With a ton of new spells out in Pathfinder Tabletop RPG since it was first introduced, does anyone else think that Paizo needs to include revised rules for the Permanency spell?
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It'd be nice, but the existence of dispel magic makes me prefer just crafting an item instead. Our arcanist has already lost quite a bit of funds on dispelled or otherwise lost permanency effects. Now we're starting to hit mage's disjunction, so permanency is extra-iffy.
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With a ton of new spells out in Pathfinder Tabletop RPG since it was first introduced, does anyone else think that Paizo needs to include revised rules for the Permanency spell?
Do you mean a new list of what spells can be made permanent or that you think the way permanency works should be revised?
If it's the former, there's a ton of spells that are eligible for permanency such as create demiplane. The cost for making a spell permanent is in the individual spell description if it is eligible. It's fairly easy to search for them online. Paizo has a design philosophy of not referencing anything outside the Core Rulebook in the text of the Core Rulebook (because that should be everything you need to play the game).
If it's the latter, how do you think it should change?
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It's the former. I'm surprised Paizo hasn't included an easy access table with all the new spells you're able to use permanency with. Has anyone else done it? Also, what website can I visit that has spells searchable via permanency availability?
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It's the former. I'm surprised Paizo hasn't included an easy access table with all the new spells you're able to use permanency with. Has anyone else done it? Also, what website can I visit that has spells searchable via permanency availability?
Dot as I have the same question.
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Archives of Nethys will probably work, but I can't access it from this location to verify. Just check spells and search for permanency or permanent. It should give you a list of every spell that mentions the word. It'll still take some work...
I'd also suggest d20pfsrd, but their site has become all but unmanageable IMO, and the search function there isn't as tidy.
I don't know about the spell list but maybe the spell can use work.
Probably better for rules question but why give a spell that as written can't be used for 4 more levels. Why not give it at level 9?
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using http://www.archivesofnethys.com/Search.aspx :
Alarm, Alter River, Animate Objects, Anthropomorphic Animal, Appearance of Life, Arcane Sight, Arcane Sight, Greater, Aura Sight, Cloud of Seasickness, Comprehend Languages, Corpse Lanterns, Create Demiplane, Create Demiplane, Greater, Create Demiplane, Lesser, Create Mindscape, Create Mindscape, Greater, Curse Terrain, Lesser, Dancing Darkness, Dancing Lantern, Dancing Lights, Darkvault, Darkvision, Decrepit Disguise, Detect Magic, Enchantment Sight, Enlarge Person, Ghost Sound, Gust of Wind, Invisibility, Invisibility Alarm, Light, Loathsome Veil, Lost Locale, Lost Passage, Mage's Private Sanctum, Magic Fang, Magic Fang, Greater, Magic Mouth, Obscured Script, Permanency, Phase Door, Planar Refuge, Prismatic Sphere, Prismatic Wall, Read Magic, Recorporeal Incarnation, Reduce Person, Resistance, Resize Item, Sanctify Corpse, Secret Sign, See Invisibility, Shrink Item, Solid Fog, Speechreader's Sight, Stinking Cloud, Stolen Light, Symbol of Death, Symbol of Healing, Symbol of Laughter, Symbol of Mirroring, Symbol of Revelation, Symbol of Scrying, Symbol of Slowing, Symbol of Strife, Symbol of Striking, Symbol of Vulnerability, Telepathic Bond, Teleport Trap, Teleportation Circle, Tongues, Wall of Fire, Wall of Force, Wall of Light, Web, Yellow Sign
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I don't know about the spell list but maybe the spell can use work.
Probably better for rules question but why give a spell that as written can't be used for 4 more levels. Why not give it at level 9?
I think you may be getting tripped up by the overuse of the word "level" in roleplaying games.
Permanency is a 5th level wizard/sorcerer spell. That means the earliest they can cast it is when they get access to 5th level spells. However spell level is not the same as character level. Or class level, or caster level. Each class has a progression detailing when they get certain spell levels.
Wizards can cast 5th level spells once they have 9 wizard levels. Sorcerers need 10 sorcerer levels to cast 5th level spells.
Unless you have items or feats that alter it, your caster level is equal your class levels in the class that is casting the spell. (A 9th level wizard would have a caster level of 9.)
So wizards (as an example) get access to permanency and other 5th at class level 9. At which point they also have 9 caster levels.
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It'd be nice, but the existence of dispel magic makes me prefer just crafting an item instead. Our arcanist has already lost quite a bit of funds on dispelled or otherwise lost permanency effects. Now we're starting to hit mage's disjunction, so permanency is extra-iffy.
I think I saw someone house rule that permanency effects are just suppressed by dispelling attempts rather than permanently removed.
That would be the solution I'd propose.| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
using http://www.archivesofnethys.com/Search.aspx :
Alarm, Alter River, Animate Objects, Anthropomorphic Animal, Appearance of Life, Arcane Sight, Arcane Sight, Greater, Aura Sight, Cloud of Seasickness, Comprehend Languages, Corpse Lanterns, Create Demiplane, Create Demiplane, Greater, Create Demiplane, Lesser, Create Mindscape, Create Mindscape, Greater, Curse Terrain, Lesser, Dancing Darkness, Dancing Lantern, Dancing Lights, Darkvault, Darkvision, Decrepit Disguise, Detect Magic, Enchantment Sight, Enlarge Person, Ghost Sound, Gust of Wind, Invisibility, Invisibility Alarm, Light, Loathsome Veil, Lost Locale, Lost Passage, Mage's Private Sanctum, Magic Fang, Magic Fang, Greater, Magic Mouth, Obscured Script, Permanency, Phase Door, Planar Refuge, Prismatic Sphere, Prismatic Wall, Read Magic, Recorporeal Incarnation, Reduce Person, Resistance, Resize Item, Sanctify Corpse, Secret Sign, See Invisibility, Shrink Item, Solid Fog, Speechreader's Sight, Stinking Cloud, Stolen Light, Symbol of Death, Symbol of Healing, Symbol of Laughter, Symbol of Mirroring, Symbol of Revelation, Symbol of Scrying, Symbol of Slowing, Symbol of Strife, Symbol of Striking, Symbol of Vulnerability, Telepathic Bond, Teleport Trap, Teleportation Circle, Tongues, Wall of Fire, Wall of Force, Wall of Light, Web, Yellow Sign
Huh, that's it? I think maybe some more spells need to be added to that list (endure elements, feather fall, etc etc).
Also, has anyone figured out if symbol spells can be applied to a caster's skin?
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I don't know about the spell list but maybe the spell can use work.
Probably better for rules question but why give a spell that as written can't be used for 4 more levels. Why not give it at level 9?
I think you may be getting tripped up by the overuse of the word "level" in roleplaying games.
We need to go up a level before we go down a level and fight harder monsters, which will cast higher level spells. Also, I'm not sure if the rogue is on the level with us.
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If I was to change one thing about Permanency it would be to make it available to all spell casters.It never made sense to me that the ability to make spells permanent should be limited to the sorc/wiz spell list.
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Permanency seems to key off spell level (SL):
Minimum Caster Level (MCL) = MAX(9,8+SL)
GP Cost = (MCL-8)*2500
Light|9|2500
Dancing Darkness|9|2500
Dancing Lantern|9|2500
Decrepit Disguise|9|2500
Invisibility Alarm|9|2500
Preserve|9|2500
Sanctify Corpse|9|2500
Secret Sign|9|2500
Speechreader's Sight|9|2500
Appearance Of Life|10|5000
Cloud Of Seasickness|10|5000
Corpse Lanterns|10|5000
Curse Terrain, Lesser|10|5000
Enchantment Sight|10|5000
Soul Vault|10|5000
Symbol of Mirroring|10|5000
Anthropomorphic Animal|11|7500
Aura Sight|11|7500
Darkvault|11|7500
Loathsome Veil|11|7500
Lost Passage|11|7500
Stolen Light|11|7500
Symbol of Healing|11|7500
Symbol Of Laughter|11|7500
Symbol of Revelation|11|7500
Symbol of Slowing|11|7500
Alter River|12|10000
Create Mindscape|12|10000
Symbol of Scrying|12|10000
Create Demiplane, Lesser|13|12500
Permanency|13|12500
Symbol Of Striking|13|12500
Wall Of Light|13|12500
Create Demiplane|14|15000
Create Mindscape, Greater|14|15000
Planar Refuge|14|15000
Symbol of Strife|14|15000
Symbol of Vulnerability|14|15000
Yellow Sign|14|15000
Arcane Sight, Greater|15|17500
Recorporeal Incarnation|15|17500
Teleport Trap|15|17500
Create Demiplane, Greater|17|22500
Lost Locale|17|22500
*Above based on spell level, not description
/cevah
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It's the former. I'm surprised Paizo hasn't included an easy access table with all the new spells you're able to use permanency with. Has anyone else done it? Also, what website can I visit that has spells searchable via permanency availability?
I would fully support an Ultimate Spell Compendium consolidating and revising all currently published spells, with a few dozen new spells tossed in for good measure.
This would also bypass the Core Rulebook issue, leaving the core rules as self contained.
An Ultimate Spell Compendium would also allow Paizo the opportunity to address many of the long outstanding rules issues associated with magic, similar to how Ultimate Intrigue addressed a number of long-standing rules issues.