Medium - assumed daily prep?

[Azothath]

kinevon wrote:

@Stephen:

What constitutes a library? Is there a minimum number of books or scrolls/documents? Some Pathfinders would have backpacks that might constitute a library, what with all their copies of the various Pathfinder Chronicles, or cookbooks, or scroll libraries...

As to stage, I would just like to cite Shakespeare: "All the world's a stage, and all the men and women merely players in it."

On taverns: I would be surprised if you couldn't, easily, get an hour undisturbed in many taverns. For PFS, just consider the Wounded Wisp, where some of the patrons listed in the scenario are mentioned as spending a lot of time there.

I understand... the FAQ directs GMs to listen to reasonable statements for access to the spirits. An example is given. A caution is given that all spirits may not be accessible at all times. I would expect players and GMs to talk and work it out BEFORE the game so you don't get a surprise or have to stop in the middle of the game.

The example in the FAQ is pretty simplistic, so I'd infer that it is not very difficult though it may take some time.

I think you are mincing it too finely and looking for details that aren't going to be given. I don't really expect campaign leadership to state how many books it takes to make a library (though I believe there is 3.0 or 3.5 data on purchasing a library how many books are in it) or whether a portable puppet stage qualifies as a theatre to channel Ms.Piggy... lol

[Markov Spiked Chain]

Steven Ross wrote:

okay - after reviewing Medium in Occult Adventures.

...

Your analysis skipped the Kami Medium, which was a large driver of the initial question, and a lot more limited list, to the point of foolishness IMHO ("Storms" is not a location.)

You also skipped the implications for long term trips, of which there are many. It would be very easy for a GM to say there's no locations available at all after your 4 day trek into the desert. Without guidance from campaign leadership to point to, your character just became a gimpy 1/3rd caster with 3/4 BaB, some haunt related abilities, and probably at least one dead feat (Spirit Focus or a Channel feat, or a casting based feat.) This isn't "doh, no undead, so my Turn Undead feat is wasted" bad, it's "GM won't let my wizard memorize spells" bad.

As long as the risk is there that I might sit down to a table and be told I have to play an incompetent with next-to-no class features, I'm not going to play a Medium in PFS. I don't think anyone else will either if they realize the risk. Which is why I think it needs to be explicitly addressed.

[Luke_Parry]

@Markov: Or, as others have mentioned, simply play a Medium(Relic Channeler), and avoid the problem of needing locations entirely ;-)

[Cao Phen]

Serisan wrote:

Cao Phen wrote:

However, there is an archetype in the book that lets the Medium disregard the requirements of being in the specific location for the Seance.

Would that punish players that chose that archetype by letting everyone waive the location requirements?

There are two major downsides of the archetype:

1. You lose the ability to swap for needs with Hierophant and Archmage spirits, which is something that a lot of people desire with the class.

2. You have not 1, not 2, but 6 bonds to pay attention to.

That is why it questions the need to waive the location requirements of the base class/other archetypes.

A Relic Channeler has to designate what spells chosen, exotic weapon, etc. desired for their lifetime, as well as focus on the 6 bonds in order to not worry about Seance location.

If PFS waives the location, it would simply say that the archetype has no use.

[MisterSlanky]

I sat down at a table I thought was going to have a medium a week ago, and this is exactly what went through my head as I read through the class in prepping for my first ever Occult table. We were running Way of the Kirin, and for those not familiar with the scenario, nearly all (not all but nearly all) of the locations are not present on the godsforsaken rock that the scenario is set on. I actually had to think long and hard about how I was going to handle this. That one situation got me thinking more about a good number of the PFS scenarios, specifically those that have you meet the VC, get on a boat, and travel for 3-4 weeks into the wilderness, or those that start with the words, "as you run to your first encounter to recall back to the briefing by your Venture Captain". In these very much non-edge cases, most, if not all, of the locations specified just aren't available.

Honestly, Mediums (except relic channelers) are an atrocious addition to PFS. In fact, the AT of relic channeler means that in order to preserve the primary ability of one AT, I'm going to have to (as GM) respect the limits of the abilities of other Mediums. I'm sorry to anybody that plays one at my table, but as the original responder said, "expect table variance" and I'd even go so far as to say think very long and hard about playing this class.

[KingOfAnything]

For PFS, the ability to improvise most locations should be assumed, or at least, generously interpreted. I would encourage any Medium players to come up with something that fits their character and treat it more like a deific obedience.

[Serisan]

MisterSlanky wrote:

I sat down at a table I thought was going to have a medium a week ago, and this is exactly what went through my head as I read through the class in prepping for my first ever Occult table. We were running Way of the Kirin, and for those not familiar with the scenario, nearly all (not all but nearly all) of the locations are not present on the godsforsaken rock that the scenario is set on. I actually had to think long and hard about how I was going to handle this. That one situation got me thinking more about a good number of the PFS scenarios, specifically those that have you meet the VC, get on a boat, and travel for 3-4 weeks into the wilderness, or those that start with the words, "as you run to your first encounter to recall back to the briefing by your Venture Captain". In these very much non-edge cases, most, if not all, of the locations specified just aren't available.

Honestly, Mediums (except relic channelers) are an atrocious addition to PFS. In fact, the AT of relic channeler means that in order to preserve the primary ability of one AT, I'm going to have to (as GM) respect the limits of the abilities of other Mediums. I'm sorry to anybody that plays one at my table, but as the original responder said, "expect table variance" and I'd even go so far as to say think very long and hard about playing this class.

IMO, on most ships that you end up riding, you can easily consider the deck to be a battlefield (Champion) and can likely consider the cargo hold to be a maze or treat the mess as a tavern (Trickster). Depending on how friendly the captain is, you might be able to get away with a library (Archmage), as well. You might even end up having an altar to Besmara somewhere on the ship (hierophant).

I agree that GMs should respect the favored location requirement, but there is a degree of leniency that one can exercise at the table.

[Rogue Eidolon]

For all those mentioning relic channeler as a reason to go hardline against normal mediums, in exchange for static spirits, they do get twice as many of the variable choices as the base medium, which is a significant increase and the archetype's main benefit (if you wind up choosing more-or-less the same choices most days, getting twice as many is better, whereas if you are constantly choosing very different options, flexibility is better). I urge you to instead use the FAQ on medium spirit locations as a guide.

[Talon Stormwarden]

Rogue Eidolon wrote:

... in exchange for static spirits, they do get twice as many of the variable choices as the base medium, which is a significant increase and the archetype's main benefit...

Except for Marshal and Guardian, which get no benefit at all. :(

[Rogue Eidolon]

Talon Stormwarden wrote:

Rogue Eidolon wrote:

... in exchange for static spirits, they do get twice as many of the variable choices as the base medium, which is a significant increase and the archetype's main benefit...

Except for Marshal and Guardian, which get no benefit at all. :(

This is because they don't have anything to choose, so they also have no drawback for it being the same spirit.

[Markov Spiked Chain]

I considered Relic Channeler, but it really guts the flexibility of Trickster and Heirophant.

Part of the seeling point of the Medium is being balt to skil monkey up for long journeys, extended challenges, or skill heavy scenarios if combat is generally covered. I really want to be able to say "we're going to explore ancient ruins, and have a solid combat lineup? Cool, I'll make Disable Device a class skill, take Knowledge(History) and Linguistics (Osirion, Ancient Osirion, Azlanti, etc) and cover the archeology. And still be able to swap to Profession(Merchant) or w/e for a Day Job roll.

Similarly, Heirophnat before 6th basically needs to take a cure spell known, or they're not getting anything from their boon. But then at 6th, that Cure spell is dead weight, so they probably have to blow 3k for a new relic. And they can't help clear conditions at the end of a scenario by grabbing (Lesser)Restoration, Remove Disease, Remove Blindness, etc as needed.

[tlotig]

Stephen Ross wrote:

captain yesterday wrote:

I had a Castle Grayskull "Spirit House" when I was a kid.

do you still get messages from the tiny Sorceress?

I know I've heard "I have the power!" at gaming conventions, but usually it involves plugging in a power charger and not a mighty sword or tiger...

okay back to the usual chatter

The laptop is mightier than the sword

[Verek Nightshade]

MisterSlanky wrote:

I sat down at a table I thought was going to have a medium a week ago, and this is exactly what went through my head as I read through the class in prepping for my first ever Occult table. We were running Way of the Kirin, and for those not familiar with the scenario, nearly all (not all but nearly all) of the locations are not present on the godsforsaken rock that the scenario is set on. I actually had to think long and hard about how I was going to handle this. That one situation got me thinking more about a good number of the PFS scenarios, specifically those that have you meet the VC, get on a boat, and travel for 3-4 weeks into the wilderness, or those that start with the words, "as you run to your first encounter to recall back to the briefing by your Venture Captain". In these very much non-edge cases, most, if not all, of the locations specified just aren't available.

Honestly, Mediums (except relic channelers) are an atrocious addition to PFS. In fact, the AT of relic channeler means that in order to preserve the primary ability of one AT, I'm going to have to (as GM) respect the limits of the abilities of other Mediums. I'm sorry to anybody that plays one at my table, but as the original responder said, "expect table variance" and I'd even go so far as to say think very long and hard about playing this class.

This is one of those cases where I, as either a GM or a player, would look at 'intent' of the rule a lot harder than the the literal wording.

In the cases of scenarios like the Murder on the Throaty Mermaid, where no suggested location is available, my argument (from either side of the table - player or GM) would be this. 'A medium channels a dead spirit, and gains abilities from the channeling. So, since people of all walks die at sea/on the road all of the time - there are no shortage of spirits. So, let's roll a die to see what spirits you can contact one and roll a second die to determine their relative strength. If you have location channel, your chances of finding one you want would improve, but still not be guaranteed.' This still confers a substantial benefit for the Relic Channeler, while still honoring the 'Don't be a jerk' and the role-play flavor of the class.

Maybe you really wanted a Legendary Marshal, but your choices today are only a not-so-legendary Hierophant and an infamous Trickster. The specific journey or location you are in would modify which ones I would add weight to. The example below is for the example of how I would handle a sea going voyage.

Base odds: 10% for any given spirit, minimum 5% (see below)

At sea - high likely spirits, Trickster +20%, Champion +20%, moderate likely Marshal +10%, Guardian +10%, low likely Archmage +0%, Hierophant +0%

Player wants a Marshal = +20% for Marshal
Player has Location Channel = +10% for Marshal, +2 for Spirit Strength

Roll 2x 10 sided die for a percentage:
1 - 5% Hierophant Contacted
6-10% Archmage Contacted
11-20% Guardian Contacted
21 - 35% Champion Contacted
36 - 50% Trickster Contacted
51 -100% Marshall Contacted

If they can extend their seance, I would allow a second roll for every additional 1/2 hour of continuous seance for searching for more spirits.

You can even (and justifiably) add a small chance of contacting no spirit - though I figure the chance of interruption sufficiently penalizes this.

As for spirit strength - on a d6
die roll plus Spirit Strength Modifier shows the number of spirit powers available for the spirit they contact. If they only get a Trickster and roll a 1, they have a lesser Trickster with only the lesser Spirit Power available.

This avoids completely crippling the class while keeping with the flavor (and the intent) in my opinion.

[Fromper]

This thread is two years old. Over a year ago, this FAQ cleared up the main issue here (mostly). Here's the whole thing, so you don't have to click the link:

FAQ wrote:

Medium Favored Locations: The medium class says that spirits can be channeled from any appropriate location, not just from the list of favored locations, but is that true, or can I only channel from one of the favored locations?

As the class says, you can channel from any appropriate location, and the favored locations are just a place to start. There might be times where you don’t have access to all six legends, but a medium, either PC or NPC, should generally be able to access a legend if they can come up with a good conceptual tie between the legend and a location he can find or even set up himself. For instance, a medium could go hunt a deer and then use that location to channel a champion spirit of a legendary hunter.

I have two mediums in PFS (one single class Grippli Fiend Keeper and one that's a single level dip on a martial PC), both of whom stick to the champion spirit all the time. When I play them, I point this FAQ out to the GM, and ask if sparring with my teammates before the seance every day is enough to make my current location a training ground for channeling a champion spirit. Nobody's ever said no.

[Pirate Rob]

On an amusing note, every time we go to Qadira or the Plane of Air my Medium ends up taking the party to the local Nascarpet track.

Sure it's all left turns but it's worth a good hour of entertainment.

[crashcanuck]

Wouldn't this be a good use of Detect Psychic Significance "oh look, you found the site of an ancient forgotten battlefield", etc.

[MrBear]

Fromper wrote:

This thread is two years old. Over a year ago, this FAQ cleared up the main issue here (mostly). Here's the whole thing, so you don't have to click the link:

FAQ wrote:

Medium Favored Locations: The medium class says that spirits can be channeled from any appropriate location, not just from the list of favored locations, but is that true, or can I only channel from one of the favored locations?

As the class says, you can channel from any appropriate location, and the favored locations are just a place to start. There might be times where you don’t have access to all six legends, but a medium, either PC or NPC, should generally be able to access a legend if they can come up with a good conceptual tie between the legend and a location he can find or even set up himself. For instance, a medium could go hunt a deer and then use that location to channel a champion spirit of a legendary hunter.

I have two mediums in PFS (one single class Grippli Fiend Keeper and one that's a single level dip on a martial PC), both of whom stick to the champion spirit all the time. When I play them, I point this FAQ out to the GM, and ask if sparring with my teammates before the seance every day is enough to make my current location a training ground for channeling a champion spirit. Nobody's ever said no.

Here's a question: the purpose of a location is to find a suitable spirit. Fiend Keeper literally has that spirit trapped in their head all day, every day. Why would a fiend keeper need locations?