Get rid of Attacks of Opportunity, limit the list of spells that people can use, and otherwise slim down and simplify the rules until everyone (including the GM) feels like they have a good grasp on them.
The Beginner Box has done a good job with this, and if it's affordable, I'd suggest your group buy at least the PDFs for the Beginner Box, so you can work with a rules-light version that is balanced, yet lets you move up to Core Rules quickly.
Essentially you have 5 brains working against 1 brain and each of the five brains gets to delve deeply into a rules niche.
If you want your GM to keep GMing, ease back on your power gaming.
Or simply rotate GMing once a month so that each of you gets familiar with all the rules, not just your favorite 15 pages of a 560 page book
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Possible helpful things you could do:
Pay attention to the details of the story - learn the names of the NPCs, etc. Try not to derail the story; no random murdering of quest-givers. And try to pay attention rather than playing with your phone when you're not taking action.
Learn the rules as best you can. If you have questions, search the Rules forum, and if you can't find what you need, ask. Not just for your own character, but any rules, so you can help explain when questions come up.
Learn about good role-playing - there are podcasts, youtube videos, etc.
At some point, you could offer to be the GM.
My main tips:
-Read the "Playing the Game" portion of the Strategy Guide. (It discusses the main rules required for playing the game and presents them in a way that I found much easier to understand.)
-Don't worry about making an optimized character. Sure, look through guides to see what things people suggest so that it's easier than looking through the hundreds of options that you have, but the optimization guides are typically written for more advanced players and require a GM that has a very firm understanding of the rules.
-Remember that the rules can be taken a few different ways depending on how you read them. Just look to these boards for proof of that! There's always people discussing different ways that they could be interpreted.
-Have fun!
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Interesting.
I find the allegations of power-gaming at this point... potentially problematic, as it seems to be trying to offload blame for growing pains onto the players. I'd have to know more about what this so-called "power gaming" is to be sure.
The rules exist to be engaged. If engaging the rules does not generate the desired style of play, perhaps y'all are playing the wrong game.
Unfortunately, Pathfinder is one of the more fiddly and complicated games to get started with, and not especially friendly to a GM, especially a new GM, and encounter balance varies wildly from party to party, because the game isn't exactly balanced. Frustration is natural, but shifting blame onto the players is something I find deeply alarming.
One thing that I feel helps combat power gaming is having players who are invested in the story beyond "go here, get this, kill that, loot." One thing I like to do as a GM in published APs and modules as well as in homebrewed campaigns is the inclusion of usable backstory.
Maybe give your GM some backstory on your character, who they are, why they're the class they are, why you do what you do. Do you have enemies, friends of family in trouble? Your GM can build upon that and include elements of your characters' backstories into the story like a woven tapestry.
This way, you have your goals, but mixed in you have to save your girlfriend from the evil wizard, or hunt down the man who killed your brother because you heard he was in this town.
This helps bridge the gap between playing a game and creating a story.
If all the players do this, it'll create some interesting camaraderie and characters who actually care about each other and what happens in their personal lives rather than just being some people they adventure with.
Rules can be learned and memorized, but the story is where the adventure takes place.
I hope that helps.
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I wouldn't assume there actually is a problem with powergaming without further information. Especially in a core-only game.
It could just as easily be that the GM hasn't figured out how to handle certain things, or isn't past the frustration of being in a role where they're supposed to lose pretty much every time.
Definitely more information required.
If you're interested in becoming more proficient with the rules, have you looked into playing any local PFS games? It may be worthwhile to play a couple, since you will likely be surrounded by veteran players, and by watching and playing with them you will likely start to see some of the mistakes you're making in your home game. The best thing to do is play the same class you're playing in the home game, so they can correct you if you're misunderstanding any of your abilities.
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I wouldn't assume there actually is a problem with powergaming without further information. Especially in a core-only game.
It could just as easily be that the GM hasn't figured out how to handle certain things, or isn't past the frustration of being in a role where they're supposed to lose pretty much every time.
Definitely more information required.
Yup.
The problem could be misuse of rules:
"My Monk adds his BAB to his flurry attack bonus, right?"
It could be the GM being unable to understand how to balance things:
"Can we have 30 point buy?"
"Make sure there are lots of magic weapons!"
"I know we said Core only, but I found this cool sorcerer bloodline combo on the internet, that's OK, right?"
"Hey! That's a CR 4 monster! Not fair, we're only level 3!"
It could be a playstyle conflict:
GM: "You arrive at a village of tiny huts. There are strange grey-skinned creatures living here. Some of them are arguing; others are crying. In the middle of the crowd, there is a dead body, impaled on a gigantic spear..."
Player: "Fireball!"
Maybe help your GM realize his main job is to come up with fun challenges, not win battles. Remember, you are all still learning, so be extra-forgiving (it sounds like you're already doing this). Also, don't argue with his rulings. Allow yourself 1 clarifying statement, then just follow the GM's rulings and move on. You can always talk about the rules after the game. During the game, just play the game and have fun! Don't let rules discussions disrupt the momentum of a combat. :-D
Maybe ask him to ask the PCs if they have any strengths they want to emphasize or weaknesses they want to overcome? Then he can plan encounters to maximize everyone's fun.
For example, if an elf PC has immunity to sleep effects, target the elf with sleep effects and get her to shine with her immunity. If the fighter took the Improved Sunder feat, attack the fighter with weapon-wielding opponents that he can target the weapons of. If the sorcerer or wizard has burning hands, throw the occasional fire vulnerable opponent at them. If the cleric has Turn Undead, let him fight and repel undead. Set up opportunities for the rogue to flank and sneak attack enemies.
Another thing the GM can do is keep some reserve monsters in reserve in case an encounter is too easy. For example, if the PCs fight 3 orcs and kill them all in 1 round, just have some more orcs show up. Don't just let the encounter end quick and boring, keep adding reinforcements until it's exciting and fun.
Also, suggest he mix up encounter types. Some might be 1 big monster, some might be a dozen weak monsters, some might be 2 or 3 medium monsters, and some might be 1 medium monster and half a dozen weak monsters.
Remember, variety is the spice of life. If there is a dungeon with 12 rooms and 10 of those rooms have monsters in them, don't fill all 10 of those rooms with the same type of monster. A lot of monsters have relationships with other kinds of monsters, so you can still have a theme without being repetitive. For example, goblins ride worgs, have weird rat-dog pets, might have some hobgoblin or bugbear bosses, and often serve a type of demon called a barghest which is a kind of super-goblin. Maybe they have an orc prisoner of war they are torturing for fun and use cannon fodder to weaken the PCs before entering battle themselves. Stuff like that.
Also, some encounters should be melee, some should be ranged, some should have hit-and-run tactics, some should feature enemy spellcasters, some should focus on Combat Maneuvers, like bull rushing, disarming, grappling, sundering, or tripping.
Another way to spice up encounters is to vary the terrain. A bunch of empty square dungeon rooms gets boring after a while. Each room should have at least 1 interesting terrain feature, like a pit, low wall, bookshelf, campfire, big table, pool of water, a sprinkling of caltrops, spilled puddle of oil, columns and pillars to hide behind, etc. Initially, don't go too crazy with too many details. Just 1 or 2 for zest. Sometimes the encounters should happen in hallways. Encounters that have a lot of running around can be fun. Just climbing a wall or swimming while fighting can make things a lot more interesting and dangerous. Occasionally do some mounted combat outside the dungeon, or fight in a boat.
Lots you can do, depending on how much help your DM wants:
Read the Combat chapter of the Core RuleBook, and then, when in combat, help all the other players make decisions prior to it being their turn. This will take the pressure off the DM, and instead he can focus on whose turn it is and applying their actions.
Start simple: rather than bring in the complicated rules, spend a few battles just dealing back and forth damage. If every player, every turn, wants to do the heroic-killing-blow-action-movie-slide-during-the-explosion move, it puts pressure entirely on the DM. Keep it simple until everyone has a base understanding of how combat runs, then slowly apply new abilities and rules.
The slow XP progression rout will likely be better, and it will pace the game and allow you to learn before gaining new abilities.
Other ideas that your DM may or may not want: I recently helped my DM, who didn't have enough time to build out NPC's. He wrote the level, and I made the characters to fill it, per his criteria. I didn't know if I was building heroes or villains, so I just made competent characters that seemed fun. Since, as a player, you may be more familiar with building a character, this could help him a bunch.
Rotating the DMing would be a huge help. I love playing an Exquisite Corpse style campaign, where one DM starts a story, and leaves a cliffhanger, and another DM then picks up where the previous left off, answering the cliffhanger and continuing on. He then leaves his own, and passes play to the next DM. In this way, each new level is unique, and all the players build an engaging story together
-Jhaosmire
PS I'm old school 2nd edition AD&D player, so sorry about saying DM and not GM everywhere.
You are doing the right thing. Talking to the GM (and including the other players as well) about what it is fun, and what isn't fun for everyone. Just continue to communicate and most likely you will be able to adapt you playstyle to the sort of game the GM will want to run and the GM will be able to adapt his game to the sort of roleplay you want to do.
Just keep talking to each other, and give constructive feedback. Most likely individual solutions to particular problems will be pretty easy if the that occurs.
I learned to play Pathfinder (and RPGs in general) in a bubble, without any outside help, and then taught my friends. It was a difficult learning process, but definitely a rewarding one. Just because there are a lot of fiddly bits and rules does NOT mean you are playing the wrong game. Here's my take on what might help:
- Communicate. After sessions, talk about what went well and what could have been done differently. Tell your GM what you would like to see in a game
- Know the rules that apply to your character. A GM will never know all the rules, and having players who don't need help every time they cast a spell will save time and keep frustration at bay. I always tell my players, the only thing I need you to know is how your character plays.
- Go with it. Sometimes the GM will make an adventure that doesn't quite work as expected. That's fine, treat it as a learning experience. Sometimes it's good to let the adventure go off the rails, and sometimes it's good to just do it the GM's way, even if the story doesn't make sense.
- Build your characters to be fun. Other people have said this, but focusing on making an optimized character when the other players at the table can't isn't fun for anyone. If the GM doesn't fully know the rules, then you're just asking for trouble. It's definitely not a bad thing if you make a powerful character, you just have to be very careful to make sure that character isn't making it less fun for anyone else (which is more about how you play the character then anything statistical).
One thing that was difficult for me is finding the right balance. Sometimes an encounter that was appropriately difficult in theory would be way too easy, and sometimes it would be impossible. This just takes practice on the GM's part and patience on the players part.
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My main realization is that I am treating this game as if it had winners and losers. Rather than one of a shared experience. He sold me on this game because it was something different, that it was a shared story not a competition. If I want to win at something there are many other games I can play. I need to remember this.
Wow! You already figured out Pathfinder! The whole point of a tabletop RPG is that the victory conditions are open. Success is: "Everyone at the table has fun", instead of defeating units, taking ground, or getting treasure. Killing and looting just happen to be fun, so things generally work out... But always remember that the whole point of the game is fun, not killing something and getting the treasure.
Here is a guide I'm writing about optimizing Pathfinder to maximize fun for everyone:
It's still a work in progress, not polished yet.
There are many great guides for building optimal characters for damage dealing, being invulnerable, battlefield control, and being Batman! While it is fun to play a character that excels at what they do, many players find that playing these builds results in a severe game often dictated by the first person to win initiative and go nova. The requirement to keep up with the Best Caster Build or Highest Melee Machine narrows the options down considerably. Likewise such characters require APL+3 (Epic!) or more encounters that bend the CR system in ways that make encounter design and management a more difficult task for the GM. The rules, the adventures, and almost everything else published is not intended for optimized play.
So what are these rules designed for, if not optimization? Like most other games, the intent is that these rules facilitate a GM and players to have fun. Sounds easy, but what is fun?
As a player, I have fun:
- Controlling the actions of my PC.
Customizing my PC with skills, feats, equipment, and other features.
- Knowing that if I generally play well, and have a little luck, I will do well most of the time.
- Having my characters decisions and actions affect the environment and story.
- Getting experience and treasure that allows me to increase the power of my character.
- Feeling that I can, and occasionally must do my best to defeat encounters.
- Knowing that my fellow PCs are supporting me, and that we act in each others best interests.
- Knowing that my PC is on par with the rest of the party and that we affect the game in fairly equal amounts.
- Not knowing exactly what to expect, and trying to be ready for anything.
- Even if bad things happen to my character, or the dice go against me, I still have fun if I am engaged in the game.
- Feeling that in most opposed circumstances, it is the dice that decide the outcome.*
GMs enjoy the game for different reasons then players.
As a GM I have fun:
- Presenting a campaign world with locations, encounters, mythos, timeline and NPCs.
- Presenting a wide variety of encounters that engage the players, and encourage them to have fun playing their characters.
- Knowing I have general control of the storyline and timeline, with occasional (sometimes unexpected) exceptions.
- Knowing that players will use wits and creativity to solve encounters, and vary their tactics to fit the situation.
- When everyone at the table participates in the game to the amount they are comfortable with.
- When players are friendly, kind, and enjoy themselves.
- While I decided if a roll is needed and add the modifiers, the dice decide the outcome.*
* GM, and even player "Cheating" (i.e. ignoring dice rolls) is a highly debatable topic. Like all issues, discuss it beforehand, and come to a consensus on how your group views it.
So how do we use the rules to make that kind of fun happen?
We start at the beginning - Creation!
Ability scores and character creation
First off, skip the dice. I know many people love rolling, but a few low rolls can result in less fun for the life of the PC. This can also result in dramatic party imbalances, and players unable to play the character they want. Let the dice decide what happens that round, not for life.
The point buy or stat array system used usually doesn't really matter much, in the sense that it slightly affects everyone in the group fairly equally (Low point buys actually benefit full caster types a little). The goal at this stage is to set the game up to work with the CR system, and encourage parity among classes throughout the game.
- 10 Points - I generally avoid 10 point buy simply because players are unable to perceive how little it increases difficulty, and even experienced players secretly don't want the added challenge. The balancing effect isn't worth the whining, unless you have a large group of experienced players.
- 15 Points - This is the "Standard" the game was balanced around, and should be the default for most groups of 4-5 players.
- 20 Points - This is the PFS standard, and has become a default for many games. I recommend this for 3 person parties, inexperienced players, or players looking to try lower powered builds such as small martial characters, monks, or builds that fall outside the default role of the class.
- 25 and up Points - While not much stronger then 20 points, this starts to bend the CR system in most games, and should be avoided except for unusual circumstances.
This is normally where the players take over and deliberately or unintentionally exacerbate some of the worst balance issues of the game. The key to evening out those power imbalances is to start characters off by evening out their ability scores. For example, it is much more difficult to become a game shattering god wizard with a starting intelligence score of 16. I recommend limiting the max starting ability scores (AFTER racial adjustments) to 16 or 17! For the same evening-out reasons, I also recommend limiting minimum stats to 10 or 8 (AFTER racial adjustments). These limits will encourage PCs more capable of dealing with a variety of situations, and less able to damage game balance.
Next is Hit Points. This is another area where many people have a wide variety of different methods that frequently bend game balance. Again, skip the dice, as no one wants to play a character that rolls a 1 every level, or be the sidekick to the guy who always rolls max. Follow the default max hit die (plus con modifier) for level one characters. After that, just give the PC happy side of average (plus con modifier) every level. PFS really got this one right. Generally, you should not modify this formula, as it can alter many factors such as the relevance of healing, AC, direct damage, etc.
How does everyone have fun?
So far we have significantly rebalanced the game, without really altering the rules, so much as providing guidelines for character creation. But perhaps I jumped the gun a little. Before we even get to character creation, it is probably a good idea for the GM to sit down with the players, and discuss what the expectations for the game are.
I would start by going over the different ways the players and GM have fun and discussing them as a group. This is NOT the time to argue, it is a time to be HONEST with yourself and the group, and express and LISTEN to everyone's opinions. Do you like Rollplaying more then Roleplaying? Be open about it! Your not doing yourself or anyone else a favor by pretending to like things you don't really like. Be open to new experiences and playstyles, but express your desires and expectations honestly. Come to some kind of consensus with the GM and players about how you will all enjoy the game.
In addition to how YOU have fun, this is a great time to discuss other aspects of play, such as:
House rules.
Use of computers and/or phones and access to reference material at the table. In general characters should have access to information about their own characters, but most GMs frown on players looking at information about enemies. Reading the adventure path or module is usually very strictly forbidden.
What books and material are allowed in the game and what restrictions are there. Do these restrictions apply equally on both sides of the screen?
Dice handling and GM and/or players ignoring dice. This usually take one of three forms:
- -GM roles in the open, results are not altered by the GM
- -GM rolls in secret, and may or may not follow the dice. Requires the players to trust the GM will fudge, but they will not know when, for fun to be maintained.
- -GM dictates action in some opposed circumstances without dice rolls. Requires players to trust the GM will dictate the action for the benefit of the game (without the 'illusion' of dice rolls) for fun to be maintained.
Amount of table time dedicated to combat, NPC interactions, and exploration.
Amount of expected wealth, mundane and magic item availability.
How downtime and/or crafting will be handled.
Tracking of encumbrance, minor items, ammunition, rations, water, mounts, living expenses, etc.
Tracking of important information such as HP, spells cast, limited abilities used, harmful conditions, etc.
If tracking discrepancies occur, will there be punitive action?
Level advancement - will the game use an XP advancement track or will leveling be handled a different way?
How will PC death be handled and how will bringing new PCs into the game be handled. Note: I recommend bringing in new PCs at the same level as the rest of the party, but with the starting wealth of a character one level lower. I also disagree with the designers about allowing characters to exceed WBL if they have crafting feats. I feel this unbalances the game in favor of the classes that generally need the least help (especially wizards) and breaks the assumptions that a PC used all his powers to get his starting wealth.
Expectations about what general types of encounters the PCs can expect. Players should be able to make informed decisions about character aspects such as favored enemy, deity and domains, schools, etc.
How alignment will be handled. Is it polar (the rules/setting default) or more of a subjective "realistic" situation.
Level of gore and sexuality in the game as well as any topics that players would have issues with encountering in game.
Out of game issues like food, drugs/alcohol/smoking, money, attendance, guest etiquette, etc.
Again, BE HONEST with yourself and the people you play with.
ABILITY SCORES
The more you spread your ability scores out, the more you can contribute in a variety of situations. Always pay attention to weaknesses your character might have, and don't neglect the scores associated with that weakness. For example, clerics and druids have weak reflex saves, and can greatly benefit from a little dex. This can be especially true for will saves, as failing them can often result in loss of actions, or wost, your characters actions being dictated by the enemy. Failing saves and being consistently hit in combat is generally not fun for most players, so plan for strong defenses (adequate Dex,Con,Wis)
To participate effectively in social situations it helps to have a little Cha, although Wis for sense motive is good in a pinch. Being able to put ranks into a variety of social and other types of skills (especially knowledge and languages) is easier when you have more Int. I don't want to leave out Str, especially for characters who wear armor, and want to deal weapon damage.
CLASS
Barbarian
Save the super raging power attacking crazy high damage stuff for when it is required. Put a little effort into ranged attacking, and consider what you can do when you can't be effective by doing melee damage. Put resources into AC (perhaps ude a shield sometimes) and will saves. Invest in being effective without raging and/or taking excessive damage. Other then intimidate, the class doesn't give many social options, but put some points into sense motive or diplomacy, keep your Wis high, and don't dump Cha or Int.
Other then being aware that you can disrupt combat encounters with massive damage, barbarians are also more then capable of losing massive amounts of hit points as well. As the player of the Barbarian, YOU are responsible for dealing with this, and you should not expect any other player to give up their actions, spell slots, or resources without talking about it first.
Bard
Bard is one of the funnest classes to play! You are great in social and skill situations, and with a little effort, you can be an archer, melee, or specialize in enchantment or illusion. You also have great skills, and inspire courage and many other buffs makes you welcome in any party. Huzzah!
Cleric
Clerics are a very powerful and very versatile class. By selecting domains, you gain access to all kinds of different spells and abilities. Channeling positive energy will make you an exceptional healer, and there are many great buff spells clerics can cast. You can melee, summon, blast, de/buff and more. Keep a supply of scrolls and potions around so you don't have to fill your memorized spells with delay poison and remove paralysis. Clerics are one of the most skill starved classes, so you will need to spread your ranks carefully.
Druid
Similar to clerics, druids are versatile, and can be built to fulfill many different roles. Druids can be very powerful summoners, but this can really suck the fun out of the game if used excessively or if the player is not prepared and knowledgeable of the creatures abilities. It is generally best to only have one summon spell at a time, and be aware of affecting other PCs with you summons. A similar idea applies to some of the druids battlefield control spells like entangle and spike stones. Be careful not to slow the game down or interfere with other players.
Fighter
Fighters are the most consistently powerful martial characters, often the only one in the group who doesn't need time to get up to full power when suddenly facing an enemy. While fighters have many options for specializing in defense, archery, 2HD, 2WP, focus/specialization, maneuvers, they also have enough feats to do a few other things well in addition to their specialties. Fighters should mix up their tactics to best fit the situation and avoid over using action-denial tactics like tripping and grappling. Like Barbarians, fighters struggle to succeed in social situations, and have even less skill points to spend... dig deep.
Monk
Monks are one of the most difficult classes to play and have fun with. Monks often feel overshadowed by the full BAB classes in combat, and lack decent options for ranged attacking. While monks have some great defensive abilities, AC is not among them, and they struggle with hit points as well. If you are going to play a monk, work with the other party members and get buff spells like mage armor and displacement cast on you. Monks also tend to do better in groups that play a more lawful style rather then chaotic kick-in-the-door-play.
Paladin
Paladins can be a very fun and powerful class to play, however, this class is more dependent on alignment then any other class. Be sure that the ENTIRE group is willing to compromise with a paragon of lawfulness and goodness. Create a code of conduct that your character will follow, and agree with the GM about what constitutes Lawful and Good.
Ranger
Rangers are a slightly odd class, with a little of everything, and a few amazing feats and options here and there. Like fighters, rangers class features/ feats focus them in a particular style, but with a little effort into diversity, they can participate in any situation. I highly recommend checking out the switch hitting ranger in Treantmonks excellent guide. Rangers do best in campaigns where their favored enemies and terrains come up frequently.
Rogue
The rogues problems are largely not the fault of the class, but rather the parts of the game that he specializes in. The rogue is generally consider to be the "skill monkey" however most skills do not ramp up throughout the game as well as other class features. The "skill monkey" is also the character who is expected to sneak ahead, scout, and find/disable/trigger traps, however, none of the other characters can generally be more then a liability for the rogue in these situations. This results in the situation of one player acting alone while the rest of the players wait, and the GM attempts to minimize the rogues spotlight time in order to get the other players back in the game. Finally, rogues generally require a fairly high level of game skill to do well in combat. If possible, work with the other players to maximize your assets and minimize your liabilities.
Sorcerer
Sorcerers can be very versatile, however it requires careful spell selection. Try to select spells that can be used in a variety of situations. Remember that you will be casting the same spells over and over (often round after round) so you don't want to select spells that will bog down the game, or focus too much on action denial. Spells that you can cast on other characters will always be appreciated. Sorcerers are one of the most skill starved classes, but have a great Cha for social situations.
Wizard
Wizards are generally considered the most powerful and easiest to optimize of the core classes. A high Int and focus on save-or-suck magic can upset game balance from the beginning, and full casters progressively get more and more spells that bypass common adventure plots. They also have access to crafting bonus feats that allow them to be masters of magic equipment far beyond their suggested wealth by level. The best way to play a wizard is to focus on teamwork and save your most powerful spells for when things are going badly for the party. If you use your magic to make the whole party succeed, everyone gets to participate, and the GM has a much easier time maintaining parity among party members. Be wary of using powerful spells with long duration such as command undead, dominate person, and planar binding. These spells can be used to drastically upset game balance and story development. Wizards (and other full casters) can eventually do things to break the game - so don't do those things.
NEXT UP: GMing the Game
Do your best to understand the rules and what aspects of the game you enjoy and why. I personally don't enjoy action denial and save-or-suck effects. I won't allow characters that are incapable of functioning with the group or as a part of the campaign setting. Every character is expected to be "special-forces" material, and be capable at what they do. You are part of an elite group that relies on each other for survival every day. Playing a "lone-wolf", psychopath, spoiled brat, revolting deviant, moron, jerk, or other non-team player will not be tolerated. Characters are generally not allowed to attack, target with hostile spells, or use adversarial skills on another PC. PCs are also expected to not steal from each other, or withhold information. All treasure discovered is considered group property until divided up. While I don't explicitly ban Evil characters, I don't really want to spend hundreds of hours of real time facilitating your character committing evil acts. It usually gets depressing fast. I won't allow player characters to make opposed rolls against each other (baring magical control)
I also have a policy of no rules exploiting. Bringing a character to the table who is going to disrupt play, destroy verisimilitude, or otherwise squelch the fun of others is unacceptable, regardless of optimization level.
I expect the party to be able to handle the challenges of an adventure. They need to be able to participate in combats, heal injuries and conditions, talk to people, and a variety of other tasks. They don't have to do these things well, but they do have to be able to function in an adventuring environment.
I LOVE the idea of a guide to maximize fun! I think it might be hard to pull off a one-size-fits-all guide for it, but this looks like a great start
I LOVE the idea of a guide to maximize fun! I think it might be hard to pull off a one-size-fits-all guide for it, but this looks like a great start
Thanks Malachandra! It is such a broad and subjective topic that I'm having a hard time finishing it. Any additional advice and input would be very welcome!
I'd be interested in seeing that class list expanded to the non-core classes, as they're... considerably more interesting.
I am a storyteller, as are most of my friends, so our campaigns are very story heavy. One of the things that is never a good idea, but is incredibly fun, is giving the GM ideas. We just finished a story arc, and I gave a short blurb over text how my character was spending our days of rest. (I have extreme stats damage due to another way this giving GM ideas backfired.) Just a little while ago, The GM sent another text, and it turns out our days of rest may not be so quiet. Having these little tidbits of information about our characters gives our GM more material to work with to create an intense story that will effect all.
Sometimes all that you need is to know your group dynamics. We have a GM's discretion rule, where if something goes terribly wrong, or right, we know that he will keep the game balanced. I have had it help and hurt my character, but it keeps the game interesting for all of us.
Open communication is the the best way to make sure everyone is having a good time.
I'm surprised no one has mentioned the Pathfinder Open Reference app you can download on iOS and Android. It's my main tool for Pathfinder.
Try to encourage everyone in your group to download it, and find topics to discuss and reference on your off days about classes, spells, feats, and monsters. There's plenty enough to get you all started for the first few years.
Learning about Feats will make you understand combat and positioning, learning about Spells will make you understand utility and strategy. Constantly reference the Conditions found in spells and feats.
There is a layer around Pathfinder's rules, and it's hidden behind it's precise wording and perspective. Knowing how to interpret the wording logically will separate you from the ambiguous to the obvious. Logic is a very important trait when reading rules and mechanics of Pathfinder, remember.
I like the app, but it is a bit advanced. All my new player's, using the app, overwhelm themselves. Basically, there's too much material there for them to handle. Put a solid Core Rulebook in their hands, and that's enough.
Show this to your GM. -- The "heart" of the game isn't combat. It's the adventure, and creating an immersive environment is Job #1.
Don't just run the PCs into a grid of square rooms.