That's why we need diversity in our love interests! Who knows what someone's going to go for?I know I never expected "awkward, handsome mongrelman crush" to be a thing in an AP. Glad it is though!
So yeah, absolutely agreed. Variety is extremely important for that.
Variety would make the APs far more appealing. One of the problems I tend to have with them is that they tend to lack it. Male love interests I can throw at the party would be good.
Male and female love interests that include members of unusual races would be even better. Sure, you get hit on by the human or the elf... but are you really going to put up with the goblin's version of love poetry?
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
Male and female love interests that include members of unusual races would be even better. Sure, you get hit on by the human or the elf... but are you really going to put up with the goblin's version of love poetry?
Considering that being on fire is 1d6 points of damage per round, probably not very long.
|
So, fair warning: The background pushes just into NSFW territory.
There's a (rather large) high resolution version that'll be available for a little while. If anyone wants that, shoot me a PM!
SCHWEET.
Yeah, I think she nailed it. :)
For the purpose of the discussion, I really think one thing that can help get some balance is to get some artists that are into men and get them to apply what's appealing to them, and in the case of artists that have been working in the industry for a while, encouraging them to not let "common industry wisdom" about what sells get in the way. (Erik Mona had a recent post about how little that common wisdom really means)
For this piece, I think "whatever you think is most appealing" turned up in the commission and feedback quite a bit* and I believe trusting the artist really paid off.
*okay I did request one of Anoki's signature bits of attire, but I did qualify that with "if you think it would look good". ;)
Also, that blue agate effect is not digital. That's watercolor. :O
|
|
So, fair warning: The background pushes just into NSFW territory.
There's a (rather large) high resolution version that'll be available for a little while. If anyone wants that, shoot me a PM!
SCHWEET.
Yeah, I think she nailed it. :)
For the purpose of the discussion, I really think one thing that can help get some balance is to get some artists that are into men and get them to apply what's appealing to them, and in the case of artists that have been working in the industry for a while, encouraging them to not let "common industry wisdom" about what sells get in the way. (Erik Mona had a recent post about how little that common wisdom really means)
For this piece, I think "whatever you think is most appealing" turned up in the commission and feedback quite a bit* and I believe trusting the artist really paid off.
*okay I did request one of Anoki's signature bits of attire, but I did qualify that with "if you think it would look good". ;)
Also, that blue agate effect is not digital. That's watercolor. :O
O_O
YAISE!!!
Orgy frescoes! I WUV orgy frescoes!
*does little happy hedonistic Daemon dance*
Orgy frescoes! I WUV orgy frescoes!Emotionally respectful and responsible orgy frescoes. ;)
(or bas reliefs)
The best kind of orgy frescoes!
Orgy frescoes! I WUV orgy frescoes!Emotionally respectful and responsible orgy frescoes. ;)
(or bas reliefs)
If there is a such a thing.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
If there is a such a thing.Orgy frescoes! I WUV orgy frescoes!Emotionally respectful and responsible orgy frescoes. ;)
(or bas reliefs)
There is such a thing.
|
|
(Googling NSFW)
No joking on that warning! O_O But man, the sheer volume of those sculptures is beyond stunning. And frankly speaking, they seem to be enjoying themselves a hell of a lot more than Qin's terracotta soldiers.
I think that and the relative acceptance of sexuality in Hinduism was a part of why Anoki suggested some Indian aesthetics in that painting. Really happy with the look that lead to.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I should have stayed awake a bit later last night:
Another PC pic came down too from RA Shina/Repsychus: Ashak-Kenoth, Osirian paladin-prostitute of Lymnieris. Again, NSFW links warning, though this picture itself is work safe. Unless your workplace doesn't approve of half-naked mens. ;)
Paizo, the gauntlet* has been thrown when it comes time for official artwork for Lymnieran characters! >:)
*Not the one you won recently, mind.
*drooools*
My oracle AND my Paladin would totally be into that sexy dude.
Just a note on the topic in my opinion:
I feel the "want" to have genders and interest more or less equally represented, but i am against that they are "needed".
To explain myself i think it would be interesting character points to have some "sexy males" or "transgender person" in the story, but by experience such characters need to be planned and way too often they are made with the quirk as their sole and only character aspect with no actual personality than "oh, that X guy"
So to add variancy to the characters i hope they are planned well and not just slapped the whole "oh he/she is X by the way" and have some fancy art for the teenagers ( or any of us art lovers in general ) to drool at.
Just my two cents, i personally wouldnt mind any of these quirks in iconics or npcs at all, but i want it to be done well and not slapped in there because a minority and their supporters demanded it to be represented.
In general, I agree, but I also feel like a number of the female potential love interests are similarly tacked on. Some are better than others (Nadya of Waldsby, great! (but could it have hurt to mention a male traveling companion or two?) The opening of Serpent's Skull? Meh.)
|
|
| 6 people marked this as a favorite. |
Just a note on the topic in my opinion:
I feel the "want" to have genders and interest more or less equally represented, but i am against that they are "needed".To explain myself i think it would be interesting character points to have some "sexy males" or "transgender person" in the story, but by experience such characters need to be planned and way too often they are made with the quirk as their sole and only character aspect with no actual personality than "oh, that X guy"
So to add variancy to the characters i hope they are planned well and not just slapped the whole "oh he/she is X by the way" and have some fancy art for the teenagers ( or any of us art lovers in general ) to drool at.
Just my two cents, i personally wouldnt mind any of these quirks in iconics or npcs at all, but i want it to be done well and not slapped in there because a minority and their supporters demanded it to be represented.
So, a white character doesn't need any justification to be designated as such, while black PCs/NPCs have to follow special extra guidelines in order to warrant their appearance?
We have to default to White, Heterosexual, Male and make sure any deviation from this norm has a proper reason for this? A planned-ahead reason with plausible justification?
We have to default to White, Heterosexual, Male and make sure any deviation from this norm has a proper reason for this? A planned-ahead reason with plausible justification?
Yes. Because if you don't and the character looks bad you could be accused of racism.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Orgy frescoes! I WUV orgy frescoes!Emotionally respectful and responsible orgy frescoes. ;)
(or bas reliefs)
I prefer my orgies to be higher in relief.
For those folks asking for friendly and welcoming male nymphs, lillends, etc earlier in the thread, I got you all a couple of Christmas presents courtesy of Anoki. :)
I just need to work out the delivery system because nymph-guy is a bit NSFW. Tasteful, but NSFW.
Where have you been?
|
|
Where have you been?For those folks asking for friendly and welcoming male nymphs, lillends, etc earlier in the thread, I got you all a couple of Christmas presents courtesy of Anoki. :)
I just need to work out the delivery system because nymph-guy is a bit NSFW. Tasteful, but NSFW.
Sorting some things out and having serious connectivity issues. The former was rougher. I'll try to catch folks up on it some time once the holidays settle down.
Sorting some things out and having serious connectivity issues. The former was rougher. I'll try to catch folks up on it some time once the holidays settle down.Where have you been?For those folks asking for friendly and welcoming male nymphs, lillends, etc earlier in the thread, I got you all a couple of Christmas presents courtesy of Anoki. :)
I just need to work out the delivery system because nymph-guy is a bit NSFW. Tasteful, but NSFW.
So long as we haven't lost all of our crazies... OK we're all crazy here, but we can't loose all of the Paragons. Yes you are a dwarf now.
|
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
Were Erastil and Fandarra an item way back in Golarion's more primitive era?
Given his interests, it's almost impossible that Erastil *didn't* have a spouse and / or family, at some point, or else he's the big ol' god of hypocrisy, telling everyone else they need to settle down and plant some roots, while he's out there stagging it up. (Although I still hold out that his partner was Cernunnos.)
Although Erastil and Fandarra (or Erastil and Gozreh?) are interesting options as well. Of the male gods, Erastil and Irori seem like the ideal choices for sexed-up images. Erastil may not be Herne or Cernunnos, a god of the wild and virility and male potency, but he's as close as this setting gets. And Irori seems to be all about lean muscles and little clothing, although he seems to have gotten hosed on artistic portrayals, thus far.
Ditto, Pharasma, goddess of childbirth, *must* have a child or two banging around the universe. Perhaps several. Nobody's really clear on Abadar's parentage, or Gozreh's, or Sarenrae's. Could Pharasma be the 'All-Mother' of the gods? Or perhaps a very interesting story as to why not... (Had to give up her own power of creation to become the judge of the dead? Lost that option when undead came into existence with Urgathoa, explaining the grrrhaterade for a goddess who literally doesn't give a moldy fart about her in return? Is actually with child even now, and has been for as long as anyone remembers (millennia, at least), with her due date being 'the end of the universe?')
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
So as I don't write a wall of text, I'll try and keep it simple to say all things SHOULD be fair. I have no idea if they ever will be but it doesn't mean we should ever stop trying to make them so and let our voices fizzle out. I'm a straight man myself but I'm married to a woman who appreciates a smexy man as much as the next girl. She agrees that currently the only male character appealing in her eyes (physically) is Seltyiel. Valeros has had maybe a picture or two she didn't hate but usually something's off for her.
However, as has been discussed quite a bit, tastes are all over the place for women AND men or varying leanings. I'm a weird case where I don't think I have a "type". Female elves can be hot (though some of Golarions don't appeal to me when the eyes get TOO big and bug eyed but luckily not all of their art follows in this direction) but I can like female dwarves just as much and even the half orc lady paizo has isn't bad at all. Size 4 or 24, I don't care though truth be told, most of the smaller sized/thinner types don't appeal to me as much as a healthier form contrary to what I'm constantly told by commercials and ads I should enjoy as a man (ugh and co-workers).
Likewise, my wife's tastes can be pretty fantasy elves to hairy muscular men.
All that being said, it is funny how there are far more ugly men drawings/creatures then female. I also do not agree with the stories behind nymphs and dryads being female only, a thing we've changed in our own worlds/games. I honestly found most of those stories to likely all be male fantasies and wishing to keep it women only for their own appeal.
Bah, still turned into a wall of text >_<
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I wouldn't dismiss art that does not fit one's personal idea of "sexy", or even art that seems "cliche'".
It's a fantasy game, and some want a little bit of cliche'.
I find Imrijka sexy, but then again, I think Marv from Sin City is sexy.
If you feel your tastes underrepresented, then go on to say so, but it is self defeating hypocrisy to dismiss the inclusion of things, that suite the tastes of others.
If one of my players wants to have a chainmail bikini Red Sonja character, or would like such a thing represented in Pathfinder, then why is their tastes, opinions, and desires less relevant?
That doesn't represent an inclusive game.
Some women like to play chainmail bikini characters. And there are plenty of ways to play those: Glamered armor, mage armor, barbarians with DR and natural armor, even monks.
But there's no reason that any of the iconics need to be wearing that kind of thing. (Some of them are actually kinda close.)
Misery, does your wife have an opinion on any of the ACG iconics? I think Quinn, for example (the iconic investigator) is a good-looking older man, with kind of a Samuel L. Jackson thing going on.
Although I still hold out that his partner was Cernunnos.
I think Cernunnos is one of:
1) His son (which fits Cernunnos being depicted as younger, and in his 'wild oats' stage while Dad is in his 'settled down' stage.)2) His brother (same reason)
3) Erastil/Cernunnos is actually one, NG being (stag aspect matching more with Agathions than Archons or Azata). Erastil and Cernunnos are just aspects of the same being.
Is actually with child even now, and has been for as long as anyone remembers (millennia, at least), with her due date being 'the end of the universe?')
What if Pharasma is the mother of the universe itself? When Groetus claims this one, she'll birth another?
Does a child of deity needs to be a deity oneself? Maybe Pharasma is mother of all mortal souls instead?
Does a child of deity needs to be a deity oneself?
Not at all: Look as Lamashtu's brood. But I do think that 'child' and 'parent' with deities are as much symbolic/metaphorical as they are blood relations.
Maybe Pharasma is mother of all mortal souls instead?
I think that's excessively literal, and also puts the jyoti in a weird place. I think it's telling that she's goddess of birth, not of fertility or mothers.
If this were Greece, she'd be a Fate: She spins your thread (birth), measures its length (fate), and cuts it when it has run its course (death.)
Or to use a different metaphor, she's a shepherd. She brings souls into the world, leads them through their lives, and culls them at the end of the season. That makes her a patron of sheep making lambs, but doesn't make her an ewe. (In this metaphor, undead are stubborn rams who won't follow the flock, and those who create undead are thieves.)
Maybe she is a goddess of birth but as a metaphysical midwife - without need to be mother herself to oversee birth? Maybe possibly barren? Forever separated from what she represents?
Another option... Urgathoa is her daughter. They don't speak anymore since Pharasma put her job above her family/Urgathoa showed utter contempt for mom's duties.
It's canon somewhere that Urgathoa was the first mortal to step out of line for judgment, on the basis that dying is for chumps. What gives Pharasma the right to declare that everything dies? (Which makes Urgathoa the first sheep to say "Why do I need to go to the slaughter house?")
On the other hand, Paizo deliberate seeds the canon with conflicting myths, so you could still be right.
|
|
Misery, does your wife have an opinion on any of the ACG iconics? I think Quinn, for example (the iconic investigator) is a good-looking older man, with kind of a Samuel L. Jackson thing going on.
I have no idea what ACG stands for so ... no? Heh.
I know her taste is all over like mine, liking pretty elf dudes as well as more hairy, grizzled men (Bigby Wolf from Wolf Among Us a good example, as well as Thorin Oakenshield as he's portrayed in the movies).
I will also agree to something else you mentioned as my wife actually generally plays female characters that dress in a manner that people would assume a male designed, heh. So I'm not really for taking away any of these things from artbooks but including all types of things as has been repeated.
|
|
Misery, does your wife have an opinion on any of the ACG iconics? I think Quinn, for example (the iconic investigator) is a good-looking older man, with kind of a Samuel L. Jackson thing going on.
I have no idea what ACG stands for so ... no? Heh.
I know her taste is all over like mine, liking pretty elf dudes as well as more hairy, grizzled men (Bigby Wolf from Wolf Among Us a good example, as well as Thorin Oakenshield as he's portrayed in the movies).
I will also agree to something else you mentioned as my wife actually generally plays female characters that dress in a manner that people would assume a male designed, heh. So I'm not really for taking away any of these things from artbooks but including all types of things as has been repeated.
ACG = Advanced Class Guide.
Quinn, the Advanced Class Guide's Iconic Investigator
Looks like a proper gentleman that's been doing rough work for the greater good, in other words exactly like his background information presents him as.
It's canon somewhere that Urgathoa was the first mortal to step out of line for judgment, on the basis that dying is for chumps. What gives Pharasma the right to declare that everything dies? (Which makes Urgathoa the first sheep to say "Why do I need to go to the slaughter house?")
On the other hand, Paizo deliberate seeds the canon with conflicting myths, so you could still be right.
I know that - it partly refers to my earlier question if the child of a deity need to be deity oneself?
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Necroing the thread for this succubus! :D
|
Contributor
|
Necroing the thread for this succubus! :D
I love it so much.
But then... me and pictures of pretty shirtless boys get along well. I also love how convention-defying it is, though. ^_^
|
|
Necroing the thread for this succubus! :D
Uh, technically that's not a succubus. It's an incubus.
Kind of odd that they named the image as succubus when they do have incubus in the game already.
|
|
No it's a succubusNecroing the thread for this succubus! :DUh, technically that's not a succubus. It's an incubus.
Kind of odd that they named the image as succubus when they do have incubus in the game already.
Why do you say that? Succubus are female, incubus are male. Sure, Paizo named the photo but then I ask what book is it even from? Is it a succubus that has taken a male form? Why? If Paizo didn't have the incubus in Bestiary 3 maybe I would take a photo like that out of context as being a succubus, but by the official existence of an incubus... why is that a succubus?
It's a succubus who's taken male form to seduce someone who likes men, I suppose.
|
|
Where is it said that Succubi are female only ? Or Incubi male only ? Come to think of it why would an outsider be shackled to the rule of gender ? It is not as if they needed it for perpetuating their species :-)
It says that in the meaning of the words, now in some stories they ARE one and the same... when in female form it's a succubus when in male form it's an incubus. I don't recall if "incubus" was ever a separate being in D&D before, but it is now in Pathfinder, hence the confusion when they show a male succubus/incubus like demon and call it a succubus. I guess because the Pathfinder incubus doesn't seduce you he just... won't use the r word, but that's what he does. So, maybe that is the difference in Pathfinder enough that they don't have the more real-world mythological definition of incubus/succubus?
Don't know, but as someone who knows the mythology and etymology of succubi/incubi it confuses me.