
Belle Sorciere |
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I once got into a nasty argument with a guy who wanted to play a transgender woman in Wraith. My point was that if he couldn't respect the character enough to use the correct feminine pronouns he shouldn't consider playing the character at all and he was put out by this.
Like respect the character you're playing and you'll probably do fine.

thejeff |
I once got into a nasty argument with a guy who wanted to play a transgender woman in Wraith. My point was that if he couldn't respect the character enough to use the correct feminine pronouns he shouldn't consider playing the character at all and he was put out by this.
Like respect the character you're playing and you'll probably do fine.
Basically this.
I've had enough bad experiences with guys playing women, that I'm somewhat wary. I've seen some play lesbians as a more extreme version - I can play the sexy female and still flirt with girls and avoid the homo issues of a guy playing someone who flirts with guys.
But I've also seen more examples of people doing it well. So, wary but not opposed. Don't be a really horrible jerk about it and it'll be fine.

Wei Ji the Learner |
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I *used* to play what would be charitably called a caricature before some awesome understanding folks pulled me aside and gave me pointers.
As my forum handle indicates, I'm always learning things.
What's been more interesting to me is that the more I learn, the more of a 'feel' I get for these sort of characters, the more sensitive and aware I've become when I see other people doing the caricature route and it puts me in a weird spot.
How does one address that beyond courtesy, dignity, and respect?
Complete aside, and I've mentioned this elsewhere before. I've had alien characters in a different space opera campaign, long-running.
GMs and players had NO problem with me playing a camel-rodent-ish bureaucratic race or a huge giant cat-person... but when I'd bring my straight cis-female human character to the table that wasn't a caricature suddenly the GMs and players would have brain melt-downs and mis-pronoun and try to do distasteful things to my character to 'prove' they weren't either straight or female...

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I don't see a problem with people playing whatever they want as long as they're respectful and not making an ass of themselves portraying a caricature. That goes for LGBTQA and for opposite gender straight characters. Be cool and respectful and its all good. Be a rude jerk and you can leave my table because I don't need you. I really do understand why some people don't like watching others play opposite gender characters or characters that don't match their gender identity though. I've known a few too many guys that want to play female rogues that could fit right into any bad '70s porn movie. And why do they feel the need to be so damned descriptive?
Heck, on the few occasions I've played female characters I inevitably have to warn somebody to quit being a jerk about my character's gender. Takes a lot of the fun out of playing those characters so I tend to restrict what tables I'll play them at. And yes, the jerks are inevitably other guys. If I'm 100% honest, I have not met a female gamer that ever compared to a male gamer when it came to being a jerk. That definitely seems to be the one category were we do have women beat. Strangely, it's something some guys are exceptionally proud of too

Wei Ji the Learner |

If I'm 100% honest, I have not met a female gamer that ever compared to a male gamer when it came to being a jerk. That definitely seems to be the one category were we do have women beat. Strangely, it's something some guys are exceptionally proud of too
The very worst folks I've encountered have been women, though if there was some sort of underlying context I couldn't tell you. Getting a sadistic grin from a female gamer as they 'try to debunk' is one of the most unnerving experiences I've had at the gaming table. *shudder*

Ithsay the Unseen |
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I've been lucky with my gaming groups: nobody has ever cared one way or the other about the gender and/or orientation of the characters I've run. I usually run gay males, because I'm one; on occasion I've run (straight) women and a couple of times -- to mix it up and confuse my fellow-players -- straight men.
Anyway, the groups I've been in haven't really batted an eye in any of these cases; honestly, we're not really concerned with the romantic aspects -- PCs might pair off, otherwise it's a mention of seeking professional company in downtime, and no-one cares with whom.

Drejk |

I have played bisexual males, though it always defaulted to "informed trait" category, declared but never really coming into play.
I did have played ace (a throughly-British male mage of the Hermetic Order) and it was less of an informed trait as I did rejected advances of another mage. She was suspecting Michael to be closeted homosexual, afterwards.

The Doomkitten |
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I mainly play surly lesbian knights.
Who doesn't want to play a surly lesbian knight, though?
Time for serious biz.
With the dust-ups that have been happening in the law recently, how much it'll freak my mom out in the middle of her already super-stressed life, and hearing my conservative grandmother who is going to pay for college complaining loudly about LGBT stuff, I'm starting to consider that maybe it's not the best idea to get the ball rolling on transitioning until I'm independent and can fully support myself.
On the other hand, some part in the back of my mind is theorizing that the HRT will be much more effective if I start it while my body is still going through puberty. On the third, mutant hand, because T and a bunch of other male hormones are pumping through my body right now, maybe the effect will be diluted. With all of this going on, I'm honestly not sure what to do.
Does anybody have any personal experiences and/or professional expertise to help me with my dilemma?

Jessica Price Project Manager |
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tangent, but maybe not so much...
I still run into players and gamemasters that do not understand periods or pregnancy.
Like, "oh you had sex, now your pregnant, you have morning sickness in the morning."
If people are still that ignorant of the process we all arrived by...
Given that our congressmen--you know, the supposed adults who we put in charge of running our country--literally can't say the word "prenatal" without snickering like 10-year-old boys, I'm no longer shocked that people don't understand how pregnancy works.

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Hmm...I'm lucky in that my local lodge is fairly diverse and accepting; every so often someone will say something eyeroll-inducing in passing, but out of ignorance rather than malicious intent, and they're willing to listen when I point it out.
I'm also lucky in that no one here has ever given me a hard time about playing an LGBTQ character (which is most of mine). I am guessing people assume a lot of them to be straight, though; I tend to default to cisgender bisexuals like myself, which comes with the whole passing vs. erasure thing. On the other hand, my tendency to (over)compensate by being (obnoxiously) loud about my identity likely carries over in some cases...
Also, surly lesbian knights! I will always swoon over strong srs ladies in sensible armor.

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Time for serious biz.
In regards to your more serious matter, I don't think there's an easy answer. I didn't start HRT until I was 27 (almost a year ago), and--while it has had great effects so far--the thoughts of how much better it would have been to start earlier never go away. They only get quieter with time and emotional labor. On the other hand, finances are a supremely practical matter that must be handled, and financial dependency upon unsupportive family causes all kinds of issues.
I think the situation comes down to several questions you need to ask yourself:
1. Do I have the emotional strength to get through years of college while closeted?
2. Can I be financially independant if necessary?
3. Will I regret not transitioning sooner?
As a final note in regards to that first question, I would make sure to heavily consider and weigh that question, as the weight of being in the closet and holding something like this in does not come without costs to your health, both physical and emotional.

Abraham spalding |
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Abraham spalding wrote:Given that our congressmen--you know, the supposed adults who we put in charge of running our country--literally can't say the word "prenatal" without snickering like 10-year-old boys, I'm no longer shocked that people don't understand how pregnancy works.tangent, but maybe not so much...
I still run into players and gamemasters that do not understand periods or pregnancy.
Like, "oh you had sex, now your pregnant, you have morning sickness in the morning."
If people are still that ignorant of the process we all arrived by...
On the plus side I've found it's almost universally been due to ignorance with the people I have played with.
While it has led to some talks that I'm not certain I was the best person to be having them with I did the best I could and generally think the effort was appreciated and acted on (i.e. the person fixed their ignorance and assumptions).
It's part of the reason I keep coming back to this thread, discussions like the one currently going on about HRT are helpful to me understanding my fellow people better, and I hope keep me from making them uncomfortable and possibly even be helpful instead.

Ithsay the Unseen |
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Off-topic; I found a group to play Pathfinder with!
Much better fit than the batch of teenagers playing 5E that was the last open group I tried... we got more done in two and a half hours than the two four-hour sessions I endured before giving up.
So, woot! Have been jonesing for a game so badly that I'd've joined a game of Paranoia...

KSF |
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Time for serious biz.
I second everything Hrothdane said, particularly the three questions she laid out.
Further, I'd add....
If you do want to get going on HRT now, don't worry about all the testosterone you've got going on at the moment. Spironolactone (the T-blocker commonly used in HRT) will knock that stuff right out. Like, quickly.
As Hrothdane said, the financial side is important, both in terms of supporting the medical costs of transition and in terms of supporting yourself.
I would suggest looking into how much basic HRT might cost you - estrogen, testosterone blocker (spiro), periodic checkups and blood tests to check liver and kidney function. Depending on the delivery method used for estrogen, it might not be unmanageable. At the very least it's good to know how much it'll cost you a month once you do get things up and running. That doesn't solve the problem of parental support, or your grandmother's support for college. But the more information you have when you make decisions about this, the better.
I'd also suggest, if you know where you're going to college (if things are that close) that you look and see what sort of coverage they offer for transgender medical care, and what they offer in terms of therapy.
Therapy can be very important. As Hrothdane says, the weight of being in the closet does not come without cost. I didn't start transitioning till I was 41, and didn't come out publicly for another 9 months after that. Three years later, I'm still working through a lot of damage caused by my time in the closet.
However, if you need to wait until after college, that's okay. Many people have. I see a lot of younger trans people these days expressing fears about whether it's too late to start, including some who fear that starting after 18 is too late. And that's simply not true. Some of the physical results may be different, and the effectiveness of HRT may decrease once you're older (like around my age), but it can still be effective, and your physical results depend on your genetics as much as anything else.
I'm a "late transitioner," and even though there are some physical aspects of my body I'm not happy about, and probably will never be happy about, I do pass, and there are some physical aspects that I am super happy with. HRT worked as advertised.
And the non-physical results are, I think, powerful and vital regardless of when you start, and are more important to your long-term well-being than the physical effects, in my experience.
So my immediate suggestions are:
1. Be safe. If you need to wait, wait in the knowledge that it's okay to do so.
2. Look into the costs and into the practical details of transition. Here are the WPATH Standards of Care, which are a good place to start. And here is WPATH's website.
3. If you can start seeing a therapist now who has experience with trans people and gender issues, do so. If not, try to see what you can set up while in college. Even a couple of sessions can help. Just saying words out loud to another human being can help.
4. When you're looking at colleges, look at what kind of resources they have for trans people, and not just health services but things like LGBTQ campus centers. Even if you don't transition in college, it can be good to build a support network. You don't have to wait until you're on hormones to start talking to other people about this stuff, if those people are supportive. You're unlikely to be the only trans person on campus.
And in my experience, and as you've seen on these boards, there are also a lot of super awesome cisgender women who can support you as well. My friendships with cisgender women, and the discussions we've had and time we've spent together, have ended up being one of the more vital components of my own transition. It's good to have girlfriends.
5. And if you do decide to wait a bit, don't let anger or frustration toward your body, or resentment toward it, turn into neglect of your body. Get in the habit of taking care of yourself. Once you do transition, you'll be happy that you did.

thejeff |
The Doomkitten wrote:Time for serious biz.I second everything Hrothdane said, particularly the three questions she laid out.
Further, I'd add....
If you do want to get going on HRT now, don't worry about all the testosterone you've got going on at the moment. Spironolactone (the T-blocker commonly used in HRT) will knock that stuff right out. Like, quickly.
I'm not at all an expert on this, but would it make sense to start the testosterone blocker without starting full HRT? Push off the male physical changes.

Rosita the Riveter |

While we're on the topic, how bad is muscle mass reduction from HRT? I'm decently built for a 25 year old with a male body, amd I need that muscle at work to lift all sorts of stuff, from large beverage cases to furniture, and some of what I do taxes my limits. I worry that HRT would end up impacting my ability to do my job.

Quark Blast |
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I'm posting this link here because this seems the most apt location, since it's all about gender issues though not expressly LGBTQ.
Giving up alcohol opened my eyes to the infuriating truth about why women drink
Is this really what white-collar careers look like?
This does not make me happy. I'm hoping for sampling bias in the linked article but she makes it sound rather widespread. If generally true I need to learn myself a trade as an escape hatch from the hell of this sort of work environment.

Cole Deschain |
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I'm posting this link here because this seems the most apt location, since it's all about gender issues though not expressly LGBTQ.
Giving up alcohol opened my eyes to the infuriating truth about why women drink
Is this really what white-collar careers look like?
This does not make me happy. I'm hoping for sampling bias in the linked article but she makes it sound rather widespread. If generally true I need to learn myself a trade as an escape hatch from the hell of this sort of work environment.
Anecdotally, my hetereo-cisgender male self can absolutely back up what that article describes. I've seen it.
Especially the bit where the the two guys talk about how great it is to be a woman working there immediately after the only woman on stage just said it could present a problem.
And I don't think it's so much limited to white collar work as it is simply the author's experience has been in the white collar world.
Well, I need to amend that- the oblivious, blind, indifferent sort of stuff seems more prevalent in the white collar sphere, but only because blue collar jobs tend to both have a smaller percentage of women involved and be more open about the sexism present in the workforce.

Quark Blast |
Quark Blast wrote:Anecdotally, <snip> Well, I need to amend that- the oblivious, blind, indifferent sort of stuff seems more prevalent in the white collar sphere, but only because blue collar jobs tend to both have a smaller percentage of women involved and be more open about the sexism present in the workforce.I'm posting this link here because this seems the most apt location, since it's all about gender issues though not expressly LGBTQ.
Giving up alcohol opened my eyes to the infuriating truth about why women drink
Is this really what white-collar careers look like?
This does not make me happy. I'm hoping for sampling bias in the linked article but she makes it sound rather widespread. If generally true I need to learn myself a trade as an escape hatch from the hell of this sort of work environment.
LOL! Well there goes my backup plan of having a trade job to escape the inanity of it all.
Related question. Do people really drink that much?

thejeff |
Cole Deschain wrote:Quark Blast wrote:Anecdotally, <snip> Well, I need to amend that- the oblivious, blind, indifferent sort of stuff seems more prevalent in the white collar sphere, but only because blue collar jobs tend to both have a smaller percentage of women involved and be more open about the sexism present in the workforce.I'm posting this link here because this seems the most apt location, since it's all about gender issues though not expressly LGBTQ.
Giving up alcohol opened my eyes to the infuriating truth about why women drink
Is this really what white-collar careers look like?
This does not make me happy. I'm hoping for sampling bias in the linked article but she makes it sound rather widespread. If generally true I need to learn myself a trade as an escape hatch from the hell of this sort of work environment.
LOL! Well there goes my backup plan of having a trade job to escape the inanity of it all.
Related question. Do people really drink that much?
The drinking seemed over the top to me. I've never seen an office with bars built in or wine on every desk. Or a pharmacy with beer on tap.
I suspect that's partly intentional - reflecting what the world looked like to her when she was trying to stay sober - temptation everywhere.
Cole Deschain |

LOL! Well there goes my backup plan of having a trade job to escape the inanity of it all.
Related question. Do people really drink that much?
I think the amount of actual consumption is perhaps overstated, but not the kneejerk, "get booze to cope with that" response from the wider macro-culture- which makes a fair bit of sense (my heaviest drinking years were also my most miserable years), but which doesn't help attempts at sobriety one bit.

Jessica Price Project Manager |
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Quark Blast wrote:I'm posting this link here because this seems the most apt location, since it's all about gender issues though not expressly LGBTQ.
Giving up alcohol opened my eyes to the infuriating truth about why women drink
Is this really what white-collar careers look like?
This does not make me happy. I'm hoping for sampling bias in the linked article but she makes it sound rather widespread. If generally true I need to learn myself a trade as an escape hatch from the hell of this sort of work environment.
Anecdotally, my hetereo-cisgender male self can absolutely back up what that article describes. I've seen it.
Especially the bit where the the two guys talk about how great it is to be a woman working there immediately after the only woman on stage just said it could present a problem.
And I don't think it's so much limited to white collar work as it is simply the author's experience has been in the white collar world.
Well, I need to amend that- the oblivious, blind, indifferent sort of stuff seems more prevalent in the white collar sphere, but only because blue collar jobs tend to both have a smaller percentage of women involved and be more open about the sexism present in the workforce.
It's strange how it plays out -- I came from law, where the sexism was institutional and open: an overwhelming majority of the lawyers at my firm were male, while all the paralegals and legal secretaries were female. So the roles at the company were literally--though not impermeably--segregated by gender.
And with the exception of one old, crochety partner, the (mostly male) partners and other senior lawyers at the firm were enormously supportive of me. They offered me advice on the LSAT and law school, they encouraged me to come back after law school for a job, and while there were certainly traces of sexism, it was generally of the unintentional/traditional/"benign" sort--I got a lot of compliments on my looks, they jumped in to explain things a little too quickly, and so on.
They were quite open about law being sexist, too. They weren't sure how to fix it, other than getting more female partners in at their firm, but they acknowledged it, they acknowledged the world had changed and they weren't always sure how to change with it, etc. When I pointed out double standards, they were usually eager to fix them.
Whereas in tech/games, the sexism is very much misogyny. It's hostile, it's intentional, but the industry doesn't want to admit it exists, and people tend to get angry when you point it out.
I suspect there's a lot to do with security, there. The younger associates at the law firm were a lot more like the guys in tech--frat boys, felt the need to prove their superiority to women, etc.
And from what I know of real estate (it's my parents' field, and I've worked in it a bit, since for a while I thought I'd do real estate law), there's a similar pattern playing out. There are a lot of women in powerful positions (like my dad's mentor--and the older men in secure, senior positions were usually very helpful, but the younger men were competitive in a misogynist way.
I don't think the white-collar stuff is any more oblivious than the blue-collar sexism.
There's a tendency to portray higher-class, more educated portions of the populace as more progressive, but the truth is considerably more complex than that and always has been. Part of the reason we have this idea that women got married super-young in the past is because we focus on records from the nobility, whereas the average age of marriage, first childbirth, etc. has been fairly consistent for non-noble women back through the middle ages (their mid-twenties). Upper-class women have generally been the ones who have the means and leisure to think and write about gender issues, and are therefore the ones participating in organized ideologies, so we tend to assume they have more freedom. But their lives have often been more constrained than those of women in lower-class positions, who have been running businesses, having more sexual freedom, etc. because they had to, or because no one cared enough to stop them.
Upper-class women have the vocabulary and framework for talking about oppression, but that doesn't necessarily translate to greater freedom from it, especially since A) academia is itself ardently misogynist, and B) it's among the privileged (wealthy people, white people, etc.) that women's behavior becomes the minutely scrutinized mark of class.
All of which is to say, white-collar and blue-collar jobs are sexist in different ways. But having worked in a number of white-collar prestige industries (banking, real estate, law, tech), it seems to me that white-collar men (at least those in my age group) claim to be enlightened, but seem to be unable to see us as anything but women first and people second. Whereas the blue-collar men I've dealt with openly espoused sexist attitudes, but once I proved myself to them, they seemed to see me as a person first and a woman second.
Both suck, but the white-collar version is harder to fight. I think it's probably related to why education isn't proof against being an anti-vaxxer, believing in other types of pseudoscience, etc.--regardless of education level, facts don't actually change people's minds, but educated people can actually come up with counterarguments to ideas they don't like, which may make them harder to sway with facts. I suspect something similar explains the intractability of white-collar misogyny.

Jessica Price Project Manager |

Quark Blast wrote:Cole Deschain wrote:Quark Blast wrote:Anecdotally, <snip> Well, I need to amend that- the oblivious, blind, indifferent sort of stuff seems more prevalent in the white collar sphere, but only because blue collar jobs tend to both have a smaller percentage of women involved and be more open about the sexism present in the workforce.I'm posting this link here because this seems the most apt location, since it's all about gender issues though not expressly LGBTQ.
Giving up alcohol opened my eyes to the infuriating truth about why women drink
Is this really what white-collar careers look like?
This does not make me happy. I'm hoping for sampling bias in the linked article but she makes it sound rather widespread. If generally true I need to learn myself a trade as an escape hatch from the hell of this sort of work environment.
LOL! Well there goes my backup plan of having a trade job to escape the inanity of it all.
Related question. Do people really drink that much?
The drinking seemed over the top to me. I've never seen an office with bars built in or wine on every desk. Or a pharmacy with beer on tap.
I suspect that's partly intentional - reflecting what the world looked like to her when she was trying to stay sober - temptation everywhere.
I dunno, booze is everywhere in tech, and abundant in workplaces.

thejeff |
thejeff wrote:I dunno, booze is everywhere in tech, and abundant in workplaces.Quark Blast wrote:
Related question. Do people really drink that much?The drinking seemed over the top to me. I've never seen an office with bars built in or wine on every desk. Or a pharmacy with beer on tap.
I suspect that's partly intentional - reflecting what the world looked like to her when she was trying to stay sober - temptation everywhere.
Maybe? I don't work in a startup or anything like that, so maybe the culture is different. I mean, sure people drink after work and talk about drinking, but not openly drinking at work. No bottles on the office desks or anything. Closest would be going out for lunch and having a drink or two.
Or at office parties, but that's not work time.

Quark Blast |
said lots of useful things and this
They were quite open about law being sexist, too. They weren't sure how to fix it, other than getting more female partners in at their firm, but they acknowledged it, they acknowledged the world had changed and they weren't always sure how to change with it, etc. When I pointed out double standards, they were usually eager to fix them.
Based on various team activities I've been involved in; if the gender numbers aren't at parity then the cliques never go away; sexist or otherwise actually. And by otherwise, it can be things like relative wealth, fandom, as well as the old standby of ethnicity.
People are really good at self-selection and staying in their comfort zones.
And thanks for the complete answer! I'm not sure but I think I can find a place to work that is some sort of middle ground with all these issues. No use finding the perfect place since I would just mess it up once I was hired on.

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Time for serious biz.
** spoiler omitted **
Hrothdane and KSF both have some excellent advice on this front, and I just want to chime in with: Don't worry too much about a few years' wait ruining your chances for a successful transition. Hormonal changes (in either direction) are very gradual, and waiting a few years won't cause too many problems if you need to. And like KSF said: Even if you can't start HRT, at least take good care of your body; it's the only one you've got and it's the raw clay you'll have to sculpt your real body from.
On the other side of things, you can easily start HRT and not worry about transitioning socially for years, if needbe. Again, most of the changes are slow and gradual. You skin will soften and clear in the first few months, but other changes take at least six months, and sometimes many years (just like any other girl's puberty). You can also look into testosterone blockers to slow or eliminate any further puberty damage; Spironolactone is the cheapest part of HRT, but also the most dangerous. If either of these sound like an approach you'd want to try, talk to an informed consent clinic; they exist to tell you about the effects and risks of medical treatment, but not bar you from unusual paths.
College is a really stressful time, even without adding transition to the mix. I ultimately had a lot of problems in college because I was visibly trans with virtually no support network or resources, and even though I'm happy that I got to transition young, I regret how many opportunities focusing on my transition cost me. It's a difficult balancing act, and I know in my own experience that navigating it became a LOT easier once I found a therapist with experience helping transgender patients. Even if you don't do anything in terms of hormones just yet, absolutely find yourself a quality therapist to help you keep organized, teach you to manage stress, and understand your feelings.

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While we're on the topic, how bad is muscle mass reduction from HRT? I'm decently built for a 25 year old with a male body, amd I need that muscle at work to lift all sorts of stuff, from large beverage cases to furniture, and some of what I do taxes my limits. I worry that HRT would end up impacting my ability to do my job.
Testosterone is a steroid. It doesn't make muscle out of nothing (there are plenty of hairy dudes out there with no muscle mass to speak of), it just makes it easier to build and maintain muscle when you work at it. On HRT, you might see some reduction of how faster you can put on muscle, but so long as you're keeping up a steady workload over time, it won't affect you much. Your maximum ability and endurance may both drop slightly, but you shouldn't see much impact on your day-to-day routine.
I know plenty of buff trans ladies.

Caineach |

Jessica Price wrote:thejeff wrote:I dunno, booze is everywhere in tech, and abundant in workplaces.Quark Blast wrote:
Related question. Do people really drink that much?The drinking seemed over the top to me. I've never seen an office with bars built in or wine on every desk. Or a pharmacy with beer on tap.
I suspect that's partly intentional - reflecting what the world looked like to her when she was trying to stay sober - temptation everywhere.
Maybe? I don't work in a startup or anything like that, so maybe the culture is different. I mean, sure people drink after work and talk about drinking, but not openly drinking at work. No bottles on the office desks or anything. Closest would be going out for lunch and having a drink or two.
Or at office parties, but that's not work time.
My buddy works for a startup in Seattle and brags about the kegs in the office. If your sober at work your in the minority, and there is a very fraty mentality. Meanwhile, the most I have ever seen is groups that hit up a bar and have maybe 1 beer, 2 on special occasions, at lunch, and while there is some discussions about alcohol, no one talks about getting wasted as recent things. I think it has a lot to do with the corporate environment you are in.

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I know plenty of buff trans ladies.
Yeah, I remember seeing a post going around on tumblr with lots of buff trans ladies showing their pictures (I, uh, maybe showed off my bicep on it...).. I know some trans ladies that have even expressed disappointment at how little HRT has reduced their muscle mass.

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Crystal Frasier wrote:Yeah, I remember seeing a post going around on tumblr with lots of buff trans ladies showing their pictures (I, uh, maybe showed off my bicep on it...).. I know some trans ladies that have even expressed disappointment at how little HRT has reduced their muscle mass.I know plenty of buff trans ladies.
Mmmm.. I remember that thread.
And yeah, HRT isn't a magic potion (although it feels like it when you compare before and after pics). It just changes your body chemistry to be like most other women's. If you're muscly or big-boned, you'll still be muscly and/or big-boned (and I say this is a big-boned woman who was muscly during her transition)

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Thanks for popping in, Crystal!
Yeah, thanks for all the advice, everybody who pitched in. I might go for testosterone blockers at this point, just so I can stop growing hair in a surprisingly large-and disturbing-amount of places, but I don't think I'll be going all in yet. Thank you all so much!
Probably the most responsible plan for now. It lets you go whichever way you'd like in the future. Good luck!

TerminalArtiste |

Venting about romantic troubles under the cut:
So I've been chatting with this guy lately, and most of the time we have nice conversation and whatnot but then sometimes he just. Ignores me? For days at a time? And just today I saw him on campus (he's starting at my university this semester) and he said he would hang out after he sorted out some business he had to take care of but then he never showed? And I guess I'm just getting mixed signals. I mean I like the guy and I'd like something nice to come of this but he keeps blowing me off and...
I'm just annoyed at it, and I don't know how to talk to him about it without making it all...awkward? And part of me keeps saying "He's ignoring you on purpose, he doesn't like you, he's just being as barely nice as he is out of politeness," and I just. Don't know how right that is. I don't want it to be right.

Violet Hargrave |
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I mainly play surly lesbian knights.
Who doesn't want to play a surly lesbian knight, though?
Time for serious biz.
Spoiler:With the dust-ups that have been happening in the law recently, how much it'll freak my mom out in the middle of her already super-stressed life, and hearing my conservative grandmother who is going to pay for college complaining loudly about LGBT stuff, I'm starting to consider that maybe it's not the best idea to get the ball rolling on transitioning until I'm independent and can fully support myself.On the other hand, some part in the back of my mind is theorizing that the HRT will be much more effective if I start it while my body is still going through puberty. On the third, mutant hand, because T and a bunch of other male hormones are pumping through my body right now, maybe the effect will be diluted. With all of this going on, I'm honestly not sure what to do.
Does anybody have any personal experiences and/or professional expertise to help me with my dilemma?
I'm in something of a similar boat on the stressed-out-mom front, but I'd still advise getting the ball rolling sooner rather than later for a few reasons. Which I'm also going to spoiler because wow I can ramble on.
Also, there tends to be a lot more groundwork to be laid with transitioning than just deciding it's what you're going to do. Personally, I spent decades fretting over coming out to my family as trans, carefully testing the waters, bringing up other trans women I know and what they go through, pointing out examples of awful bigotry, etc. Then when I finally built up the courage to tell my mother I was trans, she just said "No you aren't." And thus began months (if not years) of having to chip my way through that wall of denial she tossed up. If nothing else, knowing me as "her son" for all these extra years just makes it harder for her to process. And then of course after dealing with that, depending on where you live and what doctors you see, actually getting access to HRT and any surgeries you might eventually go for could involve wading through red tape for years, so it's good to get the ball rolling as soon as you can in case the track turns out to be extra long.
Gaining your financial independence first can help sidestep stressing out your family, but again, coming out to them will still cause stress either way, and moreso if it's a sudden "here's what I'm doing" surprise than something they can start processing as a future possibility while working out how to eventually afford it. That and you need to consider that financial independence isn't guaranteed to anyone. The job market can be rough for anyone, but if you're acutely aware you're trans and still in the closet, it tends to lower your confidence quite a bit, and then you're just setting yourself up for "well, if I come out now I might lose my job."
Finally, there's the recent spike in transphobia, but that's happening because A Certain Political Party got together at a planning session and decided to make it their big wedge issue. So it should die down at least a bit after election season (and even if you started HRT today, nobody would likely notice before then), after which it should either stay relatively dead as a failed strategy, or it's something that's going to keep flaring back up every two years for the next decade or two, and you don't want to stall for that long, trust me.

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Venting about romantic troubles under the cut:
** spoiler omitted **
This sounds like the perfect case for my go-to relationship advice: use your words!
Sorry if that comes off glib, but I'll expand on it. Consider whether you're just generally saying "we should hang out" or if you're making specific plans like "let's get coffee at X o clock this weekend"; the latter is super preferable. You may already be doing that, but I couldn't tell from what you provided. If he's flaking on you after you make concrete plans and not letting you know ahead of time that he can't make it when he doesn't show, then it's time to consider whether you want to keep inviting him to spend time with you. If so, just be honest (with him and with yourself), and bring it up directly: say that you feel like he's breaking plans with you a lot, and ask if he actually wants to hang out, or if there are times that would work better for his schedule. He might just be busy (after all, university can be hectic), or otherwise just not have the time or schedule to spare. Just be honest with yourself about how you feel and what you want and do your best to communicate that to him; it might be hard, but you can't dice this problem if this guy doesn't even know it's a problem!

Rosita the Riveter |
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Rosita the Riveter wrote:While we're on the topic, how bad is muscle mass reduction from HRT? I'm decently built for a 25 year old with a male body, amd I need that muscle at work to lift all sorts of stuff, from large beverage cases to furniture, and some of what I do taxes my limits. I worry that HRT would end up impacting my ability to do my job.Testosterone is a steroid. It doesn't make muscle out of nothing (there are plenty of hairy dudes out there with no muscle mass to speak of), it just makes it easier to build and maintain muscle when you work at it. On HRT, you might see some reduction of how faster you can put on muscle, but so long as you're keeping up a steady workload over time, it won't affect you much. Your maximum ability and endurance may both drop slightly, but you shouldn't see much impact on your day-to-day routine.
I know plenty of buff trans ladies.
Yeah, I remember seeing a post going around on tumblr with lots of buff trans ladies showing their pictures (I, uh, maybe showed off my bicep on it...).. I know some trans ladies that have even expressed disappointment at how little HRT has reduced their muscle mass.
Mmmm.. I remember that thread.
And yeah, HRT isn't a magic potion (although it feels like it when you compare before and after pics). It just changes your body chemistry to be like most other women's. If you're muscly or big-boned, you'll still be muscly and/or big-boned (and I say this is a big-boned woman who was muscly during her transition)
Good to hear. This is the first time in my life I've actually been strong, and it's kind of uplifting after a lifetime of being decidedly unmuscular and needing help all the time.
If I can ask another question, do you know anything about the experiences of transwomen who are particularly overweight? I may be nice and muscular now, but I'm well over 100 pounds above what's healthy for a male-bodied individual of my age and height, and a lot of it is belly fat. My friends think I've lost weight even though I really haven't, which tells me I've been converting some of the belly fat into muscle, but I still have a quite noticeable gut. I love cheese, beer, and fried food, and it shows big time.

KSF |
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If I can ask another question, do you know anything about the experiences of transwomen who are particularly overweight? I may be nice and muscular now, but I'm well over 100 pounds above what's healthy for a male-bodied individual of my age and height, and a lot of it is belly fat. My friends think I've lost weight even though I really haven't, which tells me I've been converting some of the belly fat into muscle, but I still have a quite noticeable gut. I love cheese, beer, and fried food, and it shows big time.
There's a term that I remember coming across in the medical literature about transition, fat migration. That's a bit of a misnomer, as the fat itself doesn't move, the sites of fat accumulation move.
In my experience, the weight you were already carrying in typically male locations stays where it's at when you transition. Any new fat generated once you're on HRT will form in more typically female locations.
(Haven't lost weight since I transitioned, so I'm not sure how weight loss comes into play here, in terms of how the fat is lost in either set of areas.)

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Rosita the Riveter wrote:If I can ask another question, do you know anything about the experiences of transwomen who are particularly overweight? I may be nice and muscular now, but I'm well over 100 pounds above what's healthy for a male-bodied individual of my age and height, and a lot of it is belly fat. My friends think I've lost weight even though I really haven't, which tells me I've been converting some of the belly fat into muscle, but I still have a quite noticeable gut. I love cheese, beer, and fried food, and it shows big time.There's a term that I remember coming across in the medical literature about transition, fat migration. That's a bit of a misnomer, as the fat itself doesn't move, the sites of fat accumulation move.
In my experience, the weight you were already carrying in typically male locations stays where it's at when you transition. Any new fat generated once you're on HRT will form in more typically female locations.
(Haven't lost weight since I transitioned, so I'm not sure how weight loss comes into play here, in terms of how the fat is lost in either set of areas.)
What KSF said. The fat that's there when you start stays, but new fat gets deposited in different locations. I don't have much experience first-hand (I started HRT while struggling with an eating disorder, and was unhealthily thin), but I've seen several trans women transition while overweight and look just fine. I have only anecdotal evidence, but it seems like if you start HRT, lose a lot of weight, and then gain it back, you body seems to do a much better job of putting fat in "feminine" places (but, and hips, mostly) than if you start HRT skinny and gain weight from there. The trans women I know who've bounced through that cycle (unintentionally) seem to have to best hips and butts of any of the trans women I know (not scientific evidence, I know; just speculation).
Overall, extra body fat doesn't seem to have been an impediment to any of the trans women I've known, though being too skinny has been.