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In an mainly undead baddy campaign, how will the following plan of action of one of my new players that is looking to play a 10th level wizard affect the undead:
1) The wizard wants to use the spell Unprepared Combatant in round 1 to lower the undead baddy's initiative place in the next round of combat.
2) Then, using the dazing spell metamagic feat, he wants to then cast a spell with this and daze the creature due to lowering it's reflex save by 4.
Would this work on say: Ghouls, Ghasts, Wights, Liches, Vampires and Zombie Lords? Or would Dazing Assault work better as a feat?
Thanks for your grizzled veteran designer wisdom.
Your new wizard will be in for an unpleasant surprise with that tactic:
The undead will ignore the Unprepared Combatant - they won't even need to make a save.
Unprepared Combatant is an enchantment spell, specifcally a "compulsion" "emotion", "mind-affecting" spell.
All undead are immmune to mind affecting effects:
- Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, morale effects, patterns, and phantasms).
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/monsters/creatureTypes.html#undead
My advise is don't tell him/her that until they try and fail, or specifically research the immunities of undead.
As for the "dazing" metamagic - I'm sure many on the boards will disagree with me, but I use the same rule as above - I treat all "daze" effects from spells/sla's as "mind-affecting"
My reason - the 0-level spell "daze":
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/spells/daze.html#daze
DAZE
>>>School enchantment (compulsion) [mind-affecting]; <<<
Level bard 0, sorcerer/wizard 0
This spell clouds the mind of a humanoid creature with 4 or fewer Hit Dice so that it takes no actions. Humanoids of 5 or more HD are not affected. A dazed subject is not stunned, so attackers get no special advantage against it. After a creature has been dazed by this spell, it is immune to the effects of this spell for 1 minute.
Your mileage may vary on the latter ruling regarding "daze".
Hope this is helpful
:)
Rory
As for the "dazing" metamagic - I'm sure many on the boards will disagree with me, but I use the same rule as above - I treat all "daze" effects from spells/sla's as "mind-affecting"
While that's a fair enough houserule, there is nothing to support it by RAW. Just because undead are immune to one thing that causes the dazed condition doesn't mean they're immune to everything that causes the dazed condition. The dazing spell metamagic doesn't make the spell mind-affecting, and if it doesn't say it's mind-affecting then it isn't.
Same deal with negative levels, by the way. Undead are immune to energy drain but not negative levels. This means that they take the normal penalties for wielding holy weapons since the negative levels imparted by a holy weapon wielded by an evil creature are not an energy drain effect.
I disagree with one aspect of rweston's advice: allow the wizard to realise how undead work. If the player is new, simply tell them. If they are experienced in Pathfinder, make them roll their knowledge skill and see how much information their character should know.
As for the "dazing" metamagic - I'm sure many on the boards will disagree with me, but I use the same rule as above - I treat all "daze" effects from spells/sla's as "mind-affecting"While that's a fair enough houserule, there is nothing to support it by RAW. Just because undead are immune to one thing that causes the dazed condition doesn't mean they're immune to everything that causes the dazed condition. The dazing spell metamagic doesn't make the spell mind-affecting, and if it doesn't say it's mind-affecting then it isn't.
Same deal with negative levels, by the way. Undead are immune to energy drain but not negative levels. This means that they take the normal penalties for wielding holy weapons since the negative levels imparted by a holy weapon wielded by an evil creature are not an energy drain effect.
Actually - don't actually treat ALL daze effects from spells can sla's as if they were mind effecting - if the source of the "daze" condition is from, say a physical battering effect ("the mighty blow from this creature dazes anyone who fails a fort save, DC xx...") then I would have undead make the save.
And the other folks above are correct - it's a houserule, there is nothing I can see in the rules that says undead are immune to the "dazed" condition.
:)
Rory