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I am confident that Green Ronin will make this product super awesome. They are experienced hands at the publishing game and knows what it takes to meet the demands and standards of their audience.
I would have once believed that too, but after the Companion, I'm not so sure anymore, especially with Fiery Dragon as PFRPG-inexperienced designers holding the reins...
I'd second Dungeon Grrrl's sentiment: If Grandmaster Crunch Owen K.C. Stephens were doing this or if Christina Stiles or another name that has some positive mechanical PFRPG-design-credit was involved in a lead-designer role, I'd be much more inclined to believe that this will be awesomesauce.
Also: Progressing meta-plot and new content and the amount we'd get would be crucial information for fans of the setting like me who have Buccaneers, the Companion and a ton of other Freeport books.
Most importantly, though:
PFRPG is no longer 3.75. New classes, races, archetypes, firearms, naval and vehicular combat - all there for the picking. Having an official statement that makes sure that we don't just get the companion-material reprinted and instead a system that is truly using PFRPG-rules would assuage my fears and the concerns of many of the posters here.
Again, not trying to be negative, just trying to be helpful.
Endzeitgeist, That is my concern. Too many times reputable 3pp publishers of the 3e Era think that Pathfinder is 3.5e with one or two minor cosmetic changes. I have backed this project, but if I don't get any information on their approach, other than just telling me they are adding more pages, then I will pull out. They need to state definitively the design approach. To tell the truth, bragging about new classes is really a turn-off for me. I can see the Noble class, but the rest of them need to be reskinned as archetypes for existing classes. They have nothing to offer that isn't already part of another class. The Monster Hunter? Why? We have a Ranger that does that. I never got to run Freeport, but I had intended on not allowing that class because of that. they need to keep the flavor, but change all of the mechanics to Pathfinder.
So are they going with Fiery Dragon because they are good, or are they using them because they are cheap & need the money? Like it's been said, they have NO experience with Pathfinder. Green Ronin, while a good company, has a less than stellar record with Pathfinder. I would LOVE to see this done right, so I am hopeful, but I say again, if somebody doesn't give us some details then I will pull out.
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I had pledged but withdrew for the same reason xorial and Endzeitgeist have mentioned. With a more precise explanation of what the book will contain I would renew my pledge. I am not thrilled with the idea of just another 3.5 setting book. I don't buy any 3.5 books anymore.
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I understand the concerns that some of you folks have. I saw the same sort of thing when older companies jumped into the d20 market. Some of them thought they could put out any old thing, slap a d20 logo on it, and it'd sell. They didn't bother to learn the system well or hire people who already did. Those companies did not do well in the d20 era.
With Freeport and our other d20 releases, we always tried to put quality first. That has not changed. Some of the things you have suggested were already in the works before we even launched the Kickstarter.
We have 28 days of this campaign left. There are many more announcements to come and I think you'll be happy with what we have planned. The goal here is to make a great Pathfinder Freeport book and we will do whatever it takes to make that happen if we get funded.
Thanks.
Chris Pramas
Green Ronin
I share the reservations voiced here. The new Freeport needs to make full use of the Pathfinder rule set. But Chris Pramas's statement makes me confident. Let's see this become the best Freeport book so far!
If it matters to anyone, I signed on the first day of this project's announcement. I'd certainly be in at higher levels could I afford it, let me tell you!
I hear what you are saying, but I don't believe for a second this project will be bad. What we all know to be true in regard to Green Ronin is that Chris Pramas is an astute game producer who has been prodcuing great games for over a decade now. He has a proven track record, and he is one of us: a gamer! I know he wants to produce the BEST FREEPORT BOOK EVER, and he has chosen a partner he knows to be up to his standards. This kickstarter, as Chris said, is Green Ronin's way of responding to fan requests, and this is a way to grow new fans--those who aren't familiar with everything that came before. I understand a lot of you have concerns about this book incorporating all that has become the essence of Pathfinder, but Chris isn't a rookie. He'll ensure this book is a PATHFINDER Freeport, and he'll make sure it's a quality product. I NEVER doubt such things when it comes to Green Ronin.
Lastly, thank you to those who've said they'd like to see me work on is book. Wow, how your comments made my day! I'm so happy to have garnered your trust and confidence. Let me just say: Chris is VERY AWARE of my interest in working on this book--in any way, shape, or form. It could very well happen. But whether or not it does, I hope you'll support this endeavor because it could herald big things for the Freeport line, a line many of us want to see thrive.
So, if you're a Freeport fan, supporting this project is one of the best ways to ensure more material for this beloved setting gets introduced. Rather than taking a stand against Fiery Dragon because you are leery of their lack of Pathfinder experience, I ask that you take a stand for Freeport and for Green Ronin as a quality producer and pioneer in all that the OGL has produced.
Honestly, this kickstarter had me at the word Freeport. Long live the City of Adventure!
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Wow. There's a lot of "oldskool 3.5 isn't PF, this needs legs" going on here. As an avowed grognard from BECMI and 1e I'm a bit taken aback by all the fuss. Still you folk seem to have a consensus so I'll leave you to your rumblings.
Unheeded. Maybe it's because I own exactly one Freeport book (Hell in Freeport, IIRC) I picked up for a buck at my NVLNFBIAIGGS (not very local nor favorite but it's all i got game store) a few years back, so I'm less worried about duplication. Maybe it's because I like the concept of Freeport, and the fact that GR were there on day one of 3.e, when I wasn't. I'd left gamin on a long hiatus, but when I returned Freeport was there. Chris Pramas seems to have the chops to deliver, and no matter his reasoning for using Fiery Dragon I'm sure he has no intention of letting any part of the creation of this hold it up from being far from perfect.
I too welcome calls for Christina Stiles or Owen Stephens or similar to work on this, only because I admire both of their approaches and style, and as publishers and developers they are personable and fair, without sugar or salt. Are they absolutely die or dammit necessary? No. But the more the merrier. AND Christina has taken the developer role for the soonily appearing Dark Deeds in...Freeport.
I also support calls for full support of those books that move PF away from 3.5. Piratical alchemists, summoners, oracles, cavaliers and inquisitor archetypes yes please!!!
But really? Really, really, really? I WANT W.A.R. Cover. If you guys keep lollygagging we ain't gettin our booty and I'll be saltlicked if I have to explain to my crew why there isn't W.A.R. on Freeport.
Oh. As Amora Games has just made the announcement of a War-based AP, I guess W.A.R. And war is on my mind. Can we have a War in Freeport supplement doen the line? ;)
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I already own a 3.75 style Freeport book. It even has a WAR cover. So if I had to decide between a new WAR cover and a book for the current PFRPG, my choice would be pretty clear.
And don't blame people for not paying 130$ for a product they are not interested in.
Slightly offtopic but what are the chances of a thieves world update to pathfinder?
It really depends on how this Kickstarter goes. If it does not fund, the chance is maybe 5%. I know that's a blunt answer, but if it turns out the Pathfinder fanbase is not interested in seeing material from us, we are unlikely to try again.
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Let me just say: Chris is VERY AWARE of my interest in working on this book--in any way, shape, or form. It could very well happen. But whether or not it does, I hope you'll support this endeavor because it could herald big things for the Freeport line, a line many of us want to see thrive.
Thanks for the vote of confidence, Christina (and Erik, Wolf, and Owen).
Christina approached me about working with us again a few months ago and I told her I had a project coming up she'd be perfect for. This is it and we're talking about specifics.
Chris, There seems to be a certain amount of confusion on the rules set you are using. You say it will be for Pathfinder but all the pledge level descriptions say it will be for 3.5.
So I ask, which rules set are you shooting for?
In my opinion Pathfinder quite being 3.5 compatible several books ago. I could be wrong.
My wife is interested in the book so we will probably back this if we can be satisfied with it and can raise the funds having backed quite a few kickstarters of late. I am a little confused when people say $130, when it looks to me like the cost for a print copy is $100? I don't even see a pledge at that level.
As I stated previosly, we have bought a lot of d20 Green Ronin stuff and like the material. Myself mostly Thieves World. I am not real concerned about quality. Everything in the past was well done and well written and I see no reason that this won't be either.
My concern is the last statement,"Pathfinder quit[typo corrected] being 3.5 compatible several books ago." For us the closer it is to 3.5 the better even if we are in the minority opinion.
Chris, There seems to be a certain amount of confusion on the rules set you are using. You say it will be for Pathfinder but all the pledge level descriptions say it will be for 3.5.
So I ask, which rules set are you shooting for?
In my opinion Pathfinder quite being 3.5 compatible several books ago. I could be wrong.
I think you are misunderstanding something there. Freeport: The City of Adventure Third Edition does not mean "this is Freeport for D&D third edition." It means "this is the third edition of Freeport."
Some older adventures and/or sourcebooks that are offered in addition at certain pledge levels, such as the Freeport Trilogy Anniversary Edition or Dark Wings over Freeport are 3.5 material, though, but the main book the Kickstarter is about will the for the Pathfinder RPG, I understand.
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I just added three new entries to the Kickstarters FAQ that should answer some of the questions asked here.
Q: Which rules set is this for, Pathfinder or D&D 3.5?
A: Freeport: The City of Adventure Third Edition and the Player’s Guide to Freeport are straight up Pathfinder. Some of the PDF rewards, like Dark Wings Over Freeport and The Freeport Trilogy, are older books that use the D&D 3.5 rules.
Q: Green Ronin has only published one Pathfinder book before. How can we be sure the Pathfinder rules in Freeport: The City of Adventure will be up to snuff?
A: The answer is simple: we are hiring experts to design and develop the rules sections. Green Ronin and Fiery Dragon have a lot of experience with the d20 rules but we understand that Pathfinder is its own beast. Our focus will be on the expanding the city with new locations, NPCs, adventures, and the like. For the rules sections we are working with experience Pathfinder freelancers to make sure they are cutting edge. We intend to use existing Pathfinder classes, monsters, magic items, and so on where appropriate. We want this to be a great book in every respect.
Q: I only want the printed book of Freeport: The City of Adventure itself. How can I just buy that?
A: We will be selling the finished book through game stores, book stores, and our webstore after it ships to backers. If you only want the book, you’ll be able to get it that way. You could also try talking to your local store and seeing if they’ll buy into the Kickstarter at the Sea Lord’s Guard level.
As a new fan of Freeport I'd actually like to see a bunch of the WAR covers reproduced in this product. They really are fantastic.
Anyhoo, heres the Kickstarter link again:
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I just wonder if we will get new classes. Many of the classes in the deluxe edition are already in the companion. We have according to the table of contents:
Assassin
Corsair
Monster Hunter
Noble
Survivor
Npc the Cultist.
Will they remain the same. Altered slightly. New. Granted it's early yet we need more information. I'm still keeping a open mind for now. As for the APG classes and archtypes I say why not. Even if I'm mot a huge fan of PF gun rules.
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A: The answer is simple: we are hiring experts to design and develop the rules sections. Green Ronin and Fiery Dragon have a lot of experience with the d20 rules but we understand that Pathfinder is its own beast. Our focus will be on the expanding the city with new locations, NPCs, adventures, and the like. For the rules sections we are working with experience Pathfinder freelancers to make sure they are cutting edge. We intend to use existing Pathfinder classes, monsters, magic items, and so on where appropriate. We want this to be a great book in every respect.
That's reassuring to hear! As is that Christina might be involved. I'll have to scrounge some bucks together, I guess...
Regarding the classes from the Freeport Companion - I honestly don't see the reason why Corsair, Monster Hunter, Survivor etc. need to be classes - they should be archetypes instead and I hope they will.
@brvheart: I get where you're coming from, but there already is a 3.5ish Freeport-book out there, the Companion, which is imho a 3rd edition book with VERY minor tweaks. Not wanting to come across as unpleasant or something, just wanted to point you towards it - if you don't want too pathfindery Freeport, that one has you covered.
Personally, I really want a full-blown pathfindery Freeport, with judgments, teamwork-feats, archetypes, firearms and vehicle/naval combat-support (of the paizo-system) etc. and hope the book will deliver.
Just my 2 cents and not wanting to step on any toes here. :)
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Personally, I really want a full-blown pathfindery Freeport, with judgments, teamwork-feats, archetypes, firearms and vehicle/naval combat-support (of the paizo-system) etc. and hope the book will deliver.Just my 2 cents and not wanting to step on any toes here. :)
We are on the same page, Thilo! Those are the types of things I'd like to see in the book and help bring to the book.
I kick in my 2 coppers as well. That is what I have been asking about, and now have some of my fears calmed, for now. I want the full Pathfinder treatment.
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My wallet wants to say no. But my Razor Coast aspirations say yes.
(one failed will save latter...) I'm in!
I remade my pledge. Thanks Chris for answering my question even though I did misspell one word (quite for quit).
Contributor; Developer, Super Genius Games
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WOW do I hate waiting for ink to dry sometimes.
So, Chris Pramas just made the following announcement over at the Freeport Kickstarter:
"I'm delighted to announce that Owen Stephens has joined the design team of Freeport: The City of Adventure Third Edition. Owen and I worked together at Wizards of the Coast 12 years ago. He's written numerous D&D and Stars Wars book, and was a co-designer of the Star Wars Saga Edition RPG. He's also done some great work for Green Ronin, including Bastards & Bloodlines, the Advanced Gamemaster's Guide, Black Company, and Thieves' World. These days he's one of the principles at Super Genius Games and a recognized expert on the Pathfinder rules.
Owen will be designing the player oriented rules material in Freeport: The City of Adventure, which will also be going into the Player's Guide to Freeport. His job will be to make sure that Player Characters in a Freeport campaign have a bevvy of new options that capture the feel of the City of Adventure and work hand-in-glove with the cutting edge of Pathfinder design.
Welcome aboard, Owen! Now don't drink all the rum!"
Now I make no promises about the rum, but I absolutely intend to bring the best of GR's style and the Pathfinder rules together on this project. I've worked with Chris on a lot of things over the years, and I'm really excited to be part of this one.
And by the way, I can't say how humbled I am that some folks mentioned me by name in this thread. It's awesome to be known for doing something I love, and even more awesome when some smart people think I do it well.
Now, let's get this thing funded!
Congratulations, Owen. This is good news indeed1
+1
Yay, Owen!!!!
Effectively, all of my concerns have went out the window. Great to see Owen on this.
Shut up & take my money!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Off to pledge! Great news and thank you for listening!
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O_O
Grandmaster Crunch is ob board as well! Now I HAVE to scrounge the bucks together!
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WOW do I hate waiting for ink to dry sometimes.
So, Chris Pramas just made the following announcement over at the Freeport Kickstarter:
"I'm delighted to announce that Owen Stephens has joined the design team of Freeport: The City of Adventure Third Edition. Owen and I worked together at Wizards of the Coast 12 years ago. He's written numerous D&D and Stars Wars book, and was a co-designer of the Star Wars Saga Edition RPG. He's also done some great work for Green Ronin, including Bastards & Bloodlines, the Advanced Gamemaster's Guide, Black Company, and Thieves' World. These days he's one of the principles at Super Genius Games and a recognized expert on the Pathfinder rules.
Owen will be designing the player oriented rules material in Freeport: The City of Adventure, which will also be going into the Player's Guide to Freeport. His job will be to make sure that Player Characters in a Freeport campaign have a bevvy of new options that capture the feel of the City of Adventure and work hand-in-glove with the cutting edge of Pathfinder design.
Welcome aboard, Owen! Now don't drink all the rum!"
Now I make no promises about the rum, but I absolutely intend to bring the best of GR's style and the Pathfinder rules together on this project. I've worked with Chris on a lot of things over the years, and I'm really excited to be part of this one.
And by the way, I can't say how humbled I am that some folks mentioned me by name in this thread. It's awesome to be known for doing something I love, and even more awesome when some smart people think I do it well.
Now, let's get this thing funded!
Awesome!
I really love Freeport. But, at this point my home game players are burned out on pirate themed stuff. We played the 3.5 version of Freeport 2009-2010 time frame, and are now playing Skulls and Shackles. I'm a big fan of Green Ronin material, just this doesn't appleal to my group of players at this time. And by the way this also applies to Razor Coast, which we won't be playing due to the same pirate theme fatigue.
It's no secret that I love miniatures, so I've added a degenerate serpentman promo mini to our Freeport Kickstarter. For more info and a look at Brian Snoddy's awesome concept art, check out today's update!
Does anyone know at this point what content this book will finally have?
There is very little information for those that started with D&D/PF only recently.
My wife's birthday is Friday and she wants Freeport so I pledged at the Pirate level for her. She doesn't want to name anything, just wants more content. She has the original 3 adventures and needs the city.
I really love Freeport. But, at this point my home game players are burned out on pirate themed stuff. We played the 3.5 version of Freeport 2009-2010 time frame, and are now playing Skulls and Shackles. I'm a big fan of Green Ronin material, just this doesn't appleal to my group of players at this time. And by the way this also applies to Razor Coast, which we won't be playing due to the same pirate theme fatigue.
Razor Coast is not really Piratey; a lot of it is more about colonialism and ancient evils.
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Does anyone know at this point what content this book will finally have?
There is very little information for those that started with D&D/PF only recently.
I can't answer for the devs, but basically :
Freeport is a pirate port turning semi-legit (at least that's what they want you to think) on a tropical island.
You can find : nautical adventures, colorful NPCs, some little crunch, a whole city, and ... adventure on the high seas.
I'll let those in the know tease you more.
Overall, I have never been disappointed by a Freeport product.
Just looking for a quick clarification, that maybe be obvious...
The new new $80 backer level that was announced on Monday reads: "You get a print and PDF copy of Freeport: The City of Adventure Third Edition and no other rewards."
That same day you announced the new 6-part adventure series that will be free to all backers of level $30 and up.
Will $80 reward backers get access to these adventures, or do they count towards the "no other rewards?"
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Chronicles LIVE! Episode 004 features Chris Pramas and Jason Bulmahn.
We take an in-depth look at the Freeport Kickstarter and what supporters can expect. He also gives us an exclusive first look at the next Stretch goals!
Video of the session can be viewed HERE
Enjoy!
I bought Death in Freeport at Gen Con 2000 as the first 3e adventure, and have gotten a lot of mileage out of Freeport over the years; I have the Pathfinder Companion and have used content from it in my recent Golarion pirate campaign (predating Skull & Shackles). $100 was a big bite and I was unsure, but now that there's a $80 "get the book and not piles-o-pdfs" I'm in!
P.S. If anyone has an idea of how Captain Morgan Baumann, in the brig with her thumbs cut off, first mate slain, and her surviving crew spread across her ship and her captor's, can escape my PCs to cause them trouble again before they turn her in for the reward it would be great!
This project definitely needs more support. It is at around $28,000 with 9 days to go. We need a surge of support over the final days folks.