I just want to double check something cause all of the posts above have made me paranoid, especially people talking about the different ways punctuation can be read. Probably why I've been trying to avoid reading them too much since I submitted.
I checked my word count in the Word program I used and it was within the 300. I then also checked the word count using the Preview button for the submission tool which confirmed that it was within the 300.
My question is do the judges read/evaluate the submissions within the forum program or do they do it somewhere else? Will they copy and paste my entry into whatever program they use which might then read my entry differently and pop it over the 300 count?
This is probably wicked nit-picky and I'm just freaking myself out cause it looked fine in the preview section but better to have asked.
I just want to double check something cause all of the posts above have made me paranoid ... I then also checked the word count using the Preview button for the submission tool which confirmed that it was within the 300.
My question is do the judges read/evaluate the submissions within the forum program or do they do it somewhere else?
That IS the count they use. If it says 299, then you're at 299, and they won't be using the Egyptian left-handed WordPerfect counter that puts you at 303 or 294 or something.
That IS the count they use. If it says 299, then you're at 299, and they won't be using the Egyptian left-handed WordPerfect counter that puts you at 303 or 294 or something.
Correct. We built that tool into the submission form so Clark wouldn't have to C&P the text into his copy of Word and give us a count... which may not be the same count as the submitter's word processor. Now there is ONE official word counter: the one on the submission tool.
A word of warning for anyone who might want to preview their item in the submission tool: if you are going to compare it to a previous year's Top 32 item, print off a hard copy of the Top 32 item. When I first previewed my submission, I had the submission tool open in one tab on my browser and a Top 32 item open in another tab. I noticed (thankfully!) that after I made a tweak to my formatting and clicked preview again that the browser got a little confused and had grabbed the item name (the "thread title" and word count) from the item in the other tab and inserted it into my preview. At that point I copied and pasted my BBCode to Notepad and then closed out my entire browser before going back into the submission tool for a fresh attempt.
*scribbles something on his to-do list*
The real question is, "Can you follow the rules?"
The R1 rules tell you the entire submission, including the title, can't exceed 300 words.
People have submitted items that are well over 300 words, no matter what word processor's counting tool you're using, including the final arbiter of word counts: the word-counter in the submission tool.
The R1 rules tell you that if you hit "Preview," it'll show you what your submission will look like.
People have submitted items without using the Preview button, because their submission looks horrible and includes improper formatting codes. If your submission has visible BBCode tags in it, you've done it wrong.
And the R1 rules tell you if you hit "Preview", it'll give you an official word count of your item.
People have ignored the word count tool in the Preview, because if they hit Preview and actually read their entire item, including the title, they would have seen that their title says "Blah blah name--### words."
The rules tell you to not include anything in your submission that would de-anonymize it.
So far, nobody's broken this one.
The rules provide the proper magic item format for you to type into, including boldface tags.
People have ignored this rule entirely, submitting an item without any formatting, or bolding the wrong words, or removing some parts of the format, or formatting it by hand.
There's only so much hand-holding I can do. And believe me, I have a 7,500 word document I give to freelancers explaining how to do X and how not to do Y, I'm all about hand-holding if it makes my job as a developer easier. And the people I keep giving work to are the freelancers who can follow the rules I present to them. And the people I stop giving work to are the ones who can't follow the rules I present to them.
If you can't follow a few simple rules for formatting a wondrous item that's no more than 300 words, why on Earth should I trust that you can follow the rules for a 20,000-word adventure manuscript?
I shouldn't have to tell a writer "don't make this more than 300 words" and then make it impossible for them to write something that's more than 300 words; telling them not to do it should be sufficient, especially when I've given them a tool to make sure they're not breaking that rule. Because if the writer fails to understand and follow that rule, odds are they'll fail to follow and understand rules that I can't program. I can't, for example, make it impossible for them to refer to 1e/2e/3.0/3.5 terminology in their turnover, or name NPCs after modern public figures, or use an incorrect magic item or monster stat block format, or put headers in all caps, or not spell-check their submission before they turn it over, or to give me 1,000 words when I wanted 500, or give me 500 words when I wanted 1,000. Some things I have to expect that they can get right on their own, without me hard-coding a brake on these mistakes.
Some people fail to read the instructions. Some people ignore the instructions. I don't care how brilliant these people are, those instructions are there for a reason--to make my job easier. If you make my job harder, I'm going to stop working with you. So... do you want to be brilliant and misunderstood, or do you want to follow some very simple instructions, prove you can be trusted to follow some very simple instructions, and get published? Seems a simple choice to me.
And I completely understand your point. I think it's all the holiday spirits making my Scrooge-like heart a little softer than usual. Either that or a congenital defect. I should get that checked.
It's all good, James. You and I have both been through this process. It might be different I was taking that stance having never experienced what it's like to be on the other side of things submitting a wondrous item. But I have. And even then, I've got high expectations of those who want a shot at RPG Superstar. I'm not inclined to support anyone suggesting that the bar be lowered to help those who can't manage their own word count. If that makes me a Scrooge during this time of giving, I guess I'll play that role.
It's not Paizo's responsibility to make sure you follow the rules. "Sorry, officer. I know the speed limit sign says 50mph. But, I thought it was a suggestion so I did 75mph."
That's actually a pretty good analogy. And I don't think anyone should expect the police to install a speed-limit cap on your car so it can't go over 50 mph on that particular stretch of road. It's up to you to manage that. And yes, some speedometers run a little high or a little low. It's still up to you to manage it. And the cop's radar gun isn't available for you know his exact reading of your speed. At least with the preview tool here (which was referenced in the Round One rules), you've got an opportunity to double-check yourself before submitting if you're worried about going over.
Remember, the ultimate prize to is to submit an adventure "outline" to Paizo. Their writers and creators will be creating the adventure. They want someone with the creative juices.
I can assure you that they want someone who can keep their creative juices under word count, too. That's because the winning adventure outline is expected to be turned into an actual adventure. And that whole process gets started with the designer in question, as guided, edited, and developed by Paizo's staff. Don't make their jobs any harder by failing to learn this crucial lesson about freelancing. Because if you don't learn it, it's highly unlikely they'll be coming back to you for repeat assignments.
Plus, it totally could have been me. Heaven knows I've made stupid easy to fix mistakes on things before. It why we have erasers on pencils and delete buttons on computers.
That's basically the essence of my point.
Yes, people can get this right.
Yes, it's not that difficult.
Yes, they have all the tools they need to get it right.
Yes, it's Paizo's right to set whatever rules they choose.
Yes, it's perfectly reasonable that Paizo prioritizes something like word count differently than I do.
Yes, there's no chance that I personally would get this wrong.
But anyone who says they haven't made a bigger and easier to avoid mistake than this with a computer is Amish or lying, and if preventing it for next year's competition is easy, why not?
Ultimately the people making the decisions don't feel as I do, and that's fine. Adults can agree to disagree about something. None of that makes my position ludicrous, however, as some suggest.
Wow. It's a good thing round 1 is being judged anonymously. There's folks who have posted here that have definitely irked the judges.
That's basically the essence of my point.
Plus, it totally could have been me...
It could've been me, too. I've been through this competition before. Doesn't change the essence of my point one iota. This is a proving ground. You prove yourself capable of operating within these constraints...or you don't. Those who don't, don't advance. Now let's put this debate to bed. I don't believe further anguish over it will change anything...not for this year or next.
Wow. It's a good thing round 1 is being judged anonymously. There's folks who have posted here that have definitely irked the judges.
It must be somewhat frustrating for you judges have to restate numerous times what should be completely obvious. I apologize on behalf of all those contestants who are arguing rules issues which are crystal clear. I think we should all thank the judges for explaining more and using their valuable time responding to persons who seem to be trying to force a tool that does not allow them to break the word count rule. That is so important a rule that you should be allowed to break it to make it easier show just how NOT superstar material your submission is.
That being said, I fully expect that if my personal submission doesn't follow the rules it should be kicked out of the contest. I won't bewail the discrepancies of word count between my word processing program and the official count on the submission tool. It will have been my fault for coming too close to the maximum word count allowed and not double or triple checking using the official word counter.
Wow. It's a good thing round 1 is being judged anonymously. There's folks who have posted here that have definitely irked the judges.
And subsequent rounds aren't anonymous, either. An excellent reason to always be polite ... sooner or later it might actually matter.
Sometimes sooner than you think :)
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 4
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As said above, I think shooting for a lower word count than you were allotted is a good rule for any writing assignment you get. Editors always seem to need more room; to squeeze in an extra piece of art, add a cool magic item somewhere else in the book, or just make space for those ‘other’ writers that do run over their word count. If you become known as the writer that makes that space for the editor, that can only help get you more jobs in the future.
If you become known as the writer that makes that space for the editor, that can only help get you more jobs in the future.
Especially if what you write is just as cool as the longer version.
And now, if you'll excuse me, I have the Book of the Damned and Bestiary 2 to look at. Good day. :)
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Marathon Voter Season 7
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As said above, I think shooting for a lower word count than you were allotted is a good rule for any writing assignment you get. Editors always seem to need more room; to squeeze in an extra piece of art, add a cool magic item somewhere else in the book, or just make space for those ‘other’ writers that do run over their word count. If you become known as the writer that makes that space for the editor, that can only help get you more jobs in the future.
Within reason. If its a printed book and you turn in too little, it has to be filled with something (blank spaces don't look as good as filled spaces) and art cost more than words, generally speaking.
Wow. It's a good thing round 1 is being judged anonymously. There's folks who have posted here that have definitely irked the judges.And subsequent rounds aren't anonymous, either. An excellent reason to always be polite ... sooner or later it might actually matter.
Sometimes sooner than you think :)
If only someone had posted some advice on being smart about that.
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If only someone had posted some advice on being smart about that.Wow. It's a good thing round 1 is being judged anonymously. There's folks who have posted here that have definitely irked the judges.And subsequent rounds aren't anonymous, either. An excellent reason to always be polite ... sooner or later it might actually matter.
Sometimes sooner than you think :)
<pats Neil on the back so he doesn't break his arm> :)
It's really, really easy to get it right. We make it easy for you to get it right (it's up to you to make it *great*, but you can at least try to get it right).
Here's a screenshot I did of what happens when you hit "Preview." Let's see how this item fails.
1. I put my name right there in the item's title. That breaks the "must be anonymous" rule.
2. The word count is right there in the item's title. And it's over 300. That breaks the word count rule.
That's two ways this item failed, and it's in the very first line of my submission. Are you saying you can't be bothered to read the first line of your own work?
There's other blatant mistakes in the item (references to Gandalf, Hitler, Metallica, Corinth, Angelina Jolie, broadswords, and so on), but the official word count is right there in the title. Hard to miss.
Didn't use the template provided did you Sean? No wonder you got this item rejected, LOL. I mean no name of item at top, no aura info at top, no slot information provided, and not to mention the obvious errors you already mentioned.
I will leave the other errors I found for others to find.
Dedicated Voter Season 6
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Plus, it totally could have been me. Heaven knows I've made stupid easy to fix mistakes on things before. It why we have erasers on pencils and delete buttons on computers.That's basically the essence of my point.
Yes, people can get this right.
Yes, it's not that difficult.
Yes, they have all the tools they need to get it right.
Yes, it's Paizo's right to set whatever rules they choose.
Yes, it's perfectly reasonable that Paizo prioritizes something like word count differently than I do.
Yes, there's no chance that I personally would get this wrong.
But anyone who says they haven't made a bigger and easier to avoid mistake than this with a computer is Amish or lying, and if preventing it for next year's competition is easy, why not?
Ultimately the people making the decisions don't feel as I do, and that's fine. Adults can agree to disagree about something. None of that makes my position ludicrous, however, as some suggest.
Sean succinctly told you why not above.
In short:
This isn’t just a contest, so hard-coding ways in to dummy-proof a contest is not something Sean and Paizo are interested in doing.
This is a job interview to be a free-lance writer with a contest format. As such, this is the first test to see if Sean would even want to work with you as a free-lancer.
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It's really, really easy to get it right. We make it easy for you to get it right (it's up to you to make it *great*, but you can at least try to get it right).
Here's a screenshot I did of what happens when you hit "Preview." Let's see how this item fails.
1. I put my name right there in the item's title. That breaks the "must be anonymous" rule.
2. The word count is right there in the item's title. And it's over 300. That breaks the word count rule.That's two ways this item failed, and it's in the very first line of my submission. Are you saying you can't be bothered to read the first line of your own work?
There's other blatant mistakes in the item (references to Gandalf, Hitler, Metallica, Corinth, Angelina Jolie, broadswords, and so on), but the official word count is right there in the title. Hard to miss.
Hurrah! Thanks, Sean. I think what's happening is people are getting in a hurry. When they click preview they are not looking at everything and expecting the word count to appear near the box they are typing in. If they just slow down and take their time, they'll be fine. I had my submission in the box and edited for like 30 mins hitting preview over and over just to make sure it looked right and fell under the word count before I finally hit submit. Just take a deep breath people and take your time. You have until the 31st! If you are stressing under this much time, you're sure to have a stroke in later rounds when you have even less time.
Now let's put this debate to bed. I don't believe further anguish over it will change anything...not for this year or next.
I thought we were discussing, not anguishing. Honest! But I agree to stick a fork in this one.
Senior Software Developer
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Here's a screenshot I did of what happens when you hit "Preview."
Best. Entry. Ever.
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16, 2011 Top 32
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Star Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Star Voter Season 8
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If only Sean's sword had been around in the 1930's... Curse you reality for not conforming to my fantastical specifications! CURSE YOU!
Oh, and Neil, I was totally not comparing you to Scrooge. You're totally our Jacob Marley and Sean is our Ghost of Superstars Future. Just pointing toward the reject pile with his horrible shiny pate and fixed grin... Even now I regret kicking Tiny James Jacobs....
Here's a screenshot I did of what happens when you hit "Preview."Best. Entry. Ever.
He's got mad skills even when he's intentionally messing up. ;-)
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Here's a screenshot I did of what happens when you hit "Preview."Best. Entry. Ever.
Fantastic item.
Also confirms what I thought - I started reading the preview from where my avatar appeared and blanked all of the page above that. It took me over a minute to see that word count, even though I knew it was there. Darned dysfunctional brain.
I'd vote for that item.
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Here's a screenshot I did of what happens when you hit "Preview." Let's see how this item fails.
Ignoring the obvious reasons for making this item, I must say that reading the description for that item made my day. Wonderful. RPG superstar? No. Awesome? Absolutely.
Here's a screenshot I did of what happens when you hit "Preview." Let's see how this item fails.
Does this mean that Godwin's Law has killed RPG Superstar now?
There's probably something wrong with me, because my first thought was: "It's a shame that you can just take +5 to the crafting DC and let Hitler live."
I confess that I also probably couldn't resist voting for that item.
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6
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Dedicated Voter Season 6
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As said above, I think shooting for a lower word count than you were allotted is a good rule for any writing assignment you get. Editors always seem to need more room; to squeeze in an extra piece of art, add a cool magic item somewhere else in the book, or just make space for those ‘other’ writers that do run over their word count. If you become known as the writer that makes that space for the editor, that can only help get you more jobs in the future.
This sounds like a good idea, but I'm going to speak up and say it probably isn't. Going under your word counts creates work for your developer too. If you're given a target, try to hit it.
Now if I'm asked to write some archetypes, and keep them under 300 words (like these magic items), then I'm not going to stress over some of them being much under that. Because that just means more archetypes when I'm done, which people won't kick about.
This round 1 assignment's more of a limit than a target, that's what I'm saying. Don't go over a limit when you freelance (or under if it's an "at least"), and aim close to the target :)
So when the rules say it must be 300 words, including the title, does that refer to the title I type into the "Wondrous Item Name" field, the title that appears at the top of my entry as per Sean's template, or both?
Wondrous Item Name: Bunny Slippers of the Purple People Eaters
Description: Bunny Slippers of the Purple People Eaters
Aura faint something; Caster Level 6th
etc.
Am I dinged here twice for word count?
Am I dinged here twice for word count?
It only counts what's in the Description box. So in theory you could cheat a few extra words by not putting your item's name in the Description box. But if your item was 300 words and we saw that it didn't include the name in the Description box, we'd rough you up in the alley behind the bar, and take your wallet.
Am I dinged here twice for word count?It only counts what's in the Description box. So in theory you could cheat a few extra words by not putting your item's name in the Description box. But if your item was 300 words and we saw that it didn't include the name in the Description box, we'd rough you up in the alley behind the bar, and take your wallet.
Still, I'm guessing it's bad form for many, many reasons to blow 30 or 40 words in the item's name.
I just laughed when I read your last post Sean. I would consider myself luck then for if I was roughed up in the alley behind the bar and my wallet taken, the last laugh would be on you for I would have a few bruises but you would have an empty wallet with nothing in it but cobwebs.
Well then come to think of it I might not of been roughed up behind the bar for odds are I wouldn't have been in the bar to start with...
Still, I'm guessing it's bad form for many, many reasons to blow 30 or 40 words in the item's name.
Right this way to the dark alley out back.
Oh BTW don't forget your wallet...
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Star Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8
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Hey, on the topic of rules, I accidentally misspelled a single word in my entry and didn't realize it until I had hit the submit button. Everything else is perfect on the description, I spent a full week and a half working on it. Please tell me that one typo won't disqualify me. It wasn't even a big typo.
They are looking to see if you can:
1. Follow the rules.
2. Be creative
So I think you will be okay with the typo.
We all typos now and then. ;)
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Hey, on the topic of rules, I accidentally misspelled a single word in my entry and didn't realize it until I had hit the submit button. Everything else is perfect on the description, I spent a full week and a half working on it. Please tell me that one typo won't disqualify me. It wasn't even a big typo.
It's been stated elsewhere and in the Auto-Reject rules (#27). Small things (other than the 300 word count limit) will not automatically disqualify you if the item is good enough. One typo? Doubtful it will auto disqualify you. But, if it came down and you were tied for 32nd place, and the other entrant was perfect, it could hinder you.
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A word of warning for anyone who might want to preview their item in the submission tool: if you are going to compare it to a previous year's Top 32 item, print off a hard copy of the Top 32 item. When I first previewed my submission, I had the submission tool open in one tab on my browser and a Top 32 item open in another tab. I noticed (thankfully!) that after I made a tweak to my formatting and clicked preview again that the browser got a little confused and had grabbed the item name (the "thread title" and word count) from the item in the other tab and inserted it into my preview. At that point I copied and pasted my BBCode to Notepad and then closed out my entire browser before going back into the submission tool for a fresh attempt.*scribbles something on his to-do list*
Ross, if it matters:
Dang it! And I was really hoping for that sweet #32 spot that says 'Hey, if the judges were even slightly less generous I wouldn't even be here.'
If it makes you feel any better Sinister Chris, I will cheer for you to get that 32nd spot with the judges saying just that, but then remember if you get spot #31 and I get the #32 spot with the judges saying that. It isn't my fault but yours and I don't want you to hold it against me.
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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Here's a screenshot I did of what happens when you hit "Preview."Best. Entry. Ever.
+1 million :)
... and stuff.
And an entire month to bang out a simple, elegant wondrous item in 300 words or less? ;-)
In my opinion, giving people a month+ is part of problem. Participants have too much time and they over think, commit to indecision, over-write, and try to 'drow up' their entries. In this over working I image it is easy to loose the simple details, like word count and 'does this make any sense at all'.
I admit I don't have too much sympathy. I'm not sure how people can write 300 words for an item in the first place. The Migrus Locker was under 200 as I recall. This year I think I hit *edit* a low number of words too.
I doubt word count and poor spelling will be why I get disqualified.