| 1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. |
I think they meant 'mounted archer' instead of 'mounted charge'. That should be clarified by a designer. The one-handed bit isn't part of the archetype but rather something from earlier posters erroneously thinking that you need quick draw to use Iaijitsu strike.
@Boggard
I don't think it is super powered overall, hence "conditionally awesome". I like it enough to possible give it a shot at some point. I love the draw-strike-kill theme, just it is something here that must be carefully used to get maximum benefit from each challenge and iaijutsu strike.
As to the one-handed element
Sword Saint
"The following benefits apply only when a sword saint is using a sword and carrying nothing in his other hand."
Free-hand fighter
"His fighting school benefits only apply when he is using a one-handed weapon and carrying nothing in his other hand."
In the case of the free-hand fighter, if this wording did not mean that you must be one handing your weapon, you could use a one-handed weapon in two hands for all abilities other than singleton, which I believe goes against intent, if not outright writing.
With regards to drawing the weapon as part of the iaijutsu strike, I have also come to the position that the ability draws the weapon.
After making an iaijutsu strike, a sword saint takes a –4 penalty to his AC until his next turn, but his weapon is now drawn and he may continually to fight normally."
Alright, this line is what has lead me to divine intent regarding the issue. If it assumed that you used the "Draw or Sheathe a Weapon" action, it would have been a foregone conclusion that your weapon was out and you could fight normally. Since it directly states it, I would say that it does indeed draw the weapon. I might say it could have been worded a little more directly without changing the amount of page space it took up. My bad all around on that one.
I would also have to agree that switch hitting after your foe has closed the distance or attacking and then taking a move action the previous round to sheath your katana would work because it merely states that you have to choose this attack option after you have targeted a foe with your challenge ability but before you attack that targeted foe...the previous round he was just an ordinary foe...this round he is your targeted foe of your challenge which meets the requirement of Iaijutsu Strike. To me that all just makes sense.
Honestly this is the interpretation that I would probably run at my table if someone wanted to use this. It would just take too much flexability away from the ability to read it harshly. It is already a small difficulty to perform, I need not make it an even greater difficulty by not allowing him to use it if he attacked prior to the challenge. It also sidesteps problems like "If it does not begin with the challenge, can I not Iaijutsu Strike this man this evening if I shot an arrow at this man in the morning? It does not state how long I must wait since I attacked him before I can attempt to iaijutsu strike him." The challenge criteria offers a much easier to deal with time-frame.
What if you carried two swords?
Move in and attack, then drop sword 1. Challenge and iaijutsu strike rd 2?
Not sure what you are trying to get at here. Assuming that we use the challenge as basis for time regarding iaijutsu's "cannot attack before the iaijutsu strike" then you could fight him normally with your whatever weapon, then just hold it in one hand, declare your challenge, draw your wakizashi or katana for an iaijutsu strike, then drop or return the sword to the sheath and continue to fight with your first weapon. There is no overt need to drop swords. Honestly could be an interesting idea for a two weapon fighter if he were to fight with his katana two-handed, then challenge and draw his wakizashi for suprise iaijutsu damage and continue the fight Musashi style.
I wish they'd read all of the class they were modifying when they created this alternative. At least one of the alternative features replaces something that does not exist and its closest approximate feature comes in a level later.
Furthermore, I might be remembering it wrong, but I believe I remember myself being disappointed that it didn't replace all of the Samurai's mount-related features. Most of them, sure, but you still get this one ability that you're never going to use and no, you can't replace it either.
. . .
If they missed one, I can't find it. As for the mistaken ability, it looks like they were thinking Cavalier’s Charge, which would be third level. Regardless, it is fairly clear that for the samurai they intended it to replace mounted archery. I suppose there is nothing saying that the replacement abilities cannot come at different levels than the one they replace anyway. Not a terrible ruling if you were to move it to the "correct" level regardless.
. . .
Finally, it's a serviceable alternative to putting up with a mount, but it only works with one-handed weapons. Not enough. They could have done better.
. . .
I might ask what is wrong exactly with the one-handed (and light) weapons within the context of this one ability? All things considered I see that like complaining about the one-handed fighter being one-handed. This is the exact motion of which you are doing with the iaijutsu strike For the impatient this is the cleanest example from the video with none of the explanation. Fantasy game, sure is. I never want to see someone doing this with a pike or halberd. The five foot long greatsword and nodachi are also fairly inappropriate for this. The samurai gets free one-handed proficiency with the katana, which is arguably one of the best one-handed weapon out there. Your damage is coming from power attack, challenge, and iaijutsu for this strike. The base weapon is practically irrelevant, just with Brutal Slash making either a 18-20 or x4 weapon look a little stronger.
. . .
They have to have realized that people might want to play a quadrupedal Cavalier (or Samurai, for that matter). Therefore, either they intend for Centaurs riding horses to be allowed, or they included alternatives so that quadrupedal races aren't at a disadvantage when they select this class or alternate class.
I should hope that they do offer some suggestions for alternate abilities with the new characters that are very much more incomparable with mounted combat. They would have to prevent penalizing knights of these races for no particularly good reason.
That said, all classes including samurai and cavaliers (both I will call "knight" at times) are basically taking PFS play into account where you will not have quadrupeds characters at all. Both of them are classes about mounted combat, with the samurai being a more infantry take. Regardless, if you have a people who have no mounted combat, I doubt they would have mounted combat classes. If they do not have a feudal structure to boot, they are less likely to have knights. Within the game setting both of these classes are the products of humanoid society. Not that I am going to seriously sit here and say that it would be correct to just shaft the quadrupeds, but there is a case to be made that thematically it is not required to give them a replacement ability.
The game should take into account many different play styles, but it will probably be assumed that if you do something well outside of PFS guidelines, it is up to you to make fixes as needed.
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There is no overt need to drop swords. Honestly could be an interesting idea for a two weapon fighter if he were to fight with his katana two-handed, then challenge and draw his wakizashi for suprise iaijutsu damage and continue the fight Musashi style.
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This is my plan for the upcoming Jade Regent game I'm in, so I'll see how viable it is in actual play within the next few months.
This is my plan for the upcoming Jade Regent game I'm in, so I'll see how viable it is in actual play within the next few months....
There is no overt need to drop swords. Honestly could be an interesting idea for a two weapon fighter if he were to fight with his katana two-handed, then challenge and draw his wakizashi for suprise iaijutsu damage and continue the fight Musashi style.
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Is there any written explanation as to the difference between "Carry" and "hold?" The way I read it was to say there can't be anything in the hand you aren't striking with...
I was just being an idiot, thinking back to the Oriental Adventures iaijutsu rules. Back when you could longspear and double-bladed sword (only with one end of course) iaijutsu strike and there was no off-hand note.
Yeah, nothing in the off hand, you would have to put the two-handed weapon away then you could iaijutsu strike. Still don't NEED to drop swords. I always advocate sheathing weapons instead of dropping them if possible. I still like the idea of transitioning into two-weapon fighting because of the challenge bonus damage. Quick draw the wakizashi after you get done with your main attack.
Replacing sleep with coffee does not always end well.
God, and in the same post where I even pointed out the one handed thing. I almost should be banned.
It is not written in the class ability section but at the end of the fluff explaining the class it mentions: The following benefits apply only when a sword saint is using a sword and carrying nothing in his other hand.
So RAI it is not meant for 2h or TWF and only with swords.
You can't iaijutsu strike two-handed or with two weapons. However, after that first big hit, you are a regular samurai and should start two-handing your weapon or can draw your second sword. RAI here is only concerned with iaijutsu strike, and well it is a one-handed attack. Intent does not say that the sword saint needs to be one-handed only after his iaijutsu strike.
If any of my players show interest in taking this archetype in the JR campaign I'm running, I'll probably allow for iaijutsu strike to modify the attack action instead of a full-round action, therefore allowing it to be paired with vital strike. It's not that powerful of an ability, honestly, and can only be used on the subject of a challenge once per day. You give up a lot for situational precision damage and a couple debuffs.
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If any of my players show interest in taking this archetype in the JR campaign I'm running, I'll probably allow for iaijutsu strike to modify the attack action instead of a full-round action, therefore allowing it to be paired with vital strike. It's not that powerful of an ability, honestly, and can only be used on the subject of a challenge once per day. You give up a lot for situational precision damage and a couple debuffs.
Design protip : don't make iaijutsu modify the attack action.
Make the vital strike feats usable as part of the attack made during the full-round action instead.
@Majesticmoose
You didn't read up high enough in the description. It is at the end of that top chunk of writing, right before your long quote from sword saint. It is in the same location relatively that all of the special conditions on the archetypes are located.
As to the one-handed element
Sword Saint
"The following benefits apply only when a sword saint is using a sword and carrying nothing in his other hand."
Free-hand fighter
"His fighting school benefits only apply when he is using a one-handed weapon and carrying nothing in his other hand."
In the case of the free-hand fighter, if this wording did not mean that you must be one handing your weapon, you could use a one-handed weapon in two hands for all abilities other than singleton, which I believe goes against intent, if not outright writing.
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@Majesticmoose
You didn't read up high enough in the description. It is at the end of that top chunk of writing, right before your long quote from sword saint. It is in the same location relatively that all of the special conditions on the archetypes are located.As to the one-handed element
Sword Saint
"The following benefits apply only when a sword saint is using a sword and carrying nothing in his other hand."
Free-hand fighter
"His fighting school benefits only apply when he is using a one-handed weapon and carrying nothing in his other hand."
In the case of the free-hand fighter, if this wording did not mean that you must be one handing your weapon, you could use a one-handed weapon in two hands for all abilities other than singleton, which I believe goes against intent, if not outright writing.
Yeah. What I was hoping to go for was perhaps a quick, Iaijutsu greatsword strike, but that's not possible due to the restrictions. Quick-draw on the other hand is entirely possible, and I've done it before.
However...Could, with exotic weapon proficiency, a bastard-sword be used instead?
If any of my players show interest in taking this archetype in the JR campaign I'm running, I'll probably allow for iaijutsu strike to modify the attack action instead of a full-round action, therefore allowing it to be paired with vital strike. It's not that powerful of an ability, honestly, and can only be used on the subject of a challenge once per day. You give up a lot for situational precision damage and a couple debuffs.Design protip : don't make iaijutsu modify the attack action.
Make the vital strike feats usable as part of the attack made during the full-round action instead.
Wouldn't they both serve the same end? Modifying the attack action just allows a PC a move action before the iaijutsu strike.
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Wouldn't they both serve the same end? Modifying the attack action just allows a PC a move action before the iaijutsu strike.If any of my players show interest in taking this archetype in the JR campaign I'm running, I'll probably allow for iaijutsu strike to modify the attack action instead of a full-round action, therefore allowing it to be paired with vital strike. It's not that powerful of an ability, honestly, and can only be used on the subject of a challenge once per day. You give up a lot for situational precision damage and a couple debuffs.Design protip : don't make iaijutsu modify the attack action.
Make the vital strike feats usable as part of the attack made during the full-round action instead.
Except that right now they could only do it at 10th level (full-round becomes standard) instead of 1st ; and not receiving this capacity nine levels sooner is part of the archetype's intended balance. ;)
Hmm, true. I forgot about the level 10 action downgrade. I think I will do it the other way. Thanks for the advice!
Seems a lot of people are having issues with the actions required to perform Iaijutsu Strike. Many appear to be in favor of changing Iaijutsu Strike at first level from a full-round action to a standard action. Yeah sure house-rule it that way, I agree with it and it's first thing I thought of houseruling after going over the Sword Saint. Not game-breaking but it doesn't make Iaijutsu Strike all that exciting or useful. You're ignoring the 10th level ability that changed the action to a standard action. If you're going to houserule the 1st level class ability then houserule the 10th level class ability. Behold!
At 10th level, a sword saint learns to focus faster and is able to make an iaijutsu strike as part of his first attack on the given round, and the penalty to his AC is reduced to –2.
Now Iaijutsu Strike is more versatile and you can now do all types of things with it. Cleave, Spring Attack, Vital Strike, The Order of the Warrior abilities are just among fews things that can be done. Still not game breaking but it gives the Samurai a satisfying oomph. Also Brutal Slash should probably be a 4th level ability instead of 3rd as the ability it replaces is Mounted Charge. I'm sure they meant Mounted Archery as Samurai don't get charge and it makes more sense to get rid of the mounted abilities instead of Weapon Expertise.
I might ask what is wrong exactly with the one-handed (and light) weapons within the context of this one ability? All things considered I see that like complaining about the one-handed fighter being one-handed.
I want to be able to play a Samurai without using a mount and while still getting as much bang for my buck as a mount-using Samurai. I should be able to do this regardless of weapon choice. With the archetype, I can do this with one-handed weapons, but not with two-handed weapons. One-handedly, there is nothing wrong with this archetype. Two-handedly, it is so much uselessness.
And yes, the alternative class features were created as per the inspiration given by the action of iaijutsu. However, I think inspiration as a starting point should be exactly that, a starting point. They could have continued on with the archetype, making it accessible to both one- and two-handed, and left the onus of narratively describing how a character is using a drawing technique normally used for a one-handed weapon with a two-handed weapon instead on the player playing the character. Instead, they quit and someone who might be perfectly happy using a class feature inspired by a one-handed drawing technique on a two-handed weapon is stuck with a no-win, barring DM intervention and redesign of the game (which is not their job).
I never want to see someone doing this with a pike or halberd. The five foot long greatsword and nodachi are also fairly inappropriate for this.
And yet, other people playing the game might be perfectly willing to suspend their disbelief for this. If you don't want your character to do this, then, barring domination, I can guarantee you that he would never be able to. But your choice for your character's capabilities should not be your choice for the capabilities for everyone else's characters (especially in other games). Likewise, game designers should be expected to look beyond their own immediate preferences.
That said, all classes including samurai and cavaliers (both I will call "knight" at times) are basically taking PFS play into account where you will not have quadrupeds characters at all. Both of them are classes about mounted combat, with the samurai being a more infantry take. Regardless, if you have a people who have no mounted combat, I doubt they would have mounted combat classes.
From what's been said on prior occasions, monster races are not a priority in class design considerations.
They have to have realized that people might want to play a quadrupedal Cavalier (or Samurai, for that matter). Therefore, either they intend for Centaurs riding horses to be allowed, or they included alternatives so that quadrupedal races aren't at a disadvantage when they select this class or alternate class.
Don't get me wrong. This shouldn't be a fix for the benefit of quadrupedal characters of mounted combat classes. This fix should apply for all characters. Lord knows we've had people pining for a human, dwarf, elven, etc. Cavalier who didn't use a mount since the Cavalier first saw playtesting.
I.e., the "knight" shouldn't be a mounted combat class, it should be a class with the option for mounted combat. Paladins don't have to put up with a mount. Rangers and Druids don't have to put up with an animal companion. Mages don't have to up with familiars. I want to play a fighter-like character able to challenge specific foes and inspire greater teamwork in his allies. So exactly where did I say "I want a mount"?
The game should take into account many different play styles, but it will probably be assumed that if you do something well outside of PFS guidelines, it is up to you to make fixes as needed.
Yes, it does. My issue is with the difference between what I would call "well outside of PFS guidelines" and what they apparently consider "well outside".
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I'm playing a Samurai and was interested in seeing mechanically how this archetype can hold up. So using the DPR Olympics rules here:
I built a quick lvl 10 Samurai to compare a vanilla Samurai and Sword Saint. Here are the Samurai's Stats:
Test Samurai
Level 10 Human Samurai
STR: 24 ( start 18,+2 level, +4 belt of strength)
DEX: 14
CON: 14
INT: 9
WIS: 14
CHA: 7
Weapon: +2 Keen Katana
Attack: +20/+12 (+10 BAB, +7 STR, +2 Magic, +1 Weapon Focus, Second Attack gets-3 for Power Attack)
Damage: 37.5 (4.5 avg.,+10 two-handed STR, +2 Magic, +2 Weapon Specialization, +9 Power Attack, +10 Challenge)
Critical Threat: 15-20/x2.
Iaijitsu Strike avg. damage: 52.5 (3.5 per six die x 5)
Relevant Feats: Weapon Focus (Katana), Weapon Specializtion (Katana), Power Attack, Furious Focus
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So the vanilla Samurai when performing a full-round attack against his challenge is 58.5 DPR
The Sword Saint does 82.688 DPR. This takes into account Brutal Slash which in this case gives the Sword Saint a 95% chance to confirm a critical hit (I assume a 1 on a threat roll misses?)
However, should the vanilla Samurai use boots of haste or haste spell to gain an extra attack he dishes out 90.189 DPR
As the Samurai increases his levels and gains more attacks per round, his Iaijutsu strike becomes ineffective. So looking according to this the minimal damage increase, difficulty in delivering an Iaijutsu strike, and AC loss make the Sword Saint ineffective.
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I want to be able to play a Samurai without using a mount and while still getting as much bang for my buck as a mount-using Samurai. I should be able to do this regardless of weapon choice. With the archetype, I can do this with one-handed weapons, but not with two-handed weapons. One-handedly, there is nothing wrong with this archetype. Two-handedly, it is so much uselessness.
Am I missing something here because there is nothing in the archetype that states an Iaijutsu strike must be delivered one-handed. If that is true then the argument that it makes more sense for an Iaijutsu strike to be restricted to one-handed attacks is not valid.
Hidden in the flavor text
"Sword saints hail from lands where samurai are prevalent, and are often ronin who wander the world seeking new challenges to perfect their intricate style of swordplay called iaijutsu. The following benefits apply only when a sword saint is using a sword and carrying nothing in his other hand."
I missed it on first read through too.
@Majesticmoose
You didn't read up high enough in the description. It is at the end of that top chunk of writing, right before your long quote from sword saint. It is in the same location relatively that all of the special conditions on the archetypes are located.As to the one-handed element
Sword Saint
"The following benefits apply only when a sword saint is using a sword and carrying nothing in his other hand."
Free-hand fighter
"His fighting school benefits only apply when he is using a one-handed weapon and carrying nothing in his other hand."
In the case of the free-hand fighter, if this wording did not mean that you must be one handing your weapon, you could use a one-handed weapon in two hands for all abilities other than singleton, which I believe goes against intent, if not outright writing.Yeah. What I was hoping to go for was perhaps a quick, Iaijutsu greatsword strike, but that's not possible due to the restrictions. Quick-draw on the other hand is entirely possible, and I've done it before.
However...Could, with exotic weapon proficiency, a bastard-sword be used instead?
Yes.
A katana is nothing more then a reflavored bastard sword that samurai automatically have EWP with. So, yes, you can iajitsu with a bastard sword.
Are those DPR numbers correct? At level 10, The Saint can make the iajitsu attack as his first attack of a full attack action. That seems to me like it could be hugely strong as he keeps levelling, or do the additional abilities from other orders overwhelm it?
==Aelryinth
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Hidden in the flavor text
"Sword saints hail from lands where samurai are prevalent, and are often ronin who wander the world seeking new challenges to perfect their intricate style of swordplay called iaijutsu. The following benefits apply only when a sword saint is using a sword and carrying nothing in his other hand."
I missed it on first read through too.
Ahh thank you. Well that will lower the Sword Saint's DPR slightly since he is wielding it two handed.
Are those DPR numbers correct? At level 10, The Saint can make the iajitsu attack as his first attack of a full attack action. That seems to me like it could be hugely strong as he keeps levelling, or do the additional abilities from other orders overwhelm it?
Pathfinder SRD states "At 10th level, a sword saint learns to focus faster and is able to make an iaijutsu strike as a standard action, and the penalty to his AC is reduced to –2. This ability replaces a samurai’s mount."
The way I'm reading this is he can only make an Iaijutsu strike as a standard action, not as one of his attacks during a full round attack.
I had overlooked this when making the DPR build (hence why it was quick lol) and now the Sword Saint becomes much more appealing for being able to use Iaijutsu Strike as your move up and attack at lvl 10. Before lvl 10 it's pretty useless though because you essentially let the enemy hit you first before you strike when in combat the best option is to always be on the offense.
At low levels it takes a full round attack for one attack from the way I read it. Later that one attack is a standard action similar to vital strike. It does give the option being able to do decent damage even when you can't get a full round attack in.
"After the sword saint has challenged a foe but before he has attacked the target of his challenge, he may choose to use his iaijutsu strike as a full-round action, making an attack roll with his weapon as normal. In order to use this ability, the sword saint’s weapon must be sheathed at the start of his turn. ...
Regardless of whether he hits his opponent with the iaijutsu strike, a sword saint cannot use this ability on the same foe more than once per day."
Just to check if i got this right, you make a challenge on one foe and then can use this ability on him one time.
Luckily a challenge is only a swift action, so you can step in and do this in the same turn. On level one it would make (katana 1d8)+(1 challenge)+(1d6 iaijutsu strike)+ (x stärke). If your STR is not negative its minimum 3 and max 15 damage, not bad.
Sad its only usable one time and only on challenge.
I first felt this archetype would support some cool fighting style like the girl in the "Ichi" movie, she´s blind and using a light sword finesse like with great efficiency in some iaijutsu style, drawing it fast.
It comes close, buts its not exactly the thing.
Another question:
Isn´t vital strike already usable with this?
In the SRD it says:" When you use the attack action, you can make one attack at your highest base attack bonus that deals additional damage."
Doesn´t speak of any action else than attack action.
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Also don't forget Sheathing your weapon is a move action that provokes and Quick Draw doesn't allow you to quick sheath a weapon.
However there is a feat in Advanced Feats: Secrets of the Alchemist called Weapon Juggle
It might sound weird, but im thinking about to play a Kitsune sword saint.
Not sure if to take weapon finesse or not, but STR should be at least 10.
Don´t like negative modifiers.
Swift Kitsune shapechanger and vulpine pounce allow you to challenge someone, then charge and iaijutsu strike pounce him at level 10.
With fox form you could even be sneaky if necessary.
Also the byte can come in handy as a backup attack.
Order of the cockatrice braggart with the speeded dazzling display might be redundant with terrifying iaijutsu, but it seems kind of cool and its a nice debuff.
Vital Strike is its own standard action. The wording is bad, and when the devs clarified it in the FAQ not to many people were happy about it.
It might sound weird, but im thinking about to play a Kitsune sword saint.
Not sure if to take weapon finesse or not, but STR should be at least 10.
Don´t like negative modifiers.Swift Kitsune shapechanger and vulpine pounce allow you to challenge someone, then charge and iaijutsu strike pounce him at level 10.
With fox form you could even be sneaky if necessary.
Also the byte can come in handy as a backup attack.Order of the cockatrice braggart with the speeded dazzling display might be redundant with terrifying iaijutsu, but it seems kind of cool and its a nice debuff.
That does not work. The charge is still a full round action, which means you have no actions left for the Iaijutsu strike.
It might sound weird, but im thinking about to play a Kitsune sword saint.
Not sure if to take weapon finesse or not, but STR should be at least 10.
Don´t like negative modifiers.Swift Kitsune shapechanger and vulpine pounce allow you to challenge someone, then charge and iaijutsu strike pounce him at level 10.
With fox form you could even be sneaky if necessary.
Also the byte can come in handy as a backup attack.Order of the cockatrice braggart with the speeded dazzling display might be redundant with terrifying iaijutsu, but it seems kind of cool and its a nice debuff.
That does not work. The charge is still a full round actions, which means you have no actions left for the Iaijutsu strike.
Double :(
Hayato I am trying to find out how to get the most out of a sword saint myself, and I had found another way to pounce, but that full round action killed my idea also.
I just wish I could charge with it even if pounce was strictly forbidden.
When Iaijiutsu strike becomes a standard action, can you ready it?
Yes.
Hayato I am trying to find out how to get the most out of a sword saint myself, and I had found another way to pounce, but that full round action killed my idea also.
I just wish I could charge with it even if pounce was strictly forbidden.
Whats your way to pounce?
It still works, only charge and pounce first, maybe with the byte, then swift action challenge and iaijutsu strike with your blade.
I really love moonlight stalker by now and the idea to build a kitsune that uses it to pounce from the shadows seems a superfluff, fitting a chinese movie i saw. Also high CHA for a debuff with dazzling display is perfect.
Now if we could just get an official hound master archetype for the Cavalier I'd be thrilled :-)
wow that actually sound kinda awesome....ive gotta go try something.
Hayato I am trying to find out how to get the most out of a sword saint myself, and I had found another way to pounce, but that full round action killed my idea also.
I just wish I could charge with it even if pounce was strictly forbidden.
Whats your way to pounce?
It still works, only charge and pounce first, maybe with the byte, then swift action challenge and iaijutsu strike with your blade.
I really love moonlight stalker by now and the idea to build a kitsune that uses it to pounce from the shadows seems a superfluff, fitting a chinese movie i saw. Also high CHA for a debuff with dazzling display is perfect.
IIRC the barbarian allows for a way to pounce.
Once you charge your full round action is used up so you need another action for iajutsu strike.The challenge and iajutsu strike are two separate actions.
Hayato I am trying to find out how to get the most out of a sword saint myself, and I had found another way to pounce, but that full round action killed my idea also.
I just wish I could charge with it even if pounce was strictly forbidden.
Whats your way to pounce?
It still works, only charge and pounce first, maybe with the byte, then swift action challenge and iaijutsu strike with your blade.
I really love moonlight stalker by now and the idea to build a kitsune that uses it to pounce from the shadows seems a superfluff, fitting a chinese movie i saw. Also high CHA for a debuff with dazzling display is perfect.
IIRC the barbarian allows for a way to pounce.
Once you charge your full round action is used up so you need another action for iajutsu strike.
The challenge and iajutsu strike are two separate actions.
Mh.
Pounce gives you a full attack action ne?Can´t you use iaijutsu strike while that after levl 10?
Or could you charge as move action only and byte pounce on it,
swift challenge then standard action iaijutsu strike?
Aren´t there any feats speeding up charges or such?
The archetype really has a mistake.
3rd level samurai weapon expertise and 4th level feature are confused, but brutal slash replaces mounted charge, what is probably mounted archery as other pointed out.
So in question you get weapon expertise, allowing you to quick draw your chosen weapon.
I think iaijutsu should somehow profit from quick draw.
Perhaps it should be useable with quickdraw and once per oponent, without challenge. You can quickdraw your sword as a free action and your first strike each round does additional damage and after the strike you sheath it again, something like that.
Would be cool Ichi and Zatoichi style.
What reminds me that i would love to see a feature for taking oracles blince curse there.
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Now if we could just get an official hound master archetype for the Cavalier I'd be thrilled :-)
wow that actually sound kinda awesome....ive gotta go try something.
there was one submitted to the RPG Superstar 2011 that you may want to look at then. Not mine but still was pretty decent from what I remember.
I think it would have been great if the iajitsu strike ability was as follows (bolded text is the changes I would like to see):
A sword saint can perform a lightning quick iaijutsu strike against the target of his challenge to inflict devastating wounds while drawing his sword. After the sword saint has challenged a foe but before he has attacked the target of his challenge, he may choose to use his iaijutsu strike as a full-round action, making an attack roll with his weapon as normal. If the sword saint has chosen either the katana or the wakizashi for his weapon expertise class ability and is using it as part of the attack, he is able to make an iaijutsu strike as a standard action.
In order to use this ability, the sword saint’s weapon must be sheathed at the start of his turn. If he successfully hits his opponent with an iaijutsu strike, his attack deals an additional +1d6 points of damage. This bonus damage increases by an additional +1d6 at 3rd level and every two levels thereafter to a maximum of +10d6 damage at 19th level. Any extra damage as a result of a successful iaijutsu strike is not multiplied by a critical hit.
After making an iaijutsu strike, a sword saint takes a –4 penalty to his AC until his next turn, but his weapon is now drawn and he may continually to fight normally. Regardless of whether he hits his opponent with the iaijutsu strike, a sword saint cannot use this ability on the same foe more than once per day.
At 10th level, a sword saint learns to focus faster and is able to make an iaijutsu strike as a standard action, and the penalty to his AC is reduced to –2. If the sword saint has chosen either the katana or the wakizashi for his weapon expertise class ability and is using it as part of the attack, he is able to make an iaijutsu strike as part of an attack action. This ability replaces a samurai’s mount.
I chose weapon expertise as opposed to Quick Draw (or Quick Draw and weapon expertise as it limits it to one weapon only for iajutsu strike+. It also shows a greater mastery of that specific weapon, and shows that you know how to draw-strike with that weapon even more efficiently, rather than just being able to do it with any weapon you get your hands on). I like it because the ability stays the same, except for a specific weapon type (katana or wakizashi), in which case you become even better at it.
Have yet to see what archetypes it stacks with it.
the magus has an archtype tthat is basically the same called a Kensai
Undead Samurai are the best.