No.
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What's the meaningful item in question?
It feels wrong to me to not include items, if they are part of the creature's stat block. We should be able to assume that my new sprite familiar will have a sword and bow without me having to visit a tiny shop.
Improved familiars are a class-based and feat-based feature. Why would they come with their own loot?
This said, it seems extremely logical for a pixie, say, to arrive with non-magical gear like a tiny sword and bow. Gold pieces? Not so much. One single piece of coin would be a huge burden for the little fellers!
If this were the case then it means you would be able to recoup a portion of your costs every time you make a leshy since in nearly every case they are listed as having "standard" treasure and some constructs are the same way.
No.Care to back that up with more than one word and a source?
Not unless there's a argument that warrants additional verbiage.
Makes it seem like you are trolling, because typically only trolls do that.
???
Cohorts and Followers from Leadership come with their own Heroic (Cohort)/Normal (Followers) NPC wealth, and that is just a feat. The creatures live their own lives, and those lives say they have a set amount of money before you ever meet them. Until you can provide a rule saying that Improved Familiars do not come with their own wealth, the general rules say they do.Improved familiars are a class-based and feat-based feature. Why would they come with their own loot?
This said, it seems extremely logical for a pixie, say, to arrive with non-magical gear like a tiny sword and bow. Gold pieces? Not so much. One single piece of coin would be a huge burden for the little fellers!
Sounds like you already had an answer, then. Why ask here?
If your pixie was a cohort from the leadership feat, sure, you could argue that you should use the WBL tables to equip it.
Familiars aren't cohorts. Nothing in the books suggests they get WBL equipment, or any equipment at all.
If your DM is very lenient, maybe you can argue your case. If you are the DM, you can do as you wish.
AFAIK, there is no RAW argument for allowing familiars to come with their own gear like cohorts.
This feat allows you to acquire a powerful familiar, but only when you could normally acquire a new familiar.
Prerequisites: Ability to acquire a new familiar, compatible alignment, sufficiently high level (see below).
Benefit: When choosing a familiar, the creatures listed here are also available to you. You may choose a familiar with an alignment up to one step away on each alignment axis (lawful through chaotic, good through evil).
Improved familiars otherwise use the rules for regular familiars, with two exceptions: if the creature’s type is something other than animal, its type does not change; and improved familiars do not gain the ability to speak with other creatures of their kind (although many of them already have the ability to communicate).
With two exceptions, you treat them as ordinary familiars. Ordinary familiars get no gear or loot. And Bob's your uncle.
Familiar Basics: Use the basic statistics for a creature of the familiar's kind, but with the following changes.
So, is Treasure part of the "basic statistics"?
At the least, equipment found in their attacks and defenses are easily part of "basic statistics".
The examples I've seen don't include any such gear or treasure. For that matter, there's nothing suggesting selling your faerie dragon's hoard in order to get better equipment is in any way acceptable to that faerie dragon.
I think assuming that any such treasure is not normally accessible to the familiar's master is fairer and feels less like slavery.
If you read the bestiary, you will see that it is a guideline on how much treasure to reward for an encounter with that sort of creature. It even refers to the core rulebook and explains that this varies based on the slow, medium or fast game tracks. Looking at the refereed to section of the CRB shows that this section is all about getting rewards for encountering monsters, things like money and XP.
Your familiar isn't a monster encounter. You don't get treasure for it anymore than you get XP for it.
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You may feel that you've refuted the arguments made against you Reksaw, but just reminding you that a) there's nothing directly supporting your case and b) all six other people posting on this thread have disagreed with you.
And no, you don't normally have to roll diplomacy checks to get an improved familiar. Is that a PFS thing?
Yes. That’s why you can’t gain any type of Familiar all wily nily, because they aren’t all located where you are when you gain your next Familiar. If you use the Environment section, then there is no reason not to use the Treasure section that is literally immediately underneath it.Familiar Basics: Use the basic statistics for a creature of the familiar's kind, but with the following changes.So, is Treasure part of the "basic statistics"?
At the least, equipment found in their attacks and defenses are easily part of "basic statistics".
The Environment field is not a factor when determining which improved familiars are available to you. You takes the feat, you meets the specific (alignment and sometimes other things) requirements, you gets the familiar. Whether you roleplay that out is a table preference matter, not a rules one.
Literally the past 27 stat blocks I’ve looked at of anything in Pathfinder have been wrong in some way, shape, or form.
Also, any stat block that has an Improved Familiar without gear is probably wrong.
This suggests that even if we pointed at a specific rule, you would simply say that it's wrong anyway.
The biggest reason to have an I.F. is to give it a wand. Nearly every player does it.
I mean, it's a reason, but even leaving flavor concerns aside, I wouldn't call it the biggest one. I've never done it, and I probably never will as it puts a giant bullseye on my familiar's face. There are far better uses for the feat.
Roleplay encounters are encounters. You typically have to role Diplomacy to get the creature to accept you as its master. Especially if it is evil or territorial, as they will attack you.
This is not generally true (again, from a rules standpoint, not a table-specific one) unless you want to convince a specific creature to become your familiar. You takes the feats, you gets the familiar. You don't have to convince it of anything. There are a few exceptions--the pipefox, for example, must agree to pledge itself to someone before that someone can take the pipefox as a familiar. And it may be more fun to play out such encounters for other creatures. But it isn't strictly necessary--any schmuck wizard who dumped Charisma can still take the improved familiar feat going just by the rules.
And yes, you do have to roll diplomacy. You can’t just go “you’re my familiar now” and it happens. They are NPCs. They have to want to join you.
No, but you can go "I want an imp familiar", take the feat, and the GM is generally obliged to provide it. See FAQ:
The exception to the above is if you take the Improved Familiar feat, which allows you to immediately replace your familiar with the new familiar, at no cost or time required (it is assumed this occurs during whatever preparations you make while leveling up).
The implication is that your initial (or improved) familiar arrives via a ritual similar to that used to replace a lost familiar. But it can be flavored all sorts of ways. Maybe your existing familiar "morphs" into the new form. Maybe its skin and guts split open and an imp sheds its old body like an old bit of clothing. Or maybe your previous familiar just wanders off and the new one arrives in a puff of arcane magicks. Either way, you get your familiar.
The FAQs are pretty clear that availability is irrelevant. The feat comes with a lot of hand waving that you’ve already done the things, like find the right creature in your off time. It’s like how you don’t typically role play shaving or going to the bathroom. It’s stuff your character was doing that no one was paying attention too. A wizard adding two spells per level to his book is the same thing. He is assumed have been writing those into his book all along.
And there is no official answer as to how much of the creature is “basic statistics”. It doesn’t have to include treasure, though it could. That’s a DM call. We do know it includes things like hit dice, hit points, attacks, saving throws and skills.
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If everyone disagrees with you then maybe, just maybe...everyone but you is wrong. Or, generally, not.
If everyone disagrees with you then maybe, just maybe...everyone but you is wrong. Or, generally, not.
this.
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Congrats team, you've tried to use "common sense", "duh it's obvious" and "everybody does that this way" on an autistic OP. Now s_he thinks you're trolls, you think s_he's intentionally obtuse. In case of rules being not 100% explicit, nothing short of errata/Word of God will work here.
The next time you're faced with somebody coming up with ridiculous yet not fully ruled out interpretation, consider the fact that their brain might be wired in a different way than yours before you go full Monty. Due to resasons better discussed elsewhere, people on A spectrum are somewhat overrepresented here, so better be safe than sorry.
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It doesn't matter whether or not the familiar has treasure listed. Treasure listed is not the same as gold in hand.
"Encounters against NPCs typically award three times the treasure a monster-based encounter awards, due to NPC gear."
You didn't succeed in an encounter against yourself or your familiar. You're not awarded xp or treasure for it. So you have no access to that treasure.
As a player, you can gain treasure from a creature for defeating it. Notably, that HAS to happen with the gm at the table. There's no default way to gain that treasure otherwise.
Additionally, the familiar rules do not mention the familiar coming with gold, so you don't get random gold from that. And you haven't done anything to receive the treasure. For comparison, the leadership feat explicitly mentions that cohorts should come equipped with gear appropriate for its level.
In short, treasure has specific rules about how it can be gained.
This said, it seems extremely logical for a pixie, say, to arrive with non-magical gear like a tiny sword and bow. Gold pieces? Not so much. One single piece of coin would be a huge burden for the little fellers!
A Sprite (Diminuitive with Strength 3) can by RAW carry up to about 2.5 pounds and still be considered as carrying a light load. A single gold piece weighs 1/50 of one pound.
Because I don’t know if I am missing something. I don’t have the books, so everything I know (mechanically) about the game comes from d20pfsrd.com or aonprd.com. While they are amazing sources of information, they don’t have everything. Like the other day I learned from looking at a friend’s set of books that there are specific rules for using Soul Gems (1st party rules that is) that aren’t on either site, even though the feat that grants you access to using Soul Gems in that manner is on both sites.
I think you will find them under The Soul Trade under daemons.
As to treasure, the monster may have treasure. You are not getting a monster, but a familiar.
Under Familiar, it states: Only a normal, unmodified animal may become a familiar. Treasure is not an animal, and so is not part of the familiar.
Under Improved Familiar, it states: Improved familiars otherwise use the rules for regular familiars, with two exceptions: if the creature’s type is something other than animal, its type does not change; and improved familiars do not gain the ability to speak with other creatures of their kind (although many of them already have the ability to communicate). Clearly, this does not change what you get, beyond the type of creature.
/cevah
It can be argued that treaure is part of the “animal”, though, as it is in the stat block. It’s all already been covered above.
I seriously doubt the intent is for the familiar to come with treasure, but there is a reasonable argument to be made for either side. Meaning it’s completely a DM call. I’d be surprised if many DMs let you have the treasure though.