Masters, what's your secret?


Advice


I'm thinking to start a new campaign as a Master. I have little experience in that field, with a bunch of adventures started, but none finished so far.

Here I am looking for tips, home-rules, and any advice on how to make the game more interesting.

I'm interested in everything, from alternative XP systems, to magic use, to simple improvements to mundane stuff (like hunger, stress, pain, and so on), to the wildest ideas you had!

What are the most fun settings you played in? Or the hardest?

Which things make you want to come back the next session? What makes a session great for you?

Any suggestion is appreciated!


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I have an HP rolling system I rather like. They can reroll dice results that are equal (or less than) their constitution modifier. So a character with 14 constitution rerolls 1s and 2s but is stuck with a 3 if they roll it. Etc

It reduces the variance in HP totals somewhat, which is nice since random HP can be rather punishing.

Also, I prefer stat line-ups to having my players roll for stats or buy stats. It allows me to know exactly what capabilities the PCs will have. I have a 27 point stat array I give out, so they can assign any of the following numbers to stats (before racial bonuses)
Standard: 16, 15, 14, 13, 12, 10
Balanced: 16, 14, 14, 14, 12, 10
Spiked: 16, 16, 14, 12, 10, 10
Slanted: 18, 14, 14, 12, 10, 8

As far as advice, the best thing I can say is that you should listen to your players. Ask them, at the end of each session, what they liked and what they didn't like. Make sure they are having fun. You should not cave to everything your players ask you to change, but you should take their comments to heart.

In regards to settings, poll your players and find out what they want to play. The more you tailor the campaign to their needs before hand the less you need to worry about them going off in strange directions looking for something the main story is not providing.


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Keep the succubus happy.


I like the HP system you use. I know for experience how bad rolls can be!

I'm not sure about the STATS system. As a player I always thought that having a very low stat (like a 7 or less) makes it easier to imagine your character and it's very fun to RP.
I could follow your example, adding a lower score maybe... I'll think about it.

In my brief experience as a DM, I always tried to ask my players. But usually I don't get much out of them, because they are fine with the game and don't know what they would change. My bigger issue so has been to make them "take the time" to play. Often happened that someone didn't show up because they found "something better" to do, or they arrive late, or whatever. Being I don't have people to replace them with, how would you address the problem of them not taking seriously the given dates? (decided as a group when to play) Or more in general, how do you address the lack of a player at the table? (NPC him? Make him "disappear" and "reappear" when he shows up? punish his character?)

As for the setting, all of us were always interested in underwater adventures, but it feels awfully complicated to create one, and I don't think I'm experienced enough to do it from scratch.


Bober wrote:

I'm thinking to start a new campaign as a Master. I have little experience in that field, with a bunch of adventures started, but none finished so far.

Here I am looking for tips, home-rules, and any advice on how to make the game more interesting.

When I started, I read the Game Mastery Guide extensively, it helped a lot. It not only provides a lot of knowledge, but also offers you a constructive mood: Focus on having fun and work with your players, not against them.

Don't overdo houserules. They can easily do more harm than good, and each one can p*ss off players. Small changes are more likely to turn out well, in my opinion - big ones always have so many side effects...

If you need inspiration, reading / watching / playing anything vaguely related to Pathfinder can help. Make sure to collect notes about your spontaneous ideas - they might not be relevant for next session, but maybe in 2 years or as a basis for something more sophisticated. The amount of notes per book / movie / game / whatever also roughly tells you how inspiring it is.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder has at least one (I think two) Adventure Paths rereleased as hardcovers. Using those and reading up on it here (as well as seeking advice) was invaluable to me as a starting GM.


Something else important -> Do not let rules trip up your game. If you do not know the specific rules for something, make a decision for the moment, and look up the actual rule after the session. This keeps the game moving, and prevents your players from getting bored or pulling out cellphones while you shuffle through rulebooks/websites for the obscure rule you are looking for.


Bober wrote:
My bigger issue so has been to make them "take the time" to play. Often happened that someone didn't show up because they found "something better" to do, or they arrive late, or whatever. Being I don't have people to replace them with, how would you address the problem of them not taking seriously the given dates? (decided as a group when to play) Or more in general, how do you address the lack of a player at the table? (NPC him? Make him "disappear" and "reappear" when he shows up? punish his character?)

If players show up late, cancels at last minute or the likes of it, they are being rude and unappreciative of the amount of work that goes into prepping a session. You should tell them that. Your expectations on players should be made clear before you even start a campaign.

However, you can't force someone to love the game. If your players are casual in their approach to the game, and you can't find others, you might have to adapt. Play shorter sessions. Have a style of campaign where 100% attendance isn't a requirement (this has other advantages, it's easier to invite new players to a less character-invested campaign).

When a player is missing, I find some in-game reason for the absence of the PC. The PC wandered off on a private quest. After (or before) the session, I write up a mail to the absent player, describing what her PC experienced while the rest of the party was adventuring. Often I'll try to drop clues to the main plot or develop the PC in some way in these mails. Sometimes, if the player can find time and inspiration, this develops into a short play-by-mail solo adventure.

You'll notice it that this method works bad when the PCs are deep in the wilderness or in a mega-dungeon for more than one session. It's hard to imagine a PC disappearing and then reappearing under those condition. But again, if you're having troubles getting attendance up to 100%, you should avoid those types of adventures.

The Exchange

I thought of a system I've wanted to try for stat generation when I next run a campaign.

Stats will be rolled in order 4d6 drop lowest. If no stats are 18 players will be able to increase any one stat they want to an 18, but they have to reduce another single stat by the same value.

So rolling 14, 8, 15, 10, 12, 16 and they really wanted a Barb/Fighter type they could increase strength by 4 to get 18, but then decrease CHA by 4 making it a 12.


Blymurkla wrote:

If players show up late, cancels at last minute or the likes of it, they are being rude and unappreciative of the amount of work that goes into prepping a session. You should tell them that. Your expectations on players should be made clear before you even start a campaign.

However, you can't force someone to love the game. If your players are casual in their approach to the game, and you can't find others, you might have to adapt. Play shorter sessions. Have a style of campaign where 100% attendance isn't a requirement (this has other advantages, it's easier to invite new players to a less character-invested campaign).

When a player is missing, I find some in-game reason for the absence of the PC. The PC wandered off on a private quest. After (or before) the session, I write up a mail to the absent player, describing what her PC experienced while the rest of the party was adventuring. Often I'll try to drop clues to the main plot or develop the PC in some way in these mails. Sometimes, if the player can find time and inspiration, this develops into a short play-by-mail solo adventure.

You'll notice it that this method works bad when the PCs are deep in the wilderness or in a mega-dungeon for more than one session. It's hard to imagine a PC disappearing and then reappearing under those condition. But again, if you're having troubles getting attendance up to 100%, you should avoid those types of adventures.

They do know my expectations, and that's the reason most of our attempts to play failed after just a few session. Only once, with one of them as master, we managed to go on for a few months.

The length of the session is not a problem. When they show up, they are willing to play all night long without a problem. The issue with campaigns where 100% attendance is not required is that we are a small group. Usually 4-5 people, meaning either 3 or 4 characters. If, let's say, the fighter is missing, it's going to be a whole lot harder for them to fight, without anyone soaking dmg.

---

On a side note. What do you guys think about having your players make a character without knowing what the other players are? I've noticed most people tend to play "what's missing" instead of just what they would like.
Of course that's because people want to fill in the roles more needed, avoiding to have (for example) a party without a front-liner, or without a magic user. But wouldn't it make more sense, and be more fun, if everyone just built his character not knowing what the other players play?


Bober wrote:

They do know my expectations, and that's the reason most of our attempts to play failed after just a few session. Only once, with one of them as master, we managed to go on for a few months.

The length of the session is not a problem. When they show up, they are willing to play all night long without a problem. The issue with campaigns where 100% attendance is not required is that we are a small group. Usually 4-5 people, meaning either 3 or 4 characters. If, let's say, the fighter is missing, it's going to be a whole lot harder for them to fight, without anyone...

If you're a player short it's possible to balance the encounters accordingly. Or level up on the spot. Or have hirelings or allies contribute. But when you're down to say 2 players, that doesn't work very well.

They know what investment goes into GMing, and still show up late or cancel at last minute? Are you sure you're not playing with a bunch of pricks?

If this is the way it is, and talking haven't solved the problem yet, lower your expectations as a GM. Make super-light-prep sessions, so you don't have to sweat it when things fizzle out. And spend that extra time you have on finding new players.

Bober wrote:

On a side note. What do you guys think about having your players make a character without knowing what the other players are? I've noticed most people tend to play "what's missing" instead of just what they would like.

Of course that's because people want to fill in the roles more needed, avoiding to have (for example) a party without a front-liner, or without a magic user. But wouldn't it make more sense, and be more fun, if everyone just built his character not knowing what the other players play?

As a one-of-type of session, I'd find it a bit fun. But most campaigns improve with a thought-out party. Not just crunch like classes, but a reason to stick together, a purpose or quest. That stuff. A bunch of random odd balls can lead to in-party conflicts, which many players can't contain so they don't interfere with playing the adventure.

However, it's worth noting that Pathfinder is a rather flexible game. You don't need a fighter, rogue, wizard and cleric. Sure, it's nice to have both arcane and divine magic, and it's good to have one or two front-liners. But if you don't it might still work. And if players have concepts which leads to strange party compositions, the GM can compensate. "No divine magic? Okey, have some Wands of Restoration and we can all continue to have fun."


That works if you are willing to design encounters around their party. If they cannot find and disarm traps then sending them into a trapped area isn't very fair without offering them the services of an NPC who can reliably disable traps. If they have no frontline then their encounters need to be carefully designed around them being a ball of squishy paste. Etc, etc

Basically, if you have an unbalanced party you will need to provide them with encounters designed around their imbalance.


Bober wrote:
But wouldn't it make more sense, and be more fun, if everyone just built his character not knowing what the other players play?

If the GM is willing to adapt the campaign to the gaps and overlaps, yes. Gaps (no PC for a role) can be covered by items, NPCs or spells, to some extent. Or by reducing the according challenges, for example by using less traps if no dedicated trap remover is around. Overlaps (several PCs for the same role) can be adressed by increasing the challenge (more monsters, higher DCs, more counterspelling etc.).


The goal is to let your players have a good time. When you run a good session you feel good. Circle of life

Rule of cool- let the players do cool stuff if it makes sence even if it isn't quite RAW. Also add a few touches of cinema magic. IE: let the player jump off the ledge and charge attack the BBEG even if he technically cannot fall that far in 1 round. If it puts the boss at 5 or lower hp just let it drop
Player focused plot- players need the ability to make decisions that affect the plot
Originality is overrated- you physically cannot be original. There are more players than you. One of them will have seen/read something similiar reguardless what you do.
Be unexpected- this does not mean originality. This means throw a few curve balls in the mix. Helps stopping the game from getting stale
Tone of voice- you can have amazing impact with changing your voice. A more rushed speaking can get your players more involved. A solemn voice can make the players actually care. Etc
DO NOT GET ATTACHED TO NPCS- you are here for pcs
Homebrew and houserules are your friends- homebrew lets you make interesting monsters and npcs. Also it helps the players make characters they want to play. House rules help everyone have fun.
Talk to your players- this is how you solve problems

Alternate Rules- not gonna debate these here so please give your own advice to the OP. Most I have already defended on other threads. I use them. They work for me. Good luck and have a wonderful game

Ignore WBL to a point- give the treasure you feel the players deserve.
Plot XP- rather than giving RAW xp points let the players level up once they have completed an important goal or won a big fight
5e legendary rules for solo bosses
Death saves- give players an unmodified d20 roll when they would die to not die. % based on how overkilled they are
Remove Revival magic- excluding breath of life and artifacts. See DBZ as to why


Lots of good advice in various threads here.


Bober wrote:
On a side note. What do you guys think about having your players make a character without knowing what the other players are? I've noticed most people tend to play "what's missing" instead of just what they would like.

No, as a player I tend to need something to narrow it down for me. There are so many different things that I would in principle like to play that just asking me "what do you want to play?" won't get very far. Knowing about the campaign you're going to be playing can do some of this, of course (e.g. if it's an underground campaign, or a pirate campaign, or whatever, then you can rule out character concepts that you don't think would fit that). But I also find being the only "class X" in the party more fun than being one of two, for most X. So what I'd like to play really does depend somewhat on what other people do.


Thanks for all your suggestions.

I know for experience as a player that not every role is needed. For example I played with several groups that didn't have a trap finder, but it's pretty easy to check for traps anyway.. a quarterstaff, some marbles and a sack of rocks or sand usually do the trick. We were able to activate most mechanical traps from a safe distance.

As a player I always found it more fun when things were harder. It was more realistic, where every combat meant risking your life, would make you think twice before charging towards a monster.

---

As a GM, something that I'd like to home-rule somehow (suggestions are welcome) is a "pain" system. HP don't really do the trick in Pathfinder... It makes no sense to me that if you have 200HP or 1 HP you are still able to do the exact same things. You can climb, jump, fight with full strength and so on, even if you are just a pinch from "death"

Shadow Lodge

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The secret is alcohol, and lots of it.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
TOZ wrote:
The secret is alcohol, and lots of it.

THAT'S MY LINE

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

And thus was the toothy bags alcoholism exposed.


https://sites.google.com/site/pathfinderogc/gamemastering/other-rules/uncha ined-rules/wound-thresholds-optional-rules

There's your pain system, or at least a pain system.

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