Need some help fleshing out this concept.
Considering a character for PFS play. Character feels he has been cursed by the gods but struggles to survive inspite of their disfavor. Doesn't like the gods and doesn't feel the need to bow to their will. Sentient people of all shapes need to forge their own destinies.
Starting at level 1 through level 12 for PFS
Race: Human, Half-Orc, or Half-Elf
Abilities: 20 point buy
Class: Oracle
Curse: Wasting probably
Mystery: (not sure) Ancestor, Dark Tapestry, Life, Lore, Nature, or Time seem to fit the concept
Emphasis is to be a caster/healer instead of a combat machine, but I haven't pinned it down any more than that.
Ideas? Suggestions?
From a RP perspective, the god(s) that gave them their power must have some strange and subtle plan.
I don't think Ancestor fits the theme. You're binding spirits for your own use, meaning you aren't letting the spirits choose their own destinies. Plus, that's a combat mystery.
Lore and Time I can see. Life and Nature runs into the issue with ancestor, but to a much lesser extent (nature moreso than Life, IMO). Maybe Life does fit.
You don't have to revere the gods in order to be an Oracle. My personal opinion about the Oracle is that to be played "right" requires an understanding between GM and player and that there should be times where the GM asserts direct control, in part or whole, over the character given that the entire Oracle concept is something akin to divine rape except instead of emotional scars you have powers and abilities forced upon you.
Although the gods work through many agents, perhaps none is more mysterious than the oracle. These divine vessels are granted power without their choice, selected by providence to wield powers that even they do not fully understand. Unlike a cleric, who draws her magic through devotion to a deity, oracles garner strength and power from many sources, namely those patron deities who support their ideals. Instead of worshiping a single source, oracles tend to venerate all of the gods that share their beliefs. While some see the powers of the oracle as a gift, others view them as a curse, changing the life of the chosen in unforeseen ways.
While I don't think the GM should take absolute control over the PC I do think if there is this understanding, and if done judiciously and only at certain, brief moments in time, it can greatly add to the experience. For example, let's say a god has set you on the path of healing. You come across some being in need of healing not realizing it is an outsider in disguise seeking to entrap you, since you're an agent of this god. You go to touch the creature to heal it only to find yourself frozen, unable to move because your benefactor has chosen to yet again intervene in your life. You are helpless but to watch this trickster be stripped away of it's false-self through the sheer divine might and to be revealed for what it truly is. To me, to experience something like that in game would rule. Had the Oracle not been there or had they been a different class and that god not been there you never know what could have happened. Perhaps their soul would have been trapped or whatever. To me, the Oracle is a way to introduce the god's influence in a more direct way in the world of Golarion.
If I do this, it will be for PFS.
...Custom curse: Mute. Basically, he can't communicate through any means which resembles words, including by speaking, writing, telepathy, or hand-signals-as-words. His only means of communication is standard hand signals and other physical expressions. The benefit is that he can cast oracle spells silently without using a higher spell slot...
Custom curse won't be allowed, but I like it.
You don't have to revere the gods in order to be an Oracle. My personal opinion about the Oracle is that to be played "right" requires an understanding between GM and player and that there should be times where the GM asserts direct control, in part or whole, over the character given that the entire Oracle concept is something akin to divine rape except instead of emotional scars you have powers and abilities forced upon you....
I have never heard of any GM in PFS treating it like that, though it could be good for a home campaign.
I have never heard of any GM in PFS treating it like that, though it could be good for a home campaign.
Which is fine. To each their own. I just say that as clearly the Oracle is not entirely their own person. They were given abilities and for a purpose and with power comes responsibility. I can see that purpose being expressed from time to time, as needed only, in what could be considered as "taking over" just to make sure that purpose is fulfilled and, in extreme cases, creating people who feel lost to their abilities and the beings that gave them their power if they truly do not want them. For the majority, I would think the abilities would be viewed more in a "hey this is cool" light and they would go with it, though.
Doesn't like the gods and doesn't feel the need to bow to their will. Sentient people of all shapes need to forge their own destinies.
How exactly are you rationalizing him using the spells/revelations?
I hate the gods and how they mettle in mortal affairs.
<something bad happens>
Hold on, let me use this power from the gods to fix that.
You need to add a reason to the character why he uses that power, in spite of his dislike of the gods.
My understanding was that the gods had little, if any, say in what an oracle does. Unlike a cleric, druid, or inquisitor, Oracles don't have any of those silly alignment restrictions on the spells they can cast; an oracle dedicated to Iomedae can freely cast animate dead with no restrictions ( outside of roleplaying, of course).
That being said, I've played oracles that had nothing to do with with gods. One character, a lore oracle with the haunted curse, was roleplayed as being a psychic; his haunting wasn't due to malevolent spirits, but his uncontrolled telekinetic capabilities.
The way I see it, Oracles seem to be the only divine casters that don't have to brown nose a deity for stuff.
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How exactly are you rationalizing him using the spells/revelations?I hate the gods and how they mettle in mortal affairs.
<something bad happens>
Hold on, let me use this power from the gods to fix that.You need to add a reason to the character why he uses that power, in spite of his dislike of the gods.
Two possibilities. The first works better for PFS play but I like the second better.
1) Similar to cleric, "...As their powers are influenced by their faith, all clerics must focus their worship upon a divine source. While the vast majority of clerics revere a specific deity, a small number dedicate themselves to a divine concept worthy of devotion—such as battle, death, justice, or knowledge—free of a deific abstraction. (Work with your GM if you prefer this path to selecting a specific deity.)..." Divinity of sentient life or some such.
2) Way to do the 3.5 Ur-Priest without being so over powered, "...Ur-priests despise gods. However, a small number of them have learned to tap into divine power and use it for their own needs without praying to or worshiping a deity..."
Actually, you could knda combine all three. He personally is working toward thinking beings cooperating and making the world a better place without relying on the gods and their interfering ways. One of the gods (doesn't really matter which) likes what he is doing 'helping those who help themselves' even if his attitude is odd, so supports him with divine power. However, himself (and any converts he manages) Ur-priests who believe that through their meditations they are stealing divine power from the gods. Could be he's just a tad delusional which fits pretty well with oracle.
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You might want to read the latest Pathfinder Tales (Death's Heretic). The lead chatracter may not be an Oracle (appears to be an Inquisitor to me if game stats must be used), but he appears to have the same attitude to the gods that you have listed and gets divine spells.
EDIT: Also, for flavour, you could have the spells be forced on him by the gods in question. He doesn't want to cast the spell, but the divine power surges through his body and forces that effect (taking up his actions, using the holy words that he doesn't know, etc). So at times he's a puppet of the gods (in this case the player). Describe his eyes as rolling back in his head and then asking "what happened?" after your action?
You might want to read the latest Pathfinder Tales (Death's Heretic). The lead chatracter may not be an Oracle (appears to be an Inquisitor to me if game stats must be used), but he appears to have the same attitude to the gods that you have listed and gets divine spells.
EDIT: Also, for flavour, you could have the spells be forced on him by the gods in question. He doesn't want to cast the spell, but the divine power surges through his body and forces that effect (taking up his actions, using the holy words that he doesn't know, etc). So at times he's a puppet of the gods (in this case the player). Describe his eyes as rolling back in his head and then asking "what happened?" after your action?
This may be a stupid question, but what/where are Pathfinder Tales?
I thought about the inquisitor, but it seems to be more of a melee character than I want at this time.
The 'forced' aspect would be cool for a NPC, but I don't want to feel/act like I don't control my own PC.
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Pathfinder Tales are the series of paperback novels Paizo produce. You can find them here. I only mentioned the Inquisitor as a side comment on the character. Not to sugget you create one.
And you misunderstood me. You, the player, is still in complete charge of what happens but the character isn't. You decide what to do, but the character doesn't get the same luxury so play how you like but flavour the spells as s something 'outside the Oracel's control'
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My understanding was that the gods had little, if any, say in what an oracle does. Unlike a cleric, druid, or inquisitor, Oracles don't have any of those silly alignment restrictions on the spells they can cast; an oracle dedicated to Iomedae can freely cast animate dead with no restrictions ( outside of roleplaying, of course).
That being said, I've played oracles that had nothing to do with with gods. One character, a lore oracle with the haunted curse, was roleplayed as being a psychic; his haunting wasn't due to malevolent spirits, but his uncontrolled telekinetic capabilities.
The way I see it, Oracles seem to be the only divine casters that don't have to brown nose a deity for stuff.
This.
An oracle already doesn't have to REVERE the gods. He may not even believe his powers come from gods, but rather the Great Old Ones beyond the stars, or powerful Celestials, or Infernals, or Abyssals.. He might even be right.
Judging by the OP however, I think the OP may have meant an oracle that follows in the tried-and-true footsteps of many memorable characters before-hand who may not love the gods, maybe even hate them. But always they RESPECT their power if nothing else, and only the absolutely insane would believe they don't exist at all in a setting where they are verifiably real.
Some good ideas here,
I like the idea of the Oracle being able to imbue healing to others at the cost of his own life force. ie: life mystery and wasting curse.
Being put into the situation where you have it within you to heal the masses, but knowing that it is causing your body to rot away is plenty enough reason for a "good" character to have disdain for the gods.
This way, the Oracle may believe his powers are generated through his own lifeforce and not divine granted, and its a cruel joke that his being is allowed to exist.
I play a life oracle in a Kingmaker campaign, he doesn't worship any gods, he believes that in combat he is possessed by a Celestial (tongues curse) and his out of combat healing comes from residual power left over from the possession.
... And you misunderstood me. You, the player, is still in complete charge of what happens but the character isn't. You decide what to do, but the character doesn't get the same luxury so play how you like but flavour the spells as s something 'outside the Oracel's control'
Ok, I thought you meant letting the GM decide what spells and when. Your suggestion sounds decent now.
Doesn't like the gods and doesn't feel the need to bow to their will. Sentient people of all shapes need to forge their own destinies.How exactly are you rationalizing him using the spells/revelations?
I hate the gods and how they mettle in mortal affairs.
<something bad happens>
Hold on, let me use this power from the gods to fix that.You need to add a reason to the character why he uses that power, in spite of his dislike of the gods.
Why should fictional characters be held to a stricter degree of logical consistency than real humans? People are able to rationalize pretty much anything.
An oracle saying "I'm cursed by the gods, but if they're going to give me powers, I should at least make the most of a bad situation" is hardly any less of a logical contortion than you can see any day in reality. I knew a guy who was one of the farther out there of the "government is evil" spectrum who was receiving financial assistance from no less than three government agencies at the time.
I think you misunderstand me, I fully realize that people rationalize things poorly all the time. I was pointing out that that rationalization could make the character more cohesive and easier to build around the theme.
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Maybe his being an Oracle doesn't have anything to do with the gods at all. He never chose to be an Oracle... and nobody else chose it for him. He was just born that way.
Or if you want to be specifically anti-deity, remember that Oracles are Charisma casters. Maybe he casts divine magic because of his overwhelming faith in himself, and his devotion to his own cause. He wasn't empowered by the gods-- he is a god, just a very small and weak one. For now.