Occultist Legacy Weapon + Magus Arcane Pool


Rules Questions


Hello!

Just a quick question: am I able to combine the Occultist focus power Legacy Weapon with the Magus Arcane Pool weapon enhancement in any manner? I know the enhancement bonuses won't stack, but could I, for example, get a +1 from the Magus pool and then add a magical weapon quality with my Legacy Weapon ability?

Assuming the limit for each ability in question is +1 bonus.

Thanks!

The Exchange

Actually I believe they would stack. But more likely you gonna pick bane 99% of the time.


Both bonuses are explicitly called out as the stack-able kind so you could use both to get a +2 bonus, but I agree with leonvios that +1 and Bane is going to be your go-to option.

Scarab Sages

I do this with my magus/occultist. I will usually add +2 from Magus and Bane from Occultist, though Ghost Touch has come up as well. I'm 99% that combination works.

I'm less sure about stacking the enhancement bonus. So far I've just avoided doing that.

The question I'd like to confirm is if special abilities stack. So could I use my Arcane Pool to add +1 Keen, and Legacy Weapon to add Bane? I believe the answer is yes, but confirmation would be good.


I realized something I left out: what if I have a non-magical weapon? Legacy Weapon says the weapon must have a +1 bonus from either itself or from Legacy Weapon. Can the Arcane Pool enhancement count as "from the weapon itself"? Also, the Legacy Weapon Enhancement bonus is specifically called out to stack with the weapon's enhancement bonus, not with other enhancement bonuses.

Honestly, I expected the answers to be a solid "no," and to be the last thing I needed to convince myself not to VMC Magus haha.


Both pools are defined as stackable. They are from different sources. They should work together in every combination, even naked +1 enhancement stacking.

Until there is an FAQ that puts all these stacking bonuses into one special class of bonuses they all stack.

Magus Arcana (Magus)
Legacy Weapon (occultist)
Bladethirst (Bard Arcane Duelist)
Arcane Weapon (Arcanist)

NOT Ki Weapon (Monk Sohei)


I'm sorry, I just don't think randomly saying this stuff stacks when the effects themselves imply heavily that they do NOT stack with each other is enough for me. Any sources for the claims?


Ohh, a Magus/Occultist combo, I like. Does anyone have an example build? I can sorta see how it works, but I'd like to see some specifics.


MCPooge wrote:
I'm sorry, I just don't think randomly saying this stuff stacks when the effects themselves imply heavily that they do NOT stack with each other is enough for me. Any sources for the claims?

I wasn't randomly saying stuff. As I said earlier, the abilities say that they stack.

UM wrote:

Arcane Pool (Su): At 1st level, the magus gains a reservoir of mystical arcane energy that he can draw upon to fuel his powers and enhance his weapon. This arcane pool has a number of points equal to 1/2 his magus level (minimum 1) + his Intelligence modifier. The pool refreshes once per day when the magus prepares his spells.

At 1st level, a magus can expend 1 point from his arcane pool as a swift action to grant any weapon he is holding a +1 enhancement bonus for 1 minute. For every four levels beyond 1st, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves.

So if you had a +1 weapon, for example, and could add +2 from Arcane Pool then the bonuses would stack to give you +3.

OA wrote:
Legacy Weapon (Su): As a standard action, you can expend 1 point of mental focus and touch a weapon to grant it an enhancement bonus. The bonus is equal to 1 + 1 for every 6 occultist levels you possess (to a maximum of +4 at 18th level). Enhancement bonuses gained by this ability stack with those of the weapon, to a maximum of +5. You can also imbue the weapon with any one weapon special ability with an equivalent enhancement bonus less than or equal to your maximum bonus by reducing the granted enhancement bonus by the appropriate amount. The item must have an enhancement bonus of at least +1 (from the item itself or from legacy weapon) to gain a weapon special ability. In either case, these bonuses last for 1 minute.

From before you have a +3 weapon. If you can add +2 from Legacy Weapon then it would stack for a total bonus of +5.

If the weapon had not originally had a +1 enhancement bonus, then this process would still work but would have left you with a +4 bonus.


I'm on my phone so it's rather difficult to quote, but read the second to last sentence in the description of Legacy Weapon.

"The item must have an enhancement bonus of at least +1 (from the item itself or from Legacy Weapon) to gain a weapon special ability."

My primary question is whether the Arcane Pool bonus counts as being from the weapon itself as far as Legacy Weapon is concerned.

To clarify the example even further: I have a mundane dagger I found in a gutter. Can I use a point from my Arcane Pool to make the dagger a +1 dagger and then use a point from Legacy Weapon to make it a +1 (insert +1 quality here) dagger?


I thought you were asking about the stacking rules.

As far as Special Abilities are concerned, Legacy Weapon requires a +1 Enhancement Bonus to add a Special Ability. Tautologically, if you use Arcane Pool to grant a weapon a +1 Enhancement Bonus then the weapon has a +1 Enhancement Bonus. So Arcane Pool to add +1 and then Legacy Weapon to add Bane (for example) works fine.

Scarab Sages

Quentin Coldwater wrote:
Ohh, a Magus/Occultist combo, I like. Does anyone have an example build? I can sorta see how it works, but I'd like to see some specifics.

I'm on my phone, so can't post my full build. I dipped Occultist to give a trip specialist Magus (Kapenia Dancer) some addition combat effectiveness. It wasn't in the original plan, but 1 level with Transmutation and Divination got me:

6 Mental Focus points
2 go into Divination for +1 Perception and 2/day +1 insight bonus to attack or a few other things
4 into Transmutation for +2 to a physical stat. Initially this was DEX. Now that I have a belt, this goes to CON. Also 4/day Legacy Weapon +1.

2 level 0 spells (Detect Psychic Signifigance. Can't remember the Transmutation spell).

2 level 1 spells (Heighten Awareness and Lead Blades).

Initially I used Legacy weapon for Agile, before I had the fame/gold to afford it. Now it's mostly for Bane. One of the nice things about Legacy Weapon is that it isn't limited to your weapon. It's a weapon touched. So I'll often find myself giving an archer or a big melee character Bane instead of myself.

EDIT: Almost forgot... It also got me martial weapons and light and medium armor Proficiencies, all of which the archetype gives up.

Trade off was a point of BAB and slower magus progression, but so far it's been worth it.

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