overstepping of boundaries.

Perhaps you were all unaware, and if so I apologize for whatever part I may have played in the response, but I find that highly unlikely. We recognize the limitations of being strictly Lawful, and we're not going to chase after hostile parties shouting their rights at them before engaging. When it comes to AGC and a resource as valuable as a T2 escalation, there's plenty of reason to believe you all knew the consequences already.

If you were relying on that warning to tell you when to run, then I remind you we're Neutral Good, not LG.

And again, if none of you genuinely had any idea we'd claimed the territory, then I apologize. In a thread as large as this one, one would think AGC's leadership would be well aware.

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Tharak Venethorn wrote:
Lam has backed you guys up in the past so you could attempt to enlighten him on how you are not evil.

I haven't read through this thread, and I don't really intend to. I've seen enough vitriol in previous threads that I don't want to burn myself out on this one, too. However, I will address the quoted topic.

One major shortcoming of the D&D/Pathfinder system has always been alignment. It's fundamentally flawed, but it works well enough that tabletop groups of players can usually come to agreements about how it works. One challenge we face by converting this game to an MMO is dealing with the dreaded alignment debate on a much larger scale.

My personal feelings follow.

Name any single action and you could describe any number of circumstances for which that action would apply to almost any alignment.

Stealing? Most likely chaotic, but who are you stealing from? And why? Robin Hood is likely CG, but the common thief is likely CN, working for his or her own gain.

What about murder? "Chaotic Evil!" most people shout. My paladin "murdered" plenty of demons at the table. Plenty of humanoids that refused to surrender, too.

In short, to me, the Law vs Chaos axis deals with either the law of the land or your own code and how strictly you adhere to it. The Good vs Evil axis speaks more for your intentions and how selfish/altruistic you are.

Based on my above views on alignment, I'd respond as such: The EBA (being predominantly Neutral Good) finds itself in a defensible corner of the map where we can remain mostly out of the way. Those who travel to the declared territory are (largely) there because they mean to visit us. As for Law vs Chaos, the EBA wanted to lay down a border to inform its neighbors, but visitors are absolutely welcome. We care less about following the rule as written to the letter and more about welcoming those who may not know better and politely asking those who do know better to refrain.

As stated, we are predominantly NG and want to see this area of the River Kingdoms grow to be inviting to new players. We want the non-consensual PVP of the past to be a fringe element, in favor of organized PVP for strategic locations or objectives. We seek to protect those who cannot protect themselves and provide a welcoming environment for new players and new members alike. I rule this as a Good intention.

Declaring a border (and declaring it where it now lies) isn't done out of greed, it's a necessity. Every hex included is factored into our projections for required resources over time. Bulk resources, escalations in monster hexes, resources in nodes, and even strategic locations within the borders are essential to fulfilling our Good mission.

We have a glorious vision for the Everbloom Alliance. We work only to ensure that our goals can be successful. Threatening the sovereignty of that border threatens our ability to provide that bastion of safety. I believe this is still Neutral Good.


For the record, I didn't follow the damage thread very much. I wasn't implying you, specifically, didn't know how the reporting works, and I recall you mentioning that possibility in the original post. I'm not bringing it up to discuss it, I'm using it as an example.

Again, not targeted at anyone in particular.

As for the rest, I get a very strange "guilty until proven innocent" vibe from your reply. Very unbecoming of someone belonging to a Lawful settlement, but I suppose Lawful Evil is perfect for that.

Gol Guurzak wrote:

the only plausible answer to that question is "the devs are preferentially giving TEO members strategically valuable information not available to the general playerbase."

I look forward to the day that players attribute our successes to the effort we put into them as an organization, rather than accusing the largest group in the game of being "preferred" by the GMs because someone misinterpreted a post or doesn't know how the damage-reporting system works.

Gol Guurzak wrote:
the claim as stated cannot reasonably be interpreted as anything other than an assertion of game-mechanic fact.

Sure it can: as an assertion that, based on Cheatle's experiences, he believes to be true.

I know next to nothing about what anyone else on the server has, and I don't even know what all Michelle might have, but I would bet Cheatle's assertion is true.

We don't know how difficult it would be to add those hexes as open PvP to begin with. That function may be embedded into the War of Towers code in a way that applying that kind of "hotfix" to PvP would take actual coding time.

As for balancing now vs future, I still maintain that the best solution to this issue is players declaring open PvP with other companies/settlements through feuds, etc. That doesn't mean I agree with the rep regen changes we've already gotten. Did it regenerate too quickly? Yes, but without a viable alternative, it kind of needed to.

@Ravenlute, the tower windows are only marginally comparable in my mind. The towers don't mean nearly as much to players currently, so monster hexes have far more players in them than tower hexes, in my experience.

It sounds to me like the best solution to your issue is the ability to declare feuds on opposing companies and on hexes in general. To me, this is the best way to solve the problem and make the game more enjoyable and meaningful.

Anything implemented in lieu of that system is just duct tape. I don't think the game needs any extra temporary work done to it when they can be working on permanent features.

Gol Phyllain wrote:
these two places are suppose to have the best loot and raw materials in the game

I believe the design intent is that this fact alone will drive players to that hex, specifically. These hexes are, in fact, more dangerous to go to specifically because these are the points at which bandits should be lying in wait.

If that's not currently true, then there is some other cause. Perhaps the monster hexes aren't special enough resource-wise, perhaps there aren't enough players in the game for the kind of bandit population we need, or perhaps there just aren't enough players looking to kill off/farm escalations.

It's a big map, and you could likely never see anyone at all if you stayed out of towns and monster hexes. As soon as you enter that monster hex, though, the chances of someone else finding you is increased significantly.

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Thanks for the response, Tigari. There is definitely a distinction to be made between a flawed but intentional decision and a bug that was never working as intended.

I think this is dangerous for us to consider, though, because how will we know what is intended by the developers and what isn't? We report things that we believe are unintentional as bugs, but how long do we wait before a "bug" is considered intentional after being silently ignored by the developers we reported it to? We knew mobs weren't using proper attacks, but it wasn't until someone finally encountered Ustalavians that we found an example of that bug that was really imbalanced.

By prioritizing other fixes first, does the developer assume responsibility for this specific case of the same bug? Do we blame the developers who had both pieces of the puzzle but didn't put them together? Or do we expect the players to predict the developers' response to issues they aren't even aware of?

In Alpha, we could explore every bug and exploit freely to understand just how bugged that thing was. Now, players are left second-guessing the developers and, worse, their intentions.

I fully agree that the Ustalavian casters are less effective than they should be, but when players have to ponder the ethical and political consequences of killing any mob they come across, it cripples us. There's no way for us to know every intention of every developer. We have to act on what we have, not what we think the developers want, or else we won't be able to play the game at all without someone crying foul because their prediction of Goblinworks's intentions differs from ours.

Gol Tigari wrote:
We can sit here and debate this all day, but its all up to GW to decide.

Absolutely, and I apologize for my incessant questioning, but I'm trying to get down to the misunderstandings at the root of this issue. Thank you for obliging me with answers.

I think "taking advantage" is a very broad term. Essentially, this bug has gotten a lot of attention because some players classify farming mobs that are easier than they should be as taking advantage of that bug. I won't disagree with that interpretation. Others interpret it to mean that exploits are things players must actively do to give themselves an advantage over other players that they wouldn't otherwise have.

Humor me for one further example:

Starter goblins used to drop more than they should have. It was not considered exploiting to farm them, as many players did. Every player could kill a goblin, get the same chance at loot. It didn't matter how you did it or what technique you used. Now, they drop next to nothing.

What if you could drag all those Desperate Goblins over the hex border and they'd turn back to their loot-giving selves? This would be an action or combination of actions that gives that player an advantage over every other player killing goblins. This is, to me, clearly an exploit.

To me, there is no exploitative action a player must perform to benefit from the Ustalav casters. They don't have to walk backwards, or use a particular utility that inexplicably makes you immune. No, every player, regardless of technique or build receives the same benefit from killing a caster.

That benefit may not be intended to be as rewarding as it is, but it's very different, in my mind, from actively provoking some state that makes them easier for you than the next player.

Perhaps better clarification is required from someone whose opinion actually matters, but that likely requires a thread on GW.

Take advantage how?

But why should it be an exploit, according to Goblinworks's definition?

Gol Tink wrote:
Remember when there was a mob that basically doesn't fight back, that drops valuable T2 recipes? Remember when that wasn't considered an exploit?

Pathfinder Online remembers.

Though this does highlight the underlying problem in this thread. What actually is an exploit? How does this bug fit some players' interpretations of an exploit but not others'?

It does "fight back," just not with damage. Rather than fixing the individual mob, all they might have to do is make it so they can't spawn support casters without melee-types to support.

Gol Phyllain wrote:
Bob could have missed all those reports, unlikely but possible. You actually didn't report it, or GW saw the reports and just kind of swept them under the rug in the hopes that only one group would use this bug to their advantage. All three of those possibilities are troubling in their own way.

If you take a complaint from one customer, who is calm and polite, it's easier to make it a lower priority. We treated this bug with a "no big deal" attitude, because this is the same bug that every other mob has, and it hardly makes the escalation itself "broken." We did, though, make it clear that it's the best thing for players to do at the moment.

If another customer storms in frantically half an hour later to complain that the same issue will bring the End Times, you're more likely to deal with it urgently to address their much higher level of concern. Golgotha's members were the first to (supposedly) treat this bug as a full-blown exploit. Around Goblinworks, that's surely a red flag. Somebody get the red phone and call the guys who balance stuff. Is this gamebreaking?

TEO reported it calmly, and (to my knowledge) we didn't get a response. Golgotha reported it with arms flailing wildly over their heads, and Goblinworks sprung into action by telling you to calm down. It's not an exploit, but it is something they intend to fix.

There is something to be said here for more transparency and uniformity among Goblinworks' responses, but this is hardly the straw that breaks the camel's back.

It's a separate program that some people use to connect to voice servers and talk. It also has text chat functions, so those without microphones can still participate in the conversation.

Other programs like it are Teamspeak and Ventrilo, you may hear about those as well.

In Pathfinder Online, it's very useful for finding people to play with, since it can be difficult to find those who are online if they're a hex or two or ten away.

If you're interested, you can find more information here.

Savage Grace wrote:
maybe they'd even think I'm crazy for thinking the game benefits when we provide it.

While I disagree with your judgment of this particular incident, the intention to do more than is required of you to make this game better for everyone is commendable.

Just perhaps consider giving the victims of your ire the same credit occasionally.

@Erian, I thought the Keepers marched on the Razmirans last night, not the Ustalavians? That doesn't quite sound like Ustalavian behavior.

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To play Asmodeus's Advocate and perhaps save Nihimon some typing (sorry if I'm not predicting your response well enough):

What, specifically, about Ustalav Casters/Ustalav Prelates invokes the Terms of Service clause you've quoted?

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I helped pioneer my group's methods for attacking groups in PvE. As such, I dealt with learning the individual Ustalavian invaders first-hand. I had no experience with them until EE.

They hit hard. It is, at times, difficult to tell what hit you when you're not familiar with the different types. They can slow (on opportunity? on critical?), and sometimes it seems they can stun (on some secondary condition?). It wasn't until I happened upon Enervation's entry in the spreadsheets that I realized that may be what the casters are using.

I recognize that farming those mobs while they behave as they do is considered exploitative by some. I recognize the validity and legitimacy of these individuals' opinions.

That said, I personally disagree with that opinion, which makes it difficult for me to see both sides. I did not report the issue with the same urgency the "exploit" individuals may have, because it never crossed my mind that this was exploitative in any way (especially after how the starter goblin issue was handled).

Now that more people are identifying this issue, some of the first players to consider it exploitative are raising the flag, and they're understandably upset that others have been "abusing" it, because, with the official decisions still pending at that time, these people consider it an exploit. I think we can all agree we'd be upset at other players abusing an exploit.

What has people all heated up here is what's actually an "exploit" and what's just imbalanced for now. Perhaps something productive can be accomplished before this thread ultimately dies: Can we assume that by filing bug reports Goblinworks will call out official exploits as they see fit? Or must we raise every issue like this with some arbitrary, defined degree of urgency?

Side note: Something entirely separate that TEO pointed out to Goblinworks has been ruled as an exploit, and now the members of TEO know to avoid it entirely. However, I either missed a thread announcing it to other players or no such thread exists. I'm hesitant to mention it (if Goblinworks has, for some reason, decided against it), but I wish to reassure all those who cry "foul" that we do, indeed, check everything we deem exploitative, imbalanced, or even advantageous with Goblinworks.

That being said, with no such announcement, how do I know members of other groups aren't "quietly benefiting" from the same exploit?

Savage Grace wrote:

and yet the devs are going to fix what they called (in the thread linked in the O.P.) an "imbalance".

As I said lots of times before, new arrivals can judge for themselves how quickly that imbalance should have been noticed, and reported, including how much urgency they would have used in communicating the brokenness to GW and how much they'd choose frank honest candor with the devs over quietly benefiting off the brokenness.

I'm hoping for a lot more opinions from objective people after the weekend feeding frenzy is over.

We've raised concerns numerous times in the past when something seemed imbalanced to us (starter town goblin drops, anyone?). Goblinworks responded as they saw fit, and we made use of it while it existed.

I'd thank you to not imply the lack of the imbalance being corrected was due to any organization seeking to "quietly benefit" off of it.

Also, the escalation is not "broken." The caster-types are less effective than they should be, but the Sergeants, Knight-Errants, Captains, Generals, Heroes, Strike Force Commanders, Legends, and Tairina herself would like to have a word with anyone who doubts their lethality.

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Just checking. After all, I recall something about touching and a doll..

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Shouldn't that be something you'd look favorably upon?

@Savage Grace,

I think when someone accuses others of exploiting, it provokes GW into giving that topic immediate attention, even if the issue had been brought up less urgently before.

I'm glad your concerns have been addressed. I believe the conclusion we can all take away from this is that we didn't freak out about it because we don't consider it an exploit, and neither does Goblinworks.

Now, let's all just lower the pitchforks nice and slow.

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Savage Grace wrote:

Dont cheat.
If you find some condition, combination of actions, location, or feature that is broken or provides you an advantage you should not have due to a bug, don't do that thing. Report it.

"Being attacked" by a monster is not a combination of actions. Nothing about Ustalav Casters or Prelates gives any player an advantage over any other player.

Many of us have told Goblinworks of the issues with mobs using the same attack repeatedly (bandit archers as well as Ustalav casters), but this is an issue with (presumably) every mob in the game. The only difference is which attacks an individual mob has access to, and which it chooses to spam. This has been discussed on the Paizo forums as well as the GW forums. Need I make a separate thread to tell everyone "Hey, you remember that bug affecting all mobs? It affects this mob, just so everyone knows."

Essentially, this has been reported as a potential exploit because:

1. Mobs that fill support roles in their groups and don't just pew pew pew all day are inconceivable.

2. Players that get hit by Enervation repeatedly instead of being bandit archer-interrupted repeatedly are giving themselves an advantage.

3. Every submitted bug report must be accompanied by a Paizo thread to alert the players.

This is silly. I feel like I'm making up the Kobold's rules for him.

@Lahasha, Specifically, I was referring to the first time our group spotted yours, when TEO and AGC exchanged nothing more than risk-assessing glances. The second encounter of the night was Asha's unfortunate demise.

@Asha's concerns:

I care little if you consider the incident theft. Consider yourself lucky that the River Kingdoms aren't plagued with the demons Mendev faces. There, you learn quickly what one must sacrifice in the name of protecting the ones you care for. Allegiant Gemstone Company's band of murderers and thieves themselves may come to Keeper's Pass to sate their bloodlust in the future, but they won't be shooting arrows drawn from the quivers made using the recipe I took from your remains myself.

You'd be naive to think Atheory or any of his bandits would do us any kind of courtesy you expect me to show you.

<Kabal> Kradlum wrote:
Yes, it's all Kabal's fault, obviously. You sound like my 6 yr old. See my previous post as to how to deal with 6 yr olds.

You put words in my mouth, sir.

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<Kabal> Kradlum wrote:
Naming them here would not have been appropriate.

It's a shame Kabal's concerns weren't brought up in a more appropriate setting, then.

Asha, I take into account the lives of everyone involved with my adventuring groups. I'm afraid your companions have exhausted all of my goodwill with their attacks on fellow members of The Empyrean Order and other partners in the Everbloom Alliance, and so it's no secret that I instructed my followers to be extremely cautious upon sighting your group once, but you neglect to mention that I did not order them to attack, nor did any of our Order's faithful advance of their own accord.

You should not, however, think me foolish enough to leave your belongings in the hands of the Ustalavian soldiers who slayed you, for I harbor no more amiable feelings toward them than I do for the Allegiant Gemstone Company. Take solace in the swift execution of your killers by the fine volunteers under my command that night.

As for the liberation of resources that once belonged to you, I hold no illusions about where they would end up. Whatever you return to your benefactors will only be used to harm me or my allies in the future. If circumstances were different, perhaps we would avenge you solely to return your belongings. Or perhaps you would add your strength to our ranks and rejoice in the collective might of our Order. But alas, this is not the case, and your affiliation with Atheory's band of lowly raiders sealed my decision that night.

I speak only for myself, and my ideals are not necessarily those of The Empyrean Order. But I am not a merciful man, and others may heed my natural leadership if they agree with me.

In short, I answer only to Ragathiel. If you seek mercy, ally not with those who intend to do me or mine harm.

Note that this isn't just a gatherer problem, they're just the first to reach it. In another 7 weeks, refiners and crafters will be trying to piece together ability score bonus, as well. The absence of Freeholder and Expert features is noticeable.

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In my (likely unpopular) opinion, a settlement with 0 towers should be less functional than a starter settlement. The War of Towers began, what, two weeks ago? We're only now reaching the point that people need better training to advance, and most of that advancement is only symbolic for yet *another* week while we wait for crafters to reach proper Tier 2 equipment.

In short, the towers have been active, but they have yet to mean anything. It's my hope that having a few towers becomes (more or less) essential soon.

Tyncale wrote:
Eyraphel Teralyn wrote:

Going to piggyback on your initiative and mention I'm also interested in one before January 31.

But I'm fine with being behind Belthar in line. :P

I think the cutoff date for the backdated xp is the 29th of januari, just saying. So if you log in the 29th you are still good to go for the extra xp. 1x Game time is 30 days, I believe, and EE started the 31st.

I think the last thing I read said "until the end of January," but I was likely going to put money into a basic first-month EE account on the 30th if I had no prospects. Perhaps I'll push that forward a day to be absolutely certain I get it. Thanks!

Going to piggyback on your initiative and mention I'm also interested in one before January 31.

But I'm fine with being behind Belthar in line. :P

In ancient times, hundreds of years before the dawn of history, an ancient race of people... the Druids. No one knows who they were or what they were doing...

DeciusBrutus wrote:
Eyraphel Teralyn wrote:

Actually, it depends on the offending party's settlement. The accused company has taken a protected tower, but that company's settlement could choose to side with its company (likely removing that settlement and its protected towers from the NAP) or evict the company from affiliation with the settlement in an attempt to retain its protection under the NAP.

Either way, the end result is up to the Tribunal, but Aragon in this case would have some sway in the decision by choosing to embrace AGC's actions or sever ties with them.

Edit: To be clearer, the "biggest" sanction that can be dealt to the offending party (remember, the company) is to be forced to find a new settlement to affiliate themselves with. And based on this infraction, only a settlement willing to break the NAP would likely take them. But this would all be imposed by the settlement, not the NAP itself.

No, the settlement of Aragon is the respondent here, not the company of AGC. One of the possible resolutions that might be found acceptable would be kicking AGC and blacklisting AGC and the leader of it. But the only only *sanction* possible is withdrawal of the protection provided to Aragon.

Agreed. I think I'm failing to clarify my point sufficiently, but I'll leave it be. You're entirely correct that the NAP can only remove Aragon from its protection. I'm merely trying to say that the repercussions of the NAP violation may have larger impacts on the companies who take towers, even if it's not directly because of the NAP.

Actually, it depends on the offending party's settlement. The accused company has taken a protected tower, but that company's settlement could choose to side with its company (likely removing that settlement and its protected towers from the NAP) or evict the company from affiliation with the settlement in an attempt to retain its protection under the NAP.

Either way, the end result is up to the Tribunal, but Aragon in this case would have some sway in the decision by choosing to embrace AGC's actions or sever ties with them.

Edit: To be clearer, the "biggest" sanction that can be dealt to the offending party (remember, the company) is to be forced to find a new settlement to affiliate themselves with. And based on this infraction, only a settlement willing to break the NAP would likely take them. But this would all be imposed by the settlement, not the NAP itself.

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Whispers to Ravens wrote:
Aragorn is a more chaotic settlement and you "Laws" Means nothing to us devoted to chage and will rebel agains the stagnation caused by Treaties like Nap.

Nipping the "Aragon is chaotic" discussion in the bud:

Pathfinder Wiki wrote:
While many inhabitants of the surrounding kingdoms think of the people of the River Kingdoms as back stabbing curs they are wrong as one of the codes of the River Freedoms is that oathbreakers must die (usually in a very painful manner), as a result most people from the River Kingdoms would die before they broke their word but are also very cautious about giving their word in the first place.

For those of us with interest in lore. Chaotic is not equal to compulsive liar or rule-breaker.

Disregarding everything above (which is to say that I have no comment on whatever allegations were brought up), I have an entirely separate issue that should be looked at.

In one of the fights, after I attacked "Bows," he charged me and I began trying to heal myself. I pressed Escape to remove the target and began spamming my Minor Cure, but every time I was hit by the spear, it would re-target Bows, healing him because he's still white.

Now, I realize that I'm terrible at PvP (video is perfect example of why I'm a crafter) and I should have just pressed F1 instead of Escape, but I feel this reiterates the need for a system that can tell when someone is your enemy. If my ally begins the fight, I still want to heal him (but can't), and I don't want to heal our enemy (but the system prefers the white guy attacking me).

Not a bug in the current system and likely wouldn't be an issue if I were any good at PvP, but it's still something I'd be glad to see changed.

Let those winds, in turn, beware my light. For so long as the march threatens the innocent of this land, it will break upon my shield like water in the rapids of these River Kingdoms.

I beseech the righteous in this land to stand with me and join the phalanx. May Ragathiel's eyes be upon us and his wings shield us.

Very glad that you have no hard feelings toward The Empyrean Order, Thod. Though I wasn't part of the group the marched on Baron's Folly myself, I heard great things about the warriors of the Emerald Lodge. I fully expect this will be sufficiently resolved by the powers that be, and I only hope that I'll be present if there is another clash.

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Neadenil Edam wrote:

Just a minor comment in response to some comments further up the thread about orisons being weak.

A character who:
- can cast in heavy armor
- cast spells (not orisons) while using fighter weapons and a shield
- heal himself and others
- buff himself and others
- who ALSO had damage spells equivalent to a wizard

would be a touch unbalanced

The actual game mechanics aside, I was always under the impression that PFO would handle this sort of thing in a slightly different way. Sure, if I could take one level of cleric in a tabletop game and have all those things, then why would anyone ever be anything else? But PFO does things the other way around. You can pick up heavy armor proficiency, holy symbol proficiency, whatever you need for a shield, focus, grab minor cure, buffs, whatever orisons you want, and go grind for spell drops with your [insert fighter weapon here]. The damaging spells could even be on par with the damaging spells of a wizard for all I care.

In PFO, the difference is that by spending experience on all those things, you may be just as effective as a Wizard 1 and a Fighter 1 in addition to your abilities as Cleric 1, but you've spent the same amount of experience as the guy who's now Wizard 4.*

*Note: I'm not actually doing the math/builds for this example, it's just the way I've always imagined the game would be balanced in my head.

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Savage Grace wrote:
Eyraphel Teralyn wrote:

P.S. As a non-combat character who took the touch-range Minor Cure to help support a party of dual Whirlwind-ers: Ouch. Please stop hitting me.


Wait until your mages use wraith's cry.

I expect I'll enjoy it as much as I enjoyed my serving of Burning Hands.

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No issues with the alleged "grinding." Nothing in the game is forcing me to grind right now. I've hit no gates and won't for the foreseeable future. If I choose to grind enough so that I can bypass gates months in advance, that's my choice.

As a PFO player who DOES NOT play a full cleric (and so I'm blissfully ignorant to their finer aspects), I expect that many of the buff complaints here are coming from people who are frustrated with *Orisons* because they're not *Spells*.

As a tabletop player, I do have to admit that I don't like seeing clerics somewhat pigeonholed into healing full-time. I understand that some of those issues can be solved by spells' power later, but I've always been fond of versatility in my characters, and a battle cleric (mace/shield plus buffs/healing) should be doable without someone dying from lack of focus spam.

P.S. As a non-combat character who took the touch-range Minor Cure to help support a party of dual Whirlwind-ers: Ouch. Please stop hitting me.

The Kindleburn/Brighthaven/Keeper's Pass area has been nicely populated. There's nearly always someone hanging around a bank, even if the majority of us are in nearby hexes doing our things.

As the game is now, considering I've only been here since the beginning of the stress test, it's more or less what I was expecting from Alpha. I'm eager for EE to start, but I'd like for every player to be on equal ground at the beginning. If someone's getting teleported/rolled back, everyone should, and if someone's lucky enough to not experience those bugs, no one should. I understand that bugs exist and will likely persist through EE, but I trust GW will know when it's acceptably "fixed."

With regards to direction, the gameplay is what I was hoping for after reading so many of the dev blogs. I really do like the idea of EVE, but I tried it once and just couldn't get into it. I realize now that the solution was to join a good group of people, and I've found that in PFO. My choice now is to stick with PFO and the people I've met or to attempt to find decent people in EVE for a similar experience.

My above "choice" is irrelevant because I absolutely adore the Golarion setting. EVE will never have this world, and it keeps me bound to PFO because I love it so much. Therefore, I must admit that I could overlook a million smaller issues if I felt like I'm playing in the River Kingdoms. I know it's still early and a lot of that content can wait, but I want to vocalize my support for fleshing out gods, races, neighboring countries, etc.

As for MVP, I'd like to see the bugs relatively "fixed," encumbrance on, player looting, and tower pvp windows working properly. Everything else (and some of the above) can wait.

...Or just let me play an angel and you can go in any direction you want, GW!

I've been looking for an answer to this for a while. I'm sure it's been asked before, but I can't find the answer or a name or anything! I come here from the Reddit AMA you did because I forgot the all-important question that's been plaguing my mind:

Who is that awesome Aasimar on the Blood of Angels cover??

Blood of Angels cover and from the Champions of Purity back cover