A request for phonetic spellings of complicated NPC and location names

[Bongo BigBounce]

...is just that. So many of the names in scenarios are odd and/or complicated. If GMs had phonetic spellings we could come much closer to proper pronunciation without looking the fool trying to figure them out and repeat them properly. I am aware this would add slightly to the word count, but I feel it would be worth it.

[Mystic Lemur]

I ran Icebound Outpost yesterday, and when I got to "Mizravrtta Brahmodya" one player said "You're just making these up, now!"

It wouldn't hurt, especially when having to run cold.

[Muser]

Anglophonic weaklings. Kopparberget or bust!

[Tallow]

Mystic Lemur wrote:

I ran Icebound Outpost yesterday, and when I got to "Mizravrtta Brahmodya" one player said "You're just making these up, now!"

It wouldn't hurt, especially when having to run cold.

I don't think running cold should ever be used as an argument for making changes to how scenarios are developed.

[Hmm]

Heh. Part of my prep is coming up with pronunciations for those names and saying them in my head, many, many times. What is especially hilarious is when I get a player who's met and NPC before, and who then tells me, "No, it's pronounced THIS way."

If I can make the head switch for established local canon, I do so. But usually by then it's too late. My brain has come up with its own pronunciation that I have practiced multiple times over the preceding days, each time I read through the scenario. At that point, I shrug, and say, "Regional Variation, this is how his name is pronounced in Ustalav."

For pronunciations, I do tend to pick ones that fit with languages from around the world. So names from Ustalav get Russian or German pronunciations. Qadiran and Katapeshi names get more arabic sounding pronunciations. Having studied Marathi, I use a lot of indian pronunciations for things that are long and unclear.

I do know that when I GMed 'Feast of Dust' my inner liguist was offended by having a Qadiran family with the last name 'Whitewater," since they were locals. I just could not handle it as a GM, so I told the group, "We're doing this campaign mode," just so that I could switch their last name. That, and cut random encounters that had no basis in the story. I went with the Arabic word for bright waters, and we moved on.

TL/DR:
A pronunciation guide would be great, actually. Until then, I am going to make my best guess based on other languages I've studied and come across.

[claudekennilol]

While no longer a legal source for PFS, I love that the back of the Pathfinder Chronicles: Campaign Settings has phonetic pronunciation for a lot of deities/places/lore stuff.

Spoiler:

Word Pronunciation
Abadar AH bah dar
Abadius ah BAY dee us
Abaddon AH bah don
Abendego ah BEN deh go
Abraxus a BRAHK zuhs
Absalom AB sah lahm
Abyss uh BIS
Achaekek uh CHAY kek
aeromantic AIR oh man tik
agathion a GATH ee on
Akiton AK eh ton
Alaznist a LAZ nist
Alevrah ah LEV rah
Aldinach ALL di nach
Aldori AL door ee
Alkenstar AL ken star
Almas AHL mehs
Amiri ah MEE ree
Andirifkhu an de RIF ku
Andoletta an do LET ah
Andoran ann DOHR ann
Angazhan ANG uh zan
Apollyon uh POL yuhn
Arabasti air ah BAS tee
Areshkagal uh RESH ka gal
Aroden AIR oh den
Arodus AIR oh duhs
Arshea AHR shey
Asmodeus azz MOH dee us
astradaemons AH strah day mon
asura a SUR ah
Avernus ah VUR nuhs
Avistan AV ihs tan
avoral ah VOR al
axiomite AK see oh myt
Axis AK sihs
azata ah ZAH tah
Azlant AZZ lant
Azlanti AZZ lant ee
Azrinae AZZ reh nay
Baalzebul BALL zee bull
Baba Yaga BAH ba YAH guh
Bakrakhan BAK ra khan
Baphomet BAPH oh meh
Barbatos BAR ba tus
Belial bee LIE uhl
Belimarius bell uh MARE eh us
Belkzen BEHLK zen
Besmara bes MAR uh
bich’hwa BEECH hwah
boggard BAH gurd
Boneyard BONE yard
bralani brah LAW nee
Brevoy BREV oy
Caina CANE uh
Calistria kah LISS tree ah
Calistril KAHL izz trihl
Castrovel KAHS tro vehl
Cayden Cailean KAY den KAY lee en
Celwynvian sehl WIN vee enn
Charon KAIR unn
Chelaxian che LAX ee en
Cheliax CHEL ee ax
Chelish CHEL ish
Chesed CHES ed
Cocytus koh KY tus
Corentyn KOHR ehn tin
Cyrusian si ROO see un
Cyth-V’sug SITH vih SUG
daemon DAY mon
Dagon DAY gon
Deskari des KAR ee
Desna DEZ nuh
Desnus DEZ nuhs
Dis DIHS
Dispater DIHS pay tuhr
djinn JIHN
Droskar DROH skar
drow DROW
Druma DROO muh
Eando ee AN doh
Edasseril eh DASS ur ill
efreet eh FREET
efreeti eh FREET ee
Egede eh GEHD eh
Egorian eh GOR ee an
Elidir EL eh deer
Elysium ee LIZ ee uhm
Erastil eh RAS til
Erastus eh RAS tuhs
Eurythnia yoo RITH nee ah
Ezren EZZ ren
falcatta fahl KAHT uh
Flauros FLOR us
formian FOHR mee an
Galt GALT
Garund gah ROOND
Garundi gah ROON dee
Gastash GAS tash
Geb GEB
Geryon JER ee ehn
ghaele GAYL
Ghlaunder GHLAWN dur
Ghol-Gan GOHL gahn
Gogunta go GUN tuh
Gorum GOR um
Gozran GOHZ ran
Gozreh GOHZ ray
Groetus GRO tus
Haagenti hah GEN tie
Harsk HARSK
Haruka hah ROO kah
Heaven HEV uhn
Hell HEHL
Hermea her MEE uh
Iadara eye uh DAR ah
Ileosa ihl ee OH sah
Ilizmagorti Ihl izz mah GOR tee
imentesh IH mehn tehsh
incarna in KAHR nah
infadibulum ihn fah DIHB uh luhm
Iomedae ahy OH meh day
Ipeq ahy PECK
Irori ih ROHR ee
Irrisen IHR ih sehn
Isger IZ guhr
Ishiar IH shee ahr
Iz IZ
Jalmeray JAHL meh ray
Jandelay JAN deh lay
Jezelda jeh ZEL dah
Jistka JIHST kuh
Jol JOL
Jubilex JOOB eh lex
jukamis joo KAH mihs
Kabriri ka BREE ree
Kaer Maga kare MAH gah
Kalistocracy kal ihs TOK rah see
Karcau KAHR cow
Karzoug kahr ZOOG
Katapesh KAT a pesh
katar KAH tahr
Kazavon KAH zah von
keketar KEH keh tahr
Keleshite KEHL esh eyt
Kellid KEHL id
Kerse KERS
khopesh KOH pehsh
klar KLAHR
Korada KOH rah dah
Korvosa kohr VOH sah
Kostchtchie KOSH chuh chai
Krune KROON
Kurgess KUR gess
Kuthona koo THOH nah
Kyonin ky OH nihn
Kyra KY rah
Lamashan lah MAHSH ahn
Lamashtu lah MAHSH too
Lem LEHM
leonal LEE oh nahl
leukodaemon LOO koh day mon
lillend LIHL ehnd
Limbo LIHM boh
Lini LEE nee
Lirgen LIHR gehn
Lissala lis SALL uh
Macridi ma KRID ee
Maelstrom MEYL struhm
Magnimar MAG nih mahr
Malebolge MAL eh bulge
Mammon mam MONN
marid mah RIDD
Mazmezz MAZ mez
Mechitar meh KEE tar
Mediogalti med ee oh GALL tee
meladaemons MEHL ah day mon
Mendev MEN dev
Mephistopheles mef uh STOF uh leez
Merisiel meh RIHS ee el
Mestama me STA mah
Mierani meer AWN ee
Milani meh LAW nee
Minderhal MIN dehr hawl
Mivon mih VON
Moloch MOH lok
Molthune mole THOON
Mwangi MWAN gi
Nar-Voth nar VOTH
naunet now NEHT
Nessus NEHS uhs
Neth NEHTH
Nethys NETH uhs
Nex NEKS
Nidal NYE dohl
Nirmathas NEAR math ehs
Nirvana nir VAH nuh
Nocticula nok TICK you lah
Norgorber NOR gore ber
Numeria new MARE ee uh
Oenopion oh NOH pee ohn
Oinodaemon OIN oh day mon
Oliphaunt ALL eh faunt
Oppara op PAH rah
Orcus OHR kuhs
Oregent OHR eh gehnt
Orv ORV
Osiriani oh seer ee AH nee
Osirion oh SEER ee on
pata PAH ta
paueliel PAW ehl ee ehl
Pazuzu pah ZOO zoo
Pharasma fah RAZ mah
Pharast fah RAHST
Phlegethon FLEG uh thon
Pitax pih TAHKS
Plaguemere PLEYG meer
protean PROH tee uhn
purrodaemon PUHR oh day mon
Qadira kah DEER ah
Ragathiel rah GATH ee el
Rahadoum rah ha DOOM
Razmiran RAZZ meer ann
Rova ROH va
Rovagug ROH vah gug
sahuagin sah HOO ah gihn
Sajan SAW jonn
Sarenith sa REHN ihth
Sarenrae SAER en ray
Sargava sahr GAH vah
Sarkoris sah KOHR ihs
sceaduinar SKAY doo nahr
Seelah SEE lah
Sekamina seh kah MY nah
Seltyiel SELT yeel
Seoni see OH nee
Shaitan shy TAWN
Shalast sha LAST
Shalelu sha LEE luu
Shax SHAX
Shelyn SHEHL ihn
Shoanti show AHN tee
Shory shoh REE
Sifkesh SIF kesh
Sinashakti sin ah SHOK tee
Sivhana siv AHN ah
slurk SLUHRK
Socothbenoth so KOTH beh noth
Sorshen SOHR shehn
Stygia STIJ ee uh
Styx STIKS
Szuriel ZUR ee el
Taldan TAL dan
Taldor TAL door
Tar Taargadth TAHR TAHR gahdth
tatzlwyrm TATZ el werm
Tekritanin tek rih TAN in
teratoma ter uh TOH muh
thanodaemon THAN oh day mon
Thassilon THAHS ih lon
thaumaturgy THAW muh tuhr jee
thileu THIHL ee oo
Thuvia THOO vee uh
Tian TEE yawn
Tian Xia TEE yawn shaw
Torag TORR awg
Trelmarixian trel mar IX ee an
Ulfen OOL fen
Urgathoa oor gah THO ah
urumi er OO mee
Urxehl URK zhell
Ustalav OO stah lahv
Valani wah LAH nee
Valeros VAHL err ohs
Varisia vah RHIS ee ah
Varisian vah RHIS ee ann
Vialesk VEE ah lehsk
Vudra VOO drah
Vudrani voo DRAW nee
vulpinal VUHL pihn ahl
Xanderghul ZAHN dur gool
Xer ZER
Xoveron ZOV er ahn
Yamasa yah MAH sah
Ydersius yeh DER see us
Yled EH lehd
Yondabakari yawn dah ba KAR ee
Zevgavizeb zev GAV ah zeb
zhen worm ZHEN wurm
Zirnakaynin zeer nuh KAY nen
Zon-Kuthon ZONN koo THON
Zura ZOO rah
Zutha ZOO tha
Zyphus ZIE fess

Obviously it's formatted much better in the back of the book, but this is still super helpful.

[Yiroep]

We usually come up with nick names for everyone and just assume the character is saying the full name when we say the nick name.

[nosig]

I see this SO much in RPGs... It's not just a PFS thing. Here's an old thread about the same thing...

Some Thoughts on Names in PFS.

I think the thing that amazes me most about names in RPGs is that they are almost all "one-off"... by that I mean they only really appear once.
Only one NPC has that first name... and you never see it anywhere else. There should be a BUNCH of people named Nex or Geb or... whatever. Kind of like Mary or John in the real world.

edit:
About the thing that has always bothered me about names in fictional settings... why don't we have two people with the same first name?

I've worked in an office with 3 people named John. Out of 5 people.

I have heard that the most common first name in the world is

guess?:

mohammad

and the most common last name?

guess?:

Lee.

so this begs the question?:

How many people named Mohammad Lee are there?

[Leathert]

There is a metalogic to not having names repeated in media including games, ie. not having the players and gms confused about things like

"Yeah, John gave us the orders to do this" "John?! I thought he was dead, when did he come back?" "What, John hasn't died...Oh, I meant John Carpenter, not John Two-Fingers".

In short, if everyone's named different, they're less likely to get mixed up. Of course real world doesn't work on this level of logic, so certain non-realism is part of every fictional world.

Back to the topic, yes, pronunciation guides would be nice. +1 for that idea.

[Cpt_kirstov]

claudekennilol wrote:

While no longer a legal source for PFS, I love that the back of the Pathfinder Chronicles: Campaign Settings has phonetic pronunciation for a lot of deities/places/lore stuff.

All of these are also part of the associated pages of Pathfidner wiki as well.

[Cpt_kirstov]

claudekennilol wrote:

While no longer a legal source for PFS, I love that the back of the Pathfinder Chronicles: Campaign Settings has phonetic pronunciation for a lot of deities/places/lore stuff.

All of these are also part of the associated pages of Pathfidner wiki as well. There are also a few other clarifications from the boards that have made it into the wiki

[Crag_Irons]

+ 1 for this idea.
Maybe a common side bar with character names listed.

[nosig]

Leathert wrote:

There is a metalogic to not having names repeated in media including games, ie. not having the players and gms confused about things like

"Yeah, John gave us the orders to do this" "John?! I thought he was dead, when did he come back?" "What, John hasn't died...Oh, I meant John Carpenter, not John Two-Fingers".

In short, if everyone's named different, they're less likely to get mixed up. Of course real world doesn't work on this level of logic, so certain non-realism is part of every fictional world.

Back to the topic, yes, pronunciation guides would be nice. +1 for that idea.

Mixing up NPCs? Heck, we do that now - even when the names are different! (Sauron and Sarumon anyone? why would someone name two BBE dudes ALMOST the same name?) I've actually had this sort of thing happen in a PFS game more than once - if they had had the same name it might not have happened, as there would have been some of the "this is the John who is a VC, not the John who is trying to kill you (ok, maybe not the best example... sometimes it feels like the VC is trying to get you killed).

[Calybos1]

Every time I run across a gibberish/unpronounceable NPC name, I just say his name is Throatwobbler Mangrove.

As for mixing up names, I think it's deliberate. As evidence, I submit the AP Wrath of the Righteous, in which three major NPCs are called

*Arueshalae,
*Aravashnial, and
*Areelu Vorlesh

[DesolateHarmony]

Calybos1 wrote:

Every time I run across a gibberish/unpronounceable NPC name, I just say his name is Throatwobbler Mangrove.

Isn't it spelled 'Raymond Luxury-yacht'?

[Quentin Coldwater]

Most names are easy to pronounce if you take a few seconds to look at it. But I agree that NPCs should have less unpronounceable names. Not everyone needs to be called Bob, but there's enough examples of "regular" fantasy names already (all of the Venture Captains have perfectly normal names), there's no need for anything to be called "Mizravrtta Brahmodya."

Small linguistic trick: the best words are words that alternate pronunciation between the back and front of your mouth. Too many sounds at the same end and you get tongue-tied. "Marcos Farabellus" jumps nicely between labio-dental sounds and glottal sounds. "Rural" is very difficult to pronounce because your mouth basically stays in the same shape as you say it, your mouth just drops in the middle. Names with apostrophes and weird intercaps or dashes in the middle are fine, just as long as it isn't all guttural sounds or so many vowels that your mouth never closes.

[rknop]

nosig wrote:

About the thing that has always bothered me about names in fictional settings... why don't we have two people with the same first name?

Well, there is a dog named Arnisant....

[Murdock Mudeater]

Bongo BigBounce wrote:

...is just that. So many of the names in scenarios are odd and/or complicated. If GMs had phonetic spellings we could come much closer to proper pronunciation without looking the fool trying to figure them out and repeat them properly. I am aware this would add slightly to the word count, but I feel it would be worth it.

The worst bit is when the character's name really doesn't matter to the plot of that scenario, it's just a tie in for the overarching plot for that Season or PFS play in general.

[nosig]

Murdock Mudeater wrote:

Bongo BigBounce wrote:

...is just that. So many of the names in scenarios are odd and/or complicated. If GMs had phonetic spellings we could come much closer to proper pronunciation without looking the fool trying to figure them out and repeat them properly. I am aware this would add slightly to the word count, but I feel it would be worth it.

The worst bit is when the character's name really doesn't matter to the plot of that scenario, it's just a tie in for the overarching plot for that Season or PFS play in general.

but the name is only used in the game once - the second time it's used is in a Pathfinder Tales novel...

"Arnisant was a great hero of the Shining Crusade. The Taldan general gave his life to allow his allies to imprison Tar-Baphon, the Whispering Tyrant." With this sort of background I would expect to see this name popping up in several places in the game - but it doesn't.