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Sean, Question isn't attempting to put himself in the right, he's attempting to get a query answered. I grant you he comes off as abrasive (something I'm certain you can sympathize with) but that's all he really wants. Regardless of how well we understand your industry or workday doesn't change the fact that as customers we want something from you. In this particular case Question has run completely out of patience waiting for issues to be resolved in a 3+ year old product. His frustrations are showing but all he really wants is for Paizo to answer his question.
Your response has been filled with extreme hostility and condescension, and quite frankly isn't helping (neither in this thread nor the image of the company you represent).
Your rant at Vivianne was completely uncalled for. As patrons of your company we deserve to be shown respect, please do.
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I think the point may very well be that you can't refuse or not refuse to do something you probably don't have time to do in the first place.
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I don't see what any of that has to do with what I wrote.
You aren't the only one.
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Sean, Question isn't attempting to put himself in the right, he's attempting to get a query answered.
"Politely."
There, you're all set.
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None of us were debating about how to politely ask a rules question...nor was it our intention to do so.
Then you chose your thread title... poorly.
Creative Director
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I'm pretty sure this thread has run it's course, especially considering it's now the weekend.
Let's all take a step away from the thread for a few days, folks, take some deep calming breaths, and then look forward to starting next week, hopefully, with an official response to the hex question. Continuing to argue here isn't gonna make that happen any faster, but I can certainly see it making things happen much slower.
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Geez, you guys..
Look it comes down to this: Paizo staff are both busy and MORTAL. Ask your questions, but if they can't or don't answer then do things the old-fashioned, true-to-original RPG technique:
HOUSE RULE THE FRIGGIN THING AND MOVE ON!
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I don't think it's fair to ask people to house rule 25% of Witch hexes to have a range and duration.
It's not just Ice tomb.
Since when are you entitled to get an answer from staff? They're busy people and there are lots of people on the messageboards.
Most staff email addresses are on the 'Contact Us' page, if you really think you need it.
Indeed. "Question" why do you think you need the staff to clarif your stuff at all? Get some advice from other posters and then make your own ruling.
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The staff are not being asked to clarify our stuff. We're asking them to print rules that were looked over by an editor.
Such as 25% of the Witch hex ranges and durations.
It's not a question.
about 13 hexes are incomplete. Missing something vital, such as range, duration, or odd rules interactions.
I actually enjoy seeing posts from staff and authors. No game I have ever played do I feel this. They don't respond to everything but enough to make me feel I am a part of this gaming community.
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I'm opening the thread again, now that it's not the weekend.
Vivianne Laflamme, I'm going to answer your question again, and address the intent I missed earlier.
Is the implication here that you'll refuse to respond to the at least sixty-something people who have asked for a response to this ice tomb hex issue because you don't like how one person is talking about it?
That is not my implication at all.
My original question was: "Do you think your posting behavior and attitude are more likely to get the staff to answer your about specific rules questions you want answered, or less likely?"
Meaning, specifically: If you have a question about an unanswered FAQ, which of these three hypothetical posts is more likely to get a staff reply?
A) "Hey, Paizo, I'm really hoping for an answer to how the ice tomb hex is supposed to work. There are over 60 FAQ clicks for it but there isn't a response yet, and not knowing its range really makes it hard to use it, especially in PFS play where we're supposed to go by the official rules."
B) "Still waiting for an official paizo response as to why they wont issue an errata with range, duration, etc...considering it takes 5 minutes or less to do. Really confused by this, there have been countless threads on this topic for months. I really dont get why a major class ability has no errata when nobody knows how it should work. At the moment everyone is just making guesses and house rules."
C) "It is obvious that outside of special events like playtests, paizo staff barring mods do not actually read or respond to threads on the forums. How exactly are people supposed to get stuff clarified by Paizo then, ask them questions, bring issues to their attention, etc?"
The answer, of course, is (A), because it's just a question—not a complaint and criticism wrapped around a question, or a complaint, criticism, and lie wrapped around a question.
So...
Is the implication here that you'll refuse to respond to the at least sixty-something people who have asked for a response to this ice tomb hex issue because you don't like how one person is talking about it?
Of course not. The question is already in the FAQ queue. And, as the official post about The Rules FAQ, and How to Use It says,
So the design team will get to it when we have time and if there are no other FAQ issues the design team considers more important than that specific question.
In other words, more clicks won't get it answered any faster. Angry posts won't get it answered any faster. PMs to staff won't get it answered any faster. The two factors are (a) when the design team can fit it into their schedule, and (b) if the design team thinks there aren't other FAQs that can or should be answered more quickly.
Which leads to what I originally posted:
Vivianne, what duties does being a designer at Paizo entail? What is a normal workday for a Paizo designer? How long does it take to develop 32 pages of rules content? How many hours of meetings does a designer have per week? What does the designer do if a freelancer's turnover is poor and the content is unusable? How long is a typical outline for a core book? Do you know? Do you have any understanding of what Jason, Stephen, and I do to get a book finished, how much time it takes, and what we have to do to get it out on time? Do you know what other time-consuming duties we three must do as part of our jobs that have nothing to do with getting the 3-core-books-a-year finished? Because if you don't know these things, you're really not in a position to question why we spend our time on FAQ question X instead of FAQ question Y, or developing project Z.
The point of those questions was to make you (generic you) realize that we're really busy, and you (generic you) don't really know what happens on a daily basis at this company, and therefore you (generic you) are not really in a position to accuse us of neglecting our duties. In other words, it's easy for a person to suggest that we're not doing our jobs if said person only sees (or places value on) one of the dozens of things we actually do as part of our jobs.
All of us at Paizo are very busy. I say that not as a gripe, but with absolute sincerity: we don't sit around playing games all day. We're reading text, developing text, writing text, editing text, and so on. All of that takes time, and the deadlines are always looming closer. We take work home on nights and weekends to get caught up.
In particular, the design team's work on finished the ACG was delayed by the second round of the ACG playtest (we had originally planned only one round), and we're trying to wrap that up this week (the development process is currently late).
Jason's work on the ACG has been delayed because (as head of the design team) he has to attend meetings planning later products in the core line and meetings relating to the other product lines, Goblinworks, and so on.
My work on the ACG is delayed because I've been hosting RPG Superstar, and while that isn't as much of a time sink as judging, I still have to write blog posts, provide judging guidelines for the judges, write the competition rules documents and FAQs, and answer questions from judges and competitors about the competition rules.
And the rest of the staff is in crisis mode because we're publishing two additional hardcover books this year (Inner Sea Gods and Emerald Spire), plus the Strategy Guide (which is unlike any book we've done before and therefore has its own share of delays). So that's three extra not-part-of-our-normal-schedule books this year.
And our has-to-ship-in-time-for-GenCon deadlines are looming.
And the new releases for the Adventure Card Game, which we're still adjusting to having in the schedule (fortunately, we just hired Brian Campbell to work on that).
Oh, and let's throw a wrench in the works by me leaving Paizo in two weeks, which means the design team has to find a replacement person to handle all the work I do.
A lot is going on that the public isn't seeing.
So when someone asks me, "Why haven't you answered this specific question I want answered, instead of all of the other questions you've answered in the past 6 months?," my answer is
In other words: just because your specific question hasn't been answered doesn't mean we're in dereliction of our duties, and perhaps there's a whole lot going on behind the scenes that's prevented us from answering that question in a manner you feel is timely, and maybe you shouldn't insult the people you're trying to get an answer from.
And, if that person's specific question is posted in an angry, frustrated way, and leads to a lot of angry followup posts, we really can't set aside our other tasks to answer that person's question. Not because we're trying to punish anyone, or out of spite, but because we can't set a precedent that being a jerk on the boards is the way to get your question answered. Because that means "starting an inflammatory post to force the staff to get involved and answer the question" becomes the default method of getting a question answered. And none of us—employees or customers—want that.
RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32
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Bravo SKR. There are several things I wish you guys had the time to address, but I know from talking to you guys in the forums and at conventions that you are super, super busy. Maybe that is the reason why I just decided to click the FAQ buttons, make a house rule, and be patient until things are addressed.
And if all else fails, 3PP are willing to take some of that pressure off by offering their own alternatives to some of those issues.
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I'm just glad that Paizo is the sort of company that takes care to reopen threads and answer the question asked in said threads. How are people supposed to "talk" to Paizo? Given how much care the staff puts into these boards, it's astounding to me that any posters feel they can't.
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How are people supposed to talk to Paizo?
They're suppised to denounce them for their anti-goblin bigotry, of course!
Down with Paizo!
Vive le Galt!
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How are people supposed to talk to Paizo?
They're suppised to denounce them for their anti-goblin bigotry, of course!
Down with Paizo!
Vive le Galt!
{looks up from How To Monologue Like A Villain book} Not bad. Nice and short, definitely passionate. You forgot to make specific threats against the PCs though, and had no maniacal laughter. Also, have you considered an accent? Great villains usually have memorable accents.
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You can't hear my accent? Oh yeah, that's because you too are a native goblin speaker. It's called Gobonics.
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Perhaps the FAQ just needs a disclaimer. "Neither Paizo nor its staff are required to answer questions about the Pathfinder Rules Set. Further, Any and all answers shall not be deemed to waive said lack of responsibility. Any answers related to the Pathfinder Rules Set are gifts given out of the goodness of Paizo's and/or Paizo Staffs' hearts and are not mandatory in any way."
Because Paizo is so open to interaction, I think it is hard for some people to realize that Paizo does not owe us "Official Answers" and that the game is designed to be interpreted by each game group. Really, if Pathfinder Society did not exist there would be no need for official errata at all.
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I'm opening the thread again, now that it's not the weekend ...
That fact that Sean took the time to post this amazingly frank and honest response speaks volumes about the kind of person he is, the kind of company Paizo is and the incredible amount of hard work and passion they all put in to making the products we all love.
It really feels like some people might want to spend a little less time complaining or being demanding and a little more time just saying ... Thank You
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It really feels like some people might want to spend a little less time complaining or being demanding and a little more time just saying ... Thank You
Screw it. I don't have a cock in this fight but...
Thank you Sean.
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So when someone asks me, "Why haven't you answered this specific question I want answered, instead of all of the other questions you've answered in the past 6 months?," my answer is "because we're really busy, and we can't just drop everything we're doing to answer your question, and maybe you should realize that there's a whole lot that we do as part of our jobs that doesn't involve answering FAQs, and sometimes those things have higher priority than answering your specific question, and I don't appreciate you saying that we do not answer questions, because that's not only blatantly false, but insulting to everyone who works here."
While I totally understand this, I have to say that the current situation is not particularly good.
The fact is that there is a lack of key information in a important section of one of the defining books of pathfinder.
The CRB is like an improved 3.5, the APG is what make pathfinder what it is.
And after so many year and so many reprints the problem is still there.
And it is not a balance issue or "I disagree with your desing philosophy", it is more like "how can I even use this in my games".
I suppose it is a issue that cannot be solve though, cause it would need a revision of published material and I suppose paizo do not have the time to do it taking into consideration you have to print more books to actually make the bussiness work.
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That was a lot of words that somehow managed to not include an apology for acting abusively and rudely.
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That was a lot of words that somehow managed to not include an apology for acting abusively and rudely.
I'm not seeing where an apology is due to you...?
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That was a lot of words that somehow managed to not include an apology for acting abusively and rudely.
I didn't see where he was actually rude to you. The reverse, however, does not seem to be true.
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That was a lot of words that somehow managed to not include an apology for acting abusively and rudely.
He answered your question and actually addressed your concerns. Yet you will not drop it and just plain let it go. You forget that text does not convey emotion here and I am thinking you just plain misinterpreted what was said to you exactly and the way it was said. You and one other person only read it the way you did. So just please, please let it go already.
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That was a lot of words that somehow managed to not include an apology for acting abusively and rudely.He answered your question and actually addressed your concerns. Yet you will not drop it and just plain let it go. You forget that text does not convey emotion here and I am thinking you just plain misinterpreted what was said to you exactly and the way it was said. You and one other person only read it the way you did. So just please, please let it go already.
Two people speaking =/= two people feeling.
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That was a lot of words that somehow managed to not include an apology for acting abusively and rudely.I didn't see where he was actually rude to you. The reverse, however, does not seem to be true.
Moreover, it is rare for people to apologize on these forums. It happens, don't get me wrong, but it is rare.
What is more puzzling to me is that Sean is expected to come back with an apology for acting abusively and rudely. Where is the counter-apology for the same treatment? For the treatment in the very thread where he was reported to be leaving the company there were insults galore, no apologies. Not perceived rudeness, but out and out vile comments because what, he didn't rule in your favor or give you the pony that you wanted? It's amazing that the folks at Paizo -- and for that matter the third party companies as well -- take time and energy to answer questions and interact with the community. Then when the internet does as it is wont to do and reacts with the grace of a deranged rabid animal, people are flabbergasted that one of these people may not have responded with sunshine and puppies.
Perhaps if you believe you (the universal you) are due an apology, you may want to review your own posting habits. Cause there is a lot of rudeness going on, a lot of insults, and not a heck of a lot of "sorry for being short with you" or whatever going on.
I... love your post knightnday. So much. Heh. Sunshine and puppies.
You know, I favorite'd your post before, but now I wish I could do so again. :)
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And, if that person's specific question is posted in an angry, frustrated way, and leads to a lot of angry followup posts, we really can't set aside our other tasks to answer that person's question. Not because we're trying to punish anyone, or out of spite, but because we can't set a precedent that being a jerk on the boards is the way to get your question answered. Because that means "starting an inflammatory post to force the staff to get involved and answer the question" becomes the default method of getting a question answered. And none of us—employees or customers—want that.
As someone who mostly just reads the boards, thank you for this.
The rapid escalation of this thread surprised me. I will admit the category of people in the must have official answers category surprises me, well unless it's for PFS. I thought Sean's after weekend post was thorough. There is one issue that the OP raised at some point that wasn't addressed. The claim that the hex issue was marked as answered in FAQ , but then they were not able to find any such FAQ. Assuming the OP was correct in that statement, how does something like that happen? I can understand someone finding something like that finding it frustrating. Did it happen? If not, can someone find the FAQ on that ability? I don't really care about it one way or the other, but that seems to be the only thing left unaddressed. I appreciate greatly whenever staff members give us as much transparency into what goes on as is possible. I usually find it interesting or at least it sates my occasional antsyness when something new and exciting to me is on the horizon and gets delayed, etc.
The claim that the hex issue was marked as answered in FAQ , but then they were not able to find any such FAQ. Assuming the OP was correct in that statement, how does something like that happen? I can understand someone finding something like that finding it frustrating. Did it happen? If not, can someone find the FAQ on that ability? I don't really care about it one way or the other, but that seems to be the only thing left unaddressed.
Well, one, I don't know which post they're referring to, so I can't see what question was marked as "answered in FAQ," so I have no insight about why the question might have been cleared.
Two, we don't have the ability to track which of us cleared that post by clicking "answered in FAQ," so I don't know who did it and can't ask them.
Three, the likeliest answer is that it was accidentally cleared as "answered in FAQ" instead of "question unclear."
There is still a FAQd thread in the queue about the ice tomb hex. The other "answered in FAQ" thread which other posters are talking about is the one that's no longer in the queue (and doesn't need to be, as multiple FAQd threads for the same topic are redundant, and they'll all be cleared when the FAQ is answered).