|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I know that me wife feels the sexism at the table. Here are a couple of examples.
She has trouble getting the group to even discuss her ideas on a party choice. She can repeat herself over and over again with no avail. However, if I just repeat her ideas one additional time the group discusses it.
She has been gaming for 25+ years. However, no matter how up to date /correct on rules or character choices, people still second guess her. I have seen players double check an obvious basic pathfinder rule just because she pointed it out. This even happens when she is the GM.
Its very frustrating for her. So she usually likes to game with me if we are with new people.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Sorry to hear that your recent experiences have been eerie. It's likely that only time might make things tolerable, as in a few non-white, non-straight, and / or non-male gamers come to that location and make a lot of charismatic appeals to become accepted.
To adapt and change, the environment has to change first. If the only people at the gaming table are Caucasian, straight males, then there is no change in the environment. If a new element is added, there will be awkwardness at first. If the new element is a very cool, charismatic person, then the others might change and accept the new elements. If they don't, the loss is theirs.
| 5 people marked this as a favorite. |
As a woman involved in the gaming hobby, I can completely believe you've encountered situations like this. I've experienced players not familiar with a woman showing discomfort when I join a table, ignoring or disregarding my suggestions in game, or assuming I don't know the rules, and it is incredibly patronizing and annoying. It's always a small thing, not small as not hurtful or important, but small as in easily overlooked by people not directly effected by it. Even my husband, who often shares a table with me, won't even notice when it happens.
One of the biggest things you can do if you see things like this happen at a table is say something. When there is no one there but the straight, white, cis-gender males, call them out on behavior they wouldn't engage in when the table is more diverse. But most importantly, if you see someone treating another player with subtle disrespect, call them on it. Even if they don't completely correct the behavior, even knowing ONE other person at the table realizing it's happening can mean so much to someone who is used to dealing with that kind of crap constantly, invisibly, and alone.
I have questions about one of these particular instances, specifically the female playing the dwarf.
A woman described her gruff male Dwarven Fighter, and there was a pause, a response of "uhhh, okay", and then proceeded to ignore her throughout most of the game, and then when she had to remind others that she was playing a male Dwarf, "yeah, whatever" was the response.
How are people supposed to respond when someone tell you the race and gender of the individual playing? Honestly, those aren't usually particularly important, unless you want to play up some sort of racial dispute between characters (like the classic elves and dwarves don't get along). So if someone just describe their character as a stereotypical dwarf (the gruff dwarven fighter, Ghim from Lodoss War) I'm just going to say "Okay". Because what else am I supposed to say? Generally speaking in the home games I play in whenever someone introduces their character we just go in round and no one really says anything unless there is some particularly interesting thing when the character is described. Male dwarf fighter isn't, in my opinion new or groundbreaking.
However, that only covers ignoring her character introduction. When you say they ignored her throughout most of the game, in what way did they do so? Did she make suggestion and they just didn't acknowledge it? Did she make suggestion and they explained they had a different idea that they thought was better and explained why? Not a lot to go on, but depending on what happened could be a case of exclusion.
On reminding others that she is playing a male dwarf, within what context was she doing this? Why did it matter? Is it because people referred to her in character as she? Because honestly, I have a hard time remember other characters names at tables I'm playing with (unless we use name tags). Failing to remember that you're playing a character that is opposite sex from your real life sex is a simple mistake to make when you're looking at a female in front of you. I don't think such is a purposeful or hateful thing as much as when you don't see the character in front of you and are looking at the player you revert to using pronouns that apply to the person you are looking at. Unless the player's character kept being referred to as she and the player kept reminding them she was playing a male dwarf I'm just not sure of the relevance. Without context, I would probably reply with "So?", with the implied idea being, "So, why is that important here?"
|
| 12 people marked this as a favorite. |
My favorite thing about this thread is that it's perfectly OK for folks to be frosty in a public, community oriented game towards someone just because they're not like them, but calling that behavior out and asking for a discussion on how we can be better is somehow socially unacceptable.
First, if you're uncomfortable with a player at the table because of who they are (and not, say, because they don't have a Wand of Cure Light Wounds and prepared nothing but Jump spells), that's fine. But that's your problem. You shouldn't be letting that change your behavior at the table. This falls under the "Don't be a jerk" rule. And yeah, some of this IS unconscious. Most of us don't practice mindfulness about our body language, speech, and social interactions all the time. That's exhausting. But we're still responsible for it. I may find a client at work absolutely frustrating and roll my eyes; that doesn't make it OK.
Folks, in turn, have every right to go "Hey, can you assume I know the rules until I don't?" "Listen, I can't help but notice my role play as a male dwarf is getting some no selling from everybody else. What's up?" or "...look, I'm going to mention my husband occasionally the same way you mention your friends or partners, too. When you look at your feet and stop talking and do other stuff it looks like you're uncomfortable. And that sends a message that that part of my life isn't welcome here when that part of yours is. We're all adults (or responsible young people!) here, can we not act like this?"
Second, think whatever you want. No one is telling you to change that right now or else, just reflect on it. Figure out where your discomfort is coming from, control for it, and make an effort to move past it to pull everyone into the game. If you're picky enough about how you game that you feel every right to behave differently towards folks that aren't like you...don't do it in a public PFS game. Just don't. American PFS (and American tabletop as a hobby) are overwhelmingly cisgender, white, and male. They have stayed this way because folks who don't fit this mold approach, start getting subtle signals they are not a good "fit" based on their identity, and decide it isn't enjoyable enough to keep going.
I don't want a gaming community like this and I surely don't want it for PFS. That's deciding your comfort and not having to reflect on your own beliefs is more important than another person having space at the table. And that's not cool. There's room for all of us here and it only makes our hobby better.
BTT, thank you for being brave enough to start this conversation and sticking with it.
EDIT: Noticed a participle disagreement and adjusted. Trying to be better about my grammar.
| 5 people marked this as a favorite. |
As has been said before, most of this appears to be reflexive/unconscious actions. That doesn't make it right and that also means they probably aren't going to change this response on their own (if they are even fully aware of it). Fortunately, you are aware enough to have noticed and I fully agree with Andrew above! I get the impression that you have put yourself into a box where you can either do nothing or call them out, neither of which makes you feel particularly comfortable. Unless this escalates to something more severe, leading by example is a great way to deal with the situation. Some people are afraid or uncomfortable etc about new situations and sometimes it just takes some positive interactions to put people at ease and realize that nothing has really changed, there is just a new gamer who wants to roll dice like everybody else.
Venture-Captain, California—Sacramento
|
I think that once you get past the "let people be jerks" responses, there is a lot of good advice in this thread.
I would lead heavily toward lead by example, with a side helping of talking to people one on one when you have a natural opportunity. (For example, you and someone else are cleaning up after game. "Hey, I notice you seemed to be ignoring Sally's dwarf tonight. What was going on?")
|
I think that you should consider bringing this up to the local authority (probably VO but possibly store coordinator). Pretty much as you did here, very much NOT accusing anybody.
If such a thing was brought to my attention, I'd probably make a post on our local board mentioning the potential issue but most definitely NOT including any information that would identify any of the people involved (our local site serves 4 separate venues so anonymity would be easily preserved). The post would also reiterate our standing policy on such matters.
I think that you should consider bringing this up to the local authority (probably VO but possibly store coordinator). Pretty much as you did here, very much NOT accusing anybody.
If such a thing was brought to my attention, I'd probably make a post on our local board mentioning the potential issue but most definitely NOT including any information that would identify any of the people involved (our local site serves 4 separate venues so anonymity would be easily preserved). The post would also reiterate our standing policy on such matters.
I'm not sure anyone did anything actionable though.
From BBT's description the gay male mentioned his husband and some people were "visible uncomfortable". I don't think there is anything to be done about that. He didn't mention them being discourteous or acting in any disparaging way, so I'm not sure there is anything to be done. I'm also not convinced that he's not putting meaning into body language that isn't there, but that's not really important. Even if there is meaning behind it, there's isn't much to be done except to say, "Hey, why are you guys not comfortable with gay people?"
As far the issue with people of different ethnicities/race, I'm also not sure if there is an issue here. A new person walked up the table and someone assumed they didn't know anything about the game. It may have been because the individual was black, but there also could have been other reasons. Again in this case nothing provocative was done or said, outside of the apparent assumption that the newcomer didn't know the rules of the game. Nothing really to act on here either. Heck, the person who started explaining the rules might have simply assumed the individual didn't know them because they frequent PFS events and had never seen that person before and thought them new to the hobby. They may have genuinely been trying to be helpful.
The action however with the woman, does seem like it might be a case of sexism and exclusionary action, which is why I asked for more clarifications from BBT in my previous post.
|
|
| 4 people marked this as a favorite. |
My favorite thing about this thread is that it's perfectly OK for folks to be frosty in a public, community oriented game towards someone just because they're not like them, but calling that behavior out and asking for a discussion on how we can be better is somehow socially unacceptable.
I don't think (at least from what I read) that anyone is saying this conversation is unacceptable (socially or otherwise). I think that what several people have pointed out is that there could be multiple explanations to the second-hand behaviors that we are hearing about, including bias.
First, if you're uncomfortable with a player at the table because of who they are (and not, say, because they don't have a Wand of Cure Light Wounds and prepared nothing but Jump spells), that's fine. But that's your problem. You shouldn't be letting that change your behavior at the table. This falls under the "Don't be a jerk" rule. And yeah, some of this IS unconscious.
If a behavior is unconscious (like body language often is), it's hard to control it. Assuming that people have training in regulating their own body language is just that, an assumption.
Most of us don't practice mindfulness about our body language, speech, and social interactions all the time. That's exhausting. But we're still responsible for it. I may find a client at work absolutely frustrating and roll my eyes; that doesn't make it OK.
Rolling your eyes at someone and showing disengaging body language are separate things.
Second, think whatever you want. No one is telling you to change that right now or else, just reflect on it. Figure out where your discomfort is coming from, control for it, and make an effort to move past it to pull everyone into the game.
you are doing in the second sentence what you said you're not doing in the first. Now I'm confused.
If you're picky enough about how you game that you feel every right to behave differently towards folks that aren't like you...don't do it in a public PFS game.
Except that this presumes that the reason that someone is being excluded is based on race or religion, and not anything else (like someone's level of comfortability with things like PDA, or the behavior of the person being discussed, or any other of a number of factors that can be based on an individual, not a group of people.
Just don't. American PFS (and American tabletop as a hobby) are overwhelmingly cisgender, white, and male. They have stayed this way because folks who don't fit this mold approach, start getting subtle signals they are not a good "fit" based on their identity, and decide it isn't enjoyable enough to keep going.
And I'm sure that stereotypes about gamers hasn't helped things, either.
Honestly, BBT, the best advice that I can give is to pull people aside one at a time and mention what you've noticed. Doing so in a respectful manner should give you all the information that you need to know. It's been my experience that most people who are unaware of how their non verbals are being perceived will be appreciative of the fact, as long as it's done with tact (I'd recommend using I statements like "hey, so I'm guessing that you might have missed this, but I noticed that[female player's name] was trying to be engaged based on the fact that they were playing a cross gendered character" or something along those lines; but I digress).|
|
| 4 people marked this as a favorite. |
My favorite thing about this thread is that it's perfectly OK for folks to be frosty in a public, community oriented game towards someone just because they're not like them, but calling that behavior out and asking for a discussion on how we can be better is somehow socially unacceptable.
Declaring that someone is frosty is both subjective and error prone, making it a poor basis for berating someone. Its incredibly easy for someone to project their own feelings into the interpretation.
Even worse, there's NO way of telling why someone is frosty. New person? Not good talking to women? Frosty with people they haven't known for 20 years or less? Well aware that they have a penchant for HBO esque humor or work the blue and are taking an extra second to run the jokes past the censors? In pain, on drugs, off drugs, fall on the deep end of the aspergers spectrum, hate gunslingers, dog died, fighting with spouse, got cut off in traffic on the way there, low blood sugar, hate gunslingers....
First, if you're uncomfortable with a player at the table because of who they are (and not, say, because they don't have a Wand of Cure Light Wounds and prepared nothing but Jump spells), that's fine. But that's your problem. You shouldn't be letting that change your behavior at the table. This falls under the "Don't be a jerk" rule.
Oh hell to the no.
Even if someone actually is less than totally comfortable because of who someone is (rather than just seeming that way) accusing them of jerkish behavior is both unfair and counter productive. If the best you can berate someone for is a highly subjective interpretation of their body language that means they're probably altering both their speech and their behavior trying to be polite. At best its-You are a jerk for not having better social skills- which is just as inane as blaming someone for not running fast enough in a sunday softball game.
Ironically, a lot of the discomfort comes from the possibility of these kinds of accusations which you're just going to make worse by making them real. If you berate someone for something as small as looking down when you husband is mentioned the BEST result you can expect is they're going to start second guessing everything they say and do around you which is going to exacerbate the problem.
People are playing a game to hack pretend orcs to bits and hang out with friends, not get an amateur social re alignment based on tea leaves and body language.
|
Venture-Captain, California—Sacramento
|
I think that you should consider bringing this up to the local authority (probably VO but possibly store coordinator). Pretty much as you did here, very much NOT accusing anybody.
If such a thing was brought to my attention, I'd probably make a post on our local board mentioning the potential issue but most definitely NOT including any information that would identify any of the people involved (our local site serves 4 separate venues so anonymity would be easily preserved). The post would also reiterate our standing policy on such matters.
I'm not sure anyone did anything actionable though.
...
As far the issue with people of different ethnicities/race, I'm also not sure if there is an issue here. A new person walked up the table and someone assumed they didn't know anything about the game. It may have been because the individual was black, but there also could have been other reasons. Again in this case nothing provocative was done or said, outside of the apparent assumption that the newcomer didn't know the rules of the game. Nothing really to act on here either. Heck, the person who started explaining the rules might have simply assumed the individual didn't know them because they frequent PFS events and had never seen that person before and thought them new to the hobby. They may have genuinely been trying to be helpful.
...
Except that BBT *was* a new person to the group 7 games ago, and was apparently not treated the same way.
Now, it still might not be racial bias. It could just be that BBT looks more like a traditional nerd, and the african-american looked more like a prep, so they just assumed he was new. (Have never seen BBT, so I apologize if I just criticized his looks unfairly, it was just an example.)
|
| 5 people marked this as a favorite. |
My advice (as was stated by another poster) would be to lead by positive example. Take those players you perceive as being marginalized under your wing. Go out of your way to include them in table talk, RP, tactical decisions, etc. as you would hopefully with ANY newcomer regardless of race, gender, whatever. Model the behavior you would like to see from the other players and you might be surprised by their reactions.
Until there is evidence to the contrary you must assume that these behaviors are unconscious or at worst a form of self-filtering. If it's self-filtering then A) that shows they are trying, albeit however poorly, not to offend and B) the best thing you can do is get them to focus on what they have in common with these new players -- most likely, the game -- rather than calling attention to the differences.
I think positive action is much preferable to quietly angsting and potentially projecting your own biases or ascribing intent when you cannot know the minds of the other players. Lead by example and you will both be showing support for the newcomers and perhaps proving the needed social cues the other guys need to "break the ice."
If you do that and the other players are still frosty or do something outright jerky, then you have an issue that should be addressed directly. But I really feel like jumping to conclusions prior to that is just going to make everyone defensive and lead to ugliness.
|
|
My advice (as was stated by another poster) would be to lead by positive example. Take those players you perceive as being marginalized under your wing. Go out of your way to include them in table talk, RP, tactical decisions, etc. as you would hopefully with ANY newcomer regardless of race, gender, whatever. Model the behavior you would like to see from the other players and you might be surprised by their reactions.
This right here is an excellent suggestion.
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 4, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
|
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
I commend blackbloodtroll for trying to make the PFS community a more welcoming and positive place. I don't think it really matters if the particular people and behaviors that blackbloodtroll witnessed are actually hostile or biased. A conversation about handling those sorts of things when they come up is still valuable. Because they do happen, all the time. This thread doesn't need to be about proving the guilt or innocence of specific people we don't know anything about. A more productive discussion would revolve around answering blackbloodtroll's original questions.
Has anyone experienced this?
If so, what happened, and what did you do?
I can't think of any particular experiences I've had, as the tables I've played at or run (mostly at conventions) have been full of great people. But I'll second (or third?) the sentiment that "leading by example" is a great approach.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I don't think (at least from what I read) that anyone is saying this conversation is unacceptable (socially or otherwise). I think that what several people have pointed out is that there could be multiple explanations to the second-hand behaviors that we are hearing about, including bias.
And lots of people have asked solid clarifying questions and/or talked about other things that may be going on, which absolutely warrants the really great advice to pull people aside. That said...
If you look for mirco-aggressions then you will find them.
With out knowing what changes go on, it would be inappropriate to label them as Racist/Sexist/etc. In fact not knowing and assigning motivation based upon them being straight, cisgendered, white males is also Racist ,sexist, ect.
I am having difficulty understanding what you are complaining about, perhaps because you have not been particularly specific as to the nature of these behavioral "changes." However, if these nonspecific changes are made in an unconscious effort so as not to offend diverse players, what do you expect to accomplish by even mentioning it? Moreover, why would you even consider offending those that you play with by effectively accusing them of racism or sexism?
Maybe, but I feel that to dismiss it, is to contribute, or worse, be willfully ignorant.
It doesn't seem like you even know what it is. Or if you can reliably say you're NOT contributing to it. Someone could be picking up as much from you as you are from them.
Which in turn starts a pretty solid "prove this is even happening to me or it isn't" offshoot. Good guidance starts to show up, but it takes awhile. This is strange, given the OP only asked "hey, when different folks show up they start acting weird...I think it might be an -ism bit. Has anyone else noticed this? What do I do?" (paraphrasing mine). I don't understand why it took a dozen posts to get to "Pull them aside and talk to them about it, one on one, and ask what's up."
I'm wondering if you've misunderstood: There was a solid effort to explain why this behavior is perfectly OK and even one lovely "thought police" police reference. This post was aimed at those. Someone came and asked for help and the burden of proof was required before one worthwhile suggestion for action was even given. They almost wanted to let it go, based on said posts. That's a lot of unnecessary resistance for a basic request.
Except that BBT *was* a new person to the group 7 games ago, and was apparently not treated the same way.
Now, it still might not be racial bias. It could just be that BBT looks more like a traditional nerd, and the african-american looked more like a prep, so they just assumed he was new. (Have never seen BBT, so I apologize if I just criticized his looks unfairly, it was just an example.)
7 years is a long time. Was the person who made the assumption even apart of the group at the time? Has that individual acted similarly to other new faces in the past? My point was more there is a lack of detail here for me to determine if there is anything to substantiate a claim of racism.
Except that suggestion specifically talked about "NOT accusing anybody" and suggested just raising the issue without identifying anyone and reiterating the policy. Nothing that requires anything "actionable". Just a reminder to be aware of and try to avoid such behavior - even when it doesn't rise to the actionable level.
Even though he wouldn't be naming names, bringing it up to a VO is still saying somebody is being racist/sexist/homophobic. I guess my thought is that without something more concrete I'm of the opinion you shouldn't bring a VO into it. What is a VO supposed to say or do?
"Guys watch your subconscious body behavior and posture" sounds silly to me. I'm sorry but if someone told me that I just wouldn't know how to respond. It's subconscious action. Unless you're going to start teaching courses on mindfulness I don't know what you expect it to do.If any of the individuals did have a problem, the fact that they contained themselves to only subconscious body language says they are at least trying to be accommodating and peacefully coexist (except in the case of the woman being ignored which might be a legitimate problem that needs to be addressed).
I guess I just don't see the point in a VO trying to make the statement, but perhaps it's just me and my doubt that such a statement would impact people if they did have issues.
However, if he is worried about it discretely saying something to the individual(s) in question would be sensible.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Ah yes the hypocrisy of those who claim to be progressive. You can't discriminate against white straight males because they are white straight males even while calling every minor thing a sign of discrimination.
Blackbloodtroll is bullying because blackbloodtroll purposefully label the other players as white straight males so demonization is easier. Blackblootroll wants to feel comfortable calling out their so called bad behavior, and wants permission from the community to call out their so called bad behavior. Blackbloodtroll wants to bully them into changing their behavior that blackbloodtroll dislikes with the consent of the community.
If blackbloodtroll was trying forcibility change a parties behavior for any other reason instead of so called sexism, racism, or homophobia what would you call it?
Right...sure thing, pal. You're the victim here... :P
What would I call it? Hmmm. Decency? Empathy? Consideration? Take your pick.
Not much point to going further, as this post -- along with yours -- is likely going to be swept up by the mods in short order.
|
|
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
As a white, heterosexual, cisgendered man, I probably engage in this behavior to some extent.
I don't want to. In fact, I try not to. But personally I struggle if someone is playing a cross-gender character. Not because I think it's icky or wrong, but because I am receiving constant sensory input telling me that the person in front of me is a male (or female, or whatever). It's hard to engage my imagination to the point where I "see" something different.
There's probably not much that can be done, expect perhaps in the most egregious of cases. Although threads like this can help raise awareness.
|
|
Feelings nothing more than feelings. From a bigot. I didn't mention myself at all. I said that the community is judging and demonizing people they never met because they belong to a certain group of individuals. That is the definition of racism, sexism, and phobia.
No, they're discussing observed behavior. They only one I see drawing conclusions about individuals (the actual definition of racism, sexism, etc.) is you.
Then again, you're a troll with a victimization complex and an ax to grind. Have fun with that.
|
|
Declaring that someone is frosty is both subjective and error prone, making it a poor basis for berating someone. Its incredibly easy for someone to project their own feelings into the interpretation.
Even worse, there's NO way of telling why someone is frosty. New person? Not good talking to women? Frosty with people they haven't known for 20 years or less? Well aware that they have a penchant for HBO esque humor or work the blue and are taking an extra second to run the jokes past the censors? In pain, on drugs, off drugs, fall on the deep end of the aspergers spectrum, hate gunslingers, dog died, fighting with spouse, got cut off in traffic on the way there, low blood sugar, hate gunslingers....
You're right! There isn't! That's why the advice of "pull them aside and check in" when you notice a pattern of behavior is so great. That and lead by example. I'm confused where this becomes "berating them". I'm talking specifically to folks who are acting out of discomfort based on identity. Not the case? Awesome, no worries. Maybe I should just have said "allowing an implicit bias rooted in (insert ism here) to govern social interaction with someone"? My hope was to keep it a direct, "lots of reasons that is completely OK to act completely different around this one person who isn't like us" vs. "barrage of indicators it is not really a great thing to ask about how you deal with it".
Oh hell to the no.
Even if someone actually is less than totally comfortable because of who someone is (rather than just seeming that way) accusing them of jerkish behavior is both unfair and counter productive. If the best you can berate someone for is a highly subjective interpretation of their body language that means they're probably altering both their speech and their behavior trying to be polite. At best its-You are a jerk for not having better social skills- which is just as inane as blaming someone for not running fast enough in a sunday softball game.
Ironically, a lot of the discomfort comes from the possibility of these...
Again, I'm speaking specifically about the posts suggesting "they've done nothing wrong" and making it clear treating players differently in patterns around race/gender/etc falls under the jerk rule. And as I stated above, being unconscious of it is likely the case, but does not absolve them.
It's funny how when a person posts about issues that appear to be patterned around identity, the assumption is that these behaviors are anything but.
|
|
No they are talking about imagine behaviors. No one seen this behavior at all. I am actually talking about the behavior on this thread. Thanks again for proving you are bigot.Feelings nothing more than feelings. From a bigot. I didn't mention myself at all. I said that the community is judging and demonizing people they never met because they belong to a certain group of individuals. That is the definition of racism, sexism, and phobia.No, they're discussing observed behavior. They only one I see drawing conclusions about individuals (the actual definition of racism, sexism, etc.) is you.
Then again, you're a troll with a victimization complex and an ax to grind. Have fun with that.
In a piece of wonderful timing, see jtaylor3003's many posts that went up as I wrote my last two replies for examples of my first post's target audience!
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
As a white, heterosexual, cisgendered man, I probably engage in this behavior to some extent.
I don't want to. In fact, I try not to. But personally I struggle if someone is playing a cross-gender character. Not because I think it's icky or wrong, but because I am receiving constant sensory input telling me that the person in front of me is a male (or female, or whatever). It's hard to engage my imagination to the point where I "see" something different.
There's probably not much that can be done, expect perhaps in the most egregious of cases. Although threads like this can help raise awareness.
And that's all we can really ask of ourselves: Acknowledge it as problematic, try to be aware of it, and work on it.
|
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16
|
| 7 people marked this as a favorite. |
You know, if I knew or suspected that I was at a table with someone who was going to analyze every word I say (or don't say) and every glance or shift in posture, talk about it behind my back with complete strangers in a public forum, and possibly pull me aside for a private reprimand because I shifted in my chair at the wrong moment, I think I'd end up with tense, awkward body language, and avoid role-play banter with "different" people too.
|
RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 8
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
First of all, like Pirate Rob, reading this thread makes me happy to play in Pullman and Moscow with so many awesome people. I'm confident sending new players to tables I'm not present at because I know our community is welcoming to anyone that's willing to give it a shot.
I also agree with people saying that the first step is to lead by example.
I know that when my GF started playing PFS four years ago, I fell into a couple of the common pitfalls. I'll be the first to admit that I was a bit too controlling at times with her as she was learning the game. Also, because she was a girl playing a game that was almost entirely populated by men (in our area, at the time), I found that I was treating her differently. Fortunately for me, my GF is a lot smarter than me and kicked me of those bad habits real quick. And I'm glad she did.
Now we play together in an online game of Pathfinder now along with some good friends. Its a campaign with a lot of difficult combats and critical thinking, and she's probably the most on-point player we have--remembering plot points, taking notes, etc. Whenever she suggests something, we're all listening and most of the time we take her lead when it comes to planning things out.
I believe it all starts by having a conversation and getting people on the right page. Now if you try to do that and those people are unwilling to remove their blinders, well that's another matter.
Don't engage, my good friends. Just take some comfort that this brief derail is an aberration and not that common on these forums. Let's let this line die a quiet death so the mods don't have quite as much work when they get here.
You've got a real pickle here, BBT. Have you noticed an discomfort from the non-"wsm" players?