
Bane 09 |
Attempting to make a Zen Archer monk and had a quick question about the bow. As I was reading about the com. Longbow it states in the core book:
All composite bows are made with a particular Strength rating (that is, each requires a minimum Strength modifier to use with proficiency). If your Strength bonus is less than the strength rating of the composite bow, you can't effectively use it, so you take a –2 penalty on attacks with it. The default composite longbow requires a Strength modifier of +0 or higher to use with proficiency. A composite longbow can be made with a high strength rating to take advantage of an above-average Strength score; this feature allows you to add your Strength bonus to damage, up to the maximum bonus indicated for the bow. Each point of Strength bonus granted by the bow adds 100 gp to its cost. If you have a penalty for low Strength, apply it to damage rolls when you use a composite longbow.
So if I am reading it right a strength modifier of +2 would be 300gp? And if so then I add my strength to damage? BTW I will have a +2 strength modifier.
Thank you.

Mysterious Stranger |

Adaptable is a property you can get on a magic bow that allows the bow to adjust the STR of the bow to your current STR. Its cost is a flat 1000 GP, but the bow needs to be at least a +1 bow before adding the property. It is pretty much assumed that any archer who can afford it will purchase it. This way if your STR goes up, or down the bow adjusts.

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I've got a ZAM as you call it so I'll help you out. I think you're going to want more Con than you have. So of those two I'd probably pick Dwarf (swap out the Stonecunning Racial Trait for Rock Stepper)
The stats I would have for the dwarf would be
str 15
Dex 15
con 12
int 10
wis 18
Cha 5
If I were you, I'd use the following Array:
STR:12 DEX:16 CON:14 INT:10 WIS:18 CHA:5What you lose: +1 DMG, 23lbs of carrying capacity (you can gain 7 back with a MW Backpack)
What you gain: +1 Hit at 1st Level, +1 AC, +1 HP/lvl, +1 Fort, +1 Ref, +1 Initiative
Also take Qinggong Monk archetype as it stacks with Zen Archer and you'll enjoy some of the abilities you have the option to swap out for.
You might also want to pick up either the Dangerously Curious or Arcane Archivist traits so you'll be able to use wands easier.
Your first 2 PP should be used for a Wand of CLW of course. The second should be used for a Wand of Mage Armor (+4 AC) that'll bring up your AC to 21.
At Level 4 (+1 AC Bonus) switch out slow fall for the qinggong power Barkskin. Your new buffed AC is now 25, if you've grabbed a ring of deflection and maybe dodge (as your bonus feat) your AC is now 27. Your HP is 35. Saves will be Fort: +7 Ref: +8 Will:+9
You'll be a really hard nut for enemies to crack

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Shooting them with lots of arrows? I think if you look around you'll find a couple guides to the Zen Archer. Get clustered shots to overcome DR, grab deliquscent gloves. Honestly it's really easy to do lots of damage with archery. I don't recommend gravity bow, I dont think it makes sense from an action economy standpoint.

Bigguyinblack |

Deliquescent Gloves only work on natural attacks or unarmed strikes. They won't help with the bow.
As for damage Str 14 is a good start. Since your Flurry treats you as full BAB when using it you deal Deadly Aim damage at the same rate as the Fighter. I put Holy on my bow but Accuracy can be an issue so doing straight bonus is a good option. Personally I went 8 levels of ZA for the extra attack then 3 levels of Fighter (Weapon Master) So that Gloves of Dueling adds +3 to hit and dmg.
At 11th level with Str 14 and Wisdom 24 with my items being a +1 Holy Bow, Bracers of Archery Lesser and Gloves of Dueling my attack routine is:
Counting Deadly Aim but no buffs or PBS
19/+19/+14/+14/+9 for 1d8 +14 19-20 x3 (Improved Critical)
Since I have 13 Ki and at high levels there is usually at least one haster at the table a more realistic routine is start within 30 feet of the target and:
+21/+21/+21/+21/+16/+16/+11 for 1d8 +15 19-20 x3
Toss in 8 uses of Perfect Strike.
Seems impressive but in 7-11s a lot of enemies have AC far above 20. But with 7 attacks a round it is easy to convince your allies you are a good target for buffs.
And I second the idea of getting Clustered Shots. I'm amazed there was a point where I didn't think it was worth it.
And buy the Alchemical handbook for Durable arrows.

Durngrun Stonebreaker |

DELIQUESCENT GLOVES
Price 8,000 gp; Aura moderate conjuration; CL 7th; Weight1 lb.
These heavy leather gloves ripple and flows at the wearer's command, reshaping to fit any hand, claw, tentacle, or alien limb. The wearer's melee touch attacks with that hand deal 1d6 points of acid damage. If the wearer uses that hand to wield a weapon or make an attack with an unarmed strike or natural weapon, that attack gains the corrosive weapon special ability.
The wearer's gloved hand is protected from the acid ability of oozes, allowing him to use that hand to attack oozes with unarmed strikes or natural attacks without risk of harm from contact with the ooze. These unarmed strikes and natural attacks never cause an ooze to split.
CONSTRUCTION REQUIREMENTSCost 4,000 gp
Craft Wondrous Item, acid arrow, summon monster V

Bigguyinblack |

My mistake. Dueling Gloves gives me +2 to Hit and damage so are better for me but for a straight ZAM Deliquescent Gloves are a good choice.
Though the bonuses vs Disarm and Sunder you get from Dueling Gloves and Weapon Master have come up. One of my favorite moments was the GM asking "A 39 Disarms you right?" me: "No." :)

Bigguyinblack |

Save up the 8,000 gold for the item then buy it. You do have to own the Ultimate Equipment book and you have to have enough Fame to buy an item worth 8,000 GP. The only use for most items on the cert is buying them before you have enough fame or items with less then max charges. Like a wand of Lesser Restoration with 9 charges for example.

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Why the focus on dex? After level 3 it is a marginal stat that Can do fine with 12 or 14. Focus should be on wis, str, con, dex and int=cha in that order.
Well honestly it's the fact that you need to get to level 3 for that to happen. So having a BAB+3 vs a BAB+2 to hit is nice for those starting levels (especially as you'll be taking the -2 penalty from flurry) as are the increases to your AC, your Reflex Save, and acrobatics/escape artist.
I could see rebuilding after Level 1 to focus more on strength, but the only thing strength does for a zen archer is carrying capacity (which typically isn't an issue since you don't wear armor), +1 damage, and climb and swim checks. I think there are plenty of easy ways to get +1 damage, compared to the more limited ways a monk can grab AC.
For PFS, I always find that Int is pretty nice to have for Skill points. I wouldn't try to get a bonus, but a penalty will be hard to swallow as you're going to want to keep at least 3-4 maxed: acrobatics, UMD, perception, and sense motive (Judicious use of which can make it very useful). Plus bonuses here and there to other skills it's nice to have a rank or two in (diplomacy, fly, climb, escape artist, swim, etc). So Int>Cha

Cap. Darling |

Cap. Darling wrote:Why the focus on dex? After level 3 it is a marginal stat that Can do fine with 12 or 14. Focus should be on wis, str, con, dex and int=cha in that order.Well honestly it's the fact that you need to get to level 3 for that to happen. So having a BAB+3 vs a BAB+2 to hit is nice for those starting levels (especially as you'll be taking the -2 penalty from flurry) as are the increases to your AC, your Reflex Save, and acrobatics/escape artist.
I could see rebuilding after Level 1 to focus more on strength, but the only thing strength does for a zen archer is carrying capacity (which typically isn't an issue since you don't wear armor), +1 damage, and climb and swim checks. I think there are plenty of easy ways to get +1 damage, compared to the more limited ways a monk can grab AC.
For PFS, I always find that Int is pretty nice to have for Skill points. I wouldn't try to get a bonus, but a penalty will be hard to swallow as you're going to want to keep at least 3-4 maxed: acrobatics, UMD, perception, and sense motive (Judicious use of which can make it very useful). Plus bonuses here and there to other skills it's nice to have a rank or two in (diplomacy, fly, climb, escape artist, swim, etc). So Int>Cha
Well at level 1 str wont matter shooting since the bow is gonna be a normal one, but i must admit that my zen archer was just hitting things with a quarter staff until level 3. I think damage is more important than AC for a archer. And generally for a guy that is expectet to do damage. But at level 9 he dont mind having dex 12 and loves his str 16.
i dont think this is PFS since the OP asked if tengu was a good way to go.Edit: i am not saying dump int and cha but for the archer part of the build they dont matter.

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It's for PFS (OP mentions it in posts 6 & 18). Tengu is a legal race for PFS without a boon (The list is currently: Dwarves, Elves, Humans, Half-Elves, Halflings, Half-Orcs, Kitsune, Nagaji, Tengu, & Wayang)
It's hard for me to separate the point buy from a whole character consideration and just put it on the combat portion.
I played mine as an archer from session 2 on (session 1 I was trying out a ninja). He did really good damage in those levels because of not having to move more than a 5 foot step, and if he needed to melee (mostly for AoOs) he just unarmed struck (though he carried a dagger, always carry a dagger). At most of the PFS tables I've sat at he has the highest AC and best saves, and since he doesn't provoke now he doesn't mind taking point if has to protect the squishier PCs. My only wish was that Bracers of the Falcon were a PFS legal item. I also don't mind doing a little less damage as I don't want to steal all the combat glory.

Cap. Darling |

It's for PFS (OP mentions it in posts 6 & 18). Tengu is a legal race for PFS without a boon (The list is currently: Dwarves, Elves, Humans, Half-Elves, Halflings, Half-Orcs, Kitsune, Nagaji, Tengu, & Wayang)
It's hard for me to separate the point buy from a whole character consideration and just put it on the combat portion.
I played mine as an archer from session 2 on (session 1 I was trying out a ninja). He did really good damage in those levels because of not having to move more than a 5 foot step, and if he needed to melee (mostly for AoOs) he just unarmed struck (though he carried a dagger, always carry a dagger). At most of the PFS tables I've sat at he has the highest AC and best saves, and since he doesn't provoke now he doesn't mind taking point if has to protect the squishier PCs. My only wish was that Bracers of the Falcon were a PFS legal item. I also don't mind doing a little less damage as I don't want to steal all the combat glory.
I dont say to just look at point buy for combat but the OP came here for archer advice so if he want to dump his cha to 5 i wont tell him it is wrong.
Ok PFS it is then. I missed the tengu being allowed there.The str vs dex discussion is for me clear in that i at higher levels Will want a str belt more badly than a dex one. But i prefre one with both:)
And pehaps i missed some good archery time at level 1-2 i dont know. It seemed to make sense that a dwarf Master archer wouldent shoot until he felt ready:)

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I dont say to just look at point buy for combat but the OP came here for archer advice so if he want to dump his cha to 5 i wont tell him it is wrong.
Ok PFS it is then. I missed the tengu being allowed there.
The str vs dex discussion is for me clear in that i at higher levels Will want a str belt more badly than a dex one. But i prefre one with both:)
And pehaps i missed some good archery time at level 1-2 i dont know. It seemed to make sense that a dwarf Master archer wouldent shoot until he felt ready:)
I think the main problem I had with his proposed stat buys were they had uneven numbers in both strength and dex, and too little con.
I felt differently, that my Aasimar would be building on his already exceptional knowledge of the bow as he gained combat experience (also, you can make that perfect strike ability really count).