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Reply kited in from elsewhere....Leaping shot.
I admit I took it in the beginning. Granted it allowed me to move while shooting with both pistols. Great. It costs a point of grit, and inflicts the prone condition on a finesse character.
I think I used it once and immediately got my butt bitten through by a hellhound.
It lets you shoot at any point during your movement, and at two different points if dual. It's essentially a double-barreled, ranged Spring Attack.Leaping Shot Deed is awful. It is seriously one of the worst feats in the book.
It doesn't allow you to full attack while moving. It allows you to make one attack (or two if you are dual wielding),
at the cost of grit and having to fall down.
When you're a ranged combatant, being prone is actually an advantage (+4 AC).
There are plenty of ways in the game to stand up from prone quickly and/or without provoking, so any build with Leaping Shot should incorporate them.
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Note that Improved Overrun is a prerequisite for Elephant Stomp, and the latter feat should be viewed as a tertiaty feat in a chain. -- So, you can Overrun/Stomp as a free action, then get your normal attack at the end of the charge. (In the example I provided, our hero has to jump 10' off the roof for it to qualify as a charge.)
Are you really confident about the legality of you being able to overrun the target of the charge? Because I'm not. I know that it wouldn't be legal 99% of the time, but in corner cases such as the situation you described I could possibly see it going 50/50, depending on the GM. But I wouldn't count on it in PFS, that's for certain.
That still makes it pretty much a waste of a feat.
Then I would challenge the DM to describe a situation in which I could possibly use the feat at all -- and if he doesn't have any answer, politely suggest that I ought to be able to rework my character since obviously my combat-oriented character, possessing some intelligence higher than an earthworm's, doesn't waste his time learning useless tactics.
Such as changing feat "X" to feat "Y", which permits me to do the cinematic thing described (and why shouldn't I be able to do cool things with a four-feat-chain?).
(This nonsense, btw, is why I will always love rogues: people will argue all day long about feats, but just about any DM will permit you to make an Acrobatics checks to do anything under the sun which is within the realm of some realism so long as his monster gets an opp on you if you flub.)
When you're a ranged combatant, being prone is actually an advantage (+4 AC).Do guns ignore the -4 to hit for being prone like crossbows do?
There's a feat for that!
Besides... what the hell are you doing throwing yourself to the ground in plain view of the enemy? Gonna throw a tantrum, hope it crits?
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Do guns ignore the -4 to hit for being prone like crossbows do?
*threadomancy*
Turns out that, IMO, Prone Shooter gets the Crappiest Feat Award:
Prone Shooter:
Benefit: If you have been prone since the end of your last turn, you can ignore the penalty the prone condition imposes on ranged attack rolls you make using a crossbow or firearm with which you have Weapon Focus.
OK, so you ignore a penalty for firing while prone. Let's see how severe that penalty is...
Under the "Attack roll modifiers" chart:
Most ranged weapons can't be used while the attacker is prone, but you can use a crossbow or shuriken while prone at no penalty.
and under the Firearms rules:
Fire while Prone: Firearms, like crossbows, can be fired while their wielders are prone.
So, Prone Shooter lets you ignore a penalty that does not actually exist.
It's the Crappiest Feat Ever, because it has the distinction of not actually doing anything.
-Matt
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I like that it has a whole, elaborate "Special" section for interaction with Prone Slinger. Except, of course, it gives no benefit there either.
My understanding is that it was meant to have a bonus by the original author, but it got clipped out by some editor (who presumably didn't realize the -4 for prone attacks is melee only). Whoopsie.
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Swap Places from the APG. Its a teamwork feat therefore a feat tax on 2+ players and should have been a combat maneuver.
Not arguing that it shouldn't be a combat manuever(special action...whatever), BUT I will say that this is really useful for a Cavalier's Tactician ability(they share the TWfeat with their friends) and possibly for the Inquisitor's ability (whatever it's called - they get the benefit without needing friends with said TWfeat)
The Paladin in my group is mounted, being a mounted Cavalier made this feat one of my top choices for tactician... after all mounts are allies too, so swap places applies... need to set up a charge lane anyone? ;)
Unfortunately, there's a size restriction on that feat, so there won't be any cavaliers lifting their horses out of melee any time soon...
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I too have seen people take run as a feat. This happens most often when I'm running a very small game--e.g., 2 players and a GM. Being able to run faster and longer than your foes is pretty useful in such a context.
Being able to outrun the other PC isn't a bad thing, either.
When there's a monster on your tail.|
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The point is it should be something anyone can attempt It should not be a cavalier/inquisitor only ability. It's not a crappy feat because it codified something people have been house ruling for years/ editions. It's a crappy mechanic because of how it was codified, as a feat. Even worse as a teamwork feat.
It wouldn't be so stupid if it wasn't a teamwork feat. All teamwork feats are on the list for crappiest feat award. Teamwork feats just seem like they were feats that required some sort of action from an ally so someone came up with the bright idea that "hey, let's make them BOTH take the same feat to pull off the action, that way, it inspires group dynamics and teamwork!" No, no it doesn't.
This is like saying bad guys would need feats to perform combat maneuvers on them. "If your enemy has 'Get Bullrushed', you may push it back with an additional 5' for every 5 you succeed on your check."
Why doesn't it suddenly become less stupid to require this for an ally? Just make Swap Places a standard action normally then you can take a feat to make it a move action.
If they really believe that the move requires a conscious ally to buy in to the action, they could make it use up their unused swift action (or next immediate).
Healthy Swapper: "I'm here! Grab my hand!"
Wounded Swappee: "Got you!"
<swivel>
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The Paladin in my group is mounted, being a mounted Cavalier made this feat one of my top choices for tactician... after all mounts are allies too, so swap places applies... need to set up a charge lane anyone? ;)
Are you just swapping places between the cavalier and the paladin, or are the horses switching, too? The mount is at least one size larger than the cavalier, yes?
Hah. I get what he's doing, now.
The cavalier is granting the feat to his mount, the paladin, and the paladin's mount. Both mounts are more than your average horse, so can be trained to work this tactic.
It's not the cavalier swapping places with the paladin, or with either of the mounts; it's the two horses putting their heads together, and working out when to switch places, backed up by verbal or empathic cues from their riders.
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From the almost-but-not-quite-completely-useless department...
Flaring Spell. Seriously, nobody gives a crap about the Dazzled condition; please stop making new feats/class abilities/spells to make people Dazzled.
Better dazzled then vajazzled.
Vajazzling Display
Your dedication to body modification can confuse, enthrall, and stupefy onlookers.
Prerequisite: female, Inscribe Magical Tattoo.
Benefit: While opening the front of your lower clothing, you can perform a bewildering show as a full-round action. Make an Perform (Dance) check to daze all foes within 30 feet who can see your display.
"Is that a ...unicorn? No! It's a dolphin! I see it now!"
The OPs pick was a really good one, but I think the Deathless feats should be given a good look. Think about how underpowered you are devoting four feats (Deathless Initiate, Deathless Master, Diehard, Endurance)for the purpose of remaining effective below 0 Hp. Zealot is good in it's own right but worth the investment, h3llz no, your up to 6 feats now. Same for haunted gnome feats.
Removed a post. Please be civil to others and remember not everybody plays the same game that you do.
I think that crappy feats are feats that aren't used. I took cleave for my paladin one campaign and never used it. It almost seemed as if my DM was spreading creatures out. However I remembered that is almost always does that because of aoe and multiple attacks.
I like the +4 damage in exchange for a counter attack feat.
Are you talking about Death or Glory? If so, you might want to take a closer look at it.
At first level, my two handed sword fighter deals 2d6+9 while power attacking, for an awesome average around 16. An extra +4 puts his enemy in one shot kill range. What's not to love. I'm sure there are a bunch of situations like that.
This would be a good situation to use it. Unfortunately, it doesn't work for two reasons. First, it has a prerequisite of +6 Bab (meaning level 6, minimum). So +4 damage is going to mean a lot less. Plus, since it requires a full-round action, it means you are giving up your second attack at +1 (the average damage of which is almost undoubtedly going to be better than 4). This only gets worse as you get more attacks.
Then they get to counterattack with the same bonus. Ick. Without that, it would be circumstantial at best. With it, I can't see the point.
Also, it only works on Large or larger enemies. So no orcs.
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I'm sure its been mentioned but I'm sticking with prone shooter. For a new player this is a huge trap option that might never be caught. I mean a new guy looks at the feat and suddnely thinks how cool it would be to lay flat on the hill top and rain death on his foes while hurting their ability to shoot back only to realize later that the feat does nothing absolutely nothing.
Nope spring attack is now a full round action i believe.
Mort, I was giving it the benefit of the doubt. It seems hard to believe they would make it that crappy. At +6 BAB and full round, isn't it in direct competition with Vital Strike?
Not really. It specifically states you can combine the two, but that doesn't help much. The whole point of Vital Strike is a bit of extra damage when you move then take a (standard action) attack. Requiring a full-round action means it is up against full-attack, where it will always lose.
Oh oh I know! Can they take their AoO if you aren't there? Does it work with Spring Attack?
Nope. Spring Attack only gives you a single attack, not a full-round action like this requires. To make matters worse, the attack isn't an AoO. It is a special immediate action. So no waiting until the enemy has used up his AoO for the round then trying to do it (not that average damage would be higher than a full attack, anyway).
It is just a bad feat. Great idea (one last mighty stroke against the deadly giant! Heck ya!), but doesn't quite work out mechanically.
Nah really good dagger assiassins strike and high powered calm spells save the day everytime.
I'm wondering if after all this is said and done, and they realized that somethings are simply horrible and shouldn't exist, if something will be done about it. I love paizo, I think they are fantastic, and problems happen in all games, but so far they've done a pretty good job at fixing things, but I don't see they doing anything about those issues exposed here.
I highly recommend F. Wesley Schneider's reply to my post about something horrible in Halflings of Golarion. It was very illuminating.
I'm sure its been mentioned but I'm sticking with prone shooter. For a new player this is a huge trap option that might never be caught. I mean a new guy looks at the feat and suddnely thinks how cool it would be to lay flat on the hill top and rain death on his foes while hurting their ability to shoot back only to realize later that the feat does nothing absolutely nothing.
+1000
This is really important. I have new players at the table pretty regularly. We also play in occasionally large groups with like 9 people, more than half will be relative novices. (spouses, in laws etc..). It really tough to coach up that many rookies.
When a feat like this sneaks in, it forces us to retroactively allow a mulligan; something the sneaky experienced players will pounce on.
I'm still voting for Cockatrice Strike.
It's a monk feat, that is designed in a way that leads me to believe the designer has never actually played a monk. (Similar to Scorpion Style, it's chain foundation). It's pre errata form is actually an EPIC level prerequisite. It's execution requires someone else to give you a pass along Crit (it's almost a teamwork feat). It does actually work, it's just a case of winning the lottery to pull off. That's bad design for a feat. Bad Design is at the Heart of Crappy.
Caustic Slur is a near tie. With the other two.
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I think the reason people resent Point Blank Shot is that, unless you're playing a Human and/or a Fighter, you cannot effectively play an archer at level 1, and that's just dumb. Only Humans and Fighters can take both Point Blank and Precise Shot at level 1, which means everyone else is eating a -4 to -8 penalty on every single shot they make (where Humans and Fighters only take a -0 to -4, depending on angle).
Precise Shot is the "allows you to play an archer" feat, and PBS just feels like filler because it doesn't actually contribute to letting you play an archer except as a feat tax before you're allowed to take the "allows you to play an archer" feat.
It's dumb. I understand why it exists, but it's still dumb.
Just learned this recently, a 1st level paladin can get precise shot for free if they take the Divine hunter archetype from Ultimate Combat.
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Well, it has its use when you're facing a giant who have between 244 and 263 HP, with a friend who took butterfly's sting and did a crit, and...
Meh... According to my definition, a feat "has its use" if it comes into play at least once in the whole campaign.
haha! A buddy of mind just made a joint build wrapped around butterfly sting and death or glory. GMTA!
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I'm still voting for Cockatrice Strike.
1) Must use full-round action. 2) Must (due to #1) be adjacent to target. 3) Target must be previously suckified in some way. 4) Must get a crit with an unarmed strike. 5) Target gets a ridiculously easy save.
>>> WORST FEAT EVER <<<
Caustic Slur is a near tie. With the other two.
Aside from the racial requirement (gnome), Caustic Slur is not a bad feat in a CHA/UMD rogue or defense-oriented caster who specializes in being a nearly unhittable waste-of-time -- because not only can you actually use the feat, you can always use it if you want to, and, if you've built yourself to properly exploit it, do some neat tricks. Used in conjunction with Antagonize[Intimidate] (to force people to attack you, then subject them to penalties to their attacks versus Mirror Image or some such), it can tie enemies up in knots.
For example, you're a gnome ranger/bard multiclass with FE:Human, Antagonize and Caustic Slur (probably have Bewildering Koan as well, to complete the gabmeister package); you Antagonize[Intimidate] a human enemy spellcaster; if he fails his save, he's prompted to attack you in melee at Power Attack penalty with whatever lousy melee weapon he has instead of slagging you with a big spell. He's almost certain to feebly whiff, and do barely any damage if he does hit. Then he ends his turn adjacent to you (so you can rip him apart).
It's nowhere near being on my list of awesome feats for gnome blabbermouths, but it's not in the bottom dregs either.
Actually soon antagonize will be fixed to allow spell casting against the target.
I too have seen people take run as a feat. This happens most often when I'm running a very small game--e.g., 2 players and a GM. Being able to run faster and longer than your foes is pretty useful in such a context.Being able to outrun the other PC isn't a bad thing, either.
When there's a monster on your tail.
Sometimes it's a bad thing...
Darned Fear effects!
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Being able to outrun the other PC isn't a bad thing, either.
When there's a monster on your tail.
Sometimes it's a bad thing...
Darned Fear effects!
Luckily for you, running away from the source, last night, sent you back into the party.
Imagine if you took off in another direction, at your speed, and trying to 'cloak'. They'd never find you, and by the time you recovered enough to signal where you were, you'd be halfway back to Alhaster.
Being able to outrun the other PC isn't a bad thing, either.
When there's a monster on your tail.Sometimes it's a bad thing...
Darned Fear effects!
Luckily for you, running away from the source, last night, sent you back into the party.
Imagine if you took off in another direction, at your speed, and trying to 'cloak'. They'd never find you, and by the time you recovered enough to signal where you were, you'd be halfway back to Alhaster.
And that's why I have Hard Minded (although the URL still has 'Hard to Fool' in it!)
As for rubbish feats, I've always thought that Lucky Halfling was unbelievably situational. Once per day, ally within 30' can choose your roll instead of his own... before the result is known. By RAW, the ally cannot ask for your roll, so the halfling has to decide "Is this something my ally really needs to make a save against?" without prior knowledge. Very situational.
And Sociable - a party normally has one 'face' and the others use him for Diplomacy, the Persuasive feat is normally better for that one person.
That's some serious necromancy there.
The thread I mean. There are years worth of new and terrible feats though, so perhaps reopening of the discussion is in order.
LOL - I thought the other post was from February this yeart, not last!
Oh well, the comment still stands, I think - and why waste paizo server DB space on a new thread when an old one is right there!?
Well, this feat has been around since release, and no one mentioned it.
Stand Still
Seriously, all it lets you do is make a CMB check against an adjacent opponent to stop them.
You can't use your weapon, and you can't improve you CMB for this particular maneuver in any possible way.
In order to make this feat viable, they had to make a class feature that enhanced it.
The feat might be useful at lower levels when CMB and CMD are more on par, as you're normally fighting humanoids. Past level 10 or so, it seems like everything has reach or ranged attacks.
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So I'm completely late to the party here, but I urge you all to check out our Feats Reforged title. We fixed up some of the feats seen as "worthless" and allowed all feats to level as you do! All feats will continue to provide benefit, regardless of when you purchased them in your adventuring career.
So I'm completely late to the party here, but I urge you all to check out our Feats Reforged title. We fixed up some of the feats seen as "worthless" and allowed all feats to level as you do! All feats will continue to provide benefit, regardless of when you purchased them in your adventuring career.
Is your avatar a Kyuss zombie? If so, great choice for a name and avatar. Age of Worms TPK'd 2 party's of mine.
Well, this feat has been around since release, and no one mentioned it.
Stand Still
Seriously, all it lets you do is make a CMB check against an adjacent opponent to stop them.
You can't use your weapon, and you can't improve you CMB for this particular maneuver in any possible way.
In order to make this feat viable, they had to make a class feature that enhanced it.
The feat might be useful at lower levels when CMB and CMD are more on par, as you're normally fighting humanoids. Past level 10 or so, it seems like everything has reach or ranged attacks.
Nothing there says you can't use your weapon.
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Using an immediate action on your turn is the same as using a swift action and counts as your swift action for that turn. You cannot use another immediate action or a swift action until after your next turn if you have used an immediate action when it is not currently your turn (effectively, using an immediate action before your turn is equivalent to using your swift action for the coming turn).Yeah, Elephant Stomp is useless.
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2l0yn?Sargava-The-Lost-Colony-Elephant-Stomp-Fe at#5
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It may not be possible to find something as terrible as Elephant Stomp or Monkey Lunge because they do nothing, but I strongly dislike the ones that are only for niche situations, especially niche situations you don't want to be in.
Example - Felling Escape (Combat)
Through the use of fluid contortions and manipulations of leverage, you can throw your opponent to the ground after escaping a grapple.
Prerequisite: Int 13, Combat Expertise, Improved Trip.
Benefit: When you break an opponent’s grapple with a combat maneuver check or Escape Artist check, you can spend a swift action to make a trip attempt against that opponent.
You can see the intention here, and the mental imagery is fine, like a judo throw. However, it requires being caught in an opponent's grapple. Who willingly gets into that position? I can see a use for it if a Brawler has it (being able to pick and choose combat feats on the fly), but the Int 13 is not good for Brawlers (or Monks, who might also use it).
Some things just ought not to be feats. Consider Altitute Affinity. It has a prerequisite of the dreaded Endurance anyway, and all it does is give a +2 to Survival in very very limited circumstances (being up a mountain). There is nothing in the Survival rules about acclimatisation to thin air, so there is no mechanical benefit, it's possibly of slight use in not setting off avalanches.
Yes, it has a use, but would anyone ever take it? Even if you had an NPC mountain guide, a Sherpa or something, wouldn't you just give him good Survival and roleplay it? The problem here is that some innocent players might think they have made a Mountain Dwarf so they want to take mountain style feats. It's then a punishment for people buying into their character. And people say Self-Sufficient is bad.
More crap:
Your familiarity with earth and stone gives you a distinct advantage on rocky battlefields.
Prerequisite(s): Knowledge (dungeoneering) 4 ranks
Benefit(s): You gain a +4 insight bonus on combat maneuver checks against opponents occupying a square of rocky difficult terrain such as rubble, broken ground, or steep stairs.
Yes, yes, But it's sooo niche. It's for dwarven miners. 4th level dwarven miners at least, mind.
Just... what's the point? Aside from specifically designing an encounter where the party meets Coalface Pete, the renegade monk/miner, will it ever come up in any game? It would be nice if a Swashbuckler could take it as they like to fight on stairs, but it doesn't apply to swinging on chandeliers and it requires that unfortunate 4 ranks in Dungeoneering.