Neither the CRB or NPCC seem to give a good description of what constitutes each NPC type. In the various examples it seems there is a lot of leeway, some characters in roles that dont seem to really fit.
Is there a good breakdown of each somewhere?
While Im at it, how do you decide when to make an NPC one of these categories or assign them a real class? Is it based essentially on your perception of how capable and influencial a given personae might be?
That cleric in the village you stop for the night at... if he has the chance of joining and traveling with you, do you make him a cleric instead of an Adept? Or is that only for the extremely rare heroic types and an NPC Adept/Cleric traveling with your party for a time perfectly normal?
From what I've seen on the forums, I'm a little weird I guess, but I tend to like to cap the npc classes at level 3 or so (though May go higher for the expert npc class), and just choose a normal pc class higher level characters, or for lower level ones that need pc levels it fifth the concept (both mechanically and flavor wise).
NPC classes are all kinds of fun. I tend to make liberal use of them and since CR-wise, you get 2 ncp class levels for each pc class level you give an NPC, you can really make some nuanced characters.
That and I like playing them. I'm probably played more Commoners, Experts and Adpets as PC's then actual PC classes. My favourite was the Epic (21st lvl) game we rand for 10 or so sessions, yup 21st lvl commoner! He was simply a guy that was around this group of very legendary people. They'd send me into towns to actually talk with the locals before they showed up and the locals would fawn over them and do the whole celebrity/royalty treatment.
I thought NPC-classed characters were only worth one CR less than PC-classed characters of the same level...? I'm pretty sure you aren't supposed to match a 40th-level warrior against a 20th-level fighter.
I thought NPC-classed characters were only worth one CR less than PC-classed characters of the same level...? I'm pretty sure you aren't supposed to match a 40th-level warrior against a 20th-level fighter.
I've seen a few different ratios between the two. I don't think a 40th lvl Warrior vs a 20th lvl Fighter would be unfair, should be a even fight 50/50 the Fighter would have so many abilities, all the Warrior would have would be BAB...some feats, but the basic fighter abilities would be denied to him, no weapon training, or armour training, etc. He couldn't even take the Fighter feats, since he's not a fighter and as no ability that allows him to count as one like other martial classes.
I thought NPC-classed characters were only worth one CR less than PC-classed characters of the same level...? I'm pretty sure you aren't supposed to match a 40th-level warrior against a 20th-level fighter.I've seen a few different ratios between the two. I don't think a 40th lvl Warrior vs a 20th lvl Fighter would be unfair, should be a even fight 50/50 the Fighter would have so many abilities, all the Warrior would have would be BAB...some feats, but the basic fighter abilities would be denied to him, no weapon training, or armour training, etc. He couldn't even take the Fighter feats, since he's not a fighter and as no ability that allows him to count as one like other martial classes.
That 40 BAB and 8 attacks are sure going to help and the number of feats is a bit of a wash, as the fighter gets an extra one every other level, and the Warrior has twice the levels. The extra 5 stat pushes are nice, as is the extra 20*(hp per level).
I thought NPC-classed characters were only worth one CR less than PC-classed characters of the same level...? I'm pretty sure you aren't supposed to match a 40th-level warrior against a 20th-level fighter.
The big problem with that is that a Warrior is much more dangerous than a Commoner.
I thought NPC-classed characters were only worth one CR less than PC-classed characters of the same level...? I'm pretty sure you aren't supposed to match a 40th-level warrior against a 20th-level fighter.The big problem with that is that a Warrior is much more dangerous than a Commoner.
..because I can't resist...I'd totally run a lvl40 commoner vs a 20th lvl fighter :) Classic rise of the chosen defender of the common man against the upper class noble champion stamping out the rebellion in the kingdom :)
Hmm, I thought there was a cap on NPCs... like 10 or so?
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The NPC Guide only gives us NPC Classed NPCs up to level 10, which gives the impression that past that point you should be something really impressive (and hence have PC levels).
Generally, the break down is this...
Magically capable opponent who isn't a 'real spellcaster' - Adept
Battle trained guy who isn't as good at it as the fighter - Warrior
Individuals with a mixture of skills and martial skill who are reasonably respectible but have no spellcasting - Aristocrat.
Skill Focused guy who's only focused on skills - Expert
The normal dudes - Commoners.
Aristocrats ironically are like sub-bards without the spells. They have good armor proficiencies (all), good weapon proficiencies (all simples and all martials) and 4+int mod skills.
Quite unsurprisingly, Aristos make for tough NPCs in general. The King has the same weapons as a warrior, his progression on bab is just one level behind, and he's likely got skills to go with his abiliy to whack you. He also has a respectible hit die (d8).
Experts get 8+int skills, and they still have the neat trick of being able to just choose 10 skills that are their class skills.
Unsurprisingly, Aristocrats and Experts can make the leap to PC the easiest of any of the NPC Classes, although its still (strenuously) not recommended.
ok, wierd question here then -
If a player character were to take some time off (perhaps an old fighter settles down to run a tavern for a couple years or is a farmer until his family is wiped out when he is 25 or something) would you award NPC levels? (Maybe give a couple levels in Commoner in the two examples given?)
ok, wierd question here then -
If a player character were to take some time off (perhaps an old fighter settles down to run a tavern for a couple years or is a farmer until his family is wiped out when he is 25 or something) would you award NPC levels? (Maybe give a couple levels in Commoner in the two examples given?)
The rule of thumb I use is that non-adventurers get from one to six XP per day, depending upon "how hard they work." So for example, to go from 6th to 7th level would take the hardest working person 10 years.
So it's not likely.
I generally don't fuss with statting non-combative NPCs. They're as competent as the plot needs them to be.
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The rule of thumb I use is that non-adventurers get from one to six XP per day, depending upon "how hard they work." So for example, to go from 6th to 7th level would take the hardest working person 10 years.
I use 1 XP per day. In a sense, for non-adventurers, that's what an "XP" is - one day's work. They can make the jump from lvl 1 to 2 in a couple of years (3-4), which is like going from apprentice or journeyman to being capable of doing the job on your own. Then lvl 2 to 3 in a little less than 10 years, and 3 to 4 a little more than 10 years - a nice mid-career span, and a few really good folks would make it to 5th level after many years of practice. That's right about where I like the level-span for my world (with PCs being the exception).