A) None of the above
Spell casting and two weapon fighting don't play nicely together
Although if you're playing a divine spell caster, some shields or sometimes favored weapons of your god can be used as a holy symbol and maybe allow you to supply somatic components.
In general unless your class offers a lot of static damage and attack bonuses, TWF is not a something worth pursuing.
Perhaps give more specifics about what you're thinking about playing and people would be able to give better advice.
the only way I have seen TWF and spellcasting even come close to working is something along the Mindblade Magus, who has the ability built in, but even it suffers from not enough feats to keep the TWF going.
You can two weapon fight with your unarmed strikes. You can also two weapon fight with 2 shields, but that would make spell casting hard.
Most one handed weapons can still be wielded 2 handed.
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If you are looking to stack attacks with 2-weapon fighting and are considering unarmed strike as an option I suggest you go all in and go with natural attacks instead. Take the Were-raptor kin Skinwalker subrace. That gives you a bite and two talon attacks at first level (note that talon attacks are on your feet not your hands). Take the Tigers Claws vigilante talent at 2nd level for 2 claw attacks. Now you have 5 primary attacks at second level at full strength and BAB and your hands are free for spellcasting. Buy a Helm of The Mammoth Lord to get a Gore attack and now you have 6 primary attacks. You can take Lethal Grace at 6th level for the bonus damage and take Piranha Strike at 3rd if you like. An Amulet of Mighty Fists costs the same as enchanting 2 weapons so it’s the same cost as a typical 2-weapon build and applies to all your attacks. Down the road you could even take a Fleshcrafted Stinging Tail for a 7th primary natural attack. That’s what I would do anyway.
I have to agree with Claxon that we need more information about what you want out of the character. For me, the most important thing is why are you going vigilante? An inquisitor might actually be a better choice unless there is some reason you want to be a vigilante.
An inquisitor with the Infiltrator, and sanctified slayer archetypes and the clandestine inquisition would be able to infiltrate places quite easily. Being able to choose what alignment you detect can be better than the vigilante’s dual identity. You could be l awful good and detect as chaotic evil. Studied target and sneak attack are going to be a lot better for a two-weapon fighter than lethal grace.
The way I build characters is I come up with a concept first and then figure out what class fits that best. So far, I don’t know what your concept is so giving any advice is hard. The Vigilante is and interesting class and looks to be a lot of fun, but you should still have a concept for the character.
Why are you looking to two weapon fighting? There is nothing wrong with it, but it is difficult to build an effective two weapon-based character. It requires a lot of feats and some way to add damage to each hit. Lethal Grace helps but you are going to need more. Harsh Judgement from Inner Sea Intrigue gives you access to some of the inquisitors' judgements including destruction a few times a day. That combined with Lethal Grace should make your damage fairly decent.
Don’t worry about swords go with Daggers instead. They are easier to conceal and can also be thrown. Two Weapon fighting means you can throw with both hands, but that will require Quick Draw. You can also take weapon focus and improved critical hit for daggers to improve your combat ability.
By 12th level you could have Improved Critical(dagger), Improved Two Weapon Fighting, Piranha Strike (or Power attack), Quick Draw, Two Weapon Fighting, Weapon Finesse (from Lethal Grace), and Weapon Focus Dagger. With normal daggers you will get 4 attacks +11/+6 +11/+6 doing 1d4 +19 in your primary hand and 1d4 +15 in your off hand. All attacks have a 17-20 chance of a critical hit. If you throw daggers, you have 4 attacks at +14/+9 +14/+9 doing 1d4 +8 and 1d4+7 with a chance of a critical on a 17- 20.
And for context. A. This is assuming you want unfettered access to spellcasting(As yes you would be playing a spellcaster) and B. You intend to infiltrate places either by stealth or disguise on a regular basis.
For A, probably the "preferred" option (requiring the least jumping through feat hoops) to switch between spellcasting and Two-Weapon fighting is using a double weapon. Taking a hand off to cast a spell or gripping it again with two hands are both free actions in PF1. The only issue with double weapons is that they tend to lag behind the "crit fishing" options (other than the pick head of the gnome hooked hammer for damage).
For B, a "humble" quarterstaff might work (it did for Gandalf in Lord of the Rings); too bad transformative is so expensive. Otherwise, you might be better off with using spells to create weapons: force sword, ghost whip, instant weapon (which can be any type of melee weapon), etc.
Of the two options you suggest I would go blade and unarmed strike. Buuuut, I would suggest considering spiked gauntlet or cestus as your secondary weapon instead.
Zealot vigilante with lethal grace, if twf doesn't work then my only other option is single blade which is very limiting damage wiseA) None of the above
Spell casting and two weapon fighting don't play nicely together
Although if you're playing a divine spell caster, some shields or sometimes favored weapons of your god can be used as a holy symbol and maybe allow you to supply somatic components.
In general unless your class offers a lot of static damage and attack bonuses, TWF is not a something worth pursuing.
Perhaps give more specifics about what you're thinking about playing and people would be able to give better advice.
I'm confused why you think this. Basically the only resource you have from your class kit that is a damage bonus is Smite, aside from whatever spells might do for you.
TWF works best when your class gives you some sort big flat damage bonus, because TWF gives you extra attacks to take advantage of that.
For a Zealot, a two handed weapon with reach is probably going to work better. Keep in mind your Zealot doesn't have full BAB, so TWF which causes you to take penalties to your attack roll is already a poor fit. You also seem to think you need to have super dex and no strength for your character. I would argue instead you should have a good strength and as much dex as your armor will cap at.
Also I agree with someone else who said you should just play an Inquisitor. An Inquisitor with the right Inquisition and a decent dex (but not as primary ability) will do just fine at stealth. Even if they're not the best.
Pathfinder really hates dex builds doesn't it?
It doesn't make the act of entirely ignoring the Strength ability score easy like other editions.
But more on topic, I've had some fun with combining the Shield Gauntlet Style feats to work with a two-weapon dex combatant that uses spells. Gauntlets do not tie up your hands for spell casting. It also helps you qualify for other feats that require Improved Unarmed Strike.
I've used that feat in conjunction with a Zealot Vigilante in the Hell's Rebels campaign.
Good. Very good but unfortunately because it requires weapon focus it come online much later then I would like, and given i can just get IUS at level 2 since i got weapon finesse at level 1, I'd say it's ultimately not worth it.
How quickly are you expecting this to come online? You are already attempting to do a lot already and there is only so much room you have to work with when building a dex-based character.
Have you considered the Unchained Rogue with the Eldritch Scoundrel archetype? You'll get weapon finesse for free and have access to spellcasting at the magus progression. With retraining, you could have weapon finesse, weapon focus, and shielded gauntlet at level 2 (provided you are human and have that bonus feat).
Pathfinder really hates dex builds doesn't it? Also you're forgetting about harsh judgement. which gives me the destruction judgement, so yeah i'd say i have plenty of flat bonuses
More like Pathfinder doesn't like to let character ignore one of their ability scores.
I'm looking for this Harsh Judgement ability and the only thing I can find that references that is the Gray Warden prestige class. So I'm not sure what you're talking about. Did I miss where you said you're going to multiclass into Gray Warden?
Edit: I found it on AON but not on d20PFSRD. That option does help with damage, but doesn't help with your attack. Or rather you can choose which it will help you with, but Harsh Judgement never gives you the Second or Third Judgement class feature of Inquisitors so you'll never got both attack and damage.
Two Weapon fighting on a 3/4 BAB class without some good inherent bonuses to attack rolls isn't going to work as well as you think. And the damage scaling bonus isn't amazing. At 9th level it's only a +4.
I personally think you're build would be much better off if you used a two-handed weapon and were primarily strength based. Even with less dex you will still be stealthy enough with the right selections.
With unarmed strikes and natural attacks if you get an Amulet of Mighty Fists with the Agile property you can get Dex to damage.
Maybe you could look at Divine Fighting Technique for Cayden Cailean's Blade and Tankard (rapier/tankard or light weapon/tankard). This meets your desires for finesse weapons, as the style states "[y]ou can wield a tankard (or mug) as a weapon, treating it in all ways as a light mace appropriate for your size." You could even fight with two tankards if you want.
After a few levels, you might want to look at acquiring a Cailean fighting tankard
Pathfinder really hates dex builds doesn't it? Also you're forgetting about harsh judgement. which gives me the destruction judgement, so yeah i'd say i have plenty of flat bonusesMore like Pathfinder doesn't like to let character ignore one of their ability scores.
I'm looking for this Harsh Judgement ability and the only thing I can find that references that is the Gray Warden prestige class. So I'm not sure what you're talking about. Did I miss where you said you're going to multiclass into Gray Warden?
Edit: I found it on AON but not on d20PFSRD. That option does help with damage, but doesn't help with your attack. Or rather you can choose which it will help you with, but Harsh Judgement never gives you the Second or Third Judgement class feature of Inquisitors so you'll never got both attack and damage.
Two Weapon fighting on a 3/4 BAB class without some good inherent bonuses to attack rolls isn't going to work as well as you think. And the damage scaling bonus isn't amazing. At 9th level it's only a +4.
I personally think you're build would be much better off if you used a two-handed weapon and were primarily strength based. Even with less dex you will still be stealthy enough with the right selections.
Just following up with my thoughts from earlier. Destruction judgment will give you a +4 bonus to damage at 9th level with no inherent attack bonus in your class.
Conversely, a full BAB class will be between 1 and 4 points ahead of you on attack rolls. Which a strength based character would then trade for damage via power attack. At level 1 power attack trades 1 point of attack for 3 points of damage when using a 2 handed weapon. So from a single feat, it's granting almost as much as damage at level 1 as judgment will at 9th level. Judgments for an Inquisitor are good, but they are not the main source of damage. Inquisitor are normally going to use justice judgment for attack bonus until they get second judgment and can have both justice and destruction. But Inquisitors get bane as a class feature, giving them +2 to attack and damage and 2d6 damage against their target. Before getting bane Inquisitor will usually use spells, justice judgment, and something like power attack or deadly aim for damage.
But even piranha strike doesn't play super nicely with twf because off hand damage bonus is reduced.
If I can't convince you to play a strength based character two-handed weapon user, can I instead convince you to maybe play an archer build?
...Pathfinder really hates dex builds doesn't it? Also you're forgetting about harsh judgement. which gives me the destruction judgement, so yeah i'd say i have plenty of flat bonusesMore like Pathfinder doesn't like to let character ignore one of their ability scores.
I'm looking for this Harsh Judgement ability and the only thing I can find that references that is the Gray Warden prestige class. So I'm not sure what you're talking about. Did I miss where you said you're going to multiclass into Gray Warden?
Edit: I found it on AON but not on d20PFSRD. That option does help with damage, but doesn't help with your attack. Or rather you can choose which it will help you with, but Harsh Judgement never gives you the Second or Third Judgement class feature of Inquisitors so you'll never got both attack and damage.
Two Weapon fighting on a 3/4 BAB class without some good inherent bonuses to attack rolls isn't going to work as well as you think. And the damage scaling bonus isn't amazing. At 9th level it's only a +4.
I personally think you're build would be much better off if you used a two-handed weapon and were primarily strength based. Even with less dex you will still be stealthy enough with the right selections.
Just following up with my thoughts from earlier. Destruction judgment will give you a +4 bonus to damage at 9th level with no inherent attack bonus in your class.
Conversely, a full BAB class will be between 1 and 4 points ahead of you on attack rolls. Which a strength based character would then trade for damage via power attack. At level 1 power attack trades 1 point of attack for 3 points of damage when using a 2 handed weapon. So from a single feat, it's granting almost as much as damage at level 1 as judgment will at 9th level. Judgments for an Inquisitor are good, but they are not the main source of damage. Inquisitor are normally going to use justice judgment for attack bonus until they get second
Define exactly what you mean by "magic". Because you can use a glove of storing to shrink it down and store it. At a certain level you can have a bag of holding to allow you to store it. And I assume at a certain point you'll be using a hat of disguise to help disguise yourself and your belongings. There's also the efficient quiver, that when used with a hat of disguise would likely appear to be something innocuous.
One of the problems is that the Zealot trades away so many vigilante talents for spells. That leaves you very few ways of boosting your combat ability. Most of the ways for you to boost your combat ability are limited resources. Are you ok with being really effective a small number of times per day, but otherwise only having mediocre combat ability?
Looking it over Zealot Smite may be better than Harsh Judgement. It gives you level to damage and CHA to hit, but only vs a single target of an appropriate alignment.
The other problem is that this archetype is kind of MAD. You need your main combat stat, and WIS for spells, all characters need CON. Zealot is costing you 2 skill points per level, so dumping INT is going to make it difficult to get the skills you need for infiltration and subterfuge. That leaves you with little to spare for other stats.
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There's a lot of zealot bashing in this thread. I played one for 16 levels of PFS, and I can tell you from experience it's a great archetype. Especially if you want to play a balanced character (or if you're doing rolled stats instead of point-buy) who's pretty good at a whole bunch of things.
Damage-wise you've got Lethal Grace and Harsh Judgment by 6th level, Zealot Smite at 12th. You get a bunch of good long-duration buffs (greater magic weapon, magic vestment, heroism) to toss out when you start adventuring and the option of some good short buffs (divine favor) if you need them.
On the social side of course it depends on the campaign you are playing. The renown-related talents aren't very useful in a dungeon crawl. But in a city-based campaign things like Safe House, Celebrity Discount, and Celebrity Perks can be quite helpful. Hidden Magic is great if you expect to do even the slightest bit of stealth/intrigue adventuring. Skill Familiarity and Social Grace are good in just about any campaign, even a dungeon crawl.
Can other classes/archetypes do more damage per round? Of course. But Zealot is no slouch at all.
You're probably thinking "that's a lot of spell slots to spend at the start of the day." You're right, and that's the entire point. Get the buffs running early and don't worry about casting in combat. With all that running I had a bunch of bonus damage, my to-hit bonus was as good as any full BAB class, and the full BAB classes I adventured with were even better thanks to me! (I was personally very big on the "hidden identity" part of my vigilante so I added in a few more personal buffs like hide weapon and extended Inner Focus.)
When combat started, it depended on exactly the situation and whether I was in my social identity. Usually first round would be invisibility, followed by Immediate Change as a move and Harsh Judgment (destruction) as a swift. Next round would be move and attack. If the situation demanded it I could go straight to attacking.
It's a fair amount of damage, even with a one-hander. 6 (power attack) + 6 (lethal grace) + 2 (strength) + 5 (harsh judgment) + 4 (weapon enhancement). That's +23 assuming no smite.
When I got a couple more levels I added in Quicken Spell to throw out a Quickened Divine Favor as an option. You can do it even earlier if you do the Wayang Spellhunter/Magical Lineage combo to make Quickened Divine Favor a 3rd-level slot.
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As for the original question: sword and QuickDraw shield.
Or, if your campaign is lenient about walking around with a shield and sword out all the time, just a regular light shield. With a light shield you can switch your sword to your shield hand (free) cast (standard) then switch the sword back to the other hand (free).
One way to do a STR build that is decent in combat when you are infiltrating or otherwise limited on weapon use is to use improvised weapons. The feat Catch of Guard removes the -4 penalty for using an improvised weapon. This would actually allow you to go into almost any circumstance and be able to do decent damage in combat. Instead of bringing a weapon into a social setting you simply use whatever large object is already there in two hands. This allows you to use your STR bonus to hit and get 1.5 x your STR bonus to damage.
Take the Anger inquisition to gain Rage to allow you to further boost your STR. Take Zealots Smite to get your level to damage a few times a day. At 12th level you should be doing about 10d10 +24 damage with an improvised weapon similar to a greatclub without spells. Make sure your deities favored weapon is a two handed weapon. Use that weapon when you are operating openly and use improvised weapons when you need to.