Flamboyant Arcana:the magus gains the derring-do and
opportune parry and riposte deeds from the swashbuckler's
list of deeds. The magus can spend points from his arcane
pool as panache points to use these deeds and any other deeds
he gains from the deed arcana.
This with the spontaneous magus archtype has possibilities. Not to happy with how the swashbuckler ended up, this seems better, but it does use spells.
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Yeah... It really isn't very difficult to "outswashbuckler" the Swashbuckler. The class is a mess.
I'd take a Bard, Magus, Inquisitor, Slayer, Ranger, Urban Barbarian or Daring Champion Cavalier with Dervish Dance over a Swashbuckler any day of the week and twice on sunday.
Dawnflower Dervish Bard (or Archaeologist Bard) also works if you interpret "Battle Dance" as "Buckling Swashes".
Anything with spells > anything without spells, with rare exception.
BTW, marginally on-topic, what is the spont. magus called?
Wait, the ACG adds a spontaneous Magus? How didn't I notice that?
Yeah, it does, but it's not great (you lose spell recall and have to spend arcana to use a bloodrager-esque "eldritch focus" ability to use spell combat).
I was hoping for an archetype as simple as "bard spells per day/known progression, class abilities and spells use Cha, not Int". It's more complicated than that, and a bit of a pain in the rear. I'd have been happy without spell recall, but with a minor bloodline ability. The eldritch focus thing really shot the archetype in the foot.
Yeah, it does, but it's not great (you lose spell recall and have to spend arcana to use a bloodrager-esque "eldritch focus" ability to use spell combat).
I was hoping for an archetype as simple as "bard spells per day/known progression, class abilities and spells use Cha, not Int". It's more complicated than that, and a bit of a pain in the rear. I'd have been happy without spell recall, but with a minor bloodline ability. The eldritch focus thing really shot the archetype in the foot.
Check out the Cabalist 3pp archetype on the OGC site. Basically does this.
This goes into some RAI vs RAW crap, but I don't think your Magus levels count as swashbuckler levels for anything other then meeting the requirements, which would make precise strike add 0 damage. There's also the fact you can't regain arcane pool points like a swash regains panache, but I can't say I've spent enough time with either class to know how much of an issue this might be though(though if you are just getting 0 point cost deeds, just don't spend all your points).
Also as a Cha based class Eldritch Heritage is a possibility.
Regards,
DRS
And CHA to all saves, with an appropriate dip (or the right race)! And of course don't forget to worship Arshea so you can add your CHA to AC. (Or dip Oracle for nature/lore/lunar mystery, but you should have a good Dex. I mean Noble Scion is a thing to but...)
Thing about a Magus "swashbuckler" is you're using Arcana to fuel those deeds. A Swashbuckler can restore her Panache throughout the day by doing appropriate things. Have I missed something crucial? Can the Magus restore his Arcana pool?
Not that high, brother. At least, not in my estimation. And not for what we're talking about.
Thing about a Magus "swashbuckler" is you're using Arcana to fuel those deeds. A Swashbuckler can restore her Panache throughout the day by doing appropriate things. Have I missed something crucial? Can the Magus restore his Arcana pool?For 99 percent of Magi, the answer is no. The few exceptions are 19th level Bladebound magi. and munchkins with way root.
I don't see how using wyroot for its intended purpose is munchkinning. Can someone elaborate?
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I don't see how using wyroot for its intended purpose is munchkinning. Can someone elaborate?Thing about a Magus "swashbuckler" is you're using Arcana to fuel those deeds. A Swashbuckler can restore her Panache throughout the day by doing appropriate things. Have I missed something crucial? Can the Magus restore his Arcana pool?For 99 percent of Magi, the answer is no. The few exceptions are 19th level Bladebound magi. and munchkins with way root.
Using things that give you an advantage the GM might not anticipate is being a dirty no good munchkin theorycrafter. Everyone knows that.
/sarcasm.
Terbutje!
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Ok, I will address a few things in my OP I did not.
1. No matter what a front liner with bad fort and will is bad, and gimmicky things don't make up for it.
2. I find the swashbuckler to be a very clunky class that has issues, were as the magus does what it is supposed to very well, and giving it a way to be more dashing is easy and hurts the magus not at all.
3. The Eldritch Scion does have its drawbacks, but for a swashbuckler I think most would agree he was a charismatic guy, and this is it, and the bloodrage does not confer the rage, just the level dependant powers from that bloodrage bloodline. Having options for reach, arcanes buffs and anti caster, or any of the other bloodlines when ya want is nice.
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I don't see how using wyroot for its intended purpose is munchkinning. Can someone elaborate?Thing about a Magus "swashbuckler" is you're using Arcana to fuel those deeds. A Swashbuckler can restore her Panache throughout the day by doing appropriate things. Have I missed something crucial? Can the Magus restore his Arcana pool?For 99 percent of Magi, the answer is no. The few exceptions are 19th level Bladebound magi. and munchkins with way root.
Muchkins are the ones that pick up a wyroot club and a bag of rats.
Slightly less munchkin, they coup de grace everything after every fight.
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Thing about a Magus "swashbuckler" is you're using Arcana to fuel those deeds. A Swashbuckler can restore her Panache throughout the day by doing appropriate things. Have I missed something crucial? Can the Magus restore his Arcana pool?
The big deed everyone is eyeing is Precise Strike, which is continuous as long as you have 1 point in your arcane pool.
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I don't see how using wyroot for its intended purpose is munchkinning. Can someone elaborate?Thing about a Magus "swashbuckler" is you're using Arcana to fuel those deeds. A Swashbuckler can restore her Panache throughout the day by doing appropriate things. Have I missed something crucial? Can the Magus restore his Arcana pool?For 99 percent of Magi, the answer is no. The few exceptions are 19th level Bladebound magi. and munchkins with way root.
The problem with wyroot is a badly thought out item. It is better than the capstone ability of the black blade and only cost a few thousand gp.
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Which books are the following thingies from?
1) All of these magus deed-like arcanas mentioned
2) The spontaneous magus (I think someone said ACG)
3) Some people were talking about the importance of CHA. Is it just the obvious with using swashbuckler deeds through feats/arcana, or did someone at Paizo make a CHA-based magus archetype (presumably in the ACG, but I don't think it exists, unfortunately)?
Which books are the following thingies from?
1) All of these magus deed-like arcanas mentioned
2) The spontaneous magus (I think someone said ACG)
3) Some people were talking about the importance of CHA. Is it just the obvious with using swashbuckler deeds through feats/arcana, or did someone at Paizo make a CHA-based magus archetype (presumably in the ACG, but I don't think it exists, unfortunately)?
These are all from the Advanced Class Guide.
The spontaneous Magus archetype is the Eldritch Scion, and like the vast majority of spontaneous casters, they are CHA based.
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Check the Daring Champion Cavalier archetype instead. That really does do a better Swashbuckler than most Swashbucklers, and without spells.
There are questions if the Precise Strike deed does anything at all for either Magus or Daring Cavalier.
Strictly RAW, Precise Strike only counts Swashbuckler levels. RAI, it is obviously intended to work, at least for the cavalier.