Have Fizzbang be sure to take that feat where he can make a Ride check in place of Kragthor's saving throws.
Edit#1: Indomitable Mount
I hear Barbarian Half-orcs have terrible Reflex and Will saves.
Edit#2: I almost forgot. If Fizzbang is a Sohei, then Kragthor can benefit from his Ki powers as well, including Evasion.
Just 1 level and Fizzbang can take Trick Riding, possibly preventing Kragthor from getting hit twice a round.
It's craziness like this that has my players wanting to actually do this.
I'm amazed to discover that there are apparently no rules stopping this.
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Have Fizzbang be sure to take that feat where he can make a Ride check in place of Kragthor's saving throws.
Edit#1: Indomitable Mount
I hear Barbarian Half-orcs have terrible Reflex and Will saves.
Edit#2: I almost forgot. If Fizzbang is a Sohei, then Kragthor can benefit from his Ki powers as well, including Evasion.
Just 1 level and Fizzbang can take Trick Riding, possibly preventing Kragthor from getting hit twice a round.
It's craziness like this that has my players wanting to actually do this.
I'm amazed to discover that there are apparently no rules stopping this.
And I posted those examples as craziness.
What constitutes a "Mount" is incredibly hard to pin down, though. Horses are obviously mounts. People obviously aren't. But how do you define that in game?
A creature ill-suited to be a mount imposes a -5 on its master's Ride checks. Ok, cool. So things like Snakes, Giant Slugs, and People probably fall under that category. Doing crazy combos like using Mounted Combat to protect your buddy will be less effective. But at higher levels that penalty is easy to mitigate.
And, even if an FAQ or Blog came out preventing such shenanigans, it still wouldn't prevent riding a Wildshaped Druid. Unless you're broad in defining "ill-suited mount" to include all creatures that aren't trained to be ridden, which even a Druid couldn't qualify for.
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So Claude your saying that if I'm riding lets say a giant eagle INT 10, that if for reasons of its own intelligance it refuses to go where i tell it that it ceases being a mount?
As for combat training that means that any non-animal mount is suffering A dc 20 check for riding in combat.
No, if you read my post (apparently for the first time, as you obviously didn't read it before you responded to me), you'll see that I made absolutely no mention of intelligence. My arguments were based on the "mount" being controlled by another person--not you, and that the "mount" lacked the prerequisite skills to be a combat-trained mount.
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What is there to stop a gnome from riding a half-orc as his mount?The smell.
If a horse can take it, a half-orc can take it.
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Have Fizzbang be sure to take that feat where he can make a Ride check in place of Kragthor's saving throws.
Edit#1: Indomitable Mount
I hear Barbarian Half-orcs have terrible Reflex and Will saves.
Edit#2: I almost forgot. If Fizzbang is a Sohei, then Kragthor can benefit from his Ki powers as well, including Evasion.
Just 1 level and Fizzbang can take Trick Riding, possibly preventing Kragthor from getting hit twice a round.
It's craziness like this that has my players wanting to actually do this.
I'm amazed to discover that there are apparently no rules stopping this.
And I posted those examples as craziness.
What constitutes a "Mount" is incredibly hard to pin down, though. Horses are obviously mounts. People obviously aren't. But how do you define that in game?
A creature ill-suited to be a mount imposes a -5 on its master's Ride checks. Ok, cool. So things like Snakes, Giant Slugs, and People probably fall under that category. Doing crazy combos like using Mounted Combat to protect your buddy will be less effective. But at higher levels that penalty is easy to mitigate.
And, even if an FAQ or Blog came out preventing such shenanigans, it still wouldn't prevent riding a Wildshaped Druid. Unless you're broad in defining "ill-suited mount" to include all creatures that aren't trained to be ridden, which even a Druid couldn't qualify for.
Oh but they could be, you kinky fellow.
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Have Fizzbang be sure to take that feat where he can make a Ride check in place of Kragthor's saving throws.
Edit#1: Indomitable Mount
I hear Barbarian Half-orcs have terrible Reflex and Will saves.
Edit#2: I almost forgot. If Fizzbang is a Sohei, then Kragthor can benefit from his Ki powers as well, including Evasion.
Just 1 level and Fizzbang can take Trick Riding, possibly preventing Kragthor from getting hit twice a round.
It's craziness like this that has my players wanting to actually do this.
I'm amazed to discover that there are apparently no rules stopping this.
Kind of makes me want to build a tiny ranged sohei PC who rides around on a large melee PC. Oh wait...
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Kind of makes me want to build a tiny ranged sohei PC who rides around on a large melee PC. Oh wait...
I am Groot.
No, if you read my post (apparently for the first time, as you obviously didn't read it before you responded to me), you'll see that I made absolutely no mention of intelligence. My arguments were based on the "mount" being controlled by another person--not you, and that the "mount" lacked the prerequisite skills to be a combat-trained mount.So Claude your saying that if I'm riding lets say a giant eagle INT 10, that if for reasons of its own intelligance it refuses to go where i tell it that it ceases being a mount?
As for combat training that means that any non-animal mount is suffering A dc 20 check for riding in combat.
Let me rephase for you since you missed my point. If my Eagle decides to ignore my actions does it stop being a mount? If my mount cannot be handle animaled, can it ever be combat trained?
Look to Ferra/Torr from Mortal Kombat X for inspiration as to how much destruction a combination like this could cause :3
Let me rephase for you since you missed my point. If my Eagle decides to ignore my actions does it stop being a mount? If my mount cannot be handle animaled, can it ever be combat trained?No, if you read my post (apparently for the first time, as you obviously didn't read it before you responded to me), you'll see that I made absolutely no mention of intelligence. My arguments were based on the "mount" being controlled by another person--not you, and that the "mount" lacked the prerequisite skills to be a combat-trained mount.So Claude your saying that if I'm riding lets say a giant eagle INT 10, that if for reasons of its own intelligance it refuses to go where i tell it that it ceases being a mount?
As for combat training that means that any non-animal mount is suffering A dc 20 check for riding in combat.
If your Mount start to think and act like you are a oddly looking backpack. Yes then it stops being a Mount and you become someone on its back until you regain control.
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My last thoughts on the topic:
Pathfinder is a fantasy Pulp system. There are plenty of examples of this combo in pulp, therefore the system should support it in the interest of correctly emulating the genre. By all means there should be a -5 penalty, but beyond that, relax, kick back, and let the rule of cool run free.
And if you are the GM, consider that you now have both of the party's primary tanks locked down to a single 5' square, and the rest of the party's less capable combatants completely unshielded by them. Design lots of wide open floor plans and use creatures which high movement speeds... (And give your caster's create pit and hold person, now you get two for one.)
If your Mount start to think and act like you are a oddly looking backpack. Yes then it stops being a Mount and you become someone on its back until you regain control.Let me rephase for you since you missed my point. If my Eagle decides to ignore my actions does it stop being a mount? If my mount cannot be handle animaled, can it ever be combat trained?No, if you read my post (apparently for the first time, as you obviously didn't read it before you responded to me), you'll see that I made absolutely no mention of intelligence. My arguments were based on the "mount" being controlled by another person--not you, and that the "mount" lacked the prerequisite skills to be a combat-trained mount.So Claude your saying that if I'm riding lets say a giant eagle INT 10, that if for reasons of its own intelligance it refuses to go where i tell it that it ceases being a mount?
As for combat training that means that any non-animal mount is suffering A dc 20 check for riding in combat.
So my giant eagle (which can't talk btw) has a better spot check than me. I direct it to fly over an enemy encampment because it looks clear . It sees a hidden archer and refuses trying to steer us away from it, however the enemy sees us and takes a shot hitting my eagle. Am I allowed to make a ride check to negate the hit on my mount? Or am I not because my eagle decided to wing away instead of listening. And this still doesn't answer the question of how non-animals can get combat training.
so... i'm in the interesting situation where i want to be the mount (and yes i'm of the appropriate shape to be a mount easily enough) and use leadership to get a rider... what happens?
shameless bump
I'm going to guess one or two of your players have MKX and are trying to emulate Ferra/Torr in this situation?
People keep bringing up MKX but my go-to example would be Gorc and Pic from Dark Forces II: Jedi Knight. MKX has been out for what, a month? I have no opinion on it but it seems interesting that it's come up multiple times now. Honestly, I'm surprised there aren't more Thunderdome references. ;p
@Bandw2, so long as your GM is amenable, there's no problem there. You're still considered an independent intelligent being but you could follow their lead if it suited you. Of course the GM would play the NPC, and they may not make the same tactical choices you would. If you chose to disregard the NPC's lead, they would have to make the appropriate skill checks to still perform ranged combat, maneuvers, spell-casting, etc.
Ah, must have been behind the youtube links. I've conditioned myself to avoid those, sadly. D:
If your Mount start to think and act like you are a oddly looking backpack. Yes then it stops being a Mount and you become someone on its back until you regain control.
If it's not a Mount, then you're not allowed to share a space. You're immediately thrown off the giant eagle and plummet to your death.
If your Mount start to think and act like you are a oddly looking backpack. Yes then it stops being a Mount and you become someone on its back until you regain control.If it's not a Mount, then you're not allowed to share a space. You're immediately thrown off the giant eagle and plummet to your death.
If that is how you would rule it. I expect you have problems with your game long before the gnome decide to ride around on the elf.
So my giant eagle (which can't talk btw) has a better spot check than me. I direct it to fly over an enemy encampment because it looks clear . It sees a hidden archer and refuses trying to steer us away from it, however the enemy sees us and takes a shot hitting my eagle. Am I allowed to make a ride check to negate the hit on my mount? Or am I not because my eagle decided to wing away instead of listening. And this still doesn't answer the question of how non-animals can get combat training.If your Mount start to think and act like you are a oddly looking backpack. Yes then it stops being a Mount and you become someone on its back until you regain control.Let me rephase for you since you missed my point. If my Eagle decides to ignore my actions does it stop being a mount? If my mount cannot be handle animaled, can it ever be combat trained?No, if you read my post (apparently for the first time, as you obviously didn't read it before you responded to me), you'll see that I made absolutely no mention of intelligence. My arguments were based on the "mount" being controlled by another person--not you, and that the "mount" lacked the prerequisite skills to be a combat-trained mount.So Claude your saying that if I'm riding lets say a giant eagle INT 10, that if for reasons of its own intelligance it refuses to go where i tell it that it ceases being a mount?
As for combat training that means that any non-animal mount is suffering A dc 20 check for riding in combat.
if the eagle is running the show when the arrow comes flying i would not allow a ride check to avoid it no.
But these things are out of the area where we have clear rules.In my game intelligent creatures that want to serve as mounts get a ride skill with some of the same oppotunities. They can negate a hit on the guy on there back and try to keep an paniked rider from falling. But i realize that is house rules and not for everybody.
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If that is how you would rule it. I expect you have problems with your game long before the gnome decide to ride around on the elf.If your Mount start to think and act like you are a oddly looking backpack. Yes then it stops being a Mount and you become someone on its back until you regain control.If it's not a Mount, then you're not allowed to share a space. You're immediately thrown off the giant eagle and plummet to your death.
That's not how I'd rule it. I'd come up with an elaborate series of house rules for intelligent mounts.
(I'm glad I've never had to do this. GMing for normal mounts is hard enough...)
Normally the rider controls the mount's movement and actions. Will the half-orc let his movement and actions be controlled by the gnome? If yes then he should be treated as a mount, but I could see it being boring for the half-orc. If not then he is no mount and by that all the mounted stuff doesn't work.
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I will say - you'd probably be better off with a dwarf mount so that you don't have to worry about ceiling heights.
But yes - it's a disturbingly effective combo. I would make them share a turn like a normal mount (at rider's initiative) - so no full-attacking after the barbarian charges etc.
The real question is... what happens if the half-orc/dwarf mount decides to start riding a horse before the halfling/gnome gets off?
All you need to do to stop that from being a problem is have the enemies use AoE attacks, Cleave (adjacent is defined as anything within 5ft, which you are if you're within the same square) and throw in the occasional swarm. It's not hard to balance.
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See what I want to see is the pair of halfling druids with lance proficiency and mounted combat feats that take turns being each others mounts like this
The timing is creepy; 2-3 days ago I was just thinking about making a gnome abjurer with an exotic saddle to ride fighter types in PFS.
Trying this in PFS is asking for problems. Expect table variations:)
The timing is creepy; 2-3 days ago I was just thinking about making a gnome abjurer with an exotic saddle to ride fighter types in PFS.
same or just about, it's why i asked my slightly relevant question.
SYNCHRONICITY
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What constitutes a "Mount" is incredibly hard to pin down, though. Horses are obviously mounts. People obviously aren't.Really? If an imp is sitting on a wizard's shoulder with a tiny crossbow and the wizard moves does the imp not take the mounted combat archery penalties?
If the wizard doesn't run or take a double move, no. There is no penalty for archery on a mount that takes a normal move action.
It's Master Blaster from Mad Max.
This reminds me of the dwarf riding on the barbarian in Golden Axe: Revenge of Death Adder.
I do not believe there is one. Isn't an ostrich a standard mount available to a druid?
If the question has to be asked, the half-orc in question, is without honor, and should end his life immediately for such a disgraceful submission!
I have zero advice for you on this- but, I just have to say thank you for the visual!
It makes me think of a cooler, and crazier version of Bran riding on Hodor's back in a basket on Game of Thrones.