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Gortle |
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![Mockery](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/PZO9089-Mockery_500.jpeg)
Prescient consumable is still tied to using prescient planner which is unable to select magical or alchemical items.
I understand the wording is a little open but I disagree. It explicitly adds consumables which is a broad category and nicely labelled. Given that we are no longer talking about adventuring gear, it is reasonable not to consider the restrictions on adventuring gear in the original feat. It does restate the other restrictions that still apply.
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AestheticDialectic |
![Tyrannosaurus Rex](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/PZO1126-TRex_90.jpeg)
In the guide you remarked on the Zero Gravity spell with:
Zero Gravity (UNCOMMON) - I’m sort of baffled by the purpose of this spell. Is it to create a sort of mass fly spell with a very limited range?
I'm not 100% sure why you have this impression, but it seems like you focused very hard on the fact that it spends a great deal of the spell text telling you how you can push off objects to move around in the area of the spell and that creatures in the area start off on the ground so they could push themselves in a direction, but I wanna focus on something in specific:
You negate gravity's effects in the area. Creatures float in place unless they can Push Off a surface.
While you might start at the ground, you really can only push upwards or diagonally upwards. Which is going to be borderline useless. You can't really walk on the ground anymore either since the moment you try to push against the ground to walk you'll start slowly floating up. What I'm trying to get at is that for creatures that can't levitate or fly, this is a no-save crowd control spell that makes people nearly helpless for a minute(with concentration)
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Gortle |
![Mockery](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/PZO9089-Mockery_500.jpeg)
While you might start at the ground, you really can only push upwards or diagonally upwards.
Diagonally is enough for forward movement.
Which is going to be borderline useless. You can't really walk on the ground anymore either since the moment you try to push against the ground to walk you'll start slowly floating up.
Maybe. It depends. The problem with this spell is some GMs will intepret it as a full on nerf for non flying characters, and some with have it take one extra action, as their movement is slightly disrupted. The spell doesn't tell you, that's really poor.
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AestheticDialectic |
![Tyrannosaurus Rex](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/PZO1126-TRex_90.jpeg)
AestheticDialectic wrote:While you might start at the ground, you really can only push upwards or diagonally upwards.Diagonally is enough for forward movement.
AestheticDialectic wrote:Which is going to be borderline useless. You can't really walk on the ground anymore either since the moment you try to push against the ground to walk you'll start slowly floating up.Maybe. It depends. The problem with this spell is some GMs will intepret it as a full on nerf for non flying characters, and some with have it take one extra action, as their movement is slightly disrupted. The spell doesn't tell you, that's really poor.
Idk how good it should be, but I know in terms of real physics trying to walk with no gravity is going to send you floating. If a GM ruled it as slightly disrupted movement then I would have a lot more questions and whether this spell is good or not is the least of our concerns with this revelation
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Squiggit |
![Skeletal Technician](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/PZO9086-SkeletalTechnician_90.jpeg)
Yeah, but COTG runs into the problem of being a single target debuff tied to a spell attack, which means the enemies you want to use it on are the ones you're most likely to miss.
And because you're probably using it on a big threat, even if it does hit they're the most likely to shake it off in a single action. Going 2 for 1 against a boss is sometimes okay, depending on what their action routine looks like.
The lack of any effect on a success just makes it feel really unreliable for how middling its effect is and how much randomness there is in landing the spell.
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UnArcaneElection |
![Magnifying glass](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/Plot-glass.jpg)
Gortle wrote:Idk how good it should be, but I know in terms of real physics trying to walk with no gravity is going to send you floating. If a GM ruled it as slightly disrupted movement then I would have a lot more questions and whether this spell is good or not is the least of our concerns with this revelationAestheticDialectic wrote:While you might start at the ground, you really can only push upwards or diagonally upwards.Diagonally is enough for forward movement.
AestheticDialectic wrote:Which is going to be borderline useless. You can't really walk on the ground anymore either since the moment you try to push against the ground to walk you'll start slowly floating up.Maybe. It depends. The problem with this spell is some GMs will intepret it as a full on nerf for non flying characters, and some with have it take one extra action, as their movement is slightly disrupted. The spell doesn't tell you, that's really poor.
Seems to me that this would depend a lot upon the area that the spell took effect in. If it is an open ground with nothing to hang onto, then affected creatures attempting to move would end up pushing themselves up (possibly diagonally); but if it is in an enclosed area, then creatures could push off the floor, walls, and ceiling in alternation to get around. Keep in mind that the area isn't very large, so unless the enclosed area also isn't very large, creatures will soon move out of it, which (depending upon placement) could lead to some Warner Physics effects.
Also, although it doesn't say so in the spell description, it seems implicit that if this spell is cast on the surface of a liquid body of sufficient volume and area, the spell area (actually volume) of effect will fill up with the liquid.
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AestheticDialectic |
![Tyrannosaurus Rex](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/PZO1126-TRex_90.jpeg)
AestheticDialectic wrote:Idk how good it should be, but I know in terms of real physics trying to walk with no gravity is going to send you floating. If a GM ruled it as slightly disrupted movement then I would have a lot more questions and whether this spell is good or not is the least of our concerns with this revelation
Maybe. It depends. The problem with this spell is some GMs will intepret it as a full on nerf for non flying characters, and some with have it take one extra action, as their movement is slightly disrupted. The spell doesn't tell you, that's really poor.
Seems to me that this would depend a lot upon the area that the spell took effect in. If it is an open ground with nothing to hang onto, then affected creatures attempting to move would end up pushing themselves up (possibly diagonally); but if it is in an enclosed area, then creatures could push off the floor, walls, and ceiling in alternation to get around. Keep in mind that the area isn't very large, so unless the enclosed area also isn't very large, creatures will soon move out of it, which (depending upon placement) could lead to some Warner Physics effects.
Also, although it doesn't say so in the spell description, it seems implicit that if this spell is cast on the surface of a liquid body of sufficient volume and area, the spell area (actually volume) of effect will fill up with the liquid.
It seems to me this could be a strong crowd control spell against non-flying enemies in open spaces or large rooms, and even more so if your party has a lot of ways to hit dudes at range, and the fact the space would fill up with water, which I agree seems definitely like it would be the case, I think there is potential for some really creative uses of the spell. I can't think of any but this could apply to any liquid... lava, acid, water, mercury if it ever came up. I wonder if this could be a good method of fishing
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UnArcaneElection |
![Magnifying glass](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/Plot-glass.jpg)
Let's see if I can fix the botched quotes (I hate when they do that to themselves):
UnArcaneElection wrote:It seems to me this could be a strong crowd control spell against non-flying enemies in open spaces or large rooms, and even more so if your party has a lot of ways to hit dudes at range, and the fact the space would fill up with water, which I agree seems definitely like it would be the case, I think there is potential for some really creative uses of the spell. I can't think of any but this could apply to any liquid... lava, acid, water, mercury if it ever came up. I wonder if this could be a good method of fishingAestheticDialectic wrote:Gortle wrote:Idk how good it should be, but I know in terms of real physics trying to walk with no gravity is going to send you floating. If a GM ruled it as slightly disrupted movement then I would have a lot more questions and whether this spell is good or not is the least of our concerns with this revelationAestheticDialectic wrote:While you might start at the ground, you really can only push upwards or diagonally upwards.Diagonally is enough for forward movement.
AestheticDialectic wrote:Which is going to be borderline useless. You can't really walk on the ground anymore either since the moment you try to push against the ground to walk you'll start slowly floating up.Maybe. It depends. The problem with this spell is some GMs will intepret it as a full on nerf for non flying characters, and some with have it take one extra action, as their movement is slightly disrupted. The spell doesn't tell you, that's really poor.Seems to me that this would depend a lot upon the area that the spell took effect in. If it is an open ground with nothing to hang onto, then affected creatures attempting to move would end up pushing themselves up (possibly diagonally); but if it is in an enclosed area, then creatures could push off the floor, walls, and ceiling in alternation to get around. Keep in mind that the area isn't very large, so unless the enclosed area also isn't very large, creatures will soon move out of it, which (depending upon placement) could lead to some Warner Physics effects.
Also, although it doesn't say so in the spell description, it seems implicit that if this spell is cast on the surface of a liquid body of sufficient volume and area, the spell area (actually volume) of effect will fill up with the liquid.
Might actually be best when the affected area has dropoffs to either side -- otherwise the affected creatures fly up for a few seconds, then come out of the affected area, fall, and take a moderate amount of damage, and have to get back up. That isn't nothing, and it could be quite effective against Large Animals and similar creatures, but if you're up against leveled Humanoids, they're probably going to shrug it off and just keep fighting after a short action economy interruption. The fact that it is No Save (not even Incapacitation) IS a major plus, so if you can take good advantage of an action economy hiccup and some mild damage to the enemies, it could certainly be worth it.
If you want to fish with it, you would need to have an ally thread a net through the base of the liquid column before the spell expires -- the fish aren't going to come out of the column unless they make the mistake of jumping (that said, throwing something into the middle of the column to scare them would be a valid option, as would an illusion of a predator).
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Ravingdork |
![Raegos](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/Raegos_Final.jpg)
Might actually be best when the affected area has dropoffs to either side -- otherwise the affected creatures fly up for a few seconds, then come out of the affected area, fall, and take a moderate amount of damage, and have to get back up. That isn't nothing...
Does taking falling damage still knock you prone in this edition? If so, that nothing ends up being quite something.
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UnArcaneElection |
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![Magnifying glass](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/Plot-glass.jpg)
^I do this much: taking damage from a fall knocks you prone (No Save either).
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VestOfHolding |
![Green Dragon](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/PZO9259-GreenDragon_500.jpeg)
I saw someone on the previous page asking for stars or some non-color way to distinguish the options, and I agree. In generally, if another update is coming, I hope my guide to formatting guides can help.