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I am thinking about building a monk for PFS play (20-point build) and I wonder if anyone has any suggestions.
Based on other threads, I expect that many people would suggest something like, . Please don't bother posting anything along those lines.
Seriously, I am debating between a Ki Mystic and a Drunken Master. I have never been big on the "dump charisma" technique, but I find it slightly preferable to "dump intelligence". If anyone has had any good experience, please share (and enjoy).
I've had fun with a Dwarven Monk (of the Sacred Mountain). Enemies are always thinking "How in the infenal planes does it move so fast?" right before he beats them to a pulp.
Move in, attacking with Vital Strike
If they don't run, FLURRY!
Find a new vict... enemy.
Actually a Dwarven Drunken Master could be pretty awesome. The plus to Con and Wis works good for the Monk. The minus to Cha doesn't hurt at all, but I don't like dumping it either, so I would probably go with something like this.
Str 15
Dex 14
Con 15 (13 +2 race)
Int 10
Wis 16 (14 +2 race)
Cha 8 (10 -2 race)
You can lower Cha to 6 and raise Str to 16 if you wanted a more belligerent, drunk Dwarf.
If you go Ki Mystic then you can go Human and I would suggest droping Cha a little to get a couple extra points. Something like this:
Str 16 (14 +2 race)
Dex 14
Con 14
Int 12
Wis 14
Cha 8
Treantmonk has an excellent guide to Monks that you can find here:
Guide
Of course in his guide he drops Int and Cha far more than I ever would, but the rest of the guide has some good stuff.
You know, the monk in my game has two main tricks. The first is his stupid high acrobatics check which helps him get to the squishes in the enemy group. The second is using his reach weapon to flurry while standing behind the barbarian and disarm everyone he is fighting. I'm pretty liberal with the weapons the monk can use. He has a sword and spear. I even let him flurry while holding one non monk weapon with both hands.
He isn't raw, but I'm sure there are ways to Do it normally. I love the class.
Well, using Core the Monk can pick up the Weapon Familiarity feat with either the Guisarme or Ranseur and then trip or disarm with reach. At 3rd level his BAB would be equal to his HD when doing this since it would be performing a Combat Maneuver.
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Not that it matters much, but I feel like having a dump stat kinda spoils the character. That, and you can tell a lot about a persons ability to use magic based on how beautiful they are.
Lol my favorite character of all time is a dwarven rogue with 5 charisma.....
I respect your opinion =) just remember everyone has one lol.
Edit: Also, careful using "beautiful" and charisma in the same sentence... makes some people angry.
I am also considering a monk for PFS (which will only be my second PFS character), only I'm going slightly crazy, and considering making it a Half-Elven Monk of the Four Winds 5/Cleric of Sarenrae 7. The stats of said character at level 1 (no stat dumping)
Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 15
Cha: 13
I plan on taking Monk for the first two levels, alternating until Monk 5, and then 4 straight levels of Cleric. Domains would be Fire and Sun. I kind of imagine this character staying more towards the edge of battle rather than wading into the thick of it, but still not opposed to barreling straight in.
Anyone have any suggestions for feats? Would I be silly to stick with Unarmed Strike as my main attack for the life of the character? I may be slightly crazy, but I think my overall idea from 1-12 could work and am open to constructive help (please no flat out "Pfft, stupid", etc.). I can post my whole idea if need be.
My only advice (as my PFS monk died in the second encounter), is to have a flanking buddy.
I'm holding out on making another until there is an option for me to multiclass and deliver touch spells.
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Thanks, folks. You had some cool ideas. I had never really considered a multiclass monk, mainly because I like the monk's high level abilities, but the idea really does deserve a second look.
As I said, I am not a fan of using "dump stats", but a drunken dwarf with low charisma could be a lot of fun to role play! Even before the Drunken Master starts to get special powers, he (she? hmmm....) would usually have several flasks of various types of beer on hand (and a few shots of the Golarion equivalent of bourbon).
I love the idea of a reach weapon with trip or disarm ability. That could really make life difficult for the bad guys.
I would not have expected the "how does it move so fast" question to apply to a monk of the sacred mountain. I tend to think of that monk archetype as prone to stay put. Actually, it surprised me that the MotSM does not have some other ability replacing Abundant Step. But he has fast movement and Abundant Step, just as any other monk does. A fast-moving dwarf would come as a nasty surprise.
Someone mentioned a flanking buddy. Two rogues flanking an opponent can inflict some major damage. Especially with TWF. I am in a campaign in addition to PFS; my daughter and her friend play identical twin elvish rogues. When they flank a baddie, look out! After the GM started calling them the "Doublemint Twins", they both decided to give their characters the surname "Doublemint".
(High charisma) + (low physical attractiveness) = Mick Jagger (IMHO)
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If you go Ki Mystic then you can go Human and I would suggest dropping Cha a little to get a couple extra points. Something like this:Str 16 (14 +2 race)
Dex 14
Con 14
Int 12
Wis 14
Cha 8
Interesting. I think I would put the +2 to Wis, rather than Str, for a Ki Mystic. I think I would trade the combat bonuses for the AC and ki bonuses. But that is just me, and I did ask for advice after all. (-:
I know I know.
I just don't think it is realistic for these warriors to all have low charisma. For the most part, all the fit, smart people I know are also good to talk to.
Remember that it's difficult to tell the difference between someone with a high charisma and someone with lots of ranks in certain charisma-based skills.
In the modern world, a LOT of us have max ranks in Diplomacy.|
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I am also considering a monk for PFS (which will only be my second PFS character), only I'm going slightly crazy, and considering making it a Half-Elven Monk of the Four Winds 5/Cleric of Sarenrae 7. The stats of said character at level 1 (no stat dumping)
Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 15
Cha: 13I plan on taking Monk for the first two levels, alternating until Monk 5, and then 4 straight levels of Cleric. Domains would be Fire and Sun. I kind of imagine this character staying more towards the edge of battle rather than wading into the thick of it, but still not opposed to barreling straight in.
Anyone have any suggestions for feats? Would I be silly to stick with Unarmed Strike as my main attack for the life of the character? I may be slightly crazy, but I think my overall idea from 1-12 could work and am open to constructive help (please no flat out "Pfft, stupid", etc.). I can post my whole idea if need be.
That sounds like a potent combination. The way the monk is designed, unarmed strike should be your primary melee weapon at high levels, but at low levels you might prefer something with better crit stats. It's unfortunate that you need to go with such a low STR, but I can't really think of a good way to boost it, other than dropping INT, which I don't like to do. It might be worth it, though. You would lose a skill rank per level, and take some penalties on some skill checks, but you would gain combat and weight bonuses. Your WIS and DEX bonuses, combined with some of the cleric's shield spells, would protect you adequately, at least at low levels. I highly recommend Deflect Arrows for a monk bonus feat, since staying at the fringe of combat makes you more likely to get shot. I would also recommend Dodge as a monk bonus feat at 2nd level.
That sounds like a potent combination. The way the monk is designed, unarmed strike should be your primary melee weapon at high levels, but at low levels you might prefer something with better crit stats. It's unfortunate that you need to go with such a low STR, but I can't really think of a good way to boost it, other than dropping INT, which I don't like to do. It might be worth it, though. You would lose a skill rank per level, and take some penalties on some skill checks, but you would gain combat and weight bonuses. Your WIS and DEX bonuses, combined with some of the cleric's shield spells, would protect you adequately, at least at low levels. I highly recommend Deflect Arrows for a monk bonus feat, since staying at the fringe of combat makes you more likely to get shot. I would also recommend Dodge as a monk bonus feat at 2nd level.I am also considering a monk for PFS (which will only be my second PFS character), only I'm going slightly crazy, and considering making it a Half-Elven Monk of the Four Winds 5/Cleric of Sarenrae 7. The stats of said character at level 1 (no stat dumping)
Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 15
Cha: 13I plan on taking Monk for the first two levels, alternating until Monk 5, and then 4 straight levels of Cleric. Domains would be Fire and Sun. I kind of imagine this character staying more towards the edge of battle rather than wading into the thick of it, but still not opposed to barreling straight in.
Anyone have any suggestions for feats? Would I be silly to stick with Unarmed Strike as my main attack for the life of the character? I may be slightly crazy, but I think my overall idea from 1-12 could work and am open to constructive help (please no flat out "Pfft, stupid", etc.). I can post my whole idea if need be.
Thanks. I could drop my Charisma to 10 to up Strength to 13, though I'm hesitant to do so, for losing out on the bonus channeling and the ability to heal only my allies in combat through it (Selective Channeling, even though it would only be 1 enemy). I did plan on a majority of self-buffing spells once I got into Cleric, and the Fire Domain has some nice offensive ranged spells in its repertoire. Dodge and Deflect Arrows was my one-two combo of monk feats, though I had Dodge coming first, and I figured on Weapon Finesse as the base level one feat to help my flurry. Ranged weapon would probably be shuriken so it can be flurried as well, though I'm not opposed to having something better. Though I might be getting ahead of myself, this character has to survive The Godsmouth Heresy first.
I'm a fan of dwarf monks. Not only do they have the Con & Wisdom bonuses that are useful, but they maintain the higher damage and size bonus of a medium sized creature, and quickly make up their lost movement (20') with class abilities.
Hungry Ghost Monk with a Temple Sword works well. With a Keen Temple Sword +1 you can spend ki like water. 3 attacks at +3 with with a 20% chance for each to crit, gaining you another ki point, with another coming in each time an enemy dies. At 7th level you have four attacks with a 20% crit chance (+5/+5/+5/+0) and gain both a ki point and 7 HP on each crit or kill.
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I'm a fan of dwarf monks. Not only do they have the Con & Wisdom bonuses that are useful, but they maintain the higher damage and size bonus of a medium sized creature, and quickly make up their lost movement (20') with class abilities.
Hungry Ghost Monk with a Temple Sword works well. With a Keen Temple Sword +1 you can spend ki like water. 3 attacks at +3 with with a 20% chance for each to crit, gaining you another ki point, with another coming in each time an enemy dies. At 7th level you have four attacks with a 20% crit chance (+5/+5/+5/+0) and gain both a ki point and 7 HP on each crit or kill.
The APG lists the Temple Sword as a monk weapon, but I cannot find anything that says the monk is proficient with it. Is the Exotic Weapon Proficiency feat needed?
I have difficulty with the idea of a hungry ghost monk who is not evil. I realize that it is not specifically stated that he must be evil, but it sounds pretty evil to me.
I'm a fan of dwarf monks. Not only do they have the Con & Wisdom bonuses that are useful, but they maintain the higher damage and size bonus of a medium sized creature, and quickly make up their lost movement (20') with class abilities.
Hungry Ghost Monk with a Temple Sword works well. With a Keen Temple Sword +1 you can spend ki like water. 3 attacks at +3 with with a 20% chance for each to crit, gaining you another ki point, with another coming in each time an enemy dies. At 7th level you have four attacks with a 20% crit chance (+5/+5/+5/+0) and gain both a ki point and 7 HP on each crit or kill.
The APG lists the Temple Sword as a monk weapon, but I cannot find anything that says the monk is proficient with it. Is the Exotic Weapon Proficiency feat needed?
I have difficulty with the idea of a hungry ghost monk who is not evil. I realize that it is not specifically stated that he must be evil, but it sounds pretty evil to me.
Temple Sword: Heavy blades typically used by guardians
of religious sites, temple swords have distinctive crescentshaped
blades, appearing as an amalgam of a sickle and
sword. Many have holes drilled into the blade or places on the
pommel where charms, bells, or other holy trinkets might be
attached. Monks are proficient with the temple sword.
I think they could have rectified this a little better, but yes, monks are automatically proficient with them.
I have difficulty with the idea of a hungry ghost monk who is not evil. I realize that it is not specifically stated that he must be evil, but it sounds pretty evil to me.
I like the idea of a Hungry Ghost Monk who's tainted by some spirit or curse that he barely holds under his control. Had the spirit attached itself to someone of lesser discipline, it would have made a rampaging fiend. Fortunately, through a life of strict discipline and personal sacrifice (monk lifestyle, of course) the ghost is kept restrained.
I have difficulty with the idea of a hungry ghost monk who is not evil. I realize that it is not specifically stated that he must be evil, but it sounds pretty evil to me.
Well, stealing someone's life force certainly doesn't sound very nice.
On the other hand, you're not stealing this energy for the sake of stealing it, not necessarily at least. Stealing other's ki is just a byproduct of you trying to kill them, and in Pathfinder, good guys do an awful lot of killing - an expected byproduct of good and evil being actual objective forces in the game's universe rather than mere philosophical notions.
So, as long as you steal ki from bad guys and use it to batter even more bad guys, it's not an evil act. A bit creepy, sure, but then, so is a good witch laying curses on the bad guy, or a good rogue backstabbing the bad guy with a poisoned blade, or the good wizard setting the bad guy on fire.
Path of the Hungry Ghost is much like Necromancy. It creeps many people out, and it offers greater rewards to those willing to use it selfishly and indiscriminately, but with proper attitude, it can be turned into a devastating weapon against the forces of evil.
Consider the following concepts as examples of non-evil Hungry Ghost practitioners:
- An order of justicars who believe that by absorbing the essence of evil beings, they actually eliminate evil from the universe permanently.
- A young student to an evil master/order who escaped upon seeing through the facade of lies and now tries to put his "tainted" abilities to good use.
I've had *a lot* of success with a "monk of the drunken mountain" (sacred mountain + drunken master). The character bought muleback cords (APG) and had very high strength to start; thus allowing an incredible carrying capacity. I used it to buy a big barrel and filled it up with booze (and was still in light load). That is enough to get by and regain ki points cheaply.
The abilities of the sacred mountain (along with spending drunken ki on +4 dodge AC) give plenty of protection; and the high strength mean attacks hit and do good damage.
It really works, try it.
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I like the background ideas for the Hungry Ghost monk. For me, the important part of RPG is role-playing. I am an actor at heart, if not in fact, and this is my opportunity to build a character and tell a story. I really hadn't given much thought to the Hungry Ghost monk, but these ideas make for a wonderful story line.
I did not know that a character could have two archetypes (Lorekeeper's "Drunken Mountain"). I see that their special abilities replace different base abilities, but is that allowed in PFS play?
Well, it should be fun!
I like the background ideas for the Hungry Ghost monk. For me, the important part of RPG is role-playing. I am an actor at heart, if not in fact, and this is my opportunity to build a character and tell a story. I really hadn't given much thought to the Hungry Ghost monk, but these ideas make for a wonderful story line.
I did not know that a character could have two archetypes (Lorekeeper's "Drunken Mountain"). I see that their special abilities replace different base abilities, but is that allowed in PFS play?
Well, it should be fun!
Andrew, thanks for bumping the thread back up. I had lost it and my search skill mastery was painfully lacking. For the first time in many years, I want to make a monk character. amorangais' responce about the possible "good" Hungry Ghost monk possibilities got me goin'. So I copied it, and going to hash out some ideas.
Thanks again!
Greg
PS and thank you, too, amorangais. I like monks, but haven't had a desire to play one in years.
Well, after looking things over (and consulting the carrying capacity chart), I decided to go with this stat block instead. It cuts out my ability for bonus channeling due to charisma, but it gives me some extra damage with my attacks and helps attack bonus with the temple sword I picked up.
Str: 13
Dex: 16 (+2 Racial)
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 15
Cha: 10
Again, this will be for a Half Elven Monk of the Four Winds 5/Cleric of Sarenrae(Fire, Sun) 7 for PFS. I think this will work out pretty well, as the focus will be on self-buffs and ranged attacks to start out combat and then working enemies on the outside. Channels will be for harming undead or healing the group outside of combat. I took the Magical Knack Trait(Cleric)--I believe this is ok?-- so that my cleric spells will function at a higher level as soon as I get them. Open to opinions still if anyone has any more.
I like the background ideas for the Hungry Ghost monk. For me, the important part of RPG is role-playing. I am an actor at heart, if not in fact, and this is my opportunity to build a character and tell a story. I really hadn't given much thought to the Hungry Ghost monk, but these ideas make for a wonderful story line.
I like playing transformational characters, myself. Characters who start out with one world view, attitude, motivation, but learn and grow over time, and turn into something else.
I was discussing monks with some friends (including my current GM) and we liked the idea of making a Lawful Neutral Hungry Ghost Monk working to free himself from the ghost, who eventually turned into a Monk of the Healing Hand.
I took the Magical Knack Trait(Cleric)--I believe this is ok?-- so that my cleric spells will function at a higher level as soon as I get them. Open to opinions still if anyone has any more.
Magical Knack is specifically excluded from PFS play, per the latest version of the PFS rules. Gifted Adept and Magical Lineage are NOT excluded, both are both tied to a specific spell. Magical knack is much more powerful than either of those two.
While relatively minor, be aware that you are giving up a BAB because of when you make the transition from Monk to Cleric.
I took the Magical Knack Trait(Cleric)--I believe this is ok?-- so that my cleric spells will function at a higher level as soon as I get them. Open to opinions still if anyone has any more.
Magical Knack is specifically excluded from PFS play, per the latest version of the PFS rules. Gifted Adept and Magical Lineage are NOT excluded, both are both tied to a specific spell. Magical knack is much more powerful than either of those two.
While relatively minor, be aware that you are giving up a BAB because of when you make the transition from Monk to Cleric.
Aha, should have read the guide a bit more, thanks for pointing that out. And yes, I know that I lose a BAB when I transition to Cleric. In the long run, I think that will be ok, as I can get that back with a buff or two from my spell list.
So here's what I ended up with for my Half Elven Monk of the Four Winds/Cleric of Sarenrae (Fire/Sun) combo, at level 1, for PFS.
Str: 13
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 15
Cha: 10
Feats: Weapon Finesse, Deflect Arrows
Specials: Flurry, Elemental Fist(Fire)
HP: 10 (favored class bonus to skill at 1st, HP thereafter)
AC: 15
Skils: Acrobatics
Disable Device (from Vagabond Child)
Perception
Profession (I like the extra bit of gold from Day Job)
Sense Motive
Traits: Elven Reflexes
Vagabond Child
At 2nd I'll take Dodge, 3rd, I'm debating between Quick Draw and Deadly Aim (for the shuriken). 5 may be Toughness, and at 9 I'll probably take Wind Stance, but I'm unsure what I might take at 7 and 11 to try to round her out. Possibly Extra Channeling at 7, though without Selective Channeling I won't be using my channels in combat except to harm undead, or if I'm still on the outer reaches. Once I get into Cleric levels and get some of the self-buffing spells, I can be a force in melee combat, but before I'll probably stick more to the edges of combat.
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I am thinking about building a monk for PFS play (20-point build) and I wonder if anyone has any suggestions.
Based on other threads, I expect that many people would suggest something like, . Please don't bother posting anything along those lines.
Seriously, I am debating between a Ki Mystic and a Drunken Master. I have never been big on the "dump charisma" technique, but I find it slightly preferable to "dump intelligence". If anyone has had any good experience, please share (and enjoy).
Monks are something you either love or hate.
A few tips, in addition to the ubiquitous referral to Treantmonks guide...
1. The monk two step is as follows. Move and stun in round one, then flurry and stun in round two. The save DC for stunning fist is always going to be pretty high, and you will generally have plenty.
2. You save money on Armor, so spend it on enhancements. Also not having any armor check penalties helps.
3. Brass Knuckles are your friend. Get different kinds to get around damage reduction.
4. Having all the high saves and being immune to disease at 5th level is pretty sweet.
5. You aren't going to out damage the others. Your primary job is usually going to change from battle to battle, you could stun/grapple the enemy caster or Protect your caster from big baddie by engaging him before anyone else could, or sneak ahead to scout and then train everyone back to the ambush...etc....you can do a lot of things, and new monks tend to forget the various options they have.
It isn't like playing a fighter, you don't always just run up and hit things. Between the ki options, the feats, and monk abilities you can fill a lot of roles and will be changing from fight to fight.
6. You will often be the only one not diseased, enchanted, etc...after 11th you can be the official taster for the team.
7. Potions are your friend.
8. Low level monk play is very different than high level monk play. Monk weapons, especially shuriken, may be a better choice than unarmed until you start getting bonuses and better movement. Most monk weapons have special features as well. You probably will leave them in the bag once you start getting better unarmed bonuses later, but it is a mistake to only have fists in the early going.
9. You have a lot of bonus feats at low level, as many as the fighter class, use them for long term viability rather than parlor tricks.
10. Few classes change more in style from level to level from a strategy point of view. Make sure you adjust from being the TWF with stunning fists of early levels, to the mobile indestructible cruise missile of higher levels.
Personally, I think what you give up for Drunken Master is too much compared to what you get. But if you like it for flavor, by all means it has a lot of good stuff in it.
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So here's what I ended up with for my Half Elven Monk of the Four Winds/Cleric of Sarenrae (Fire/Sun) combo, at level 1, for PFS.
Str: 13
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 15
Cha: 10Feats: Weapon Finesse, Deflect Arrows
Specials: Flurry, Elemental Fist(Fire)HP: 10 (favored class bonus to skill at 1st, HP thereafter)
AC: 15Skils: Acrobatics
Disable Device (from Vagabond Child)
Perception
Profession (I like the extra bit of gold from Day Job)
Sense MotiveTraits: Elven Reflexes
Vagabond ChildAt 2nd I'll take Dodge, 3rd, I'm debating between Quick Draw and Deadly Aim (for the shuriken). 5 may be Toughness, and at 9 I'll probably take Wind Stance, but I'm unsure what I might take at 7 and 11 to try to round her out. Possibly Extra Channeling at 7, though without Selective Channeling I won't be using my channels in combat except to harm undead, or if I'm still on the outer reaches. Once I get into Cleric levels and get some of the self-buffing spells, I can be a force in melee combat, but before I'll probably stick more to the edges of combat.
I would lighten up on the Dex and bump Strength and Wisdom. You get AC from Wisdom, so that breaks even and would raise the save DC of your stunning fist. Strength you need for attack and damage, and if you do that you can dump weapon finesse for something else.
Monk Dex is over rated.
So here's what I ended up with for my Half Elven Monk of the Four Winds/Cleric of Sarenrae (Fire/Sun) combo, at level 1, for PFS.
Str: 13
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 15
Cha: 10Feats: Weapon Finesse, Deflect Arrows
Specials: Flurry, Elemental Fist(Fire)HP: 10 (favored class bonus to skill at 1st, HP thereafter)
AC: 15Skils: Acrobatics
Disable Device (from Vagabond Child)
Perception
Profession (I like the extra bit of gold from Day Job)
Sense MotiveTraits: Elven Reflexes
Vagabond ChildAt 2nd I'll take Dodge, 3rd, I'm debating between Quick Draw and Deadly Aim (for the shuriken). 5 may be Toughness, and at 9 I'll probably take Wind Stance, but I'm unsure what I might take at 7 and 11 to try to round her out. Possibly Extra Channeling at 7, though without Selective Channeling I won't be using my channels in combat except to harm undead, or if I'm still on the outer reaches. Once I get into Cleric levels and get some of the self-buffing spells, I can be a force in melee combat, but before I'll probably stick more to the edges of combat.
I would lighten up on the Dex and bump Strength and Wisdom. You get AC from Wisdom, so that breaks even and would raise the save DC of your stunning fist. Strength you need for attack and damage, and if you do that you can dump weapon finesse for something else.
Monk Dex is over rated.
Hmm, I can take out the racial +2 I put into Dex and put it into Wisdom, though I'll still lose out on any more points in strength as I don't want to lower anything else. This would give the ability to bump Wisdom to 18 at 4, meaning saves against my cleric spells would be higher as well as my AC, though I plan mostly on buff spells save for the domain ones. At that point it's kind of a wash between Dex and Str to help my attack bonus, so if I were to do it, what feat other than say weapon focus would be beneficial to have at 1st?
Hmm, I can take out the racial +2 I put into Dex and put it into Wisdom, though I'll still lose out on any more points in strength as I don't want to lower anything else. This would give the ability to bump Wisdom to 18 at 4, meaning saves against my cleric spells would be higher as well as my AC, though I plan mostly on buff spells save for the domain ones. At that point it's kind of a wash between Dex and Str to help my attack bonus, so if I were to do it, what feat other than say weapon focus would be beneficial to have at 1st?
Weapon Focus requires a BAB of +1, which means that as a Monk, you're not eligible for it at level 1.
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Hmm, I can take out the racial +2 I put into Dex and put it into Wisdom, though I'll still lose out on any more points in strength as I don't want to lower anything else. This would give the ability to bump Wisdom to 18 at 4, meaning saves against my cleric spells would be higher as well as my AC, though I plan mostly on buff spells save for the domain ones. At that point it's kind of a wash between Dex and Str to help my attack bonus, so if I were to do it, what feat other than say weapon focus would be beneficial to have at 1st?So here's what I ended up with for my Half Elven Monk of the Four Winds/Cleric of Sarenrae (Fire/Sun) combo, at level 1, for PFS.
Str: 13
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 15
Cha: 10Feats: Weapon Finesse, Deflect Arrows
Specials: Flurry, Elemental Fist(Fire)HP: 10 (favored class bonus to skill at 1st, HP thereafter)
AC: 15Skils: Acrobatics
Disable Device (from Vagabond Child)
Perception
Profession (I like the extra bit of gold from Day Job)
Sense MotiveTraits: Elven Reflexes
Vagabond ChildAt 2nd I'll take Dodge, 3rd, I'm debating between Quick Draw and Deadly Aim (for the shuriken). 5 may be Toughness, and at 9 I'll probably take Wind Stance, but I'm unsure what I might take at 7 and 11 to try to round her out. Possibly Extra Channeling at 7, though without Selective Channeling I won't be using my channels in combat except to harm undead, or if I'm still on the outer reaches. Once I get into Cleric levels and get some of the self-buffing spells, I can be a force in melee combat, but before I'll probably stick more to the edges of combat.
I would lighten up on the Dex and bump Strength and Wisdom. You get AC from Wisdom, so that breaks even and would raise the save DC of your stunning fist. Strength you need for attack and damage, and if you do that you can dump weapon finesse for something else.
Monk Dex is over rated.
If you are looking for deadly aim later to be a ranged type, Point Blank so you can get precise shot later. Your Shuriken will be another +1 to hit and damage, which considering you also add strength isn't bad for low level.
RE: Weapon Focus. Duh, knew that. Don't know what I was thinking posting that as an option.
Point Blank is probably not a bad idea, in the grand scheme of things. It would mitigate the loss of the extra point on the attack roll from lowering Dex, and since shuriken are only good within 10ft without a penalty, means I'd always be getting it. Although that's a good question, do thrown ranged weapons use Dex instead of Str to add to the attack roll?
I must sound new-ish to all this, though I'm really not. Just too used to Fighters and Rangers, and never used thrown weapons with either archetype. Branching out with this character a bit, which means going oddball and multiclassing into Cleric. If it doesn't survive, it's a valuable learning experience at the end of it all.
On the monk I am currently playing, I just don't find shuriken all that useful. I have used sling way more than throwing shuriken. By the way, don't knock the sling - it adds STR damage, has a 50' range increment, and is dirt cheap.
But you can't flurry with a sling, that's what makes shuriken useful for a monk.
Yeah, that was the one reason for the shuriken, the ability to flurry with them. It might do very little damage in the long run, but at first level and such it's probably not a bad idea.
So, I think now I may take my racial bonus and put it into Str, which makes it a wash between Str and Dex in terms of bonus, so I'll free up my feat choice that I would have used for Weapon Finesse. Now to figure out what to take instead.
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I know you can't flurry with a sling. If the target is within melee reach, I beat it in melee. If it's flying or far away, generally I got better use out of the sling than with shuriken. 10' range increment is horrid.
It's nice to have some silver/cold iron shuriken for things with damage reduction at lower levels.
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IMO a monk X / summoner 1 multi-class is more effective than a pure monk. You get:
- Eidolon or summon SLAs can provide flank bonus
- Eidolon can provide teamwork feat bonus
- You can get Enlarge Person or Expeditious Retreat
- Spam guidance and resistance 0-level spells are VERY powerful
- With the mental link you can use Eidolon to explore ahead as cannon-fodder (perfect for scouting)
- You can cast mage armor or use the wand
- Extra utility (mage hand, read magic, detect magic, etc)
Also works with another familiar/companion class.
IMO a monk X / summoner 1 multi-class is more effective than a pure monk. You get:
- Eidolon or summon SLAs can provide flank bonus
- Eidolon can provide teamwork feat bonus
- You can get Enlarge Person or Expeditious Retreat
- Spam guidance and resistance 0-level spells are VERY powerful
- With the mental link you can use Eidolon to explore ahead as cannon-fodder (perfect for scouting)
- You can cast mage armor or use the wand
- Extra utility (mage hand, read magic, detect magic, etc)
Also works with another familiar/companion class.
Possibly, just barely at low levels. But as you go up in levels the Eidolon falls further and further behind.
Unless you're building a Gestalt character the Summoner is the most multi-classing unfriendly class I've ever seen.
I have three feats available; I plan to take Dodge and Improved Grapple. I still haven't decided on the third feat, but I usually take Toughness. Improved Initiative might be useful, if I am planning to use grapple to disable spell casters.I don't think there is any point in dodge if you aren't going to take mobility. To me, the whole point of the monk is to jump over peoples heads to give to rogue a flanking buddy, or wrestle whoever needed protecting on the far side.
I always think Dodge is great for more fragile martial fighters, especially since the monk can't wear armour.
For my drunk monk, I took Improved Initiative, Dodge, and Scorpion Style. I took Scorpion Style mostly because at lower levels, you don't get the chance to Stunning Fist as often as you'd want to. Toughness is a great idea at level one as well. When I hit 3, I immediately picked up Power Attack and I plan on Weapon Focus at 5. Works very well in the game I am in.
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Possibly, just barely at low levels. But as you go up in levels the Eidolon falls further and further behind.
Unless you're building a Gestalt character the Summoner is the most multi-classing unfriendly class I've ever seen.
Enlarge Person, Mage Armor, Guidance, Resistance and having any cannon fodder (doesn't matter if it has 1hp) are all very useful all the way to 20. Also a flanker can die in 1 round and still be of enormous benefit if you get the bonus.