Like a prismatic wall spell, for example.
Yes. Vancian Magic is fundamentally stronger than Spherecasting, and it should be just fine to run pre-written encounters. The only thing to really worry about is abilities that need specific spells as counters, in which case you should modify them to be appropriate for your group.
Ah. Cool just checking. Can you give some examples of the ones that need modifying?
Sorry Azten just saw that reply now.
Okay. I'm sure if the party gets creative I'll allow them to come up with some counters that sound plausible.
What I aim to do is have tokens of each of the Spheres in a box and then each player blindly draws a Sphere and then that's what their spellcaster will specialize in. So there's a chance someone will get a Life Sphere to help them out. My players are more experoenced than I am and in my current campaign hardly get hurt most of the time. So hopefully this will encourage them to be more creative AND provide more of a challenge for them.
Sense Sean brought it up. Can anyone offer their opinion about someone specializing on a single sphere? If so what spheres would be the most flexible and which would be the most restrictive. As in only being able to do basically one single thing through out the entire battle.
An Alteration sphere specialist is in my opinion the most versatile (especially with the release of the Shapeshifter's Handbook).
As for most restrictive, I think a Life sphere specialist will be the most restrictive. They are capable of only one thing, heal (unless you are against undead).
All the other spheres have several utilitarian abilities. Luckily in the case with the Life sphere, a Hedgewitch with the spiritualism tradition only needs a couple Life sphere talents and can simply grab 'restore X' or 'restore Y' talents whenever it becomes necessary.
I'm personally fond of Alteration, Death, Destruction, Mind, Protection, and Time for casters. Alteration is great for added mobility or melee power, Death has powerful debuff spells, Destruction is too dang fun to pass up, Mind is incredibly versatile with buffs and debuffs, Protection is practically necessary for energy resistance and "mage armor", and Time would be my favorite sphere if it had a bit more content as it has a little bit of everything.
As for Aolis, I'll post a build at some point (probably tomorrow, it's getting late for me and I'm still at school) but I'm keeping the archetype and Prestige Class. One of the downsides of Spheres of Power is that certain concepts don't translate well without a homebrew conversion and this Spell Sage / Magaambyan Arcanist build is one such example. I'm also not using the Sphere Arcanist to replicate his less focused spellbook because they get so few talents that I can't think of anything they can do to a competent level. Seriously, they almost have as many talents as a Paladin!
Conjuration is a much more flexible Sphere thanks to the Magical Companion and Extra Companion. Then you can use your summoned creatures to use all the other Spheres.
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Sense Sean brought it up. Can anyone offer their opinion about someone specializing on a single sphere? If so what spheres would be the most flexible and which would be the most restrictive. As in only being able to do basically one single thing through out the entire battle.
It depends on which handbooks you're willing to pick up?
The Destruction Sphere basically has a save to almost every blast type. You can entangle, grapple, stagger, blind, deafen, sicken, and more, and still deal your favored kind of damage. You can do it as a ranged touch attack, as an emanation, a burst, a line, a wall, as an energy blade, as an energy tether. Destruction has lots of options for dealing damage, but none for really dealing with damage or conditions. As a melee-specialized low-caster, having a resource-free source of ranged damage is a godsend.
Personally, I like the feel of the Telekinesis Sphere. As base abilities, it's a better mage hand than mage hand, you can catch thrown things, you can throw people, you can make an attack with something (or somebody) you lift with your mind. And that's just a base. And the talents just keep enhancing those abilities. Pick up the Telekinetic's Handbook and you're getting the ability to hold a shield and get its AC bonus with your magic, set things caught or picked up into orbit like an ioun stone, pick up items in the tons. And this is something that even as a low-caster you could invest a few talents into.
An Alteration specialist can bring lots of utility to the group. At level 5 you can grant everyone a fly speed. You can turn into a swarm and proceed to poison things that touch you every round. You can turn your goat companion into a dragon. You can turn your goat companion into a goatman. You can turn your goat companion into a celestial being, complete with dr/evil. You can turn the dragon into a goat. You can gift your friends with Darkvision at level 1. If it is a physical feature of some creature, you are likely to be able to pick it up as a talent and give it to your friends.
Conjuration is too talent-intensive for a dip. You need to have a lot of excess talents to make it worth it, like an Incanter, or be satisfied with a warrior, expert, adept, commoner, aristocrat with a slam or bite attack. You can make a pretty good 15 hit die monster, but you'll have really nothing else you can do.
I really like picking up the Warp Sphere with anybody. With just a one talent investment, you can pick up and get out of Dodge on your next turn, or port in on top of the wall, in front of the guard, wherever. With a few more talents, you have a free bag of holding, maybe a good resting place for the night with no hassles, emergency Evasion. But I wouldn't go neck deep in Warp till the Handbook comes out, unless you really want your demiplane at 15.
Nature didn't grab me personally, but it has its appeal. Affect the physical world around you sort of thing. I have the Geomancer's Handbook. If you're going for a druid feel, pick up some of these talents in your preferred theme and you'll be good.
The Weather Sphere seems to me to be devastating for any caster that has prep time and a large tract of land to affect. This is the army killer, but not the soldier killer, if you take my meaning. Forcing your enemies to deal with environmental effects that can slow then or force saves. Boiling rain, deathly cold, hail storms, and lightning bolts every round. If you wanted to play X-Men's Storm, this would be your go-to Sphere. This scales really well with caster level, but a +4 staff maxes you out as a low-caster so you could feasibly be as strong as a high-caster, eventually. And when you're forcing saves every round, it doesn't matter if the save is only DC 12; someone will roll a 1 eventually.
Unless you're a good Cleric or a Soul Weaver, there's no reason to go heavy into Life.
Death is a mixed bag of raising the dead vs. save or suck. Raise an army or give everyone free negative levels. It's powerful, but you should really specialize in either saves or army when you pick this up.
There's not enough Light to invest in. There's just enough Dark to be thematic.
The Diviner's Handbook actually covers a lot. Got the Divination Sphere and another Sphere? Boom, free abilities. Get Trapfinding as a talent. Get Improved Uncanny Dodge as a talent. See Invisible. Scrying. Detect the capabilities of your foes without knowledge checks. If you need a detective character, I would recommend a deep dive here. There's even some pretty good feats available here, such as using your MSB (levels in a casting class) as the variable that sets the duration of your (sense) talents, or gaining bonuses to AC, attack, damage, and saves depending on how many (sense) talents you have active; really good stuff for the Unchained Rogue archetype presented in this book.
For Protection, grab one or two things and go somewhere else. Things scale easily with caster level, so you'll get a hardly-noticed friendly bump when you level up.
Enhancement has a problem of it scales too well with caster level. It's useful for the low-casters because they're the ones most likely to need their equipment enhanced, but it's most powerful and less useful to a high-caster. There's am oxymoron for you. I do not have the Enhancement Handbook. Honestly, ask your Incanter or Cleric to pick it up for you and hope they don't laugh and go for something more useful. It's also needed for Craft Magic Arms and Armor, if your group allows item creation feats.
Fate is the "screw an alignment" sphere. If you're fighting a specific alignment, Fate can do good things for you. You don't do damage, but you buff allies and occupy enemies' precious moments in initiative. I wouldn't go whole hog, but you could do worse I guess.
Mind is great if you're willing to pump save DCs excessively. It's the Charm X / Dominate X / Suicide X of the system. Why kill them yourself when they can do it and have no blood on your own hands. Force the Paladin to turn against his comrades, smiling as he does it. Lesser charms are like Witch hexes: at-will but once per day per target. Greater charms are not as at-will (they require a Spell Point), but are generally more powerful. Powerful charms are you panic button, I absolutely must get this done now with no arguments type of mind-affecting effects. If you are a fan of SAD casters, this is another one for you.
Illusion is, I feel, in a weird spot of it covers enough and not enough at the same time. It screws with all your senses and makes a thing that appears real, plus invisibility, but somehow I wish there was more. I'm sad that the whole Sphere can be summed up in two pages. Good for tricksters that just need a temporary diversion or if you want a dip for invisibility. I guess it could be fun for a laugh at parties.
Time is a Sphere that scales with caster level in the areas of duration, area of effect, and DCs. With the base ability, for example, you'll only ever be able to give a guy one extra attack no matter if your CL is 1 or 20. If you have a magical companion from the Conjuration Sphere, delegate this Sphere to it and free up your actions for something else.
Ah, War, the Babysitter Sphere. Buff your allies. Watch your allies do work. Good for a replacement Bard or Skald. Drop an effect on an area, and when an enemy does something to your ally, do something to screw the enemy. I'm not a fan of this Sphere except for the item creation potential. Dropping physical tokens that create an aura that enhance your allies really, really kicks up the whole WoW shaman vibe for me. Other than for item creation, delegate this Sphere to your Conjuration companion if you don't have a Bard-alike in the party.
There's not enough Light to invest in.Illuminator's Handbook provides some interesting buff and debuff options. Go Light if you want to be the Shining Warrior who's shine means something.
Looks like I have another Handbook to pick up that I didn't know about. Maybe I should get in on that Patreon?
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http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/
You can also check out the wiki.
Looks like I have another Handbook to pick up that I didn't know about. Maybe I should get in on that Patreon?There's not enough Light to invest in.Illuminator's Handbook provides some interesting buff and debuff options. Go Light if you want to be the Shining Warrior who's shine means something.
I strongly recommend it.
dot
Conjuration is a much more flexible Sphere thanks to the Magical Companion and Extra Companion. Then you can use your summoned creatures to use all the other Spheres.
Sure, for 2 talents you can access a number of talents, buuuuut they only go up to CL 7 at best unless you start carrying around a ton of staffs. Your best bet is to take talents that can be easily maintained through concentration or by long durations and don't scale with CL, such as Haste or certain Sense talents. Just figure out a way to keep them away from the combat and you're golden. Save stuff like Destruction, Protection, and Telekinesis for your own talents to use your higher CL.
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(Yes, I'm here; yes, I have been lurking my own thread.)
4) Out of curiosity, what do you think the wiki could do to improve its execution?
Simple - execute. Its 'how-to' page, 'Using Spheres of Power', starts out well with 'this is a cool system, and we're going to show you how it works, but first ...' and then turns into (and remains) a list of definitions. If I'm there to find out how to use the Spheres of Power system (which I think I like, but I'm still somewhat uncertain about mixing into my campaign), I'd like to actually be shown how to use the system, not just be told 'it's cool, here's the definitions of stuff'. Add a plethora of Links; repeat yourself often. Basically, don't make your hopeful-player have to look and re-look and hunt around thirty places to discover the information you want them to have.
So let's get to that, with someone who has a small, but reachable build.
Alysandra Janus is a bard; what's more, she's a negotiator, which means her raison d'être is knowing the other person - Diplomacy, Bluff, Sense Motive, a bit of Intimidation and Perception - and having information that the other fellow doesn't (KS: Local, KS: Nobility, others). The non-magical portions of her build will remain the same; her Vancian spell-focus is primarily on enhancing her (already formidible) persuasive abilities, do a little bit of mystic strong-arming, and come out smelling like a rose and shining with innocence.
So help me build her to 5th level, level by level and step by step.
(Now, I'm going to do this in 'flow of consciousness', so it may look like I'm rambling, but you'll get to see how the new person is trying to use the wiki. Bear with me, but this is how it looks.)
Starting out, I'm going to the Sphere Bard page, where it says she gets two talents. Okay, that's ... great. What about spheres? Where are my spheres? I thought that 'cause it's 'Sphere X', you'd have 'how do I get my spheres' right there, right away. Well, let's go to 'Using Spheres of Power'. Spheres, spheres are great, how do I get my spheres? There are casting traditions, cool, we'll want to hit up Bardic Magic in a minute, but we have to find spheres.
Oo, twenty spheres!! Going by names, it sounds like maybe Divination, Enhancement, Fate, Illusion, Mind, ... Alteration, perhaps? And then more 'spheres are cool 'cause they let you do cool things'.
Uh ... how do I get my spheres?
Well, go back to the Sphere Bard page. Says I get two talents. Well, I don't know how I get my spheres, but I get two talents. So what's a talent? Back to the 'Using Spheres of Power' page, where I seem to remember it said something about magic talents. Yup, there it is. So, magic talents are like feats - they're 'sphere feats', so to speak, and they can use them to ... oh!! Finally, here it is!! 'They may spend it in one of two ways: to gain a new base sphere or to gain a talent associated with a sphere.' Yay, I now know how to get a sphere!!
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Talents: 2
Hm. Not sure what spheres I want yet. Mind sounds good, but let's go back to the Sphere Bard page again. Says that sphere bards are 'mid' casters (dunno what that is), and uses charisma as their casting ability modifier. Sure, bard, that makes sense. Does that mean I get a bonus? Aly has a CHA 18, so that +4 might be important. So ...
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Talents: 2
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Type: Mid (???)
All right, well, what else does it say there? Casting tradition, knew we'd go there. Ooo, lots of casting traditions, but we're going to hit up Bardic Magic. Says Bardic Magic has the Drawbacks of 'Verbal Casting, Somatic Casting, Skilled Casting (any Perform skill)'. That makes sense, though I think Aly might want to see about maybe nipping at least one of those in the bud, just so she can be subtle. But what's a drawback do for you? Does it ... wait, how do I find out what a Drawback does for you? Why should I take them? Granted, flavor, but if I'm doing flavor, it'd be nice to have some meat to go with it. Where do I find what it does for me, though? There's no link, no pointer ...
Hmm, here's a link buried in the middle of the list of Casting Traditions and Drawbacks - 'Balancing Drawbacks'. Let's see what that has to say.
Hmmm, says a lot of GM advice - but there's a table above it, and above that the 'General Drawbacks' section. Okay, so by taking one or multiple Drawbacks, you can gain bonus spell points. The more drawbacks you have, the faster your bonus spell points increase... okay, additional power if you restrict how you can use it, that makes sense. It also mentions that they can grant boons. Cool, what are ... uh ... boons? Boons below. No link? Where's a link, or do I have to scroll around? I guess I have to scroll around, or better yet, jump back to the top and find the link on the Table of Contents there.
... (Long table of contents - 3, 4 pages.)
Okay, here it is - Boons. 2 Drawbacks for 1 boon, those drawbacks don't count towards spell points. Okay, that makes sense. Let's see what the boons are ...
Lots of boosts to your caster level. Do I have a caster level?
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Talents: 2
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Type: Mid (???)
Caster Level: ???
Not yet, I guess. But I think ... let's stop in on the Sphere Bard page first - no, doesn't say what my caster level is, just a note in 'Magic Talents' that I get another magic talent every time I gain a caster level. Definition page? Okay, head back over to the Using Spheres of Power page. Okay, there's a definition of caster level. Oh, and look, it has a table that says something about 'mid' caster!!
Hm, okay, your caster level (CL?) is equivalent to the BAB. Interesting. 1st level mid caster's CL is ... 0. But don't despair, it says that that's treated as if it were a 1 when determining a caster's capabilities. So it's a fakey 0. Okay, I can live with that.
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Talents: 2
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Level/Type: 0 (Mid)
Scroll a bit further there, it starts to talk about Casting Ability Modifier (Charisma, we knew that), and then ... Casting Time. Well, um, okay, back to the bard page.
Hey, look, spell pool. We'd been talking about that. Spell pool is easy, here - Level + Charisma Modifier, which for Aly is ... wait, is this caster level, or class level, or character level? I dunno, it doesn't say. Well, I'll presume it's class level (usually is, right?) and since that's a 1, I have 1 + 4 = 5 spell pool. No, wait - paranoia strikes. Let's use Caster Level unless we're told differently.
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Talents: 2
Spell Pool: 4
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Level/Type: 0 (Mid)
I ... think I've gone about as far as I can go without actually getting into the spheres themselves. So let's take a look there. What'd I say might look interesting? Oh, yeah - Alteration, Divination, Enhancement, Fate, Illusion, and Mind. Mind sounds maybe best to start out with; Mind and Enhancement? Well, look at Mind. Need a link. There's one on the main page, one on the 'Using' page, but here's Mind and, because 'getting more points' sounds good, here's Enhancement too.
Do a quick look at Enhancement ... wow, that's a lot of stuff. Well, standard Vancian has a huge number of Enchantment spells, right? Hmm, we want to be able to boost our Charisma, let's do a page-search on that. Okay, second drop down, 'Mental Enhancement'. (First one was granting intelligence to critters; we don't need that for now. Or dude, maybe forever.) Okay, so that gives you +2 to a mental attribute starting out, +4 at 7th, +6 at 14th; cool. Nothing else in there I think I'm interested in yet; lots of combat. (Though Muffle Sound looked neat.)
Go back over to Mind. Lots less than with Enhancement ... um ... hm. What do I get for the money? I mean, if Spheres of Power is different/better/do magic all day, then if I get a sphere ... I guess it's what it says before the 'X Talents'? Enhance you can ... um ... hm, that's rules for how an enhancement works, I guess. Okay, the next bit, 'Enhance Equipment'. That's cool; at L5 Aly could grant a +2 to a weapon for as long as she concentrated, or 1 minute/caster level if she spends a spell point. Okay, that's fair. What's Mind give us?
Okay, you can mumble mumble mumble, make requests on a chart ... (???) all right, I guess those are examples. So with Mind you get Charm, which lets you do Suggestion, with three types of Suggestions that ... are called charms. (That's confusing. Call it all one or the other; if it's 'Suggestion', then why not call them 'lesser / greater / powerful suggestion', not 'Suggestion, lesser charm'? Or if you want to use charm, just use Charm once. Torpenhow Hill, Cumbria, England. "Hill hill hill hill", four words for hill.)
All right, well, that makes sense. Then we get into the talents, a lot of which - most of which - are 'enhance lesser / greater / powerful charm'. Those which don't are boosting the range, strength, type of mind, strength ... um, hm. Okay, so the lesser charms are at-will, but the greater charms cost a spell point (there's the SP cost for Charm), and Powerful cost 2 - AND you need the 'Powerful Charm' talent. Fair enough, though a little rough to find for me.
Hm. So. Charm ... sorry, Mind, sounds like my baby, I think. And because Alysandra needs to be doing this during a negotiation, I think the 'Subtlety' Talent would work best.
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Spheres: Mind
Spell Pool: 4
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Level/Type: 0 (Mid)
Mind Sphere Abilities: Lesser Charm, Greater Charm
Mind Sphere Talents: Subtlety
Okay, good. So .. wait, hm. What's the range, here? Ah, there it is - Close, using standard PF spell ranges (25' + 5'/2 CL).
What else? Scroll down the Sphere Bard page, recommended drawbacks; let's forego those for a moment, 'cause I don't think we actually want to do that. It would be killer having a bard who was so subtle as to simply look at someone and charm them. But hm. Nothing else there, really. Maybe on the Using Spheres of Power page?
Sure, we have Saving Throw DC (10 + 0 + 4 = 14), Magic Skill Bonus (total levels in casting classes) and Defense (11 + MSB), magic skill check / concentration (MSB + Casting Ability Mod) ... pretty much just numbers, quick easy calcs.
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Spheres: Mind
Spell Pool: 4
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Level/Type: 0 (Mid)
Mind Sphere Abilities: Lesser Charm, Greater Charm
Mind Sphere Talents: Subtlety
Save DC: 14
... wait, "total levels in casting classes". I recall seeing something about that ... gotta do a search. Hmm, just those two points, but I swear ... look for 'total'. Here we go - 'total caster levels'. That's ... not the same thing, right? Or is it? I dunno. Maybe? Let's presume they're the same thing, because the descriptions for MSB and MSD are 'your skill in magic', which sounds like 'caster level'. Which, for Aly, is that whoppin' 0.
Aaaand ... I think that's it, excluding writing out what the abilities and talents do. We're going to not take any of those pesky Drawbacks. Alysandra Janus, negotiator bard, at level 1:
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Spheres: Mind
Spell Pool: 4
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Level/Type: 0 (Mid)
Mind Sphere Abilities: Lesser Charm, Greater Charm
Mind Sphere Talents: Subtlety
Save DC: 14
MSB: +0
MSD: 11
MSC: +4
When reading through the Spheres of Power book, I wondered whether kineticist roots there...
So your Spell Points are your level (in almost any instance this refers to class level unless otherwise defined) plus your casting ability modifier.
Charm refers to the power the Mind Sphere gives you. Some other powers, as you noted, boost your charm in different ways such as range and access to the powerful version of any charm talent you pick up.
Similarly, a lot of Spheres tell you that their power has a different name so that you can easily differentiate between them. The Death Sphere, for example, has two base abilities, ghost strike and reanimate. The rules of goat strike say you gain exhausting strike, which follows the ghost strike rules but has an effect to it as described. When you pick up another talent marked (Ghost Strike), it means it is a new attack that follows the rules of ghost strike but has an effect that is different from exhausting strike.
Honestly, what you describe as your free flow of thought building your character is what I would expect of any new player being tossed a Core Rulebook or the Player's Handbook and told to make a 5th level character. The game as a whole, even before third-party supplements, is not intuitive.
Spheres of Power works partly with what is already there and modifies magic to be a bit more intuitive. You only get so much magic, nobody gets access to magic someone else can't have, and everybody gets access to the same magic at the same time. The only difference is really how power scales between the classes.
MSB/MSD only really come up when attempting to counterspell, dispel, or against SR.
About "not intuitive":
For example, what happens if you cast Enlarge Person on yourself one round, and then next round cast Beast Shape I on yourself? You know from having trodded back to the Magic chapter that you can't do that. The second polymorph effect cancels out the first.
But when you pick up the Alteration Sphere, it tells you in its rules that you can't have two Alteration effects going on the same target at once, and one must cancel out the other. It even gives both casters, if there are two of them, a chance to keep their Alteration in place by forcing a MSB vs. MSD check. But if you only pick up the Mind Sphere, you don't have to worry about what Alteration's rules are.
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Here's a link to a multiclass 7th level caster. Cleric 3, Rogue 2, Bard 2.
I think your misunderstanding with the system is that it follows the same rules and guidelines of the Magic and Spells chapters of the Core Rulebook. It doesn't. This new magic system has to be relearned since it changes Magic from a fundamental standpoint within Pathfinder RPG. The definitions are there to help you learn how to use the system. Everything is defined for you in a very quick and concise manner.
Caster level is similar to Base Attack Bonus in that multiple classes can contribute to one pool of it and that different classes accrue it at different rates.
High-casters gain a caster level for every high-caster class level they acquire.
Mid-casters gain a caster level on a 3/4 class level schedule.
Low-casters gain a caster level on a 1/2 class level schedule.
Sphere abilities are like Cantrips. You can use them at-will and they're never expended.
Spell Points let you create big effects with your Sphere abilities, but are limited. You gain a Spell Point every time you take a new level of a casting class. You gain more Spell Points for a high casting ability modifier (CAM).
Casting Traditions are a collection of pros and cons that help more clearly define your ability to cast. These tell you whether you can cast in armor, if you have to verbalize your spells, and more, while also granting you more Spell Points. Think of it like Monk Vows.
Spell ranges are covered up front so you know what each Sphere is capable of instead of having to refer to the range on each talent.
MSB and MSD are the CMB/CMD of the magic world. If you need to check against SR, you roll your CMB. If you want to counter or dispel, roll CMB vs. CMD. MSB is equal to your total levels across all casting classes. Your MSD is 11 + your MSB.
You can concentrate on an effect and cast another thing at the same time as long as both take different types of actions (swift, move, standard, etc.).
All Sphere abilities take a standard action to cast and concentration is a standard action. There are ways to do both with other actions, including casting as a move action.
Metamagic increases the cast time by 1 step per metamagic applied. Swift becomes move, move becomes standard, standard becomes full-round, full-round becomes 1 round, and so on.
A lot of spells cannot be replicated.
Magic items work slightly differently depending on their construction. A +1 longsword gives you an enhancement bonus to attack and damage, but it might also give you an enhancement bonus to your caster level with a Sphere. Wands don't have 50 charges, they have unlimited ability to use a base Sphere and 1 to 10 rechargeable charges.
Nobody is restricted to a Spell list. Everybody has complete freedom to pick up any Sphere they desire.
Thanks to the power of feats, Fighters may also cast. The class isn't exactly built around it, but they can do it if they want.
Except for certain archetypes, Sphere Casting leaves all your other class features alone.
What else do you want to know?
Here's a link to a multiclass 7th level caster. Cleric 3, Rogue 2, Bard 2.
Casting Traditions are a collection of pros and cons that help more clearly define your ability to cast. These tell you whether you can cast in armor, if you have to verbalize your spells, and more, while also granting you more Spell Points. Think of it like Monk Vows.
FYI, These are RECOMMENDED casting traditions. For what I have read, from both the website, and the two books (SoP and SoP:EO) you do not have to choose a casting tradition.
-- david
Shouldn't the Bard example above have four talents, not two?
As for Aolis, I'll post a build at some point (probably tomorrow, it's getting late for me and I'm still at school) but I'm keeping the archetype and Prestige Class. One of the downsides of Spheres of Power is that certain concepts don't translate well without a homebrew conversion and this Spell Sage / Magaambyan Arcanist build is one such example. I'm also not using the Sphere Arcanist to replicate his less focused spellbook because they get so few talents that I can't think of anything they can do to a competent level. Seriously, they almost have as many talents as a Paladin!
I look forward to seeing what you come up with.
Considering what everyone has said about Conjuration, I am sort of thinking I may dial back on it or get rid of it. Maybe use it as a way to have a familiar rather then a companion. From what I understand while a conjuration staff does not increase HD with Conjuration companions it does give a bonus. So if you had a staff of conjuration +5 then at 20th level your companion may have 15 HD but it's abilities would be in line with a 20th level. At least when it came to things like BAB and saves. So it could be viable even with the HD limit right? Let me know if I am mistaken.
Getting close to the end of Rise of the Runelords AP and I have been playing a Witch/Incanter the whole time. I will provide some of my experiences with the Spheres I have used.
Destruction - I only have a few talents in this one, but it works really well for what I need it to do. I picked up Extended Range twice and Stone Blast later, the base sphere worked out alright for what I needed; a simple damage solution. The talents helped me contribute to damaging enemies that are highly resistant or straight immune to magic.
Fate - Early game debuffing with Divine Force and small non-lethal damage from Pain. Echoing Word allows for a quick full party protection from domination and some small buff with the Hallow base ability.
Warp - I picked this up to help with positioning allies for flanks and my personal ability to flee. With increasing investment I have long range teleports. Portals which I can do some fun shenanigans with to effectively isolate enemies between two portals. This has probably become my most used sphere, only because it takes a significant investment of points to do anything fun.
Divination - Most of these were acquired by my Patron choice, but being able to scan areas has been interesting, especially when checking a room for magic stuff. Overall, I haven't used the sphere much recently, mainly because my swift action for Divine Future has been chewed up from other uses.
Creation - Not much experience with this yet. Used it mainly for Advanced Talent prereqs.
Protection - This is probably the most useful of my spheres. With the Greater Barrier talent I have created walls to separate groups of enemies. The wall could get destroyed, but those 2 mooks trapped behind it won't be able to break it for multiple turns, and in that time, their boss died from being isolated. Also, that poor frontliner getting nailed too hard and needs a sec to retreat, you can easily give him a small wall to block pursuers or a big one to stop a bunch of damage.
Time - At low levels, a concentrate duration on demand for that melee guy to get another attack is huge. At higher levels, Eject is a great way to isolate a twosome and tackle them separately. That is about all my experience with that, I haven't had much luck getting an enemy to fail the save vs. staggered, though that could be great.
Here's a link to a multiclass 7th level caster. Cleric 3, Rogue 2, Bard 2.
Casting Traditions are a collection of pros and cons that help more clearly define your ability to cast. These tell you whether you can cast in armor, if you have to verbalize your spells, and more, while also granting you more Spell Points. Think of it like Monk Vows.
FYI, These are RECOMMENDED casting traditions. For what I have read, from both the website, and the two books (SoP and SoP:EO) you do not have to choose a casting tradition.
-- david
I did note in the doc that this is a choice. Unless the GM says, "This is how it works in this game," you are free to choose a preexisting tradition or make up your own.
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Casting traditions are as much a DM worldbuilding tool as a player customization option. If the DM says you can make your own at will, awesome. This is fairly common in my experience. But maybe you are playing in a setting where traditions are important, like studious runinists (skilled casting, lengthened casting) fighting addicted blood mages (addictive, draining). The use of the traditions could be a major setting component and impact how groups interact.
CalethosVB, while you're doing a lot of explaining of what things are and how cool they are, your signal-to-noise ratio at this point is frighteningly low.
I'm not asking you for the benefits of the SoP system. And I don't believe I'm misunderstanding the system at all. I play a myriad of games. In some of them you can cast spells all day if you can keep up the effort (Shadowrun and Drain); in others, you can make up spells on the spot (HERO with a VPP). The 'Spheres of Power' system is not the problem; the Spheres of Power guide is my main gripe, in that if I'm walking into it, it doesn't give me a 'this is how you do it'. It does not Walk Me Through It. Which is what this entire thread series is about, and why I posted my 'first level conversion/creation' above - so that you could see the exact steps I had to take to walk through converting a L1 bard into a L1 SoP bard.
Yes, creating a character can be confusing; that D&D 3.5's guide is confusing, or that the Pathfinder book is, does not excuse the SoP system from being equally confusing, especially as since you WANT people to use your system, you should make it EASIER to create or convert a character and use it. Ideally the SoP would have something of the following:
1) Choose your class, and note what type of caster (Low/Mid/High) [link to definition] your class is. If you're converting a PF class, consult the links in the sidebar to the various PF classes to see what type of caster that sort of class is. [PF Class Link Sidebar]
2) To purchase spheres, first look at the number of talents your character receives. A sphere costs 1 talent, but there are neat tricks inside each sphere that also cost talents. As you go up in Caster Level (as seen on the Caster Level chart [link]) you gain additional talents; sum up the number of talents you have, then purchase Spheres and talents inside those spheres.
. 2a) Powerful casters can gain powerful talents; see 'advanced talents' [link] for more information.
3) Now that you've purchased your Spheres and Talents, let's talk about your spell pool ...
... and so forth. If you want people to go 'cool' and jump in feet-first, providing simple and clear step-by-step conversion instructions cannot be a bad thing. While the definitions are clear and concice, they do not help you convert your character - which is entirely my point.
I appreciate your wealth of knowledge; I very much do. I simply want it to be helpful instead of overwhelming. To be a walk-through guide, instead of information overload.
I'll give it a day or two in order to allow people to continue to comment and advise, and then I'll post moving Alysandra from L1 to L3.
Like these:
Shouldn't the Bard example above have four talents, not two?
I think it'll be 4 at 5th level, but I'm rebuilding Aly's magic up from 1st, so that I can step-by-step it (like it says on the tin) and make sure I'm doing it right.
Well, in fairness, the Using Spheres of Power page is copied pretty much verbatim from the actual book. XD And it answers quite a lot of the questions you asked for your sample there. For example, "Each caster gains a pool of spell points equal to their class level plus their casting ability modifier." (Emphasis mine)
Thank you, Rednal - missed that, or screwed it up. Both, likely - but I wanted to be wary and 'underbuild' instead of 'overbuild'. Alysandra is therefore:
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Spheres: Mind
Spell Pool: 5
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Level/Type: 0 (Mid)
Mind Sphere Abilities: Lesser Charm, Greater Charm
Mind Sphere Talents: Subtlety
Save DC: 14
MSB: +0
MSD: 11
MSC: +4
MSB and MSD are based on level in a casting class, not caster level, so mid and low casters still get +1/class level. A mageknight is no easier to dispel than an incanter. A level 1 sphere bard has an MSB of +1 and MSD of +12.
Ah! Okay.
Alysandra Janus
Level: 1
Spheres: Mind
Spell Pool: 5
Casting Ability: Charisma (+4)
Caster Level/Type: 0 (Mid)
Mind Sphere Abilities: Lesser Charm, Greater Charm
Mind Sphere Talents: Subtlety
Save DC: 14
MSB: +1
MSD: 12
MSC: +5
Also, I think the Wiki heard you.
Was that there before? I see it now, tucked away in the Links list on the side; IMNSHO, this should be placed immediately under 'Using Spheres of Power', big and bold. On a quick glance-through, it looks to be exactly what you - I - need(ed) when it comes to building or converting a character.
This is well done.
*Rubs chin*
You know, honestly, I'd swap Expanded Charm for Subtlety if I were you, and maybe pick it back up at Level 2 if that's something you really want your character to have. Expanded Charm is important for using that Sphere effectively, and you'll probably appreciate being able to affect different types of creatures more than hiding your power at first level.
Hm; a moderately good point, but since my next bit is taking it from 1 to 3, I'll leave it alone for now, and use Expanded Charm. Or I might take another look at the Sphere-Specific Drawbacks.
Heh. That's me, doing good things one malevolent rant at a time. ;)
In my SoP game, I required casters to take a tradition. There were 35 (I think) traditions to choose from, and each of them was banned from three to five spheres. That's not a normal restriction by the book, but I liked the idea of various orders of spellcasters not having access to everything. Players were also allowed to add drawbacks to their tradition to reflect their personal variation on what they were taught, but were not allowed to remove any existing drawbacks.
The traditions were tied to various philosophies and ideals as well, although no alignments. I didn't use alignments at all. Instead, I used 'aspects', Holy, Arcane, Death, Chaos, Nature (Yes, they are the Master of Magic schools). The list of banned spheres was largely influenced by the primary and secondary (if any) aspects of their tradition.
Oh, and in that the spheres of warp and time were only theorised. There was going to be a plot involving the source of those spheres to be an otherworldly 'sixth aspect'. Probably with some hideous, Lovecraftian price.
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The traditions were tied to various philosophies and ideals as well, although no alignments. I didn't use alignments at all. Instead, I used 'aspects', Holy, Arcane, Death, Chaos, Nature (Yes, they are the Master of Magic schools). The list of banned spheres was largely influenced by the primary and secondary (if any) aspects of their tradition.
Oh, and in that the spheres of warp and time were only theorised. There was going to be a plot involving the source of those spheres to be an otherworldly 'sixth aspect'. Probably with some hideous, Lovecraftian price.
Any chance you might link or PM me what you have put together for this? The idea does sound interesting.
Ah, I see my mistake. I forgot Mid-Casters get 0 talents, and then 2 bonus talents at level one. My bad.
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Class: Incanter
Specialization: Warp.
Level: 17-20
Sphere Talents
Telekinesis (Primary): Deflect, Finesse, Forceful Telekinesis, Acceleration, Greater Speed, Weaponize, Dancing Blade, Linear Acceleration, Effortless Telekinesis
Destruction (Secondary): Force Blast, Greater Blast x4, Extended Range x2, Crafted Blast
Warp (Minor): Distant Teleport, Emergency Teleport, Unseeing Teleport
The basic feel and strategy I am going for is an NPC "non-combatant" who depends completely on his magic to fight, both though the Telekinesis and the Destruction Spheres while staying mobile through the Warp Sphere. My goal is for him to be quite scary with his magic and be able to deal a lot of damage, especially with his Force Blast.
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Hmm, grabbing additional Talents would be nice. I admittedly picked Warp as the Incantor specialization because it was the only one that felt benefited the concept.
Quick Teleport, I must have missed that. I used the Spheres of Power wiki in building this with some limitations while at work. The reason being because of filters at work I have to open a cached version of any given page to view... checking now, it seems Quick Teleport is there so I am not certain how I missed that.
I'll look into a Destruction staff.
Of note, I actually haven't decides on any feats and I am very much open for suggestions. A way of shooting off multiple Force Blasts would be nice, if such is possible, in a given turn.
So, by default using Telekinesis AND Destruction in combat probably won't get you all that far. Both of them will want to use your standard action a lot, and so they will end up redundant.
There are a few ways to make them work together better though. The easiest way is to focus on making one more passive, and the other more active. Either sphere can be built to fit into either role. Right now you seem to have the active side of things figured out with both, so lets focus on how you can make one of them passive.
With Telekinesis, the easiest way to take advantage of it without spending too many actions is to get the Easy Focus boon as part of your casting tradition, allowing you to concentrate on your telekinesis as a move action. Combine this with a less action intensive fighting style, like attacks of opportunity (using Dancing Weapon to get attacks of opportunity with your telekinetically wielded weapons, and Divided Mind to blanket the battlefield in knives), and you can get a ton of value without spending more than a move action on Telekinesis.
More passive use of Destruction can generally be accomplished by placing down enduring effects, stuff like Energy Spheres, Energy Walls, Blast Traps, etc. That way you spend one or two actions on an effect that you can get a lot of mileage out of, while using the rest of your actions on your main offensive sphere. I suggest Energy Wall, especially if you're going Telekinesis. Set up a hemisphere and fling your enemies back and forth through it with your telekinesis.
Destruction can make a show of being other spheres. Rebuff is a good 'protection' ability, and Energy Leap gives you a 'warp' ability.