Justice League Legacies (Inactive)

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On retrospective, as I was at the Hall's entrance, I may be unable to reach Red Volcano, in which case everything still applies but I'll be attacking a Gorilloid, or as I like to call them: Harambots.

I feel like "Harambots" is so terribad that you owe me a hero point. : )

I'm actualy not sure who this man is, not very familiar with ARGUS.

Dick Grayson is Nightwing, former Robin and overall badass.

I still prefer Damian Wayne as Robin and Red Hood is definitely my favourite among the former Robins, but Dick is pretty nice as Nightwing.

Gotta give credit where credit is due.

Okay GM, I checked what you said and much to my horror my sheet is now blank.

What the flying f%~!ing frying f!**?

I will log in to see what the hell happened because this is a grade A problem right here.

EDIT Okay, I now can panic in peace: Mythweavers has suffered a major data loss, all sheets created after 25th July are now blank

I will start to work on putting together his sheet again posthaste. This time directly on the Paizo's profile.
It will take me some time, as Kyle's points were all over the place.

That said, he had every tech skill maxed out and with +9 int, so those rolls can be done. But once again, f##% me.

Essentially, a massive data wipe. The admins have uploaded a backup from July, but everything made in the last few months is... well.

Okay guys, you can thank the six years I spent studying Computers Engineering because it taught me to utterly and absolutely distrust any digital data storage and to keep multiple backups: I have Kyle's "sheet" on paper, in a doc file and I made some photos of the paper version just in case.

Kyle should have his sheet again during the next couple hours, as I do know I juggled with the PP after I finished those ersions and gotta adjust some parts.

Okay guys, you can thank the six years I spent studying Computers Engineering because it taught me to utterly and absolutely distrust any digital data storage and to keep multiple backups: I have Kyle's "sheet" on paper, in a doc file and I made some photos of the paper version just in case.

Now THAT'S a backup!

Ya, wow. The backup would've been impressed enough, but the photos...that cranks it up to 11!

Well, I am a firm defender of having multiple backups of multiple sorts.

Bad part is I am also really stupid... waited too long to hit submit and lost the 'sheet' I was putting in the profile. Again, as yesterday night it happened exactly the same. Duh.

Never ever work directly on Paizo Forums, heed my advice.

P.s.-I will go for a jog to clean ny stupidity away and redo the format, but this time I shall work on a text filw first.

I always click-drag and cntl-C everything before hitting Preview/Submit in Paizo. It only takes a second and has saved -much- frustration.

Fire + Martian = VERY BAD

Poor J'ohn.

Hey GM, I've got some medical problems I had to deal with. Luckily, they have gone asay now and I got my sheet prepared to update it.

As soon as I arrive home, I'll update it and post ^^

I for one am glad to hear that you're doing alright, and hope you continue to be such! Plus I look forward to getting this train moving again, choo choo~

And done. Sorry for the delay on the delay on the delay on the other delay. I have empirically discovered that Life's a b&+%~.

I have tried to keep the sheet as easy to surf through as possible, hope I did a good job.

And finally, I'm dying to show you superheroes my fancy house & office, complete with rooms for guests et al.

No worries Gigabyte. I hate that life sometimes gets in the way of games, but it does.

Little question, do you want me to describe Kyle's 'antivirus'? Otherwise I am ready here ^^

I feel as though this is something where even a one would succeed, because man, venturing through Manhunter's psyche to save him sounds like a great comic.

Yeah, it can be something that just succeeds. Fate magically scans everyone's psyche and projects it into Manhunter's burning mindscape. I'll let everyone else chime in, but assume it will work.

...wrex what?

All of the lines of fire lead to a central point, a shiny metallic platform about 20 feet across. On the platform stands a green martian in agony. The fire wraps around him in chains, and his skin blackens and peels away just as it reforms and blackens again.

CAN YA HEAR ME MISSUS? The chains! Around the man! There be chains around the man and they be chains going around around there! And they need ta be broke, missus! The chains that are around the man should be broke so they are no longer going around the man in chains, now!

Figures that the two of us with the highest will saves roll s#~* on the will save.

Do you want to try again?

I admit I'm afraid that I was kind of stealing all the air out of that scene, but if we all went in with guns blazing maybe we all would have an easier time of it? ^_^

Hey, I'm not disappointed or anything, I just found kt a bit funny how that worked out! Well, okay, maybe a little disappointed. I was looking forward to a battle of wills inside the tormented mind of J'ohn J'onz, but he hit hard and fast. Really shows, do NOT mess with the mind of a master, even if they aren't themselves.

Now... we get to deal with this in the real world!

Probably.

I think it would be reasonable to go back in. You just need to be better prepared. For the moment, of course, you have the physical threat to deal with.

...Physical threat? What would that be?

But, yeah, if we all went in and brought our A game first off, that might go better.

Tally ho!

('Cause that ho needs to get tallied! 0.0)

Ah crap.

I forgot to mention....

Um, Emissary of the North has been going through some IRL stuff.

He, uh, he probably isn't gonna get back to us real soon.

I'll send him a PM, but we might wanna think about replacing him.

Um, Rando, what about Phylotus? Think he'd be down?

Ive already offered him a few times, but he just didn't seem I tetesed in super hero games.

Wait, I might've been wrong. He might be back.

Wow you guys had a whole convo before I could respond.

If he's not back, one of us could just roll his stats for him while he's out. He won't be the star of the show, RP wise, but at least we'd have the firepower.

Nooo, don't replace me! I hacked my life back to a more stable copy!

Also, acrew Paizo and its no updates bug.

And sorry for the delays, everything on ny side is already back to usual.

This post is not intended to be cranky, but I'm tired and slightly tipsy, so forgive if it comes off that way.

Obviously we have some problems with advancing things. I'm looking for some direction on what the problem is. I'm not sure if the problem is something I'm doing or something you need that I'm not providing, or if things just aren't interesting?

I'm coming at all of this from a perspective of improv, where one of the rules is to say "yes" to what happens, and not just "yes" but "yes, and..." Then you add something new. I wonder if people feel like they don't know the "right" thing to do, but there isn't really a right thing to do. My thinking when running a superhero game is not to have a rigid plot, but to have a series of "givens" for the situation. So for example, now, I know where The Martian came from, what he wants, who is behind the whole thing, where things might go. But I am totally open to your ideas or input or advancement. You are free to make things up. Imagine takes the idea of a training room and hacking it, roll with that. Fate can do literally anything with magic. Gigabyte is a wizard in the tech sense, which in this future DC universe opens up almost anything. Unhuman may have the most limitations, but as a player you can still edit the scene, and if an edit is really big and beneficial it might require a Hero Point. You can also edit the scene to your detriment by invoking complications, and I don't mind if you want to introduce new complications.

I'm aiming to create a framework where you can tell the stories of your characters, not for you to fit into some story that I have pre-figured. I hope this isn't offputting or too open. I've looked through the posts of all of you, and I'm confident that this can work if it is something you are interested in. And if not, no hard feelings. The whole thing is, perhaps, a little to outside the bounds of normalcy in PbP around here.

Hey man, you're not doing anything wrong. I think we're just slow on the uptake in general, waiting for what we think is another character's action to come before we try to make our own responses. Obviously this can lead to a pileup of waiting on one another before someone finally rouses the others to keep going.

Sorry, that's not really how I'm used to playing. I understand allowing options, but generally I'm used to GM defines the setting, players react to it. Sure, there might be subplots where the player has more control, but I can't suddenly edit a scene to say "and there's a rift in the air vents, and in comes Zod!" or "but then Az wakes up and the whole thing was a dream!" can I?

Can you give me an example of what level of storytelling you want us to take?

If I can make a suggestion, perhaps a more structured series of encounters here (not necessarily railroad, but with some structure, if this then this) in conjunction with some sort of off-line storytelling from each player, might help us get into the mood more. For example, I could write a story about Dr. Fate's adventures in LA that would not directly affect the other players, and message it to everyone. We could all do that. Once we've done that a few times, we might be more in the spirit to take more ownership of the main storyline.

Well -I'm- in favor of that. I've no idea if that's what the GM wants but it certainly sounds entertaining. =)

Of note, I'm willing to offer an alternative option. If you want to include Imagine in your story, I give you carte blanche. I'll just roll with whatever the hell you come up with. You really only need to stay true to three things: 1) She's rich. 2) She's a megalomaniac telekinetic/telepathic, and, 3) She's a Luthor.

Go nuts. =)

Oh, also, I think his ideas are more along the lines of "Yes, you -can- do it." like, there's no reason for Gigabyte to wait to use the Training room to attack MM. He can just _say_ "I make the room attack MM! It's makes guns and psycho robots!" Like, he doesn't need to wait for a "Uh, can I make guns and psycho robots?" Nope, he's a living diety of t3h Science! He can do that. He can do anything.
He could make a MetroMart attack people with guns and psychorobots.

Is that close?

Oh, also, I think his ideas are more along the lines of "Yes, you -can- do it." like, there's no reason for Gigabyte to wait to use the Training room to attack MM. He can just _say_ "I make the room attack MM! It's makes guns and psycho robots!" Like, he doesn't need to wait for a "Uh, can I make guns and psycho robots?" Nope, he's a living diety of t3h Science! He can do that. He can do anything.
He could make a MetroMart attack people with guns and psychorobots.

If that's the case, perhaps more individual encouragement, until we get going, like "Fate, this situation is well in your domain, what do you do?" sort of thing. When people pause in an RPG, it's generally because they don't see how the situation relates to their character. An occasional "hint" might get us going more, if we're being remiss.

Yes. Definitely more scaffolding that can provide support for what you guys could do. I was worried about being too pushy, but I can the need for that. After some thinking, I'm going to attempt an intelligent response.

I tend to think about Mutants and Masterminds, especially at this power level, as very similar to high level Pathfinder play in the sense of what narrative control players have access to. I don't know how much high level stuff you guys have played, but I've found that you can't really railroad high level characters because they have so many options for getting around problems. So what works better is a series of stepping stones, if you will. Characters can hope, take a bus, fly, teleport, or otherwise move through the stones. I might want you to fight an opponent, but you might well decide to create a demiplane and teleport that opponent into it.

To more directly answer Fate, built into the game are three tiers of scene editing available to characters, and these are really different from Pathfinder.

1. Neutral set dressing: Players are free to insert things into the scene that don't really have a game effect on the scene. So you can have a car come along, or knock someone through the window of a Chinese restaurant that you made up. Things that would reasonably exist in the world and don't really benefit you or trouble your opponent. You probably shouldn't put a Chinese restaurant on the moonbase, but you could insert an elevator or something. Even something like a crappy space helmet or something is probably ok. So, like Imagine said, we all have a general idea of how Danger Rooms or whatever work. It is technology, it is run by a computer system. A techno-wizard should probably be able to control it. If Gigabyte wants to take Imagine's idea and mess with it, that's all good with me.

2. Beneficial scene editing: By spending a Hero point, you can edit a scene in a way that gives you a substantial benefit. This is sort of a social contract thing. The goal, as always, is to make things fun, not to skip the story. So, let's say you are fighting Kryptonians. It probably isn't super cool to say, "Hey, look at this Kryptonite ring on the ground." But you could maybe find a magic weapon here in the Watchtower. A convenient air duct into a difficult to reach area might qualify as this. It isn't really different than using a power stunt to get teleport.

3. Creating a problem for yourself: You guys probably want to look at your complications and add some. Complications can be invoked by you or by me. So Fate might have a complication: Enemy of Lords of Chaos. If you want to get a Hero Point and make your life worse, you could have Klarion the Witch Boy show up on the scene. These could also be roleplaying limitations. Something that makes life harder for your character. "Will always protect innocents." "Can't stand for anyone to be a better telepath than her."

I've never really had players take much initiative as in 1 when running M&M. Occasionally I've had people do 2, and I usually end up invoking 3 ON the player and rewarding them for it. So your method of putting the onus on the player is a little different than how I'm used to dealing with those things. I'll try to get into it a little more.

I don't know how much high level stuff you guys have played, but I've found that you can't really railroad high level characters because they have so many options for getting around problems.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

THAT is what this is about?!?

Oh man. That's funny.

Yeaaaaah, no. I've, ah, I've actually never played a high-level anything. Most games just simply don't get there. Hence, while I concede the theory is sound, to assume that your players are playing high-level characters like they are supposed to, might be an inefficient theory.

Also, the way M&M does advancement, a high-level character might actually have more in common with a low-level character than, say, a high-level wizard.
Got more Power points? Better put some into Attack. And Defense. And saves. And your primary attack power. And your primary defense power. And some skills. oops, look at that, you're in a new PL! Time to do it all over again....

It's not like we're Sorcerers and automatically get access to "higher level" spells that go from Magic Missile to warping reality.

Don't get me wrong, I can see how someone with much experience with the game system, having seen high-level players warp reality would do that. I just...I haven't done that, and I've never seen it done, at least not in this system. Indeed, to be able to cast Wish would take so many power points that no one would bother building the power for it.

Anyway, yeah, I've been looking at it about as black&white as DoctorFate has. (I've just been relying on the fat of my intellect and natural charisma and good looks to fake it. =)

I can see how we could get to 1,2, and 3, but I'm not so l33t as to get there now. We're gonna need some hand-holding. (Actually, I've never used Complications just because I wanted to get a hold of the rest of the rules. Hero Points still confuse and scare me. =)

P.S. I've often had the problem with M&M that the PLs actually advance too quickly. Like, I think it would be better if, like, a campaign said "You all have 120 power points, but you have PL7 level limits. That would let everyone afford to diversify.

P.P.S. Haha...like I care if anyone is a better Telepath than me. W-why? Do you know of any? -_-

P.P.P.S. Huh, that does answer why you've never started a PL7 game and worked up to 12....

I've never really had players take much initiative as in 1 when running M&M. Occasionally I've had people do 2, and I usually end up invoking 3 ON the player and rewarding them for it. So your method of putting the onus on the player is a little different than how I'm used to dealing with those things. I'll try to get into it a little more.

In any modernish game, I have found it useful for people to be comfortable making up or adding in things that can be assumed like that. Sometimes it might lead to things going a little differently than I expected, but I'm ok with that.

I love 2. I think it is one of the best things about the game. I have one player who is particularly attached to it. He often plays characters who are just a pile of Luck and Hero Points, so I've gotten spoiled by that, I think.

As for power points and advancement, I tend to prefer games that don't advance much in power level. I like to give power points so characters can get broader, but Comic characters tend not to gain all that much in power level.

Complications are also useful for me, of course, both on the fly and in preparing scenarios. They give me a sense of what kind of challenges you want to face.

I should mention that I really appreciate all of the feedback. It seems very constructive. I think we can build on this.

*Rubs hands together*

This'll be interesting... ST, I'm not sure I can pull off Superman completely when it comes up, is it alright for me to just narrate his actions and what he's saying in general? William could probably pull it off, but his player's not the expert on things superman. :P

Well, I must say I love Unhuman's idea to play Superman.

Let's check things, though.

Can I program the combat training room to read Unhuman's unique vital signal and disguise him as Superman while he is in there?

Failing that I guess I'd need to so it manual and keep an eye on Unhuman while I maintain the disguise as he moves.

On a completely unrelated note, Kara scares me. Good job Atlas!

I think normally you could reskin him as Superman, but in a way that would be fairly obvious to anyone who was familiar with the room. If you wanted a truly convincing illusion that he is Superman, that would probably require a Hero Point, or the use of your inventor feat.

*Rubs hands together*

This'll be interesting... ST, I'm not sure I can pull off Superman completely when it comes up, is it alright for me to just narrate his actions and what he's saying in general? William could probably pull it off, but his player's not the expert on things superman. :P

That's fine.

You don't need to masque his appearance, as he's already using morph to get a... I think +40 disguise bonus right now?

Also, thanks mate.

I just came back to say the same thing. He is using his morph power.