Goblin Squad Member
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do you intend to be more the "once paid, stay loyal" type of mercenaries, or the "Your enemies just paid us to kill you. Make us an offer" type?
I would strongly suggest being the former. If you get a contract, do not take another contract that would go against the first one. The moment you can't be trusted to hold true to a contract you would cease getting them.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I might have misinterpreted. Were you asking if they take a contract from someone that they are then that person's ally forever? From my understanding a contract is for a set time or a set task. Like defend my settlement from this particular siege or go harass my enemy's gatherers for a week. Obviously once the contract was fulfilled and over, that client would be fair game to take contracts against right?
In my above post I was just trying to say that you shouldn't take two conflicting contracts at the same time.
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Goblin Squad Member
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We saw what each other meant :-). I was truly wondering about the potential benefits of not being trust-worthy, but being staggeringly effective enough to give clients--both current and potential--pause.
If someone is not trustworthy, effectiveness usually goes out the window when considering hiring them.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If we take a contract, it is our contract. We complete that contract and do not take another till it is complete.
If someone makes a contract with us to defend their settlement for X amount of money. Then another group offers us twice X to leave that settlement undefended. We will refuse.
Once a contract is up, the contract is up. There could be groups that we like to work for and will likely refuse contracts against them. Time will tell there.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If we take a contract, it is our contract. We complete that contract and do not take another till it is complete.
If someone makes a contract with us to defend their settlement for X amount of money. Then another group offers us twice X to leave that settlement undefended. We will refuse.
Once a contract is up, the contract is up. There could be groups that we like to work for and will likely refuse contracts against them. Time will tell there.
Well spoken. The "meta" rep will serve you well.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Given our previous dialogue on establishing mutually beneficial contracts, I wanted to give specific notice to The UNC that our group, the Keepers of the Circle, has moved to a new site (http://keepersofthecircle.guildlaunch.com/). We have a Chancery established for discussions with other guilds when necessary.
Squaring the Circle,
Erian El'ranelen, Guardian of Gold
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Goblin Squad Member
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Thank you for the invite Erian.
Thank you as well Brings.
We may have opposing ideas with others on this board. One thing we will hold to is our contracts no matter what.
Pay us to stay out of your lands, done
Pay us to rob your opponents, done
Pay us to not log in for a month, hmmm well maybe lol
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Goblin Squad Member
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If it helps people to understand the contract concept a bit better:
When the UNC was originally brought into being, we were a LN bandit company due to our "Allegiance" to the coin. Our word was our bond and if given, through the form of a contract, it was honored to the very best of our ability.
Despite this being a "lawful" trait, we have kept this mentality when we switch to the CN alignment. While it is a lawful trait, we feel that it is a "flaw" we are willing to live with.
Let it be known, so there is NO CONFUSION, if the UNC accept a contract, it will be held up to on our end. That being said, most if not all contracts will have a "dissolve" clause, for example look at the agreement between PAX and UNC. Will have wording similar to "Should either party no longer benefit from this contract, either part may void this contract." Specific details will be discussed and agreed to before such contract are accepted by both parties. All those involved will be fully aware of all clauses and details of each contract.
Specifically to the question of accepting a 2nd, conflicting contract, while under a contract already. My colleges answered already but I will reiterate. Using an example, simplistic so not to over complicate the matter:
UNC accepts a contract with PAX to guard their caravan traveling to TEO settlement for 100g. If we then get a contract for 200g to "leave our posts" we will decline it. Even though it is offering more gold than the original, all contracts are binding and a higher payout isn't enough of a reason to cancel a contract already in effect.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Will have wording similar to "Should either party no longer benefit from this contract, either part may void this contract."
That's a doozy of a contract clause. Few real contract would ever include something like that without far more precise language because it's basically a catch-all that lets you void at whim. Now it might be fine to give the non-UNC member power to void at will but if i'm hiring UNC for a job, I'm not agreeing up front to let them void it THAT easily.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Will have wording similar to "Should either party no longer benefit from this contract, either part may void this contract."That's a doozy of a contract clause. Few real contract would ever include something like that without far more precise language because it's basically a catch-all that lets you void at whim. Now it might be fine to give the non-UNC member power to void at will but if i'm hiring UNC for a job, I'm not agreeing up front to let them void it THAT easily.
The clause is not enacted without discussion. But, this type of clause is found in every contract. If either party does not, can't or will not live up to the terms of the contract, it is void.
What we don't have is a consequence for breaching our contracts, on the part of the employer. But, this conversation and that particular is best suited for our policy thread.
/gives a sharp stare at The Goodfellow
In case you thought my avatar is screaming, he is not. He is on the last word of "WTF"!
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Goblin Squad Member
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Will have wording similar to "Should either party no longer benefit from this contract, either part may void this contract."That's a doozy of a contract clause. Few real contract would ever include something like that without far more precise language because it's basically a catch-all that lets you void at whim. Now it might be fine to give the non-UNC member power to void at will but if i'm hiring UNC for a job, I'm not agreeing up front to let them void it THAT easily.
Moved and reanswered in our policy thread
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Goblin Squad Member
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Thanks for fixing the link Bludd. I'm not very forum savvy without the cheat buttons.
I just noticed the "How to format your text button" below.
My self imposed punishment is having to listen to the Derp Song For the next 10 hours.
Goblinworks Executive Founder
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If it helps people to understand the contract concept a bit better:
When the UNC was originally brought into being, we were a LN bandit company due to our "Allegiance" to the coin. Our word was our bond and if given, through the form of a contract, it was honored to the very best of our ability.
Despite this being a "lawful" trait, we have kept this mentality when we switch to the CN alignment. While it is a lawful trait, we feel that it is a "flaw" we are willing to live with.
Let it be known, so there is NO CONFUSION, if the UNC accept a contract, it will be held up to on our end. That being said, most if not all contracts will have a "dissolve" clause, for example look at the agreement between PAX and UNC. Will have wording similar to "Should either party no longer benefit from this contract, either part may void this contract." Specific details will be discussed and agreed to before such contract are accepted by both parties. All those involved will be fully aware of all clauses and details of each contract.
Specifically to the question of accepting a 2nd, conflicting contract, while under a contract already. My colleges answered already but I will reiterate. Using an example, simplistic so not to over complicate the matter:
UNC accepts a contract with PAX to guard their caravan traveling to TEO settlement for 100g. If we then get a contract for 200g to "leave our posts" we will decline it. Even though it is offering more gold than the original, all contracts are binding and a higher payout isn't enough of a reason to cancel a contract already in effect.
Respecting a given word isn't necessarily lawful anyway, in the classic 9 axis alignment system from D20. Especially in the "norse" context. No master doesn't necessarily means no honnor, just as a lot of lawful organisation are very familiar with intrigue and betrayal ! :)
So I don't think that your company concept is strange or hard to understand.
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Goblin Squad Member
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@Audoucet
Just because a settlement/organization/group has an alignment in the tabletop does not mean every single individual in that organization is that alignment.
Several cities/kingdoms/organizations are listed as an alignment and that alignment is based upon a few things such as laws, ruling group, and influential acts.
Check out Karrnath from Eberron
http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Karrnath
You will notice LG, LN, LE, and NE
-2 cents
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Goblin Squad Member
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| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
The UnNamed Company is Open for New Recruits:
"We are a Positive Game Play community, making every effort to deliver Mutually Entertaining and Meaningful Interactions with Friends and Foes alike.
1. PvP focused company, some PvE content.
2. RP Theme: Norse / Viking (Linnorm Kingdoms PFRPG); The River Freedoms
3. Plans for our own settlement: Aragon (Chaotic Neutral)
4. Faction Warfare (Bandits vs Merchants)
5. PvP Training Company for New Players
Our primary activities will be raiding outposts, points-of-interest, and caravans of feud targets and rival settlements ( those in direct competition with our employer's settlements).
Secondary activities will be raiding targets of opportunity; combating Escalations; Crafting, Trade and Exploration.
Recruiting: Raiders, Bandits, Assassins, as well as other classes and professions.
Current Games: Eve Online, Mechwarrior Online, Defiance, Fallen Earth and Age of Conan, Titanfall.
If you wish to join one of the premier, PvP focused companies in the game, hit the link below.
"On Coin, Blade and Pain of Blood"
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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@Audoucet
Just because a settlement/organization/group has an alignment in the tabletop does not mean every single individual in that organization is that alignment.Several cities/kingdoms/organizations are listed as an alignment and that alignment is based upon a few things such as laws, ruling group, and influential acts.
Check out Karrnath from Eberron
http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/KarrnathYou will notice LG, LN, LE, and NE
-2 cents
I think that you must have misunderstood me, because I don't really see any link between your response and my post. I was merely saying that I didn't find it to be strange, that a chaotic neutral organisation could be trusted.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Study the 1600s when mercenary armies were active in Europe. If it made sense for a mercenary company to violate their contract with an employer, usually because they were offered more money and a place in the new noble's lands away from the employer they stiffed, then they would do it.
Now some companies were more honor-bound than others and once they took a contract they kept it regardless and they rapidly vanished from the scene as their companies were wiped out.
Actually, mercenary company captains had to always think of their men and their health, morale and equipment status over the employer's goals. If it looked like your mercenary company was going to get gutted if it kept a contract, then the captain would look for anyway out of it. After all, that company was his livelihood. If you lose 30% of your men and material, where are you going to get replacements? Who is going to hire a reduced sized company? If your employer lost, where are you going to get the money to pay your men? The mercenary captain paid the men, not the employer. The employer paid the captain.
Now real world mercenary companies won't be the same as gaming mercenary companies since your character can come back to life or you could bring in a new PC. {Are contracts going to be set up so the mercenary captain gets paid in the game and his company will be paid by him? Which brings up the question, can you trust that player to give you your share of the loot?}
But if this game was set up so you could only play one character at a time and would lose him or her when they died, no resurrection, how "brave" would you be to go the bandit or mercenary route? :-)
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Goblin Squad Member
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| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Now real world mercenary companies won't be the same as gaming mercenary companies since your character can come back to life or you could bring in a new PC.
And that is exactly the point. Because it's a game and death is just a setback, the type of contracts that are given will be different and holding to your word means more because it is the one true thing that will make or break your reputation as a merc guild. And as a merc guild your reputation is everything.
Did I mention I've lead a few merc guilds in the past? :p
UNC, you've got a tough but rewarding road ahead of you if you can pull it off. Best of luck.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Testing, can not cut and paste or respond to posts...
The UnNamed Company is Open for New Recruits:
"We are a Positive Game Play community, making every effort to deliver Mutually Entertaining and Meaningful Interactions with Friends and Foes alike.
1. PvP focused company, some PvE content.
2. RP Theme: Norse / Viking (Linnorm Kingdoms PFRPG); The River Freedoms
3. Plans for our own settlement: Aragon (Chaotic Neutral)
4. Faction Warfare (Bandits vs Merchants)
5. PvP Training Company for New Players
Our primary activities will be raiding outposts, points-of-interest, and caravans of feud targets and rival settlements ( those in direct competition with our employer's settlements).
Secondary activities will be raiding targets of opportunity; combating Escalations; Crafting, Trade and Exploration.
Recruiting: Raiders, Bandits, Assassins, as well as other classes and professions.
Current Games: Eve Online, Mechwarrior Online, Defiance, Fallen Earth and Age of Conan, Titanfall.
If you wish to join one of the premier, PvP focused companies in the game, hit the link below.
"On Coin, Blade and Pain of Blood"
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Goblin Squad Member
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Does the UnNamed Company take bribes?
Can we just pay a "toll" to go through their territory unmolested?
We don't like the term "bribe", we prefer "tax" but yes, you can pay it and be immune to UNC attacks. If you work out a contract, it can be more "long term" than every caravan we catch or that wishes to travel through our lands. Details will vary and are open to discussion.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Does the UnNamed Company take bribes?
Can we just pay a "toll" to go through their territory unmolested?
Yes of course, this can actually be done through several methods.
1. If you should be traveling along, in a caravan, and you are pulled out of fast travel from one if our groups, you will be offered a SAD (Stand and Deliver). If the demand is reasonable to you, and you accept to pay, you move on your way with protection from being SADed or attacked again for a period of time.
Even though this may be a one time encounter and differ from instance to instance, over time familiarity (a history of positive interactions) may lead to the demands directed at you to be lowered.
If on the other hand, you decline the offer, you may or may not be killed and looted. Just like above, the history that you establish may have bearing on future encounters.
2. You can contact the UnNamed Company and hire us through a contract. You can hire us not to attack you; you can hire us to escort you; you can hire us to attack a rival's supply chain.
These contracts are for short term and may not conflict with a contract we are currently operating under.
3. Now that the UNC is seeking to start a settlement "Aragon (CN)", if you establish a history of conducting a good trade with the settlement we support, you may be elevated to "Blue, or Friendly" status.
Obviously, citizens of Aragon are granted this status automatically. Not only will UNC not molest you, we will actively protect you should the need present itself.
On a personal note, my favorite kind of contract is one that hires the UNC to raid a rival's supply chain. We would likely use the feud mechanic to do this, or perhaps have the benefit of faction differences. Wars are always great fun as well, and I hope the River Kingdoms are embroiled in frequent wars!!
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Goblin Squad Member
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We don't like the term "bribe", we prefer "tax" but yes, you can pay it and be immune to UNC attacks. If you work out a contract, it can be more "long term" than every caravan we catch or that wishes to travel through our lands. Details will vary and are open to discussion.Does the UnNamed Company take bribes?
Can we just pay a "toll" to go through their territory unmolested?
Does that fit the River Freedoms, and how so?
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Goblin Squad Member
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Does that fit the River Freedoms, and how so?We don't like the term "bribe", we prefer "tax" but yes, you can pay it and be immune to UNC attacks. If you work out a contract, it can be more "long term" than every caravan we catch or that wishes to travel through our lands. Details will vary and are open to discussion.Does the UnNamed Company take bribes?
Can we just pay a "toll" to go through their territory unmolested?
Kings can not tax the roads, but they can "hire" bandits to do it for them. It is a semantically designed loophole, got to love Chaotic Neutral construction of rules.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Kings can not tax the roads, but they can "hire" bandits to do it for them. It is a semantically designed loophole, got to love Chaotic Neutral construction of rules.Does that fit the River Freedoms, and how so?We don't like the term "bribe", we prefer "tax" but yes, you can pay it and be immune to UNC attacks. If you work out a contract, it can be more "long term" than every caravan we catch or that wishes to travel through our lands. Details will vary and are open to discussion.Does the UnNamed Company take bribes?
Can we just pay a "toll" to go through their territory unmolested?
lol OK. I haven't a real personal stance on that issue. Just poking the group that loves to quote those freedoms. If you are not "Kings" in your lands, then who is? Do you have a job opening? ;)
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Goblin Squad Member
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| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Kings can not tax the roads, but they can "hire" bandits to do it for them. It is a semantically designed loophole, got to love Chaotic Neutral construction of rules.Does that fit the River Freedoms, and how so?We don't like the term "bribe", we prefer "tax" but yes, you can pay it and be immune to UNC attacks. If you work out a contract, it can be more "long term" than every caravan we catch or that wishes to travel through our lands. Details will vary and are open to discussion.Does the UnNamed Company take bribes?
Can we just pay a "toll" to go through their territory unmolested?lol OK. I haven't a real personal stance on that issue. Just poking the group that loves to quote those freedoms. If you are not "Kings" in your lands, then who is? Do you have a job opening? ;)
That position is currently filled by The Hobs "Of which all other Glories Fade in Comparison".
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Goblinworks Executive Founder
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Kings can not tax the roads, but they can "hire" bandits to do it for them. It is a semantically designed loophole, got to love Chaotic Neutral construction of rules.Does that fit the River Freedoms, and how so?We don't like the term "bribe", we prefer "tax" but yes, you can pay it and be immune to UNC attacks. If you work out a contract, it can be more "long term" than every caravan we catch or that wishes to travel through our lands. Details will vary and are open to discussion.Does the UnNamed Company take bribes?
Can we just pay a "toll" to go through their territory unmolested?
You have the River Freedoms all wrong. It's not so much that the local power is permitted to use a simple transparent cutout to violate the Freedoms, as it is that they are capable of causing others to not stop them.
Once someone decides to stop them who can do so, then the kings and their pet bandits go from a knowledge (nobility) check to a knowledge (history) check.
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Goblin Squad Member
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| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
+1 Dazyk.
If any UNC would like to go to PMs about what actually happened, Lifedragn, or ANY TEO member would answer your questions.
Other than that, this is the UNC thread, and unlike most of the other threads that have been going hardcore off topic, let us leave this one be.