Dex Fighters?

[Socinus]

I'm looking at creating a Dex based fighter and I'm not sure it's really a workable build.

Your first issue is weapons. You can use light weapons in order to take advantage of Weapon Finesse but then you're trading off damage potential. You also are at somewhat of a disadvantage with protection; armor has a max Dex bonus which seems to mean you're going to end up with mediocre armor with a mediocre Dex bonus and no real protection.

So what gives? How could you make an agile, Dex based fighter that isn't going to get basically stomped on in every fight?

[Byrdology]

Armor is a wash with high dex.

18 dex + chain shirt = 18 ac (30ft)
16 dex + b-plate = 19 ac (25ft)
12 dex + f-plate = 20 ac (20ft)

Fighters get to increase move speed at higher lvls, but by then you can afford Mithril armor.

20 dex + Mithril b-plate = 21 ac (30ft)

This is the goal you should be reaching for. If you need a higher dex, lighter armor with a higher max dex is fine. Or you can go with no armor + Mage armor (50gp potion) + shield (50gp potion) + shield of faith (50gp potion) for 20 + dex mod with no check or move penalty.

You are never going to match str based dmg output, but agile weapons and pirrhana strike will add some sting.

Dex gives you a great bonus on a lot of skills, saves and attack modes, but you will never throw down ridiculous damage.

[Nicos]

My favorite dex fighter is an elf that THF with an elven curve blade. With a moderate str (14) you can use a full plate and with armor training your high dex still counts.

Agile weapon are not needed (they rise the DPR but only by a bit). Of course your DPR will not be as good as a str based fighter but still.

With high dex you can also become a good switch hitter.

here is an old build, pretty high AC actually

Spoiler:

Elf
Mobile figter 1

=== Stats ===
Str 14 ,Dex 20 (24) ,con 12, Int 14(16) ,Wis 12, Cha 7
=== Defense ===
Hp: 87 (11d10 +22)
AC: 31
Touch AC: 18
Ff AC: 25
CMD: 31
=== Saves ===
Fort: +12
Ref: +14
Will: +10

Inmune to magical Sleep
+4 Against charm and compulsion

=== Attacks ===

Melee

+2 Silversheen Elvencurved blade: +21/+16/+11 ( 1d10 + 16, 15-20/x2)
Ranged
+1 Composite longbow: +18/+18/+13/+8 (1d8+11, 19-20/x3)
===Traits===
Acrobatic as class skill, +2 against charm and compulsion.

=== Feats ===

1. Power attack, Weapon finesse
2. Point blank shot
3. Toughness
4. Rapid shot
5. Iron will
6. Quick Draw
7. Manyshot
8. Deadly Aim
9. Nimble moves
10. Improved critical hit (Elven blade)
11. Weapon focus (Elven blade)
=== Skills ===
Acrobatics: +27
Stealth: +18
Knowledge (dungeonering): +17
Knowledge (Nature) +14
Perception: +19
Climb: +8
Swim: +7
Survival: +6
=== Special ===
Agility +3
Leaping Attack +2
Rapid Attack
Silent Hunter
=== Gear ===
+1 Agile Silversheen Elvencurved Blade (8700)
+1 Composite longbow (3000)
+2 Mitrhal Fullplate + Armored kilt (14,500)
+1 Ring of protection (2000)
+1 Amulet of natural Armor (2000)
+3 Cloak of resistance (9000)
+4 Belt of incredibly dexterity (16000)
+2 headbandof inteligence (4000)
Cracked pale grism Ioun stone (Attack) (4000)
Cracked pale grism Ioun stone (Saves) (4000)
Bracers of the falcom Aim ( 4000)
Boots of springing and striding (5,500)
Eyes of the eagle (2500)
Ring of susteneance (2500)
Handy havershack (2500)

[fretgod99]

Weapon Master (Scimitar) with Dervish Dance going into Duelist.

Stats roughly 10, 16, 14, 16, 10, 10 to start (give or take) and you'll be good to go.

[ArmouredMonk13]

TWF with a Full BAB and your favorite TWF combo. Make them Agile if you feel like it later. Use full-plate armor, possibly mithral, and make full use of your Max Dex. Weapons Finesse and always have a Longbow. You could make it even more interesting by making it a halfling for the bonus to hit and AC. Not great DPR, but a better than average TWF in AC and to-hit.

[nate lange]

fretgod is right, except if you're gonna do a dex build get your dex to at least 18... if you switch to an elf these same stats would be 10, 18, 12, 16, 10, 10- you might miss that 1hp/level but the extra +1 to hit/dmg/AC/reflex/init/etc is worth it (plus, just take toughness).

edit: you will need to pick how much you'll focus on offense vs defense... if you're willing to split them (or be more defensively minded) consider taking Improved Unarmed Strike- it seems dumb since you're class abilities won't work with a punch (though, theoretically, you could 2wf with your scimitar and punches without losing the benefits of your class or feat), but taking it allows you to take deflect arrows and the crane style tree and since you fight with a scimitar in one hand and nothing in the other you'll be able to take advantage of all of those...

[fretgod99]

The Crane Style tree with Duelist is pretty awesomely fun. That's actually one of the builds I jonesing to play, just haven't had the chance yet.

Sit in Fight Defensively all the time, deflect at least one hit per round (and counter at full BAB) and possibly deflect another hit if you want to give up one of your lower attacks. Stack INT and DEX on AC. Good times.

[Sir Thugsalot]

Byrdology wrote:

You are never going to match str based dmg output, but agile weapons and pirrhana strike will add some sting.

Min/max Agile/Keen TWF is frighteningly effective in any class with escalating bonuses to damage (such as cavalier).

The only issue is biding time until you have the money for equipment; so it's end-loaded.

Armor? If you're not maxing out the DEX bonus to Celestial, you're not building it right.

[Dragonchess Player]

Half-elf with Ancestral Arms (Wakizashi). You don't need a super-high Dex, anyway; 17-18 qualifies for all of the Two-Weapon Fighting feat chain except Greater Two-Weapon Fighting (which is less useful than the Critical Focus feat chain or Cleaving Finish/Improved Cleaving Finish, IMO), so investing for a 14+ Str will help boost damage (along with Power Attack, Weapon Specialization, etc.).

[Sir Thugsalot]

Dragonchess Player wrote:

Half-elf with Ancestral Arms (Wakizashi). You don't need a super-high Dex, anyway; 17-18 qualifies....

If your DEX is in charge of attack *and* damage *and* armor-class, there's little reason not to jam it to the moon.

(In PFS, my TWF samurai started with STR:07/DEX:19; he had his horse sit on things at low level.

[master_marshmallow]

I've been working on a build that goes Lore Master into Duelist, being DEX based means giving up heavier armors is a good trade-off. Aldori Dueling Master from the ISWG is a pretty neat feat since it gives you a shield bonus to AC without having to buy a shield, and using a dueling sword means you can qualify for all the duelisty things, and still can Power Attack by RAW, while using Finesse. The trait Sword Scion is also like being able to take Weapon Focus a third time, should you opt to stay fighter or put off going into duelist.