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Speaking of Adventure Paths: Anyone know of any modules or even non-Pathfinder Fiction set in underworld temples or locales that could be good inspiration?


Looked at the Aquatic Adventures book and it talks about the effects of buoyancy, hypothermia, pressure and the like. Coral can also be harsh and scratchy. What are some other cool water-based scenarios they might need to worry about? A rip tide? Being pushed about by sudden bursts of water movement? Seeking out that tiny bit of an air pocket in the top of a submerged room? What else?


So I'm looking for ideas of things to put into an underwater temple for an expedition of intrepid investigators (sorcerer, druid and rogue)... My players are level 4 and should reach level 5 or 6 by the end of it. I'm going with a bit of an Indiana Jones vibe in terms of adventurous expedition, etc. They're members of the Pathfinder Society and they have a leader with them (NPC) who just wants to chronicle what they find and do some archaeology.

I don't mind vastly over-levelled bad guys if we can treat them as environmental hazards or the PCs can sneak around them (I can always nerf their perception dice pools if needed). The place has been abandoned by most sentients for hundreds of years.

I want the temple to have sections that are submerged, sections with old air (i.e. in time they can't breathe in it) and sections that are safe to breathe (likely with plants to fix carbon dioxide).

I also want to seem beautiful on the surface but when you truly comprehend it you realise just what twisted purposes it is designed for. So it needs to be for a hedonistic people or at least a people that can perceive beauty in a way that is akin to humans. Lovely waterfalls and beautiful blue marble, plants that would devour a person or beautiful altars that steal your skin should you lay on them.

Food that fascinates and muddles the will, grown from strange vines, and meats you can carve from living examples of creatures woven into a web of flesh, that do not die no matter what you carve, etc.

Any particular room designs you think would work? New hazards to throw at them?

Don't worry, they have access to some degree of Water Breathing and I'll be encouraging them to swim down with gear and then camp there.


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I've found that Maphammer, Neutral Party, Czepeku, Afternoon Maps and Tom Cartos have all got some fairly decent maps. Figured I'd share what I've found so far.

And that map book you shared, Graysen, looks pretty interesting! Never heard of map books before but they seem a great idea.


They even named the chickens, collected them all, and returned them to safety. T'was a good adventure! Thank you everyone for your help in this matter.


So I've found a lot of dungeon and forest maps, even a fair few street ones, but not so much shop, workshop, business, government buildings and homes. Does anyone know of a map maker who focuses on urban environments and especially indoor ones for battle maps? Happy to subscribe to a Patreon to nab them.


So I'm looking at some woodland encounters and starting to think up some trap ideas, so I thought it might be a good idea to create a thread where everyone can put up any custom traps they've made! Especially mundane (nonmagical) ones which are often tricky to think up like nightingale floors, etc.

I'll put up mine in a bit. Still working on a few tweaks.


Ravingdork wrote:
Maybe he is illiterate, or has some sort of learning disorder.

I've had this sort of thing at a table and it plays out quite differently. You just remind them of the rules, they accept it, amend their roll and move on. Often they request the reminder / advice in the first place. It's not really very disruptive because so long as they pay attention to the kinds of things they can do, others can advise them of how the mechanics support that.

Hell I've been a GM in systems I didn't know well and with a bit of player support we got through pretty well. You accept what you don't know and that's the key.

It sounds like he's being wilfully ignorant here, attempting to repeat actions after being told and shown that's not how it works. I'd assume he's trying to break down your resolve so that you'll just let him play the character however he wants to play it, rules be damned.


This is all vital information to know. This will certainly be the most serious and important scenario in the campaign.


So one thing I've noticed is that a lot of battle maps of various buildings use anachronisms like hallways, beds, separate bedrooms for everyone and the like in even peasant's cottages and while that's absolutely fine to do (Pathfinder is riddled with anachronisms and is all the better for it), I'm after some more historically accurate designs.

In other words, inns with straw mats in the loft and peasant's cottages that have little fenced enclosures for their livestock in the same building as the families who live there. I just have a lot of fun turning player expectations on their heads when their characters lie down on a hessian wrapped straw mattress! And it helps remind me of other fun things like fleas.

So I was wondering if any of you knew a map maker, map designer or map pack that has urban or rural locations that are pretty accurate and old school in design. Something more Kingdom Come: Deliverance than the Witcher (awesome as they both are).


I love the wizard's pest trap idea! That's hilarious. I also love brainstorming ideas by taking all of the skills for inspiration.

Also I'm definitely ganking that stat block! Here's hoping the chicken wins. I'm gonna add a brooding chicken that has laid an egg, so they have to fight it without killing it.

This will be the most epic session yet! XD

Local prophecy on chicken-finding ... man, there's a whole campaign we could build around this!


Hey folks, figured I'd make a thread as I don't know if one exists already, for those who like making bestiary types or musing on the possibilities. I figured as an unusual 1st level challenge in a game that's starting off rather idyllic, I'd make the PCs have to catch chickens that are all over a little village surrounded by stone walls.

What are some good chicken catching challenges that use various skills? I'm already thinking a kid might have grabbed a chicken and decided to keep it (Diplomacy or Deception roll!)

Does anyone have, or want to make, a 2.0 chicken bestiary entry?


So my PCs have decided to take on Zelmisdria the succubus and her green dragon buddy in the gap between the Herald getting nabbed and being called on to go and fix things. (Wanted them to have some time to get reacquainted with the Worldwound rather than the Abyss). What sort of things should I fill the dragon pile with? And what kind of cool lair could the succubus have? I'll have them fight elsewhere, but finding the lair would be cool so just some descriptive stuff, interesting prisoners, cool evil items, would be great.


J4RH34D wrote:
You will get people's hackles up just by "suggesting" that they are not in full control of their character. Even though no one is a doppelganger people will get pissed off that their character might not be theirs any more by random chance.

This really depends on your player base so I wouldn't discount the idea automatically. There are a lot of players that wouldn't like that, absolutely, but pretty much all of the players I've gamed with would be cool with it so long as it just meant their PC would be tied up somewhere and could come into the game later on.

If you do have players who like to have complete control, rather than randomly assign it (or fake randomly assign it), just tell them that you've pre-organised with one player to have them run a doppelganger. You get the same kind of benefit but the players know everyone has complete control and that nothing was up to random chance.


That giant ooze idea is amazing! I will totally use that.


I'd also be interested in a few people's ideas for armies. :) I like the corpse feaster general, but what about the army itself?


I've seen some people add more military politics in gathering armies and then the issues between armies from contradictory alignments or religious persuasions taking issue with each other, requiring a lot of wrangling.


I just let the players ignore the army's Consumption for the turn that they defeat an army of similar size, to represent the sale of excess supplies and using better replacements from the deceased army.


I'm running it solo with a gestalt monk-bard tiefling who worships Shelyn. There are other main characters but they're Dragon Age style. In other words, helper NPCs who I control in roleplay but he controls in combat.

I did consider a bunch of tiefling and human deserters from CE armies legitimately decide to try and join his kingdom, but they don't understand being good and get it wrong.

Like bringing hostages as a tithe, or having chopped off prisoner hands, or torturing their commanders and burning them as effigies to show their change in devotion.


GM_Solspiral wrote:

Its too extensive, we're talking over 30 pages in word, PM me your email and I'll be happy to forward them to you.

As an aside I will ask for an assessment as I'm considering trying to kickstarter myself into a 3PP eventually (unless I win superstar.) I really want to be a game designer.

Could I have it as well?


So we finished the Curse of the Crimson Throne campaign a few years ago and I thought I could have some fun dropping one or more of Kazavon's relics in the Worldwound that could connect with a Nidalese army who are potential allies / potential enemies. Or possibly a Hellknight army whose leader is quietly using a Kazavon artefact or more. I'm wondering, though, whether those relics can be de-eviled by the Purity Forge and, if so, whether that means that Drezen's future will be one of pilgrimage to de-evil objects?

If not, which my players would accept, what should the criteria be? Only minor artefacts and intelligent items? Should I just make those artefacts Mythic (and all other super evil ones like it) and say that it can't function on Mythic items?


I'm really loving your awesome write ups so far! They're both interesting to read and interesting in terms of changes to the plots. I'm also curious about your thoughts on Wrath, for while most of the problems are mechanics related there are so many epic interesting bosses around that they tend to blur together (a fault due to space constraints) so your take on it would be magical as you weave them all together in an epic storyline!


Yeah, kill an arch demon, expect him to have something pretty. :) I'm nowhere near that point, though, so I've no idea myself.


Scars of the Third Crusade is a good one, though it's not set inside Kenabres itself. Just either reduce the levels on the bad guys or remove the combat elements.


So I've been rolling two random events a week to represent how quickly things change in Drezen and one of the things I rolled up is the following:

New Subjects: A small group of indigenous intelligent creatures joins your kingdom and submits to your rule. Society and Stability increase by 1, Unrest decreases by 1, and your Treasury increases by 1d6 BP (each time you roll a 6, add the result to the total and roll again).

I'm not sure where to go from here. I don't want to introduce new tieflings (as they have enough) and having read The Worldwound Gambit it's highly unlikely most cultists would have the wherewithal to defect.

I've considered having them be ifrits from a nearby settlement (as there's so much lava and thus the possibility of elementals), exhausted crusaders who didn't even realise the Worldwound collapsed and have made it east from somewhere west, exhausted tribesmen who've done the same, or even a bunch of refugees who were held in the slave pits before the main demonic forces from Drezen fled and who were locked up in the caverns, necessitating all kinds of terrible choices.

What do you reckon? Any ideas?


Ooh, I think you can see that I totally want more! :D


It'd be great if they included a variant type of tiefling you could use for fiend-touched gnome and Halfling. While you can take a regular tiefling and say "Oh, parents were elves but tiefling blood dominates," it makes less sense for the small races. I was surprised that they didn't touch on that in Blood of the Fiends. Same for the aasimar!


Wow, I'd love to see some of your random encounter tables as well as some of the plot seeds and histories and information you seeded around the place, like how you handled the wizard's tower or Petrified Library and Greengrave trips.


I added orphans to rescue in Book 2 (http://stwildonroleplaying.blogspot.com.au/2014/11/wrath-of-righteous-new- encounter.html) which won't be everyone's cup of tea.

And for Book 3 I threw in the Tala Monastery (mentioned in the Pathfinder fiction) and Terendelev's Hoard (http://stwildonroleplaying.blogspot.com.au/2014/12/a-slight-detour-and-tal a-monastery.html) as a way to help their own troops and have a respite from demony goodness in the Worldwound by travelling a short way through Mendev.


Yarick, Harg and Jeri seem pretty interesting, especially in terms of how they relate to each other. :)


Technically Pharasma can tell if they will be raised and just keeps them in the Boneyard rather than letting them move on to their final resting place, as once they become a demon or larvae it's hard for them to be pulled out of it. Normally they won't remember the Boneyard, either, but you could either change that fluff or have it that he was granted some insight of his likely fate before being raised.


You seem to do a fair bit of roleplaying with the various generals they have under their command. Do you have any roleplaying notes for them?


I think it really depends on your players. I, personally, would love to be minding my own business and walking along halfway through an adventure and then POW!!! Crazy stuff happens and I'm knocked into the catacombs. Only caveat is that if I got attached to any of the NPCs topside I want a chance to either rescue them, interact with them or have their death make an impact on my character (i.e. wake up to see their severed head lying inches from my own).

I think the Wardstone Patrol and the Scars of the Third Crusade both work well in giving them a real sense of Mendev without building up too much attachment for Kenabres. Also some of the lower level stuff in the Diamond Siege works well for extra encounters to throw into the attack on Kenabres itself.


I'd create a few interesting combat encounters, then, rather than looking at any big scenario or module.

Perhaps throw in a few Hauntings surrounding an old cave / home with a leather flaps on the entrance made from roper skin that used to be the home of a family of Mongrelfolk exiles who just didn't belong. One by one they starved together and left a series of minor hauntings that aren't dangerous but can be resolved by doing small things like laying the child skeleton that is wrapped in rags in it's mother's arms. Things like that if you want something roleplay intensive.

A Giant Worker Ant has gotten separated from the rest and is scouting ahead for food. Best slay it before it lays the trail for more and than bury it's entrance so that the others don't smell it's death and come looking. (Knowledge Nature can reveal the risks and Knowledge Planes could even link its confusion in coming this far away from the rest being an indication of the Worldwound's presence).

A talkative ghoul (looks like an undead Mongrelfolk but with ghoul stats) could try to barter with them, selling odds and ends for valuable items, then getting angry that the deal isn't good enough (or the PCs aren't buying) and attacking.

Alternatively there could be a few defences for Neathholm that have been set off by all of the troubles and must be bypassed. A pair of Giant Flies could have been released from their cages into one of the passageways with a dodgy portcullis keeping it from heading into Neathholm itself. Basically when the wire got tripped, the portcullis falls and opens the cage for the Giant Flies and the wire got tripped awhile ago.

Would these work? And how much XP do they need?


I had Drezen be a little lower than the West Sellen River and had some mages sent out to fill in the Vescavor tunnels so that the dirt dam could be pulled down and it could flow up toward Drezen by making that place a little downhill. It's still not enough to get much of a good flow going and they've dammed just past Drezen so the water doesn't flow into nowhere ... but the water and fish inside it have a much lower chance of taint than anything else in the area.

The Lake would be even better, though, and I've been thinking of what to do with it myself. I'd keep it non-demonic, though. Perhaps some alien city of powerful underwater fae who keep a number of magical beasts as some kind of defense and who serve an immense godling (something like that found in that Thassilonian temple in the Curse of the Crimson Throne).


Yeah, that's a good point. I left the Weapon in the Rift where it is, but then used that as a good excuse for why the bigger demons are still in the Nerosyan area as they're busy trying to wipe out that building. However I can see a good argument for it providing safety for some of the spots further north east.


Maximising hit die can really help when they're up against some of the meatier foes. There's also a really good Pathfinder Society adventure that involves checking on patrolling the wardstones that can be used with just about any adventuring party. Can't remember the title of it off the top of my head, though.


They could be good generals to add to the heads of the armies left behind when Drezen swells to 1000.


They hold less territory and more outposts, turning places like the barbarian's hold into places held by a few paladins and allowing forward patrols a place to stay and survive the weather. While demons can teleport everywhere, there's plenty of small settlements in the western reaches that have survived being literally within the Worldwound due to demonic inattention so a short-term claim to the east while the demons are focusing south makes equal sense.

Also there's been a significant hunk of time spent gathering additional personnel in Absalom via Teleportation Circle to Nerosyan (based off a story hook in the Absalom book stating that a particular woman had set up supply lines like this in secret) and then from Nerosyan to Kenabres due to a Teleportation Circle cast off a scroll and then finally by foot and by barge up to Drezen.

So there's some additional troops who can hold and patrol certain areas, including the rededicated temple and the Harnaste village remnants. Nothing huge, but enough to make it feel more worthwhile clearing the area. When they set off for later Hex Crawls, they can draw by these strongholds, maybe clear off a higher level menace or two, say hello to a few NPCs and then continue on.

Heck, the demons are also smart enough (well, some of the boss ones are) to pull back the higher level folks to encourage the army to spread out. Just throw in some Kithangians to assault the horses, stuff like that. Then they can pick them all off when ready.


There's a few Pathfinder Society adventures that could be useful like the Wardstone Patrol (best as an introductory scenario) and there's one that involves the Pathfinder Lodge in Nerosyan but as it isn't the main lodge it could be easily transported to Kenabres as it's technically a side lodge. Or you could just strip out the actual Pathfinder element of it and just have the contents occur in Drezen. Heck, any dungeon could be dropped in the middle of the various hex crawls to keep folks occupied.


I just made the hex crawls more of a deal, with environmental effects, weather rolls and random conversations during their time en route. Some of the minor battles needed to be plumped out with a few extra things thrown into it and I found my player really perked up when I let him actually claim some of the territory with his military forces rather than clearing turf that will automatically be ceded back to the enemy.


What you could do if it's a very RP-intensive game is let them use the Silver Scales as either medals for their generals or perhaps to bless shrines? Same thing with the Wardstone Shards, now that I think of them.


We've really expanded upon the kingdom building rules with the PC heading off and fetching more recruits to set up some farmland on the eastern side of the West Sellen River; turning the Lost Chapel into a defensive waystation; building guard towers, orphanage, caster's tower and a fountain of purified water in Drezen so far; among other things.

Basically that whole plateau is slowly becoming more civilised, though I keep emphasising how hard it is to maintain it with frequent armies getting sent out, etc.


Hmm, could create a kind of "positive energy" shadow that floats around and gives people heals before finally discorporating.


For me it's not the wealth = power combo that bites, but that players can't have interesting capes and belts and the like because the most logical choices are most often the stat buff ones. And they really are because as a player I tend to get the kooky gear and then be massively underpowered compared to those who grab the Big 6.

My players would love a decoupled system, just because it lets them get more eccentric stuff that's more unique to them, without having crappy saves or attack bonuses because of it.

In short, while some folks are happy getting different versions of the Big 6 (charisma or wisdom or strength this time around), there are plenty who want to get new gear now without sacrificing their own power levels.


Kalindlara wrote:

Nothing (prewritten) comes to mind... but then, I'm not as familiar with the non-AP modules. :)

Pathfinder Society might have something useful. I think I've heard of other GMs running a bit of the festival itself (before the interruption and the fall). Personally, I would write something custom for my group... but then again, I have that kind of time, and others may not. If you do, though, I'm sure we can help you with ideas. :)

Take a look at some of the Pathfinder Society scenarios. There's a few set in Nerosyan that could be re-tooled toward Kenabres. You could also run the Demon Within module, using another party of level 11s, who could then be slaughtered (with player forewarning) during the start of the campaign itself. While that won't embed the characters, it gives the players some investment.


So I'm currently running the "Demon Within" module after adapting it to occur partway through Demon's Heresy. The hourglass basically allows you to take the ashes of the dead, run them through the hourglass, and create Greater Shadows from the ashes that can be stored in urns. The party want to transport this heavy thing to Drezen and use the Purity Forge on it. Presuming they manage to do it, how would its purification operate? I mean, can you pour the ashes / bone dust of the undead through it to ensure they pass on cleanly? Would that work?

Can you think of alternatives?


If this is likely to be a big issue, you could just have a bunch of dretches arrive as reinforcements, keeping the army busy while the PCs fight their way inside as a special forces unit. It won't work multiple times but it will work once to epic effect.

Also, the basement area would likely quickly drive low level folks insane, though paladins would have better odds with this.


Could also have stuff focused on mutilation like "Gore it!" or even Abyssal words themselves might be used since Celestial words don't have enough oomph and because even though its unwise to use Abyssal in a justifiably paranoid land, well, that would also be the draw for using it for swears.

Blasphemy might also be popular, "I-oh-my" as a short form for Iomedae, a part-sword-draw-part-masturbatory gesture performed just to the right of the hip where a sword would be sheathed to indicate the arrogant self-love some folks always accuse paladins of having anyway, stuff like that.


Wow, I really love how you're touching on all of these complex issues. It's very cool!

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