Is Technomancer's Fabricate Tech near pointless?


General Discussion


The Technomancer's magic hack Fabricate Tech allows creation of technological gear that can exist for a few minutes. I'm considering choosing this when my PC levels up but there seem to be problems that render the class feature near unplayable.

First, I can't find guidelines about what qualifies as 'technological'. Presumably, the dictionary definition applies and any manufactured item is possible but only the artificial, engineered aspect. I could create a box of blank paper but not a newspaper. I could create an empty food tin but not any processed food in it.

Second, the level of the created item is limited according to spell slot expended but I can't find guidelines of item level if it's not listed. If I create a radio spectrum analyzer, how can the GM adjudicate the item level?

Third, items with limited use or charges can't be created. Looking at the Technological Items table, that's most of them. Toolkits and locks are fine but not flashlights, fire extinguishers, personal comms units or spy drones.

So, Fabricate Tech would seem to be a cool class feature as long as the item isn't too powerful to descend into engineering or technolobabble power level debate, is non-consumable, and is non-electrical. This class feature seems near pointless.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

It is pretty useful for having access to random stuff you may need but don't want to lug around. Like come to an unexpected cliff create rope or climbing gear. Need to repair a car make a tool set. It is nice that they can go into an area not loaded down with random stuff and have a good chance at being able to create most basic items they could need for a given situation.

It is not something you are using all the time but it is a handy option to have available.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I read the inability to create items with limited use or charges as just not being able to create, say, a battery to power something, but you can make something that can then be powered by a battery.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

The safest interpretation of this ability is that it produces items listed as technological items in the CRB (of course those without limited use or charges). Ie. only some of the stuff here As it currently stands this list is both small and relatively uninteresting.

Your GM can make the magic hack more powerful by allowing custom options, but otherwise I agree with you. Its pretty pointless right now. It doesn't help that the duration is kinda short too.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Well, technological items also include "any minor piece of equipment with a real-world equivalent". So, a spectrum analyzer would probably fall under that, given that they're already quite affordable nowadays. It doesn't say what level such an item would have, but I'm guessing it would be 1.
Also, I agree with Azalah that not allowing any item running on charges is too restrictive. I read that rule as meaning that they don't want to allow a PC to get "free" charges that way. I find it more likely that you can create items which require charges, but they're empty, and can then be powered up.

Dark Archive

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Fabricate Tech can definitely use some clarification. The ability may be useless. But certain interpretations of the ability could make it overpowered, as Nixitur and I briefly discussed in another thread.

For instance, handheld voice translation devices exist in the real world. I can even download a free app to my phone claiming to be a "voice translator for all languages." It's arguably a "minor piece of equipment with a real-world equivalent." Is that something that Fabricate Tech can create? I wouldn't allow it in my game for balance reasons, but the rules aren't that clear.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Jasque wrote:

Fabricate Tech can definitely use some clarification. The ability may be useless. But certain interpretations of the ability could make it overpowered, as Nixitur and I briefly discussed in another thread.

For instance, handheld voice translation devices exist in the real world. I can even download a free app to my phone claiming to be a "voice translator for all languages." It's arguably a "minor piece of equipment with a real-world equivalent." Is that something that Fabricate Tech can create? I wouldn't allow it in my game for balance reasons, but the rules aren't that clear.

I would say a voice translator would be something they could make. But it would then require a battery to charge it, and how effective it is would be based on the level. A poor one could be prone to mistranslation.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I at least would interpret the "no limited use" to only apply to stuff measured in charges or meaningful finite usage levels. A battery-powered device is fine, as long as its one of the "Charge N/A" types that are included as a default aspect of a device, rather than the kind you can swap out into a gun. So, you can't make a laser pistol ( or you can only make a laser pistol with an empty magazine ), and you can't make a fire extinguisher ( because it also has narrowly defined usage ), but you can make a comm or a flashlight or a toolkit full of electrically powered tools.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Jasque wrote:
Fabricate Tech can definitely use some clarification. The ability may be useless. But certain interpretations of the ability could make it overpowered, as Nixitur and I briefly discussed in another thread.

Oh yeah, I was wondering why this discussion seemed familiar. I'm also just going to shamelessly quote myself here, because I have already argued over the "items with limited [...] charges" wording.

Nixitur wrote:

Also, as for the "charges" wording, it says that you're not allowed to create stuff that has limited charges. It doesn't say anything about items that use charges. The "Capacity" heading in the table denotes "the maximum capacity for an item that requires charges to function", not that it has that amount of charges to begin with. Yes, when you buy them, they come precharged, but that's obviously not required.

I'm pretty sure the wording is not intended to keep you from fabricating motion detectors and microphones, but just so that you can't create ammo. But because the items you create aren't allowed to have charges, they will be empty when you fabricate them. Which is fine, though, because they can be recharged with batteries.

So, yeah, I'm fairly certain you can create items which use charges. Just not ones that have charges.

Sovereign Court

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Buy a real battery pack (or two), summon a gizmo that requires a battery, and presto.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Hmm... No FAQ or even quotes from a designer. The distinction between 'has' and 'uses' might be seen by the less pedantic as rules abuse but the examples only consisting of consumable items should be convincing. Still think it'd be cool to magic up a fire extinguisher when confronted with a fire.

This still leaves the item level problem. Creating a hand-held translator then sticking a battery in it sounds great but what item level? The nearest spell is Tongues, which is level 3, so expending a 3rd level spell slot could create this item of level 9. However, such a device would differ from the spell in a few ways.

Lasts 1 min per level, not 10 min per level.
Can only handle languages already analysed by linguists and encoded for such devices, whereas magic laughs at your petty requirement of plausibility.
Is obvious translation is happening and where the microphone/camera is being aimed at.
Requires a flexible class feature whereas Tongues requires an entry from a very limited, known spells list.

That reduced duration, in particular, is limiting. I'd say item level 5 but I'm guessing. Are there any useful guidelines or rules of thumb for deciding item level?


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Maps Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

There is a translator in the Starfinder Society RPG Guild guide, page 31.

TETRAD CERTIFIED TRANSLATOR LEVEL 2
ITEM PRICE BULK
TECHNOLOGICAL 500 L

This elaborate datapad has several additional audio receptors
to capture nearby sounds. If you don’t share a language with
creatures you encounter, you can activate this device to collect
basic linguistic information. The device requires 10 minutes of
observed conversation to gain enough information to operate.
The device then acts as a rudimentary translator. It does not
allow you to converse with creatures with whom you don’t share
a language, but it can relate very basic information. Examples
of statements the device could interpret would be: “come with
us,” “lower your weapons,” or “leave immediately.” The device
cannot parse proper names, including personal designations or
the names of items and places. Some extraordinary complex or
obscure languages might not translate clearly with this device.
A Tetrad certified translator has 10 capacity and 1/hour usage.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

"You can create any single technological item with a level equal to or less than the level of the expended spell slot × 3, to a maximum of your caster level."

I would say that answers the item level question. Unless I'm not understanding what you're asking.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Azalah wrote:

"You can create any single technological item with a level equal to or less than the level of the expended spell slot × 3, to a maximum of your caster level."

I would say that answers the item level question. Unless I'm not understanding what you're asking.

The question is about deciding an item's level based on its concept, perhaps using existing spells as a baseline.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Or existing equipment.

To take the example of the frequency scanner (mentioned above), you could treat it as similar to either the Signal Jammer (item level varies) or a simple upgrade (+1 item level) to a comm unit.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

"Level: The level of the item is the minimum level you have to be to craft the item, as well as a rough approximation of the item’s effectiveness compared to your character level."

Going off of that, I'd say there is no hard level calculating formula. They are, as it says, a rough approximation. Your best bet would be looking through the type of tech available, what they do and what level they are, and try to figure out a level based on what the character wants from what they are trying to make.

Dark Archive

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Mistwalker wrote:

There is a translator in the Starfinder Society RPG Guild guide, page 31.

TETRAD CERTIFIED TRANSLATOR LEVEL 2
ITEM PRICE BULK
TECHNOLOGICAL 500 L

This elaborate datapad has several additional audio receptors
to capture nearby sounds. If you don’t share a language with
creatures you encounter, you can activate this device to collect
basic linguistic information. The device requires 10 minutes of
observed conversation to gain enough information to operate.
The device then acts as a rudimentary translator. It does not
allow you to converse with creatures with whom you don’t share
a language, but it can relate very basic information. Examples
of statements the device could interpret would be: “come with
us,” “lower your weapons,” or “leave immediately.” The device
cannot parse proper names, including personal designations or
the names of items and places. Some extraordinary complex or
obscure languages might not translate clearly with this device.
A Tetrad certified translator has 10 capacity and 1/hour usage.

That doesn't seem very useful unless you are stealthily listening to a group of creatures speak to each other. Even then, what creatures (other than Tolkien-like treants) take ten minutes to say "leave immediately"?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Jasque wrote:

-snip-

That doesn't seem very useful unless you are stealthily listening to a group of creatures speak to each other. Even then, what creatures (other than Tolkien-like treants) take ten minutes to say "leave immediately"?

You don't need ten minutes of "leave immediately" for it to function as a translator. You can attune it to some language beforehand, perhaps by just listening to the locals. Heck, with the omnipresence of infospheres on civilized planets and stations, a character could probably just tune in to the local radio or TV and that would be that. Then, you can take your translator with you to more risky endeavors.

It's useless if you don't prepare, but there doesn't appear to be a limit on the number of languages it can save. And I don't see why it would lose any of that data when it runs out of power. Even if that was the case, I feel it's totally reasonable for a skilled hacker to make a backup of that data and to copy it back over after turning it on again. So, this could potentially be very powerful.

Dark Archive

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Nixitur wrote:

You don't need ten minutes of "leave immediately" for it to function as a translator. You can attune it to some language beforehand, perhaps by just listening to the locals. Heck, with the omnipresence of infospheres on civilized planets and stations, a character could probably just tune in to the local radio or TV and that would be that. Then, you can take your translator with you to more risky endeavors.

It's useless if you don't prepare, but there doesn't appear to be a limit on the number of languages it can save. And I don't see why it would lose any of that data when it runs out of power. Even if that was the case, I feel it's totally reasonable for a skilled hacker to make a backup of that data and to copy it back over after turning it on again. So, this could potentially be very powerful.

That's a good point. Okay, that does make it very useful.


It’s not so useful for the magic hack, given that the back lasts minutes, but it’s a really cool item on its own!


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Are we implying that Fabricate Tech w/ a translator could also program in a language unknown to the caster?
That would open up the issue of reasonable programming in said devices.

Many standard tech items (especially in a space fantasy) are going to have assumed programming within them. I think it's reasonable to assume that anything the Technomancer knows can be an element of that program (even if intuitively added) or the data present in that program.
So, just as you wouldn't want a PC to fabricate a tour guide device for the enemy's base, "And over here you'll see the doomsday lab.", I'd also think other unknown data couldn't be included.

At even another layer, then the PC might make a language decoder, even if the PC has no knowledge of decoding. If that's okay, then what's wrong with a PC making a diplobot or medibot? (Or whatever skill). If it's not okay, then that defeats much of the purpose of technology!

This is such a wiggly issue that I'd be hard-pressed to draw a rigorous line that wouldn't have good counterexamples that overstep it.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I think there may be a solution to the evil lair map problem: legality class, a concept from GURPS, meaning how much governments care that you have it. Restrict data in Fabricate Tech to open legality class, meaning it can be purchased openly.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
warmachine wrote:
Azalah wrote:

"You can create any single technological item with a level equal to or less than the level of the expended spell slot × 3, to a maximum of your caster level."

I would say that answers the item level question. Unless I'm not understanding what you're asking.

The question is about deciding an item's level based on its concept, perhaps using existing spells as a baseline.

The answer to that is, as it has always been, "Ask your GM". Its their call whether a new item is valid within your available Fabricate level range.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

The best use I'm aware of for Fabricate Tech is summoning walls, at least for now. It's pretty difficult to come up with better summonables than cover right here, right now, which can be concealment or not at the Technomancer's option (i.e. transparent or opaque). In general, you should be using it to summon something you had a good reason not to carry into battle yourself the mundane way, so something too large to feasibly carry is an immediately obvious candidate.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
quindraco wrote:
The best use I'm aware of for Fabricate Tech is summoning walls, at least for now. It's pretty difficult to come up with better summonables than cover right here, right now, which can be concealment or not at the Technomancer's option (i.e. transparent or opaque). In general, you should be using it to summon something you had a good reason not to carry into battle yourself the mundane way, so something too large to feasibly carry is an immediately obvious candidate.

Walls aren't tech.

At the very least make it a door with a fancy electronic lock.
Or an impervious window...with a high-tech cat door in it.
Or a really big, 10 Bulk, computer monitor. :)
/snark

Community / Forums / Starfinder / Starfinder General Discussion / Is Technomancer's Fabricate Tech near pointless? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Starfinder General Discussion