Martialmasters |
Currently it doesn't look like it. Support abilities appear to be both optional and supplemental to the core chassis.
If we can take anything from baseline earth it's just that it hits slightly harder at range and on successive hits.
Some of it's abilities are tank flavored, but they are a bit too spread out to be a tank.
Plus the only real tanks I know of in pf2 is champion due to their high ac and reactions to defend party members.
Everything else might be as hard to hit or have more health. I don't know if that in itself constitutes what a tank is to my mind.
Are we using the MMO term?
Verzen |
Currently it doesn't look like it. Support abilities appear to be both optional and supplemental to the core chassis.
If we can take anything from baseline earth it's just that it hits slightly harder at range and on successive hits.
Some of it's abilities are tank flavored, but they are a bit too spread out to be a tank.
Plus the only real tanks I know of in pf2 is champion due to their high ac and reactions to defend party members.
Everything else might be as hard to hit or have more health. I don't know if that in itself constitutes what a tank is to my mind.
Are we using the MMO term?
Essentially - high AC, high HP, lower damage, but great survivability.
Earth in PF1E was a tank and was very very sturdy. Earth in PF2E has some damage reducing powers, like the shield which is okayish (would be better if it didn't cancel out gather element) but that's pretty much it. Assume earths mantle is at level 14 and actually harms our AC, funny enough and we do get stone wall which is very cool but both come online really late.
RexAliquid |
Earth has Spike Skin at level 8 that gives you or your ally resistance and return damage to your allies. That's basically a lesser paladin's reaction that doesn't take your reaction.
The Dust storm aura can move enemies away from your allies at the start of your turn. For one action, you could switch the aura to difficult terrain. That's a great set-up for a reach fighter, forcing the enemy to Stride and provoke the AoO or deal with the concealed condition. Just stock up on cat's eye elixirs for your party.
YuriP |
Is the intent for simply DPS blasters only? Or will there be options so I can be a healer kineticist or a tank kineticist as well where I can be the dedicated tank or dedicated healer?
Just being "earth" doesn't make me a tank.
I feel the idea is that Kinetcist to be a martial blaster caster (I know it's confuse), due how the different Impulses works it's a Blaster that have some different "utility spells" to use in different situations.
The defensive (mostly earth) impulses are around this. Stone Shield give circumstance AC and Hardness, Dust Storm give concealed to protect you and your allies at range (and you need to switch to AoE attacks to prevents the conceal effect forcing you to do flat checks), Spike Skin give physical resistance for 10 minutes or 10 attacks, Rock Rampart can create walls of stone, Assume Earth’s Mantle give heavy armor bonus. But nothing of these impulses will turn the Kineticist into a real tanker specially because it isn't legendary in defenses but will help the Kineticist more defensively stronger. It's similar to how many spells like Stoneskin, Shield, Mage Armor and other spells that's helps defensively works.
Xenocrat |
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I was excited for the shields+ to fort DC then saw the only earth overflow impulses I'd consider was reflex DC. So I left it behind.
The bonus to fortitude DC has nothing to do with the DCs of your abilities. It's your defensive fortitude DC against things like the grapple maneuver that target your fort DC rather than requiring a save.
Micheal Smith |
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I'm not overly interested in forcing pf2e to mirror 1e when introducing classes. I'll leave you to that
Im fine with that. It shouldn't mirror 100% but should have similar concepts/roles. Completely changing it to something else I feel is not right and would be a disaster. I mean Microsoft did that with Windows 8.
2E did that as a whole and I feel it was a mistake. We are taking a system people are used to an have known for 10+ years and then just drastically changing it to something completely new.
That was one thing I liked about PF1 Kineticist, was the versatility and felt it captured the essence of what each element should be,
Shinigami02 |
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A Universalist Kineticist can actually already be a decent dedicated healer. They get 4 separate options for healing in-class (Soothing Breeze and Restoring Mud as level 4 feats, Torrent in the Blood as a level 8 feat, and Circulate Qi as a level 12 feat). Three of those are on a 10-minute cooldown per character. Two of them are AoE heals (one emanation, one a cone), while a third is a 30-foot ranged Single Target. Since they don't start until 4 that also leaves you your level 2 feat for a standard Healer build's Medic or Blessed One archetype.
Verzen |
A Universalist Kineticist can actually already be a decent dedicated healer. They get 4 separate options for healing in-class (Soothing Breeze and Restoring Mud as level 4 feats, Torrent in the Blood as a level 8 feat, and Circulate Qi as a level 12 feat). Three of those are on a 10-minute cooldown per character. Two of them are AoE heals (one emanation, one a cone), while a third is a 30-foot ranged Single Target. Since they don't start until 4 that also leaves you your level 2 feat for a standard Healer build's Medic or Blessed One archetype.
Now I kind of want a level 1 heal for water...