Naming worlds; no matter how many times I use name generators, or hell, even just attempt to make up words in my head, they either never sound quite right, or they're actual words we have now. The only way I can comprehend it is using gibberish until you get something vaguely looking like a country name or world. If you don't mind sharing your secrets, from one GM to another; how do you accomplish such a task?
I don't; once, I needed to name a city that, for centuries, had been run by a solar because it housed an extremely important artifact. I named it The City of Angels, only to have a player point out a nickname of Los Angeles.
I suppose my only option is to use real life terms..curses
Trick I picked up from a Famous Author: find a map of a particular area, take a bunch of syllables from it, and shuffle them around. You get stuff that's at least pronounceable, and by using maps of different areas you can get different-sounding languages.
Yeah. Here's a tip, whatever you decide to name something, google it first.
A few have proven truthfully unique; I suppose I just let myself get too frustrated the first time haha. Seemingly absurd names I could've garunteed werent real popped up in other languages. It's insane
Trick I picked up from a Famous Author: find a map of a particular area, take a bunch of syllables from it, and shuffle them around. You get stuff that's at least pronounceable, and by using maps of different areas you can get different-sounding languages.
....Huh, that's actually a really good idea. Simple enough too! I'll see how it goes
I google, "odd city names" and look at real life places with odd names, mix and match as needed, a quick search got these sites.
http://www.thealmightyguru.com/Pointless/Cities.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Unusual_place_names
While they are "real places" most have never been heard of and have "fantasy names" or if you take 1 word from one and 1 from another..well you get the idea
When it comes to naming things you should consider what the guy who wrote DM of the Rings said on the subject.
"Nobody wants to play a campaign with Emperor Fred or High Chancellor Gary, and so the usual approach is to give everyone high fantasy names like King Geon’ai, Sir Lua’an-Eradin, or Lady Alaain Mera-Dovrel. You know, strange and fantasy-ish. Of course, this means the names will all be unpronouncable, difficult to spell, and easily confused. For fun, have your players describe the plot of your campaign after it’s over. I promise it will sound something like this:
The dragon guy with that black sword was oppressing the people that lived on those hills. Then that one king with the really long beard got that one chick with the crazy hair, and she went to that one lake. Then she got corrupted by that curse thing that made her attack that group of guys we found dead. You know, the ones that had that +1 sword and the bag of holding? Once we broke her curse she told us about the dragon guy and gave us that thing. And the map. Then we found the dragon dude and kicked his ass.
It’s like living in a word without proper nouns. I’ve always wanted to make a campaign like this:
The Dark Lord Walter, wielder of the Black Sword of choppery, was opressing the peoples of Pittsburgh. Then King George Washington enlisted the help of the Warrior Princess Rapunzel. Sadly, in the Land of Yellowstone she fell under a spell and slew the Steelers, Knights of Pittsburgh. At last the heroes freed the princess, traveled through the kingdom of Barstow, and confronted Walter in the land of Spokane.
Sure, it sounds stupid, but you have to admit: your players will be able to remember, pronounce, and even spell all of the important people and places."
I google, "odd city names" and look at real life places with odd names, mix and match as needed, a quick search got these sites.
http://www.thealmightyguru.com/Pointless/Cities.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Unusual_place_namesWhile they are "real places" most have never been heard of and have "fantasy names" or if you take 1 word from one and 1 from another..well you get the idea
This sparked immediate names for a few stops between the main cities; many thanks are owed to you good sir!
When it comes to naming things you should consider what the guy who wrote DM of the Rings said on the subject.
** spoiler omitted **
I suppose as long as they remembered what happened, I'm happy haha that was an excellent read good sir. The few characters I have named are a little..tongue twisty, but hey; even if you can't pronounce it, such a name is bound to stick in your head, and the slightest description of the character might trigger "THAT GUY..YOU KNOW, THE DRAGON FACE", one can hope. Though..Emperor Fred and High Councillor Gary now need to make a minute appearance in my campaign somewhere
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Use the names of dead places that no longer are on the map. Or archaic names for places that still exist. Like Uruk (ancient city in modern Iraq) or Tadmur/Palmyra (same place, different names during different eras). As for archaic names, Albion is a good one (old name for England iirc). If players complain just point to Conan, the guy who wrote that (Robert Howard) use old names to give an authentic sound to the places. Just look at where he got the name for Conan's homeland: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cimmerians
As for names of rulers and npcs, just look through the roles of ancient kings, generals, and advisers. Yeah, King Lothar II (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/348512/Lothar-II) might not cut it, but what about Belisarius (Eastern Roman general under Justinian)? Unless your group is hardcore history buffs (or play grand strategy games like Crusader Kings II) they won't even know what you are doing. And if they do figure it out? All good then cause its not hard to make the NPC have similar traits and it gives some weight and interest in what you are doing.
or they're actual words we have now
Now, see, I don't understand the problem with this.
The trick is, names of people and places are (at least before the modern era) not gibberish--they all mean something. It's just that most names are in other languages.
For example, the name Thomas means "twin." Way back, when the original language was actually used, everyone named Thomas was just named a word in that language. To them, it would sound as odd as if we talked about the famous movie star Twin Selleck.
The same goes for places. The City of Angels isn't a nickname of Los Angeles, it's the translation. San Diego is just Saint James. Pennsylvania is basically Penn's Woods.
Our ancient kings sound to use like Tutankhamun or Yik'in Chan K'awiil, but at the time and place in question, they were really named stuff like "Great Fiery Red Jaguar Paws" or "The Guarded Life of The Unknowable" or whatever.
So, when I name places, I generally just, uh, use real words. For example, one continent in the world I am currently running is called Heartland. If I had wanted it to be a continent named in Elven, I would probably just continue to call it Heartland and mention "They call it Heartland, in Elvish."
It's just easier all around--I remember the names, the players remember them, they're always evocative, etc. Winning all around.
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I try to give countries a real-life language. One country might be French-inspired, so I use actual French names for both characters and cities. List of French names and cities are pretty easy to google.
Have a German-inspired country, an Italian-inspired one, etc. Just avoid using wellknown names, and you can easily have a list of prepared cities. Your players might think Berlin is a lame name, but I'm very certain you can easily find 100 of German villages and such they've never heard of.
Likewise with characters; Gunther, Lothar, Jürgen, Swein, Heinrich, Dieter, Erich... it's easy to find a list of German names, and you are certain they can be pronounced by human toungues. And your players might recognize some of them, but that just makes it easier to remember.
An added benefit is consistency; the names of characters and places from the same area have similar sounds, which is just as it should be. It also means that once your PC's meet a new guy, they'll be able to guess his country of origin, which again makes it believable.
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Something I try to keep in mind when naming locations is who named them and why. Look at New York State: named after the title Duke of York. The town of Schuylerville? Probably names after some guy named Schuyler. Halfmoon was named after the ship sailed by the explorers who named it (I'm from upstate NY if you can't tell). The point I'm making is that people in real life suck at naming things; they pick an old thing loosely connected with the new thing and slap it in front of a suffix. "I dub this land Cuupville!"
I used the same name three times for three different cities in one campaign: Ibas, South Ibas, and New Ibas. Who's Ibas? Some guy who sucked at naming his cities, most likely. In Warcraft, Thrall names Durotar after his father, Durotan.
This doesn't mean you shouldn't bother with original names. But if it comes down to the wire, and your group enters an unnamed town, all you need to do is say "OK, you approach a guard tower, which is stationed behind the city gate. A bowman atop the tower knocks an arrow, aims it at the party, and says "Halt. What business have you in (Oh, crap, I forgot to name this town. OK, no problem. Who's the King again? Right, Edward.) Edwardshire?" I guarantee the players won't bat an eyelash. Except maybe at the guy aiming a bow at them.
or they're actual words we have nowNow, see, I don't understand the problem with this.
The trick is, names of people and places are (at least before the modern era) not gibberish--they all mean something. It's just that most names are in other languages.
For example, the name Thomas means "twin." Way back, when the original language was actually used, everyone named Thomas was just named a word in that language. To them, it would sound as odd as if we talked about the famous movie star Twin Selleck.
The same goes for places. The City of Angels isn't a nickname of Los Angeles, it's the translation. San Diego is just Saint James. Pennsylvania is basically Penn's Woods.
Our ancient kings sound to use like Tutankhamun or Yik'in Chan K'awiil, but at the time and place in question, they were really named stuff like "Great Fiery Red Jaguar Paws" or "The Guarded Life of The Unknowable" or whatever.
So, when I name places, I generally just, uh, use real words. For example, one continent in the world I am currently running is called Heartland. If I had wanted it to be a continent named in Elven, I would probably just continue to call it Heartland and mention "They call it Heartland, in Elvish."
It's just easier all around--I remember the names, the players remember them, they're always evocative, etc. Winning all around.
Hmm, good point. I suppose my issues stemmed from my current..sorta current group of players; if I had a Greek inspired continent, they‘d make constant references to the real world equivalent and ignore the name I gave it, often killing the fantasy roleplay mood. Though, I do like your tactics, so I'll give em a go
I try to give countries a real-life language. One country might be French-inspired, so I use actual French names for both characters and cities. List of French names and cities are pretty easy to google.
Have a German-inspired country, an Italian-inspired one, etc. Just avoid using wellknown names, and you can easily have a list of prepared cities. Your players might think Berlin is a lame name, but I'm very certain you can easily find 100 of German villages and such they've never heard of.
Likewise with characters; Gunther, Lothar, Jürgen, Swein, Heinrich, Dieter, Erich... it's easy to find a list of German names, and you are certain they can be pronounced by human toungues. And your players might recognize some of them, but that just makes it easier to remember.
An added benefit is consistency; the names of characters and places from the same area have similar sounds, which is just as it should be. It also means that once your PC's meet a new guy, they'll be able to guess his country of origin, which again makes it believable.
I never thought of it like that; now I feel like a fool, it was so obvious! ..that also does open up a wide variety of names too for NPC's. The issue I kept running into was accurate translations; trying to figure out what the Ruby Dragon Dynasty would be in Japanese was hellish, even trying to translate one word at a time..I hardly trust Google translators, for all I know it could translate it to the Blue Hotdog Caravan
Something I try to keep in mind when naming locations is who named them and why. Look at New York State: named after the title Duke of York. The town of Schuylerville? Probably names after some guy named Schuyler. Halfmoon was named after the ship sailed by the explorers who named it (I'm from upstate NY if you can't tell). The point I'm making is that people in real life suck at naming things; they pick an old thing loosely connected with the new thing and slap it in front of a suffix. "I dub this land Cuupville!"
I used the same name three times for three different cities in one campaign: Ibas, South Ibas, and New Ibas. Who's Ibas? Some guy who sucked at naming his cities, most likely. In Warcraft, Thrall names Durotar after his father, Durotan.
This doesn't mean you shouldn't bother with original names. But if it comes down to the wire, and your group enters an unnamed town, all you need to do is say "OK, you approach a guard tower, which is stationed behind the city gate. A bowman atop the tower knocks an arrow, aims it at the party, and says "Halt. What business have you in (Oh, crap, I forgot to name this town. OK, no problem. Who's the King again? Right, Edward.) Edwardshire?" I guarantee the players won't bat an eyelash. Except maybe at the guy aiming a bow at them.
Also an excellent point good sir! I never even considered really naming cities after people, especially the people that rule them, but it makes a whole lot of sense now. It'll really make players remember the family that holds power
Likewise, it doesn't hurt to recycle names. Two guys have the same name? That's pretty common in reality, so why should your setting be any different. Then either give them a nickname to tell them apart, or let your players handle that themself.
Also, use your gods. Common names could easily have a reference to the gods. Boys could be named after the gods of war, of strength, of honor, or whatever suits the culture your working in. Girls could be named after gods of fertility, beauty, etc.
Finally, chuck an -a at the end of a boys name, and you have a girls name: Christian -> Christina
Likewise, it doesn't hurt to recycle names. Two guys have the same name? That's pretty common in reality, so why should your setting be any different. Then either give them a nickname to tell them apart, or let your players handle that themself.
Also, use your gods. Common names could easily have a reference to the gods. Boys could be named after the gods of war, of strength, of honor, or whatever suits the culture your working in. Girls could be named after gods of fertility, beauty, etc.
Finally, chuck an -a at the end of a boys name, and you have a girls name: Christian -> Christina
True true sir, just pop on some different last names and that'd work for it too. It never even occurred to me that the Core Rulebook also has a small list of names for each race, that would've been useful. Hell, I could probably name some of the characters by the God's names, making them very important NPCs..or very ironic ones
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Here's a list of random name generators and other resources. Maybe you can find one that works for you?
Here's a list of random name generators and other resources. Maybe you can find one that works for you?
Much appreciated sir! I shall look into it soon
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Looks like the idea was mentioned up-thread, but I'll say it anyway.
Most of my cultures are based on one or more real-world cultures. Those cultures have languages, so I just crib off of those. Mostly, I pick one of the languages and stick with it. If I'm feeling ambitious, I'll actually try to combine words from both languages.
For me, it starts with what kind of city/country I envision it to be. Does it have a national language? That right there guides me as to what kind of sounds the name of the city/country should have in it. For example if I have a country that would have something like French as a national language I would start thinking of sounds that are made by French words (google translate helps here) and then I start rearranging letters in the words.
Or, if it is a fantasy place with a fantasy language like Common, I think of the type of people who live there. How would they speak? Is it a small country filled with down to earth people who work hard off the land? Ok cool, that means it would probably be a short and easy to pronounce name like Stort...or as a real world example...Iceland (which is funny if you know that the country is actually NOT filled with ice).
The organisms that typically inhabit a country/region/city/district are how I start naming.
For me, it starts with what kind of city/country I envision it to be. Does it have a national language? That right there guides me as to what kind of sounds the name of the city/country should have in it. For example if I have a country that would have something like French as a national language I would start thinking of sounds that are made by French words (google translate helps here) and then I start rearranging letters in the words.
Or, if it is a fantasy place with a fantasy language like Common, I think of the type of people who live there. How would they speak? Is it a small country filled with down to earth people who work hard off the land? Ok cool, that means it would probably be a short and easy to pronounce name like Stort...or as a real world example...Iceland (which is funny if you know that the country is actually NOT filled with ice).
The organisms that typically inhabit a country/region/city/district are how I start naming.
You know, I often forget about the different languages in Pathfinder and everything; I need to make it a point to start remembered them *could cause interesting encounters when no one speaks the languages of the city they need to venture in to. I'll see what I can do! Much appreciated fellow Pathfinder
I find when I'm in a bind for town or NPC names, I use old Greek or roman settlements. It makes this sound familiar and coherent but most players can't quiet put their finger on why.
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When I'm stuck on finding that cool name I take an existing word or name, and start mixing, adding, and subtracting new letters like so:
America --> Ramerica --> Ralerica --> Raleryka --> Leryka --> Lerykas --> Lylakas...
Do that until you find something you like. I personally love this method.
As a long-time GM I lean heavily on my linguist and historian background for my GMing 'work'. As a rule, when I need names I reference ancient, dead or remote cultures, civilizations and languages to get basic naming patterns and syllabic constructs. In order to avoid the documentation I will generally standardize all names to phonetic spelling, to which my players seem to get used fairly fast. So hit some reference sites on Asyria, Phoenicia, Mongolia, Inuits, Lap, Azerbeijan and the like and draft name lists. As a test, sit someone down, read tem the list and ask them to write names as you read, then scrap the botches.
If you want to mimic common naming patterns, also try to establish some pattern words and use them. I.e. in many slavic languages, 'grad' is city (or, in older meaning sometimes fort) so you have Stalingrad, Volgograd, Biograd, Dvigrad... In germanic languages 'wald' or variations thereof mean wood or forrest, so you get a Schwartzwald, Buchenwald pattern... Ford suffix was often used for towns on river crossing, port suffix for coastal cities etc - it gives you a naming pattern that is consistent and intuitive. Once your players et used to it, if a Dwarf tells them to look in Garam-Dar and they remember Rogam-Dar And Khorum-Dar were both mountain-peak fortresses, they'll know where they are being sent.
Oh, and stay away from Welsh :)
Worlds are pretty hard to name, though. At least they used to be until I realized that every language has words like world, all, everything, earth, soil, dirt and so on. Check some language somewhere in a translation program.