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I plan to run a version of Keep on the Borderlands at the ENWorld Chicago Gameday on February 27th. So far, my conversion is coming along well (especially considering I can't find my copy of the original module and had to use a Fantasy Hero PDF and a 3E conversion document. However, I thought I would ask some questions and share some of my ideas.
I am planning to set the adventure in Golarion, specifically in Lastwall in or near the Fangwood. The Keep and a small surrounding village with farmland, is a stop on a road that goes through the wood and ultimately towards the border with the Hold of Belkzen. The humanoids in the Caves are being directed by the followers of Lamashtu to destabilize the region and weaken Lastwall. Does this scenario sound reasonable? Lastwall would obviously take any humanoid incursions seriously. However, I would imagine that they would not send armed forces everywhere for all problems -- hence the need for adventures. Does this scenario sound reasonable?
Is there a good list of common trade goods beyond what is in the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook?
I have run previous events but is there any particular advice that anyone can give in converting an adventure to the Pathfinder rules or running an adventure for the first time with the rules system?
Thanks in advance for your responses.
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I think it's a good idea you have of making the humanoids cooperate under the banner of the evil clerics in the back caverns. The original module never mentioned them cooperating, and I had a hard time buying that they wouldn't kill each other off in a final bloody battle in the ravine, living in such close proximity.
OTOH, there probably should be some underlying dislike between the various humanoid types, so the party has the option of starting some in-fighting between the various tribes with successful Diplomacy or Bluff checks. If the humanoids all work too closely together, the logical outcome would be a mass slaughter of the party by ALL of the tribes, led by the clerics, after (or even during) the party's first foray, unless they use great caution and stealth.
An addition I made to my own recent running of a PFized KotB: After the party had cleared out almost half of the lairs and had reached 6th level, the evil clerics hired an unusual and deadly assassin - an ogre mage - to ambush the party. (It didn't actually have any class levels, it was just a straight-up, out-of-the-Bestiary ogre mage.) It remained invisible in the ravine outside the caves, waited until the party had cleared out a few more caves and were wounded/low on spells, and then surprised them with a cone of cold that almost wiped them out! They succeeded in beating it, but it escaped and vowed revenge, becoming a recurring villain even after KotB was completed. (I am currently running the Slavelords mods, converted to PF of course, and they finally recently cornered the ogre mage and killed him after he attacked them in their innroom at night while most of them were unarmored!)
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I think it's a good idea you have of making the humanoids cooperate under the banner of the evil clerics in the back caverns. The original module never mentioned them cooperating, and I had a hard time buying that they wouldn't kill each other off in a final bloody battle in the ravine, living in such close proximity.
OTOH, there probably should be some underlying dislike between the various humanoid types, so the party has the option of starting some in-fighting between the various tribes with successful Diplomacy or Bluff checks. If the humanoids all work too closely together, the logical outcome would be a mass slaughter of the party by ALL of the tribes, led by the clerics, after (or even during) the party's first foray, unless they use great caution and stealth.
An addition I made to my own recent running of a PFized KotB: After the party had cleared out almost half of the lairs and had reached 6th level, the evil clerics hired an unusual and deadly assassin - an ogre mage - to ambush the party. (It didn't actually have any class levels, it was just a straight-up, out-of-the-Bestiary ogre mage.) It remained invisible in the ravine outside the caves, waited until the party had cleared out a few more caves and were wounded/low on spells, and then surprised them with a cone of cold that almost wiped them out! They succeeded in beating it, but it escaped and vowed revenge, becoming a recurring villain even after KotB was completed. (I am currently running the Slavelords mods, converted to PF of course, and they finally recently cornered the ogre mage and killed him after he attacked them in their innroom at night while most of them were unarmored!)
That was one of my thoughts as well. There should be a lot of rivalry between the various tribes. Players should have an opportunity to exploit that, and some may even try to frame some of the other tribes for their actions.
My thought is that the clergy of Lamashtu have enlisted some of the heavy hitters at the Caves of Chaos (such as the minotaur) to their efforts to destabilize the region. Eliminating some of the heavy hitters would weaken the clergy.(I view intelligent chaotic evil foes as capable of having fairly complex plans. )
Although this is a one shot event, I think it should draw in some of the grognards as well as new players. (Down the road, I will likely look for my own gaming group here as I moved back to the Chicago area recently.)
Yep, we grognards love the old-school modules, nostalgia factor ... :P
You know, canon aside, it's really a pretty dry old module...
Why not write something new? It sounds like you already are, more or less. The politics of interaction sound great, and just what I missed the first, second and third time round.
Trade goods; sorry, can't help. Make it up? It won't take much more than an hour.
Best, and peace,
The Porp.
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To steal an idea from popular novels, have the evil clerics not only using diplomacy and shows of force and religious fanaticism to get the normally fractious humanoids working together, but also deception, with one of the humanoid tribal chiefs being a doppleganger or similar 'fake,' using their position of usurped authority to organize otherwise incompatible forces.
This creates a side-option of the PCs beating the chief, who reverts to his true form, and causing the humanoids currently mashing their taters to fall apart as the deception is revealed.
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The original module never mentioned them cooperating...
Actually it did mention which groups cooperate and which don't.
TRIBAL ALLIANCES AND WARFARE: You might allow player characters to somehow become aware that there is a constant fighting going on between the goblins and hobgoblins on one side and the orcs, sometimes with gnoll allies, on the other - with the koboids hoping to be forgotten by all, and the bugbears picking off any stragglers who happen by. With this knowledge, they might be able to set tribes to fighting one another, and then the adventurers can take advantage of the weakened state of the feuding humanoids. Be careful to handle this whole thing properly; it is a device you may use to aid players who are few in number but with a high level of playing skill. It will make it too easy if there are many players, or if players do not actually use wits instead of force when the opportunity presents itself.
The original module never mentioned them cooperating...Actually it did mention which groups cooperate and which don't.
TRIBAL ALLIANCES AND WARFARE: You might allow player characters to somehow become aware that there is a constant fighting going on between the goblins and hobgoblins on one side and the orcs, sometimes with gnoll allies, on the other - with the koboids hoping to be forgotten by all, and the bugbears picking off any stragglers who happen by. With this knowledge, they might be able to set tribes to fighting one another, and then the adventurers can take advantage of the weakened state of the feuding humanoids. Be careful to handle this whole thing properly; it is a device you may use to aid players who are few in number but with a high level of playing skill. It will make it too easy if there are many players, or if players do not actually use wits instead of force when the opportunity presents itself.
So it does indeed! I stand corrected. In fact, that whole passage you quoted looks familiar, so I must've read it, forgotten it, and then thought it was my own idea. LOL!
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I removed a post linking to another company's intellectual property. Don't do that.
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Thanks to everyone for your feedback. I have been working on a few ideas.
Set, the doppelganger is a good idea -- and an explanation why one of the humanoid chieftains is so strong a supporter of the clergy of Lamashtu, who in turn get to play good cop to the chieftain's bad cop. I also plan to throw in a few NPCs and tie in a few lose threads, such as having the bandits tied to the clergy. A certain cleric visiting the keep and his acolytes will pose as Cayden Cailean and there will be some possibilities of help for the party.
Normally, I would create a new adventure but I have been swamped with a few things.
Aries_Omega, I am primarily working with this link: D&D 3rd Edition Conversion of Keep on the Borderlands as a source. If you have the original module, this conversion should help.
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I removed a post linking to another company's intellectual property. Don't do that.
Let's respect the intellectual property rights of others.
Also, I am planning on having a variety of first level characters, using the 20 point buy system. As I recall, that is what is used for the Pathfinder Society characters.
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Just dug up my B1-9 module and my stand-alone B2 to use with PF in celebration of my 30 year anniversary of playing DnD! My group is going to go into the Caves and we will be exploring other "older" modules the rest of the year!
Just dug up my B1-9 module and my stand-alone B2 to use with PF in celebration of my 30 year anniversary of playing DnD! My group is going to go into the Caves and we will be exploring other "older" modules the rest of the year!
very cool
Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth or perhaps the Danger at Dunwater?
Just dug up my B1-9 module and my stand-alone B2 to use with PF in celebration of my 30 year anniversary of playing DnD! My group is going to go into the Caves and we will be exploring other "older" modules the rest of the year!very cool
Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth or perhaps the Danger at Dunwater?
Based on what I have Caverns would be my next logical choice building up to the A-G series...but I will most likely use the U series to lead to the A.
I'm inspiered... Time to pull out my T1-4 and start converting!
Based on what I have Caverns would be my next logical choice building up to the A-G series...but I will most likely use the U series to lead to the A.Just dug up my B1-9 module and my stand-alone B2 to use with PF in celebration of my 30 year anniversary of playing DnD! My group is going to go into the Caves and we will be exploring other "older" modules the rest of the year!very cool
Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth or perhaps the Danger at Dunwater?
I am currently running the same campaign! :) Started with B2, which brought PCs to 6th level. Then A-series. They completed A1 and are halfway through A2, and are currently 9th level (using the fast-track XP column).
I am estimating that they will be around 12th level at the end of A4, and I'm curious to see how they will fare in A4. As you know, the party starts basically buck-azz naked at beginning of A4, so I'm basically considering them to be about 9th level for purposes of converting the challenges in A4.
Anyone think I should set challenges higher or lower? The party will be pretty much naked and using sticks and stones up to the end, including during the climactic battle vs. the slavelords, unless they somehow manage to sneak aboard the Earth Dragon and equip themselves unnoticed (a major feat indeed).
I'm inspiered... Time to pull out my T1-4 and start converting!
There might be a stat conversion out there somewhere - probably to 3.0, but that way, you would not have to do it all yourself.
Stefan
Based on what I have Caverns would be my next logical choice building up to the A-G series...but I will most likely use the U series to lead to the A.Just dug up my B1-9 module and my stand-alone B2 to use with PF in celebration of my 30 year anniversary of playing DnD! My group is going to go into the Caves and we will be exploring other "older" modules the rest of the year!very cool
Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth or perhaps the Danger at Dunwater?
I am currently running the same campaign! :) Started with B2, which brought PCs to 6th level. Then A-series. They completed A1 and are halfway through A2, and are currently 9th level (using the fast-track XP column).
I am estimating that they will be around 12th level at the end of A4, and I'm curious to see how they will fare in A4. As you know, the party starts basically buck-azz naked at beginning of A4, so I'm basically considering them to be about 9th level for purposes of converting the challenges in A4.
Anyone think I should set challenges higher or lower? The party will be pretty much naked and using sticks and stones up to the end, including during the climactic battle vs. the slavelords, unless they somehow manage to sneak aboard the Earth Dragon and equip themselves unnoticed (a major feat indeed).
Honestly to answer that I would need to know what the make-up of your party is..some of the PF classes might be ok for a bit the way A4 begins.
Honestly to answer that I would need to know what the make-up of your party is..some of the PF classes might be ok for a bit the way A4 begins.Based on what I have Caverns would be my next logical choice building up to the A-G series...but I will most likely use the U series to lead to the A.Just dug up my B1-9 module and my stand-alone B2 to use with PF in celebration of my 30 year anniversary of playing DnD! My group is going to go into the Caves and we will be exploring other "older" modules the rest of the year!very cool
Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth or perhaps the Danger at Dunwater?
I am currently running the same campaign! :) Started with B2, which brought PCs to 6th level. Then A-series. They completed A1 and are halfway through A2, and are currently 9th level (using the fast-track XP column).
I am estimating that they will be around 12th level at the end of A4, and I'm curious to see how they will fare in A4. As you know, the party starts basically buck-azz naked at beginning of A4, so I'm basically considering them to be about 9th level for purposes of converting the challenges in A4.
Anyone think I should set challenges higher or lower? The party will be pretty much naked and using sticks and stones up to the end, including during the climactic battle vs. the slavelords, unless they somehow manage to sneak aboard the Earth Dragon and equip themselves unnoticed (a major feat indeed).
Right. If you have a monk and a sorcerer in the party, they should have a much easier time than with fighter, wizard and cleric.
Stefan
Honestly to answer that I would need to know what the make-up of your party is..some of the PF classes might be ok for a bit the way A4 begins.
I am estimating that they will be around 12th level at the end of A4, and I'm curious to see how they will fare in A4. As you know, the party starts basically buck-azz naked at beginning of A4, so I'm basically considering them to be about 9th level for purposes of converting the challenges in A4.
Anyone think I should set challenges higher or lower? The party will be pretty much naked and using sticks and stones up to the end, including during the climactic battle vs. the slavelords, unless they somehow manage to sneak aboard the Earth Dragon and equip themselves unnoticed (a major feat indeed).
If they are 12th level by the time A4 begins, it should look like this:
Fighter 12
Wizard/Cleric/Lore Master (I'll find out what levels next game, 2/28)
Paladin 8/Knight of the Chalice 4 (estimation)
Cleric 12
Rogue 12
Plus a new player's character, which I will post when I find out. It will be awhile before they begin A4 (still halfway through A2 right now, at 9th level).
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Sounds like my thread started some good gaming discussion. (I also have played RPGs for 30 years.)
I am pretty much done with my conversion but want to ask a few questions. Some will have spoilers.
By the way, over on the Chicago Gameday 25 is Feb 27th: SIGN UP NOW!, my Pathfinder event was the first one to fill up with players -- and it took only an hour and a half.
Here are some quick questions:
In Lastwall, how would a party be expected to handle humanoids who surrender or are non-combatants? (I plan to have a paladin of Iomedae and clerics/followers of several good aligned deities.)
And here are some encounters I am considering:
Your thoughts?
Sounds like my thread started some good gaming discussion. (I also have played RPGs for 30 years.)
I am pretty much done with my conversion but want to ask a few questions. Some will have spoilers.
By the way, over on the Chicago Gameday 25 is Feb 27th: SIGN UP NOW!, my Pathfinder event was the first one to fill up with players -- and it took only an hour and a half.
Here are some quick questions:
In Lastwall, how would a party be expected to handle humanoids who surrender or are non-combatants? (I plan to have a paladin of Iomedae and clerics/followers of several good aligned deities.)
And here are some encounters I am considering:
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
Your thoughts?
The only name I can come up with is Keep Vigilio...and yea I saw your game day sign up and was hoping to get in...but alas you filled up very very quick.
I'll look at my notes for it and I believe I replaced that encounter as well...
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Sounds like my thread started some good gaming discussion. (I also have played RPGs for 30 years.)
I am pretty much done with my conversion but want to ask a few questions. Some will have spoilers.
By the way, over on the Chicago Gameday 25 is Feb 27th: SIGN UP NOW!, my Pathfinder event was the first one to fill up with players -- and it took only an hour and a half.
Here are some quick questions:
In Lastwall, how would a party be expected to handle humanoids who surrender or are non-combatants? (I plan to have a paladin of Iomedae and clerics/followers of several good aligned deities.)
And here are some encounters I am considering:
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
Your thoughts?
The only name I can come up with is Keep Vigilio...and yea I saw your game day sign up and was hoping to get in...but alas you filled up very very quick.
I'll look at my notes for it and I believe I replaced that encounter as well...
Fortunately, I have some access to different linguistic resources, so I will find something.
I have always thought that encounter was a little odd, and a bit difficult considering the resources of a party of 3rd level adventurers.
Ronin84, if someone cancels in the afternoon and I run another slot, I will ask to keep a seat for you.
Sounds like my thread started some good gaming discussion. (I also have played RPGs for 30 years.)
I am pretty much done with my conversion but want to ask a few questions. Some will have spoilers.
By the way, over on the Chicago Gameday 25 is Feb 27th: SIGN UP NOW!, my Pathfinder event was the first one to fill up with players -- and it took only an hour and a half.
Here are some quick questions:
In Lastwall, how would a party be expected to handle humanoids who surrender or are non-combatants? (I plan to have a paladin of Iomedae and clerics/followers of several good aligned deities.)
And here are some encounters I am considering:
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
Your thoughts?
The only name I can come up with is Keep Vigilio...and yea I saw your game day sign up and was hoping to get in...but alas you filled up very very quick.
I'll look at my notes for it and I believe I replaced that encounter as well...
Fortunately, I have some access to different linguistic resources, so I will find something.
I have always thought that encounter was a little odd, and a bit difficult considering the resources of a party of 3rd level adventurers.
Ronin84, if someone cancels in the afternoon and I run another slot, I will ask to keep a seat for you.
Working at a school where over 70 different languages are spoken at homes, I can usually get pretty creative.
Guardare
Guettere
Mirar
Aufpassesn (More Castles and Crusades)
I'll see what else I can dig up today...
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I was considering running a Pathfinder-ized Keep on the Borderlands for the opening adventure of my next campaign. Is there any chance you could email me what you've done?
Sure, I will. Send me an e-mail to the following address:
I will have to check, but I may not have done the CMB and CMD for the Keep inhabitants.
I ran the adventure Saturday and it went well. (I did have some last minute cancellations but managed.)
So, who would like a copy of what I worked on.
D20PFSRD.com, how would I submit a Word file to you?
Sorry I didn't stop by but with it being full I went ahead and ran something for my kids and my buddies kids....B2 using Pathfinder!
I believe I saw you at Chgowiz's game later on but didn't put 2+2 until we were out the door and gone.
Would love to talk, let me know next time you are in the area.
God yes I'd love a copy, if you could email it to:
black.leonhart@gmail.com
It'd greatly help my current game, as I was thinking of going that direction.
Hey, if you don't mind mailing these out, please count in
Thanks!
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Okay, I am going to respond to everyone's requests. So, check your mail!
D20PFSRD.com, you may want to double check my CRs for the inhabitants of the Keep. I figured that even in Lastwall, most guardsmen are warriors not fighters.
Ronin84, I am sorry that we did not meet up. I look forward to seeing you at the next Gameday.
Thank you!
Okay, I am going to respond to everyone's requests. So, check your mail!
D20PFSRD.com, you may want to double check my CRs for the inhabitants of the Keep. I figured that even in Lastwall, most guardsmen are warriors not fighters.
Ronin84, I am sorry that we did not meet up. I look forward to seeing you at the next Gameday.
I'm doing my conversion on the fly, would love to see what you have done if you don't mind.
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Glad to help out, everyone!
Ronin84, check your mail.
I did make a few changes to some of the encounters. Let me know what you think.
Please double check what I did for your own games, as I am fairly new to Pathfinder. (I just have the Core Rule Book and the Bestiary.)
D20PFSRD.com, feel free to put my conversion up on your site if you wish.
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No problem. I thought that WoTC might have given the creator of the conversion I worked with permission to use it, as the 3.0 conversion has been up for a while.
Well, here is a question. How can we, Pathfinder players and GM, help out D20PFSRD.com, the website? I know that a lot of work has gone into the site, and maybe we can get you a few helping hands.
I will be interested in hearing what people think, and their own play experiences.
Well, if you ask... I´d like a copy also :-)
Stefan
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No problem. I thought that WoTC might have given the creator of the conversion I worked with permission to use it, as the 3.0 conversion has been up for a while.
If someone can show me that the original module and rules were released as OGC at some point I'd be more than happy to host it, but I don't think it is/has been. With that said, its perfectly fine as a fan made/converted resource etc, but the site d20pfsrd.com very much has to abide by the OGL and CUP.
Well, here is a question. How can we, Pathfinder players and GM, help out D20PFSRD.com, the website? I know that a lot of work has gone into the site, and maybe we can get you a few helping hands.
Wow. Excellent question! I haven't put out a call in a while since we've got a pretty large core of people adding content every day now but let me be clear:
We are ALWAYS looking for more volunteers. What does that mean?
- Can you type? Then you can help :) Its not very involved and you can do as little or as much as you like, whenever its convenient for you.
- If you are using the site during a play session and you happen to look up a rule and notice the word "the" is misspelled "teh" you can feel free to log in and fix it.
- If you are good at and like to convert OGC monsters from previous editions of the rules, you can join the team of folks doing monster conversions every day.
- If you are good with spreadsheets you can join the team of folks assembling consolidated lists of everything ever made for Pathfinder or that would be compatible with Pathfinder.
- If you just feel creative you can have a "Lab" page where you create your own content to share with other players.
- If you want to help convert Golarion spells, we got work for you.
- If you are a talented artist and want some good exposure (we now get between 6-10,000 visits a day woot woot!) then we got work for you.
- If you just want to update the FAQ page... we got work for you.
- If you found some errata that's not on the site... guess what? Yep, we got work for you :)
So in short, we need people. More people, every day.
Now, what do you need in order to help?
A Google ID. It doesn't have to be a Gmail ID, just whatever ID you currently can use to log into various Google services. Send that to jreyst@gmail.com with the words "I'd like to help!" and I can have you added into the system in minutes. Just for pete's sake, make sure to include that Google ID in the email so I don't have to email you back asking for it :)
It's really that easy. So if you like and use the site, and would like to dedicate some time and effort to making it even better, get in touch with me, we'd love to add you into the army.
Oh and by the way, we created T-Shirts with the logo on the front and a small screenshot of the site on the back. We don't make any profit off the shirts* and we are going to be wearing them at PaizoCon and GenCon. We'd love to bump into some folks in the crowd also wearing the shirts! If you're interested, head over to Zazzle to check them out!
\I would also be interested in trying this.
you can email me at
splunge42 at yahoo dot com
Thanks
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\I would also be interested in trying this.
you can email me at
splunge42 at yahoo dot com
Thanks
Allensh and gigglestick, check your e-mails.
I am pretty busy right now, d20PFSRD, but I hope that once I get a few things taken care of in the next few months to have some time to work on some conversions. (Hmm, maybe some of the magic items in the DMG?)
\I would also be interested in trying this.
you can email me at
splunge42 at yahoo dot com
Thanks
Allensh and gigglestick, check your e-mails.
I am pretty busy right now, d20PFSRD, but I hope that once I get a few things taken care of in the next few months to have some time to work on some conversions. (Hmm, maybe some of the magic items in the DMG?)
Nice. Thanks.
One question. How do the {ooooo oo} correspond to HP (in this case, 11 hp?)