The Six Action Minon Masters

[siegfriedliner]

So the two animal companion archetypes leave an interesting opportunity for a unqiquely silly build.

Playing a animal druid/ranger then take both the Animal trainer and beast master archetypes. This should give you 3 companions that each scale of the beastmasters feats (which reference all animal companions you have).

This means you could have three mature/nimble/specialised companions that act once even if you don't command them.

Would this be a terribly effective no probably not animal companions don't scale well but it could be a lot of silly fun.

Has anyone tried this and am I misreading the rules?

[SuperBidi]

siegfriedliner wrote:

Has anyone tried this and am I misreading the rules?

Unfortunately: "You can have only one animal companion at a time."

[siegfriedliner]

Ah yes thats a shame. Sensible.

[HammerJack]

At level 16, a Beastmaster can, with the right feat, have 2 of their companions active at once.

[Mellored]

You can also have summons (no limit), and 1 familiar.

[HammerJack]

Well, not tell hnically a limit on summons, but your ability to get multople out at a time is gated by how many tools to reduce castomg actions like QuicKen Spell or to free action Sustain, like a witch's Cackle, you have.

[Mellored]

HammerJack wrote:

Well, not tell hnically a limit on summons, but your ability to get multople out at a time is gated by how many tools to reduce castomg actions like QuicKen Spell or to free action Sustain, like a witch's Cackle, you have.

Effortless concentration as well.

[HammerJack]

I was counting that under the heading of "tools to free action sustain"

[Midnightoker]

Theoretically you can get two summons on the board and also have an animal companion.

That's not limited to casting reduction actions because you dont have to command the animal companion for it to remain in existence like you do the summons. Turn 3 you can still do the "command everyone" turn.

[manbearscientist]

At high levels you can throw in rituals to get permanent summons, and most (all?) casters get Effortless Concentration. Ideal is probably 1 Animal Companion, 2 permanent ritual minions, and 1 summoned minion controlled with the Sustain a Spell from Effortless Concentration. Works best if one of these is your mount.

[oholoko]

Midnightoker wrote:

Theoretically you can get two summons on the board and also have an animal companion.

That's not limited to casting reduction actions because you dont have to command the animal companion for it to remain in existence like you do the summons. Turn 3 you can still do the "command everyone" turn.

The max i think is 4 summonas.

Normal summon turn 1
Normal summon + effortless turn 2
quickened spell Normal summon + effortless + action to sustain turn 3
Time stop + normal summon + 3 actions to concentrate + efortless turun 4

Then expend all actions concentrating from that turn on.

It's a really bad idea and i am not 100% sure it works but it seems possible.

[Midnightoker]

Oh sure, I was just pointing out Effortless isn't required.

Afterall any character can have an Animal Companion (or Familiar) at level 2 and knowing a single Summon is possible at level 1.

So theoretically a Druid with Summon and AC can do what I described at level 1.

Effortless Concentration doesn't come online until level 16, so a pretty substantial amount of time.

[oholoko]

Midnightoker wrote:

Oh sure, I was just pointing out Effortless isn't required.

Afterall any character can have an Animal Companion (or Familiar) at level 2 and knowing a single Summon is possible at level 1.

So theoretically a Druid with Summon and AC can do what I described at level 1.

Effortless Concentration doesn't come online until level 16, so a pretty substantial amount of time.

Oh yeah that's 100% correct, that's a silly tecnically possible thing but it's mostly useless. I was just giving how to summon the most theorical things are fun even when useless.

[Mark Seifter]

Beastmaster witch with Effortless Concentration and an independent familiar, plus a party of 6 with 5 bards (all gnomes with 3 focus points, familiars who give them another focus point, and Energized Font)

Companion just does 1 action each round since you never command it.
Same for familiar.

Round 1: Summon
Round 2: Effortless Concentration + Summon
Round 3: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 4: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 5: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 6: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 7: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Summon (Bards use Energized Font and grab the extra focus from their familiars, as they are all out of Focus Points but one, who has 1 left)
Round 8: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Summon
Round 9: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Sustain + Quickened Summon

So on round 9, your witch has an animal companion, a familiar, and 9 summons. Then on round 10, you and the bards all have 0 FP, so you can only Sustain four of them and the whole thing collapses.

[Midnightoker]

Mark Seifter wrote:

Beastmaster witch with Effortless Concentration and an independent familiar, plus a party of 6 with 5 bards (all gnomes with 3 focus points, familiars who give them another focus point, and Energized Font)

Companion just does 1 action each round since you never command it.
Same for familiar.

Round 1: Summon
Round 2: Effortless Concentration + Summon
Round 3: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 4: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 5: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 6: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 7: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Summon (Bards use Energized Font and grab the extra focus from their familiars, as they are all out of Focus Points but one, who has 1 left)
Round 8: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Summon
Round 9: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Sustain + Quickened Summon

So on round 9, your witch has an animal companion, a familiar, and 9 summons. Then on round 10, you and the bards all have 0 FP, so you can only Sustain four of them and the whole thing collapses.

ROFL

You wild, Mark. You wild.

[oholoko]

Mark Seifter wrote:

Beastmaster witch with Effortless Concentration and an independent familiar, plus a party of 6 with 5 bards (all gnomes with 3 focus points, familiars who give them another focus point, and Energized Font)

Companion just does 1 action each round since you never command it.
Same for familiar.

Round 1: Summon
Round 2: Effortless Concentration + Summon
Round 3: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 4: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 5: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 6: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Summon
Round 7: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Summon (Bards use Energized Font and grab the extra focus from their familiars, as they are all out of Focus Points but one, who has 1 left)
Round 8: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Summon
Round 9: Effortless Concentration + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle (Bard Accompanies) + Cackle + Sustain + Quickened Summon

So on round 9, your witch has an animal companion, a familiar, and 9 summons. Then on round 10, you and the bards all have 0 FP, so you can only Sustain four of them and the whole thing collapses.

We keep casting and pretend we will form an army they will never know it's a bluff!

[jdripley]

oholoko wrote:

We keep casting and pretend we will form an army they will never know it's a bluff!

For that, you need a 7th party member, sorcerer, who, on round 9, starts shouting "Quickened Invisibility! Quickened Invisibility!! Quickened Invisibility!!!!" and hopes to roll really well on her deception!

[Mark Seifter]

jdripley wrote:

oholoko wrote:

We keep casting and pretend we will form an army they will never know it's a bluff!

For that, you need a 7th party member, sorcerer, who, on round 9, starts shouting "Quickened Invisibility! Quickened Invisibility!! Quickened Invisibility!!!!" and hopes to roll really well on her deception!

I guess the bards could have been casting 4th-level invis on the summons as they came out, so it won't be obvious in that case.