I just don´t like the idea that ALL Maguses will get this at medium/high level. The iconic Magus certainly doesn`t seem a Heavy Armor type.
I`m OK with the possibility existing, but it seems like it should be an Arcana or something.
A ´compromise´ alternative would be that ALL Maguses gain Medium Armor Proficiency and ASF immunity at 13th level (where they now gain Heavy Proficiency/ ASF immunity). There would also exist an Arcana which `accelerated´ the schedule so that you gained Medium Proficiency/Immunity at 7th level (where it is now gained automatically), and when you reach 13th level you also gain Heavy Proficiency/Immunity. This would mean HIGH level Magus would all have Medium Proficiency/Immunity, and the option would exist (via ONE Arcana) to allow Heavy Proficiency/Immunity.
I just don´t like the idea that ALL Maguses will get this at medium/high level. The iconic Magus certainly doesn`t seem a Heavy Armor type.
I`m OK with the possibility existing, but it seems like it should be an Arcana or something.
A ´compromise´ alternative would be that ALL Maguses gain Medium Armor Proficiency and ASF immunity at 13th level (where they now gain Heavy Proficiency/ ASF immunity). There would also exist an Arcana which `accelerated´ the schedule so that you gained Medium Proficiency/Immunity at 7th level (where it is now gained automatically), and when you reach 13th level you also gain Heavy Proficiency/Immunity. This would mean HIGH level Magus would all have Medium Proficiency/Immunity, and the option would exist (via ONE Arcana) to allow Heavy Proficiency/Immunity.
And in the same vein, not all fighters take advantage of the fact that they get heavy armor proficiency as a class feature. I actually like it the way it is, and having to drop an Arcana for the ability to use armor seems unduly expensive. Not every class feature will be critical or even useful to a given build, and trying to "force" a build onto a class narrows it from an archetype or template to something much less varied and interesting.
That said, I can totally see APG-style alternate class feature sets that tweak things like armor. A duelist/swashbuckler-unarmored magus, perhaps?
+2 cp.
I'm looking forward to seeing a Magus 10/Duelist 10 in light armor with jacked up Int and Dex.
Probably not optimized, but can gain all the Duelist benefits while using Spell Combat and such. Would have a pretty nice AC and be able to do some decent damage.
How about just making the feature work with whatever level of armor the Magus is capable of using? IE, he can cast in Light Armor if he never spends any other Armor Proficiency feats; if he purchases Medium Armor, it rolls over to that; if he purchases Heavy Armor, it rolls over to that.
Thus, there's a tradeoff for playing a heavily armored Magus in losing out of other Feat choices.
How about just making the feature work with whatever level of armor the Magus is capable of using? IE, he can cast in Light Armor if he never spends any other Armor Proficiency feats; if he purchases Medium Armor, it rolls over to that; if he purchases Heavy Armor, it rolls over to that.
Thus, there's a tradeoff for playing a heavily armored Magus in losing out of other Feat choices.
With the current capstone, very few would feel bad at starting with a level of fighter before doing Magus19.
+1 :-)
That said, I can totally see APG-style alternate class feature sets that tweak things like armor. A duelist/swashbuckler-unarmored magus, perhaps?
+1
QFT
I just don´t like the idea that ALL Maguses will get this at medium/high level. The iconic Magus certainly doesn`t seem a Heavy Armor type.
I`m OK with the possibility existing, but it seems like it should be an Arcana or something.
A ´compromise´ alternative would be that ALL Maguses gain Medium Armor Proficiency and ASF immunity at 13th level (where they now gain Heavy Proficiency/ ASF immunity). There would also exist an Arcana which `accelerated´ the schedule so that you gained Medium Proficiency/Immunity at 7th level (where it is now gained automatically), and when you reach 13th level you also gain Heavy Proficiency/Immunity. This would mean HIGH level Magus would all have Medium Proficiency/Immunity, and the option would exist (via ONE Arcana) to allow Heavy Proficiency/Immunity.
I don't think of this as a problem - in the long run there ought to be a set of packages/archetypes for the Magus. And I'd imagine some of them would address this specific issue. No?
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The trouble I see with the armor improvements at later levels is, at low levels you want the heaviest armor the most. After a few levels you've already invested money, abilities and developed your build around alternate ways to boost your defenses. Either that, or like the EK, you've taken the fighter dip and just started still spelling as much as you could afford to.
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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I actually like the heavy armor option for two reasons.
1) we already have lightly armored average BAB casters, they're called bards and their archtypes*
2) W/o psionics, a high level Magus can do the 'Jedi/Darth Vader types'. (you can't tell me that Darth Vader's exoskeleton isn't heavy armor)
That said, an archtype might be an option. Hmm... big risk, big reward for the SuperStar?
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I like the option of having medium and heavy armor, but I agree that it should be limited to an arcana.
Why? the high level magus is going to be busting it out with high level spells and arcana, and charging up his weapon with neat tricks. He doesn't need to be halfway duelist. Some nicely enchanted mithral breastplate would be my preference but the heavy armor is a nice option for those who want a more Dreadnought flavor to thier melee, and heavy armor also means heavy fortification is available.I agree with Quandary, it was a problem I saw with the first version of the Magus.
Maybe I'm wrong and extensive playtesting proves me wrong, but IMO the class doesn't support high level Magi with high Dex (i.e. the Dex. 30 guy with a rapier), and it should.
The high str guy is doing the same and dealing even more damage.
The problem isn't the heavy armor ability, the problem is that it isn't an option, you just get it and it is mandatory to use it unless you want to be suboptimal for some reason.Sure, for the high Dex guy using lighter armors means just a bit less AC, but far better speed and skill modifiers. However he is dealing less damage than the strong guy, are better Reflex saves and ranged touch attack bonuses worth it?
I totally agree. Especially when the PF description of a Max Dex bonus only applies to AC. If you read the player's guide, no other DEX based checks are effected.
So you can wear that heavy armor and withstand some decent melee, and in addition you can still add your full DEX bonus to ranged touch spells...