So Fellas, one of my players has got this feat (and obviously met its requirements), the thing is I don't know if I really got the idea of this feat tree but is it right to say that:
His Dwarf Fighter has +2 to hit and damage and +4 on his AC agains ANY creature in the game forever and ever?
That's it or am I missing something? Cause it really seems way broken! I would really like further explanations if possible.
Thanks for the replies.
Any enemy that hits the Dwarf with an attack, yes.
And only whilst the Dwarf maintains his Dwarven Hatred combat style.
And only until the combat ends.
There are plenty of built in restrictions that it isn't a big deal...
So you have to do it as an immediate action, which you only get one of per turn.
But it does look like each turn he could pick a new target to get the defensive or offensive bonuses against and they would last until combat ends. But it's an immediate action per creature, and they have to choose between getting the defense bonus or attack and damage bonus, not both.
So, it's good. But it's not that amazing.
Also apparently it only works while medium (which is a weird restriction), so Enlarge/Reduce Person will disrupt the entire feat chain.
Any enemy that hits the Dwarf with an attack, yes.
And only whilst the Dwarf maintains his Dwarven Hatred combat style.
And only until the combat ends.
There are plenty of built in restrictions that it isn't a big deal...
Can you name a Few?
Also, since it's an immediate action, it means that the enemy hits first (or not) and only then he will get the bonus thereafter?
Can you name a Few?Also, since it's an immediate action, it means that the enemy hits first (or not) and only then he will get the bonus thereafter?
Correct, it requires you to actually get hit first and only then do you get to apply either your Hatred or Defensive training bonus but not both.
It's pretty weak imo for a 3 feat chain.
Can you name a Few?Also, since it's an immediate action, it means that the enemy hits first (or not) and only then he will get the bonus thereafter?
Correct, it requires you to actually get hit first and only then do you get to apply either your Hatred or Defensive training bonus but not both.
It's pretty weak imo for a 3 feat chain.
In addition, you can only apply it to 1 enemy every round (if they hit you). You can maintain multiple with the last feat, but it's still only once a round.
Maybe read the third part of a three chain feat again before saying its weak.
Can you name a Few?Also, since it's an immediate action, it means that the enemy hits first (or not) and only then he will get the bonus thereafter?
Correct, it requires you to actually get hit first and only then do you get to apply either your Hatred or Defensive training bonus but not both.
It's pretty weak imo for a 3 feat chain.
It's 3 feats that only benefit you once you've been hit by something that requires an attack roll. You also need to be hit twice to get the full benefit and spend your immediate actions to get it up and running. If you get hit multiple times in the same round, you only get to pick 1 person/benefit since you only have 1 immediate action.
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First you need to get hit with a weapon/unarmed/natural attack or spell with an attack roll. Then you need to spend an immediate action. And then, you get either +2 to attack and damage rolls, or +4 to AC against that one enemy. You could get both agaisnt the same enemy, but that requires two rounds and twice getting hit.
The first option is akin to having Weapon Focus, Greater Weapon Focus, and Weapon Specialization - also three feats, only much better because they always work. And while not everyone can take these feats, it should be clear that feats that are a weaker version of definitely-not-OP Fighter feats aren't OP, either.
The second option is not something you could easily reproduce with three feats, but an AC boost that you can only activate against one target per round, and only after you were already hit, is worth way less, anyway.
Against an enemy caster, or any enemy that only attacks your party members, the feats are completely useless. On any character who needs swift/immediate action (more than half the classes in the game), the feats are unusuable or at least decidedly worse.
So yes, the feat chain is indeed weak.
My suspicions is that the OP's player wasn't obeying the immediate action usage and was instead getting against each creature that hit him and getting both the offensive and defensive bonuses against each creature at the same time.
Which would be too good. As they work properly though, their just kind of okay.
I assume they weren't spending the swift action to get into style either.
I assume they weren't spending the swift action to get into style either.
That's a bit of a gray area. There's no time limit on styles, so you could apparently start using one at the beginning of the day and then it stays active until you activate another style.
I assume they weren't spending the swift action to get into style either.That's a bit of a gray area. There's no time limit on styles, so you could apparently start using one at the beginning of the day and then it stays active until you activate another style.
No gray area. You cannot use a style feat before combat begins.
No gray area. You cannot use a style feat before combat begins.
Yes gray area. You couldn't start it "at the beginning of the day", but nothing actually says that you ever stop being in a stance after you've entered it. Strict RAW, you take the feat, you enter the stacne first combat, and you stay in the stance until the heat death or the universe, or until you switch to a different combat style, whichever comes first.
I think it's pretty clear that these stances are supposed to end when combat ends, but it's not written anywhere.
I believe there was an FAQ that resulted in a statement of you can't be in a stance before combat, but I'm not 100% on that.
I believe there was an FAQ that resulted in a statement of you can't be in a stance before combat, but I'm not 100% on that.
There is no FAQ. There may have been a developer post, but those aren't official.
Think of your fighting style as putting your guard up before a fist fight...
Sure. Technically, you can maintain that stance after the fist fight is over... until you have to get on a horse, retrieve something from your backpack, eat, get dressed/undressed, bath, sleep...
And next time a fist fight breaks out, you will have to put your guard up again.
Don't be a freaking menace... we all know without a doubt that you have to re-enter your fighting style each new encounter/initiative sequence.
For some reason I assumed that any time spent in a style counted as part of your 1 hour of hustling per day since you're combat ready and thus hustling. It's probably an ancient house rule I forgot was a house rule.
I believe there was an FAQ that resulted in a statement of you can't be in a stance before combat, but I'm not 100% on that.There is no FAQ. There may have been a developer post, but those aren't official.
There is the text itself:
Although you cannot use a style feat before combat begins, the style you are in persists until you spend a swift action to switch to a different combat style.
Which is ridiculously simple to get around by simply entering combat.
There are also a few styles that are weird if they can't work outside of combat like Owl Style and Owl Dive. While those could be limited to combat only, they would be incredibly wasted if that's the case.