witch assistance


Advice


I've done some searching and am asking if somehow I'm missing it...

I'm playing a witch, focus on debuffing. Other than normal class level progression, is the any: feats, items, archetypes, ect. to:

1. Increase the penalty from evil eye hex

2. be able to hex twice in 1 round

3. any other cool, fun, unique shenannigans

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16

1: Malicious Eye would do it if you're a jinx halfling. There's other feats you can take to increase the power of the jinx.


2. Split Hex feat

Silver Crusade

1. Petty Alchemy is right, aside from the standard penalty increase done to Evil Eye at 8, going as a Halfling Jinx Witch focuses on increasing the penalty with Malicious eye, sluggish jinx, (other jinx feats), are the way to go. That said, its a HUGE feat tax.

2. Split hex will let you have your hex affect two people a round, as long as its not a major or grand hex.

3. The witch is my favorite class in the game, they are the best debuffers in the game. My fun shenanigans are getting an improved familiar (Lyrakien/Imp/Faerie Dragon are my favs) and have them firing Ill Omen wands at the enemies.

Dark Archive

<----- original post'r

This is the 1st time I've dealt with a familiar with a character. Do familiars get their own actions? like a whole different character, swift, move, and std action? How does improved familiar give them the ability to use wands?

I chose a Compsognathus mainly for the bonus to initiative. Can this familiar use wands?

I really have NO interest in dealing damage. I'm sort of on a mission to prove to the rest of my group that a character's value does not revolve around dpr, and how effective a support role can be for a party.

Quick clarification I posted my witch, I'm on my 2nd adventure in a PFS game, so still lvl 1. Like any lvl 1 character, mechanics are pretty simple and play doesn't get impressive until at least a few levels have been added. Are there any "tricks, combos, actions, ect" I should be focusing on? I've looked over the guides, but they are pretty generalistic.

Are there any multiclass options I should consider?

Silver Crusade

Unless you are going Winter Witch archtype into Winter Witch Prestige, or for some reason taking the Evangelist Prestige class for Witch, i see no reason at all to multiclass. Getting as many level as possible increases your most powerful abilities (your hexes).

Theres not really any other tricks per say, Cackling Hags Blouse, lets you get a couple rounds of Cackle off as Swift actions so you can move into position.

Compsognathus is a great starting choice for familiars. I always advocate getting improved familiar as it generally makes them a little tougher and more resilient to dying and they come with useful abilities (such as being able to get access to wands and using that all important UMD ability)


I love the witch class, but be careful not to upset your GM with the evil eye, misfortune, slumber, routine every encounter. Let other players have some fun too. Try being the buffer, healer, or primary caster to mix it up. I even liked going into melee with mine. (1 lvl of samurai) my original thought was to be an eldritch knight. LOL

Grand Lodge

Yeah, multiclassing as a witch is a very lackluster option, it halts your caster progression, and the DCs for your hexes.


Splitlip wrote:

I love the witch class, but be careful not to upset your GM with the evil eye, misfortune, slumber, routine every encounter.

Witch class is definitely cool. But, I don't see the point of the misfortune hex in the sequence stated above. The enemy must fail a will save against it for it to work, so why not just go evil eye > slumber?

Shadow Lodge

Tsukiyo wrote:
Splitlip wrote:

I love the witch class, but be careful not to upset your GM with the evil eye, misfortune, slumber, routine every encounter.

Witch class is definitely cool. But, I don't see the point of the misfortune hex in the sequence stated above. The enemy must fail a will save against it for it to work, so why not just go evil eye > slumber?

The reasoning being if they pass, they're immune to slumber for 24hrs, so you want to make sure they fail.

In practice most things will fail if you just open with the slumber, the two rounds of debuffing are only for when you face something truly terrible. And since most of the time the martials will kill things in three rounds or less, it's not usually an effective tactic to spend three rounds to put something to sleep.
I never took slumber as my witch, I preferred to evil eye, fortune/misfortune and then laugh. I picked up a grim lantern at one point for my familiar to carry around and burning hands stuff with. Silly magic items like that can be a fun thing to use improved familars for.


The evil eye -> misfortune -> slumber routine is just a forum misconception. You should normally just open with slumber. You usually open with misfortune or evil eye if you expect the combat to last more than three rounds against a single target -- which honestly isn't very common. In a fight with multiple enemies you are much better off slumbering against multiple targets instead of increasing the chances of it working against one target.

Misfortune and evil eye are more useful for when a) your slumber fails or b) your target is immune to sleep (or you don't want to "risk" instantly ending the combat for whatever reason).


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gnoams wrote:


The reasoning being if they pass, they're immune to slumber for 24hrs, so you want to make sure they fail.

Yeah, but if they fail their will save for misfortune to lower their chances against slumber the following round, they'd have failed against slumber too on that round (if you had used it). Seems like a waste of time to me.


As far as the OP's questions go I'd say leave Evil Eye be and go with Slumber and/or Misfortune. You'll have much more influence on combat. I've just reached level 5 as a witch in PFS and here's what I've learnt:

1) Lead with Slumber unless you know/believe the targets are immune/resistant. That's when you turn to Misfortune. Even one round of slumber is better than cackling your way through multiple misfortune rounds.

2) Misfortune is next best, particularly if you have other casters in your party with Save or Suffer spells.

3) Evil Eye is more of a fall back if I'm up against sleep immune and/or high WIS enemies. It just edges out Good Fortune mostly because your allies can only benefit from GF 1/day.

4) Cackle, Cackle, Cackle. All turns where you've misfortuned must have a cackle.

5) GM's will come for you and given the 30ft range of Hex you will be hit and ganged up on often if your party doesn't protect you. Spacing is important. Your party needs to ensure you have 5ft step options to get out of harms way and for them to fill the gap to protect you.
* A lot of the Witch's spells double up on what you already do so make sure you're not over committing to compulsions, Will saves, etc.

6) Gear wise I think AC and Con bumps are the way to go given you're a GM's first target. Other tricks to generate miss chances go along way.

7) Spells tend to be cast at range or out of combat as you're mostly just Hexing. In the long run I'm building towards Quicken Spell with the plan being to spend my turn doing Quicken Ill Omen, Hex (Sleep/Misfortune), Cackle and 5ft step if required.

8) Healing Hex has been pretty good to free up spell slots from healing and conserve curing wands.

9) I'd also suggest having the odd combat where you don't slumber or misfortune. Why? Mostly to give your GM a break as some will find the witch a frustrating character to have in the game and sometimes it's best to just let your party have their moment to shine. I mostly pick a combat where I feel the challenge is minor and will turn to the hexes if I feel it's things are starting to get out of hand against us through freaky dice rolls.


gossamar4 wrote:
2. be able to hex twice in 1 round

Apart from Split hex there are also ACGs Hex Rods - Rod of Abrupt Hexes acts like Quicken Spell for your normal hexes and Rod of Voracious Hexes gives you an extra Split Hex thrice per day each. In theory you could use both Rods at the sime time to Evil Eye 3 targets as a swift action (doesn't matter if they save or not) and then Slumber all three (with a -4 on the saves).

On multiclassing: As with pretty much every caster, everything that slows your spell progression is bad. Unless you are a Scarred Witch Doctor*, your hexes also get worse, so you lose double.

Quote:
I really have NO interest in dealing damage. I'm sort of on a mission to prove to the rest of my group that a character's value does not revolve around dpr, and how effective a support role can be for a party.

Congratulation, you have made the first step in playing a successfull witch. Or pretty much any (prepared) caster, for that matter. The main damage a witch should do is probably Ice Tombs initial damage (excluding summons, but you probably don't want to do that).

On general tips: The Flight hex is really good, and it can't be dispelled.
For spell selection, the Witches spell list is probably the worst of all full casters', and you get a lot of redundancy. Try not to pick all those "will save or lose"-spells because your Slumber hex does the same with an often higher DC. As with most full casters, divide and conquer (i.e. use battlefield controll and shutdown spells like Blindness/Deafness) and let the martials finish the enemies off.

*A Scarred Witch Doctor can potentially dip into Alchemist and/or Barbarian to boost his CON and therefore his spell- and hex DCs.


use your hexes for single target control
use your spells for aoe control

a lot of people have spoken about will save redundancy, but do keep in mind, that aoe will saves are good spells to pick since most of the hexes are single target.

also, will saves that arent mind affecting are also good since slumber is mind affecting.

boost your knowledges high, the moment you use slumber or mind affecting, on a sleep/mind affecting immune creature is a whole turn lost.

as for hexes:
misfortune is great because it affects ANYTHING.
Slumber is great but mind affecting, and vs lots of intelligent opponents that may wake up their ally in the exact immediate initiative count, it can be countered (although still detrimental)
Keep in mind that some creatures are vulnerable to mind affecting but not sleep, most importantly dragons.

Soothsayer is an excellent hex. at the very least, it means your misfortune doesnt start at your initiative count, so it lasts at least until your next round, including it. That means, that even without cackle, a soothsayer-misfortune, means the target's saves and etc vs you are affected by it. At the very best, if you guess when a big battle is coming up and use fortune on all of your allies before it, it may mean up to 5-6 "free" standard actions during the combat.

a mount is priceless for a witch, because this way you can both maneuver and keep cackling

animal skin is also godly. Apart from the sheer utility of turning to any animal you want at will, most of your hexes (all except cackle?) can be used in any form, even without hands, language producing mouth and etc. Keep yourself out of harm by appearing like a harmless diminuative animal and keep hexing opponents without anyone knowing it's you.

a wand of ill omen for an improved familiar really helps with the action economy. with a rod of quicken hexes, you can do something like: familiar: ill omen, swift action evil eye, standard action slumber/agony/saveorlose, move action cackle/retreat/get in position
that would effectivly give a "roll double save keep worse, with a -4 penalty on both rolls, or lose the combat, on turn 1" hell, it can be even done in a surprise round if you start close enough.

you are still a 9th lvl caster. quicken spell is a must have feat. even for simple things like quicken-hexvulnerability on your allies to recast fortune on one of them.

evil eye is, imo, not that great, but it's godly vs high will save opponents, as well as when your party wins the action economy, or when the rest of the party is more defence oriented (longer battles)

evil eye can be safely used outside of combat to harm skills of npcs with noone being the wiser

same as above for charm. while the spell lasts longer, there is simply no way for someone to perceive a hex charm used. so abuse that in occasions that spellcasting would be forwned upon/met with hostility, like an audience with a king!

must have feats imo:
accursed hex
split hex
ability focus (slumber or misfortune)
imp familiar
quicken spell
crafting (if allowed)

Silver Crusade

I like Amplified Hex from the Advanced Class Origins :D


Skyler Malik wrote:
I like Amplified Hex from the Advanced Class Origins :D

The range otr duration increase is nice.

There is alsipo spirit talker feat which is simply amazing.

I wouldn't say that they are necessary though


I like cherry picking one level of cleric with chaos domain, luck domain, channel and extra Orins.

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