Managing Creative Director (Starfinder)
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Hey folks!
Just wanted to let everyone know that the Starfinder Team is going to be livestreaming our next internal playtest game over at twitch.tv/officialpaizo
The game will take place on Wednesday October 18th at 1pm PST and should be available as a VOD on our Twitch channel sometime after the play. We plan on interacting with chat a fair bit during this playtest, answering some questions and giving some insight into the game state as we're playing. However, it's still a playtest and our focus will be on the game and trying to show how we as a team are approaching some of the gameplay playtests.
A few notes on what to expect:
-This is a playtest. Don't come for "riveting stories" or "deep characters". Expect to see Soldier the character, and likely a barebones story that involves them fighting threats in a Danger Room-esque scenario.
-We'll be showcasing the two classes that we've already had in the Field Tests: Mystic & Soldier. You might see some new mystic tech and some of the changes we've already implemented with Soldier since our first Field Test.
-We'll be showcasing two NEW classes that we've not revealed anything on. Not going to say which classes yet, but they'll be ones we've not previewed. We'll also NOT be doing an in-depth explanation of the classes, but more testing them publicly and letting viewers piece together what they can from our gameplay.
-Some reveals on state of equipment / weapons / ancestries that people are going to take in our game. Again, won't be going in-depth, but you'll get some previews just by seeing what the staff are taking.
Look forward to seeing you there!
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Developer
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Thursty: "So, what's your character's name, Player 1?"
Player 1: "Stress Test."
Thursty: "Oh, uh, how about you, Player 2?"
Player 2: "Mystic Mayhem."
Thursty: "I see. And player 3?"
Player 3: "Shenanigans. But my friends call me—"
Thursty: "Okay I get the point."
My body is ready for the speculation ^^
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We know Operatives have had multiple playtests, and we’ve seen a new Solarian Iconic - those two are my bets.
We know Operatives have had multiple playtests, and we’ve seen a new Solarian Iconic - those two are my bets.
That would be my first guess as well.
If the few bits of info we have on the Operative disqualify it as a class they've "not revealed anything on", then me might see the Envoy, though ^^
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Damn, still going to be at work. I expect you nerds to take copious notes for me.
We know Operatives have had multiple playtests, and we’ve seen a new Solarian Iconic - those two are my bets.That would be my first guess as well.
If the few bits of info we have on the Operative disqualify it as a class they've "not revealed anything on", then me might see the Envoy, though ^^
Yeah, the fact that they get skill depth but not breadth definitely counts as somethign they've revealed. The fact that they tend towards pistols and sniper rifles, that they tend to produce consistent damage rather than spikes, the nature of (roughly) how their damage-dealign mechanic works... they've revealed a fair bit on the Operative.
I don't think we've actually heard anything applicable about the Solarian, though, for all that they've wandered into discussion. My guess would be that or envoy.
Why not both the Solarian and Envoy? We'll get two "new" classes after all.
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A very charismatic bout of nearly contextless violence.
Who else is excited for a (vaguely) jedi-style Solarian? I promise it's totally legit, not a 100% baseless speculation ^^
I'm really hoping they're cut from a similar conceptual cloth as Kineticist. Decent melee and ranged options, revelations for some kind of solar armor...
FWIW Thursty hinted in one of the interviews (The Know Direction one, I wanna say?) that rather than choosing to be a melee solarian, a ranged solarian, or a defensive solarian, at level 1, por qué no los tres?
Mhh, it certainly sounds like a DEX KAS, monk AC and something like the Kineticist's blasts/weapons. Or something vaguely like the Magus, where you channel your mystical power through actual weapons.
A friend caught some of this and we’re both quite excited by the 2e Envoy here. I’ll need to watch it myself to see how I feel about this Solarian.
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Damn, still going to be at work. I expect you nerds to take copious notes for me.
I had to stop after 1.5 hrs, but, here's my non-edited, point-form, notes:
Solarian - primary attribute Str, gasp!Solarian - Dustin played a "Balanced" solarian, implying can attune to either attunement. Also implies "unbalanced" (Broken Cycle?) solarians may be an option?
Envoy - can issue Directives - if they "Lead by Example," i.e. do the same thing they Direct, there's another another bonus? I.E. if Directive is to attack (with Get 'Em) and then the Envoy also attack that same target, they get bonus damage?
Solarian - Binaric Assault: hit and swap attunement to same #, but opposite attunement; i.e. if you're Photon 2, you'd change to Graviton 2.
Mote acts as a short-range gun, and got a 2nd attack; hitting with it swapped back to original attunement
(but if only 1 had hit, would have swapped & stayed into opposite attunement) (the "Cycle trait")
Envoy - Quip reaction; demoralize someone hit by a strike
Get 'em! is still a thing. Looks like 1 action, grants -2 to AC?
Has an option (class feat?) to Reaction, re-deploy Get 'Em if the current target dies
Get 'Em also grants "critical specialization" if you crit against target? In this case, applied a Save vs Slowed when Get 'Em target was Crit
Kasatha: natural grace: 1/day no action, reroll a Ref save? Ancestry feat?
Low & Moderate difficulty are the 'average' encounter type expected. Low combat ended just at start of Round 3.
Solarian - Stellar Rush = stride twice, with +10 to speed? 80 ft in one move :D
Solarian - then some kinda gravitic pull, enemies within 10 ft make Fort save vs Class DC or get pulled, son (also Dustin is pro at Class DCs :D)
Soldier: Menacing Laughter = reaction intimidate vs Suppressed people? Neat!
Solarian - has a reactive strike by lvl 5
Machine gun firing in auto-fire: currently, each automatic fire is +1 extra ammo expenditure per target targeting. Follow-up fire on Primary Target takes regular ammo, as usual? Very Playtest, very subject to change
Solarian - shattering impact (class feat?) = makes weapon die +1 size, but also breaks solar weapon? 1 action to re-form.
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New spell: Selective Invisibility, seems to work like Invisibility but you can leave a target in range that you can see who can see you. Attacking them doesn't break Invisibility, but attacking anyone else does. Honestly seems like a really cool no-save "duel" style spell. (Unfortunately, it only lasts for a minute like heightened Invisibility does, so unless it also heightens, it's just a spell rank discount.)
The Solarian's weapon is free-hand.
Item: Commando serum. Grants temporary hp and +5 ft item bonus to land speed.
Item: Tactical med-patch heals 3d6+6 and gives a bonus vs. disease and poison. Upgraded version of commercial med-patch.
Stellar Rush in photon mode creates a "wall" of bi-directional concealment. The bonus to speed is a circumstance bonus.
Graviton attunement crit is a free trip attempt.
Learning Experience is an ability, probably Shirren but maybe Envoy. When taking persistent damage, you can choose to automatically take half the max damage, automatically fail the recovery check, and make a free recall knowledge check about the source. The Shirren also has an ability that bumps reflex saves (probably other saves as well) against the swarm from success to crit success.
The Bombard Soldier can ignore two allies in its area of effect.
You Got This is not an Envoy ability. (But it should be.)
Vital Prism is a spell that lets you shoot for healing. You need to roll to hit willing targets- weird knock-on effect that it includes yourself.
Damn, still going to be at work. I expect you nerds to take copious notes for me.I had to stop after 1.5 hrs, but, here's my non-edited, point-form, notes:
Solarian - primary attribute Str, gasp!Solarian - Dustin played a "Balanced" solarian, implying can attune to either attunement. Also implies "unbalanced" (Broken Cycle?) solarians may be an option?
Envoy - can issue Directives - if they "Lead by Example," i.e. do the same thing they Direct, there's another another bonus? I.E. if Directive is to attack (with Get 'Em) and then the Envoy also attack that same target, they get bonus damage?
Solarian - Binaric Assault: hit and swap attunement to same #, but opposite attunement; i.e. if you're Photon 2, you'd change to Graviton 2.
Mote acts as a short-range gun, and got a 2nd attack; hitting with it swapped back to original attunement
(but if only 1 had hit, would have swapped & stayed into opposite attunement) (the "Cycle trait")Envoy - Quip reaction; demoralize someone hit by a strike
Get 'em! is still a thing. Looks like 1 action, grants -2 to AC?
Has an option (class feat?) to Reaction, re-deploy Get 'Em if the current target dies
Get 'Em also grants "critical specialization" if you crit against target? In this case, applied a Save vs Slowed when Get 'Em target was CritKasatha: natural grace: 1/day no action, reroll a Ref save? Ancestry feat?
Low & Moderate difficulty are the 'average' encounter type expected. Low combat ended just at start of Round 3.
Solarian - Stellar Rush = stride twice, with +10 to speed? 80 ft in one move :D
Solarian - then some kinda gravitic pull, enemies within 10 ft make Fort save vs Class DC or get pulled, son (also Dustin is pro at Class DCs :D)Soldier: Menacing Laughter = reaction intimidate vs Suppressed people? Neat!
Solarian - has a reactive strike by lvl 5
Machine gun firing in auto-fire: currently,...
A heroic effort! Thank you!
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sf2e is dangerously cool. There's a very real chance I end up liking it more than Pathfinder...
The Solarian is almost everything I would want.
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New spell: Selective Invisibility, seems to work like Invisibility but you can leave a target in range that you can see who can see you. Attacking them doesn't break Invisibility, but attacking anyone else does. Honestly seems like a really cool no-save "duel" style spell. (Unfortunately, it only lasts for a minute like heightened Invisibility does, so unless it also heightens, it's just a spell rank discount.)
So funny story: my mystic in SF1 learned that spell exclusively so his brother could make sure he was still safe when he was running off to do "potentially dangerous things" alone. Also suffocating while invisible when no one else in the party can see or hear you is really scary!
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sf2e is dangerously cool. There's a very real chance I end up liking it more than Pathfinder...
The Solarian is almost everything I would want.
Why not both ^^. I can already see there will be shenanigans when we cross the streams ^^
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Some more stream observations:
-> The Solarian can attune when initiative is rolled (presumably as a free action like these thungs usually work)
-> The Envoy's "Get in there" is a Directive (probably similar to a Bard's Composition cantrips) that gives all allies a +5 ft bonus (presumably status) to Speed for 1 round (until the start of the Envoy's next turn)
-> Lead by Example is an Envoy ability that allows the Envoy to do something listed in the Directive they just used and then there is an additional benefit
- for example, "Get in there" allows at the very least for the Envoy to Stride (i.e. move up to their full Speed) and then their allies get to do that as well for free (it's unknown if this has a radius or other restriction)
-> it wasn't 100% clear, but Jump jets seem have a flat range of 30ft, rather than using your own Speed as a basis, so "Get in there" didn't affect it (it only modifies Speed, which is how far you can move on land)
-> the jump jets allow you to, who would've guessed, jump a certain distance for 1 action (possibly modifying your Leap range?)
-> the "Aim" action that the Operative will get gives bonus precision damage on a ranged hit and also reduces cover (presumably it downgrades the type of cover by 1 step); some NPCs will have it, but it is not a basic action anybody can just use (so canonically, most people literally cannot aim worth anything XD)
-> when the Solarian attunes, they also manifest a "solar weapon" - in this case a big drill bit with reach, free-hand and 2d8 damage
-> the Solarian's manifested weapon can have different damage types; Binaric Assault seems to completely change the damage type (photon attuned means fire damage)
-> Binaric Assault is a two-action activity that gives you two attacks, seemingly with a different weapon each (one is your solar weapon and the other your mote?)
-> The Soldier's additional Primary Target Strike apparently doesn't apply the MAP from using Area Fire and currently also doesn't apply it's own separate MAP (so after Area Fire, you only take -5 not -10)
-> you also seem to pick someone as your Primary Target even before you use your Area Fire?
-> Arc rifles are melee weapons for some reason (just kidding, they were just listed as melee attacks in Foundry XD)
-> the "Get 'em" directive gives a -1 status penalty to AC (not -2) for the designated target and the Lead by Example bonus - apparently triggered by a Strike - is a +2 bonus to damage rolls for everyone
-> the flamethrower is a regular Area Fire weapon with a cone attack pattern (15ft for the commerical version)
-> Mouthfinder (tm) confirmed :D
-> with the Envoy getting their crit spec via Get 'em, they probably don't get crit spec from their chassis
That's it for the first encounter! I have to agree with the team, that combat felt solid. Jessica was really unlucky with her quips, but that was balanced out by Thursty's "luck" :D
To be continued ^^
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Combat 2 (moderate encounter):
-> Stellar Rush is a two-action activity
-> the Soldier's Menacing Laughter is still an action (Jenny used it as her 3rd action in a turn)
-> the Solarian has 22 AC at level 5, which is completely normal for a martial who doesn't wear heavy armor and doesn't have a +1 armor yet (so no Monk progression sadly ^^)
-> the Solarian has 80 HP at level 5 with 0 in CON, so there might be some shenanigans going on there; the only way I can make this work is if the Solarian is 12 HP/level, has the Toughness general feat for another 12 HP and the Vesk are an 8 HP ancestry
-> the Solarian's saves are Fort +13 (with 0 CON), Ref + 12 (DEX +3) and Will +10 (WIS +1); so in terms of proficiency the Solarian would at this point be legendary in Fort saves (the +0 CON is therefore almost certainly a mistake, even master would be amazing at this level), expert in Reflex and expert in Will
-> pure speculation: given the Solarian is also missing the 4 stat boosts from level 5 (the Soldier has their's applied, so that's odd), I'm pretty sure it would be +2 in CON, so that would make them a 10HP/level class with master in Fort saves at level 5 (damn, nice)
-> the "Get 'em" AC penalty isn't a status penalty, it's circumstance
-> Jenny's MG has 40 shots in the magazine (damn, that's a lot D:) and deals d10s for damage
-> love the change to Automatic Fire (see Kishmo's post for details) - now Automatic Fire weapons are better for sustained fire, especially against smaller groups, so they have a niche!
-> in general, mobility and position manipulation seems to be very useful and prevalent in the current version, nice
-> Shattering Impact is a two-action activity
-> Solarian's attunement and weapon manifestation are definitely linked (it's 1 action total)
-> this particular Mystic is living on the edge :D
-> the Vesk have an ancestry feat called Tear Wound that can give an enemy persistent bleeding damage as an action(in this case 1d6, apparently increased to 1d6+1 due to an ability called Bathed in Blood); requirements are unclear (probably something related to hitting the enemy with a melee attack beforehand)
-> Selective Invisibility looks like a cool spell ^^
Conclusion: This shows that SF2 really puts a lot of oomph into good teamwork and gives you the tools for said teamwork. I'm all for that!
Liking the sneak peek. Solarian definitely has me wanting to see more. Hopefully that field test isn't too far off!
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Combat 3 - New map, hellknight starship (star knight starships flip-mat). This one features two level 6 creatures and 2 level 3s, so we are looking at a solid extreme encounter (the hardest difficulty in the PF2 encounter system)
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-> one of the shirren heritages (?) is called "defiant", they get bonus against the Swarm (who they really don't like)
-> those fire effects are lit :D
-> Stellar Rush photon mode's concealment-fire lasts until the end of the Solarion's next turn
-> the Solarion's built-in mote shot deals 2d6+4 damage at level 5 (so presumably scales and acts like a melee weapon that adds full STR)
-> I'm now very sure that Binauric Assault works like described above; which order you use your weapons in seems to be up to you; both attacks have to be against the same target (?)
-> "for it's third and final action..." the swarm bastorox uses a two-action activity XD (a classic, what PF2 GM hasn't made this mistake atleast once ^^) - Edit: nvm, it's meant to be 1 action, it's just listed as two actions
-> Solarian has a reaction called Nimbus Surge, presumably triggered by being hit with an attack; in graviton mode the enemy has to make a Fort save vs your class DC or be pushed 5ft away (so if they are no longer within reach, they have to waste an action to get to you again)
-> +1 for You Got This being made an Envoy ability
-> Mike's Mystic is a damn unit, they really remind me of the Sorcerer in my last campaign (our honorary tank ^^)
-> props also go to the little bug bois, they really were the heroes of this encounter :D
-> photon mode and graviton mode also have different damage calculations (photon does +2 damage?)
-> that 40-shot MG is 2 actions to reload
Final fight conclusion: welp, that's an extreme encounter for you ^^. This also shows how easy it is to focus down individuals in this system and how important it is to take enemies out of the fight! Also, with unusually little cover, things are even more dangerous.
I really like the Envoy in particular. The Solarian was solid as well, but the Envoy's focus on strong teamplay actions really stood out to me. It's like a more engaging Bard. Or a Warlord-style class that quite a few PF2 players have been clamoring about for years. I imagine this will be the class that gets ported over to PF2 the most.
That's it for now, thank you for showing this to us ^^
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The talk about Operative using the aim action and really caring about crits does make me nervous about the class, after how much of a repetitive drag Investigator ended up being to actually play.
All the classes we saw were looking good. Envoy is more involved in its buffs, Solarian has single-mode support in core to enable a lot more concepts, and Soldier got some significant improvements to issues that showed up. Mystic matched its preview, as the most recent, of course.
Love getting to see new previews of the ancestry options. I'm so excited to pick from different Shirren feats and heritages... which is itself in character.
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The talk about Operative using the aim action and really caring about crits does make me nervous about the class, after how much of a repetitive drag Investigator ended up being to actually play.
I think one the things that can be done to counter that problem is giving a breadth of real options that are related to the Aim action, but not just small additions to it. One of the problems the Investigator has is that Devise a Stratagem is basically the only thing that gets modified by your feats and beyond that you aren't really doing anything but basic actions. It's the most one trickiest of ponies, with a trick that isn't even particularly good. That gets old really fast.
The other thing is that actions you use often should have a benefit in and of themselves, not just when you use another action afterwards. Otherwise, if the second action fails, you feel like you just wasted two actions instead of one (which you have). I don't know, that always feels even worse than whiffing a two-action activity.
Just as an example, the Envoy also seems to have a really repetitive action cycle, but it doesn't feel that way (for now). For one, Issue Directive (or whatever the action is really called) has a benefit of its own the moment you use it. It also has the advantage that Lead by Example has multiple ways you can use it, though it seems only "Get in there" is baseline (something to look out for)? Lastly, its second component (Lead by Example) cannot fail to also grant you and your team some kind of benefit. The last would be pretty hard to do with an Aim/Strike combo, but we can probably get the first two.
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This Envoy seems like a dream come true.
This Envoy seems like a dream come true.
It does look pretty shiny.
It occurs to me, though, that it might wind up a bit undertuned for PF2 poaching. In particular, the SF2 general assumption of "well, of course everyone has a firearm on them at all times and knowledge of its use" is the kind of thing that can be really useful for Warlord-style "everyone gets to take a shot now" powers, if they happen to have any of those. Transplanting that into a party with a kineticist, a caster or two, and a Champion as the sole martial might leave that kind of ability feeling a bit anemic.
while the ability to give the entire party a free move on the envoy's turn is absolutely wild, i doubt they will give them a way to provide free attacks to the party(maybe at a much higher level, maybe). as is the -1 to ac is pretty damn good for most characters(even spell casters can opt to cast attack spells) and the bonus damage is gonna be useful for everyone. porting over to pf2, a shortbow envoy looks very good to me looking very good next to my pfs bard right now. melee envoy with marshal dedication has the potential to be an absolute beast.
while the ability to give the entire party a free move on the envoy's turn is absolutely wild, i doubt they will give them a way to provide free attacks to the party(maybe at a much higher level, maybe). as is the -1 to ac is pretty damn good for most characters(even spell casters can opt to cast attack spells) and the bonus damage is gonna be useful for everyone. porting over to pf2, a shortbow envoy looks very good to me looking very good next to my pfs bard right now. melee envoy with marshal dedication has the potential to be an absolute beast.
Double the movement of Four Winds for a lot of levels, plus a five-foot boost, as well as a weak one-action version. Starfinder definitely values movement less because long range combats are more expected.
oh i forgot about four winds... haven't had a chance to play my air kineticist yet and that move is the a huge part of the reason i made one. that said i find hard to believe movement is less valued. unless you start battle in the perfect position you are probably going to want o move, and being able to saving an action on that is amazing. i've got a character that uses 'To Battle'(from marshal) and another with 'Loose times arrow'(the spell) that i've used to great effect. obviously great for melees, but if cover is gonna be a common thing, people are gonna want to get there with as few actions as possible.
oh i forgot about four winds... haven't had a chance to play my air kineticist yet and that move is the a huge part of the reason i made one. that said i find hard to believe movement is less valued. unless you start battle in the perfect position you are probably going to want o move, and being able to saving an action on that is amazing. i've got a character that uses 'To Battle'(from marshal) and another with 'Loose times arrow'(the spell) that i've used to great effect. obviously great for melees, but if cover is gonna be a common thing, people are gonna want to get there with as few actions as possible.
Hmm, to be more clear: "X amount of movement" is valued less in Starfinder. At level 5, Envoy moves everyone 30-35 feet instead of Kineticist's 10-15 feet. Soldier damages an area while debuffing movement 10 feet on a regular failed save, or on a success for one subclass, instead of only on a critical hit like Ray of Frost. Solarian spends two actions to move twice with a 10-foot bonus like Psychic does, but gets a rider effect as well to make the ability more useful.
Those aren't all exactly comparable, but movement effects seem to need to be bigger and cheaper in Starfinder to matter.
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Managing Creative Director (Starfinder)
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I should also stress: This is an internal playtest.
The Envoy, as an example, is a class we're still playing around with internally and looking at a variety of builds and options for. Testing out a "free Stride/Step" was part of it, and we'll likely tone it down slightly to be a Stride up to half movement or the like.
All that being said, I'm really glad that folks are enjoying the classes and how they're portrayed. It's going to be awhile before we hit the final builds, but this open playtest is all about making these products the best we can, so Starfinder 2E can be the best game it can be.
I should also stress: This is an internal playtest.
The Envoy, as an example, is a class we're still playing around with internally and looking at a variety of builds and options for. Testing out a "free Stride/Step" was part of it, and we'll likely tone it down slightly to be a Stride up to half movement or the like.
All that being said, I'm really glad that folks are enjoying the classes and how they're portrayed. It's going to be awhile before we hit the final builds, but this open playtest is all about making these products the best we can, so Starfinder 2E can be the best game it can be.
That's fair! I don't really have a problem with the faster movement, but even just giving a 5-foot boost before having means a lot of characters with the default 25 feet of movement get to move more.
I continue to be very excited to see everything coming out over the next year, and even more excited for the long and rich future Starfinder has ahead as a result. X)
Huh. It seems like...
Well, it may be that they're just aiming a bit high on the power curve at this point in the dev cycle. It even makes sense to do so. The objective at this point is to shuffle around a bunch and come up with rough general ideas that work together and are flavorful and fun to play. Being overly generous on the powersets makes it easier to do that in these first early passes than being overly parsimonious would, and it even gives you useful info on what bits are the fun bits.
Like, if Envoy has a power that lets them grant every one of his friends stride+10ft move as a single action, and it's fun, you can recognize that it's fun, and then see how far down you can trim it (for balance reasons) without really reducing that fun too much. If you start off with a power that lets them give everyone 5=10 feet of movement... well, that might just not be fun int he first place. At that point, you gotta ask - is the power just too weak, or is it simply not fun at all? The process of figuring out what works and what doesn't is a lot slower that way, and also less fun for all involved.
So I guess maybe letting the Mystic have its kind of OP stats for the moment isn't such a terrible thing.
Finally found some time to watch and it was quite fun to see!! Starfinder flavor did come through which was very comforting to see.
My one takeaway is you need to change the name of Hero Points to Star points, as it was very jarring and for that moment it felt like a PF II reskin in space game.
Also I hope they do the Special Ed Hero Point deck like Pf II that has the more specific things one can use the "Star Points" for as they are a big hit in my PF II games. Honestly the Crit hit and Fumble decks for SF I is hit and miss as many of them when pulled just don't apply sadly :(
Looking forward to more shows like this!! :)
Tom
My one takeaway is you need to change the name of Hero Points to Star points, as it was very jarring and for that moment it felt like a PF II reskin in space game.
I mean, they also use the same names for conditions, basic actions, skills and more. I don't think hero points are the one thing that breaks the camel's back here ^^