Creative Director
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The rules for detailing nations (such as the Command DC you mentioned) ... are these rules all in one Kingmaker volume or will they be sort of spread out throughout all the AP volumes?
I ask because I'm working on a rather large and involved project (very hush hush LOL) and this info could be of particular interest.
Thanks!!!
The rules for running kingdoms and building cities will be found in Pathfinder Adventure Path volume #32. We don't have plans on reprinting the rules in every volume, because they're pretty lengthy (the article's looking like it's gonna be 12 or so pages long), so if you don't have #32, you'll have to fake running the kindgom/city building element of Kingmaker. But if you don't have #32, you'll have to fake everything that happens to your PCs from level 4 to 6 anyway...
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The rules for running kingdoms and building cities will be found in Pathfinder Adventure Path volume #32. We don't have plans on reprinting the rules in every volume, because they're pretty lengthy (the article's looking like it's gonna be 12 or so pages long), so if you don't have #32, you'll have to fake running the kindgom/city building element of Kingmaker. But if you don't have #32, you'll have to fake everything that happens to your PCs from level 4 to 6 anyway...The rules for detailing nations (such as the Command DC you mentioned) ... are these rules all in one Kingmaker volume or will they be sort of spread out throughout all the AP volumes?
I ask because I'm working on a rather large and involved project (very hush hush LOL) and this info could be of particular interest.
Thanks!!!
Perfect - thanks James (and Neil)! That's the info I was looking for!
I should ask, though... Would folks want to see something like this instead of a more heavily detailed adventure?
Nope. APs are APs - do not deviate. More adventure, less exposition. (Though I certainly do expect most - probabably all - of the support articles in the Kingmaker AP to have something to do with kingdom-management.)
In fact, I suspect there will be a number of us using more detailed systems in place of/on top of the high-level kingdom-running guidelines found in Kingmaker. (Me, for one - I'll be using the [somewhat modified] system found in the 3e Fields of Blood book, which I'll adapt with the stuff found in Kingmaker, if it's good. That book, with my modifications, is my go-to for kingdom management rules.)
Well...you are the king. Harem away!
I agree with those saying "Keep the APs coming!". I love the support articles, but I don't want to sacrifice APs to them. Even though we're about four APs behind at this point.
It's not like we havn't joked about playing the theoretical Kingmaker mass battles out with Warhammer Fantasy rules anyway... :p
The mix seems good the way it is, why change it?
The mix seems good the way it is, why change it?
Agreed. +1
The existing formula seems fine.
My question was totally ignored. Hmph!
Next time, try starting a new thread, entitled: "I demand that James Jacobs stop ignoring the following question of mine"...
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My question was totally ignored. Hmph!The one about what happens if a ruler doesn't want to get married? If they don't get married, they can still rule the kingdom. Their bonuses are just a little bit lower without a spouse to help with the ruling.
Hmm... no it involved a harem.. but it seems like the forums ate my post. :P
Here we go again.. will there be rules for building/creating a harem? Will there be rules for a harem girl/boy position? Will there be rules for advancement within the harem (kind of a playing favorites?)
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Is it too late for the art department to order a spread of King Sajan and Queen Amiri? :D
Something tells me the bonuses more have to do with marrying to wealth and "established nobility" as opposed to have your own limited "by the sword" resources.
Think along the lines of marrying a Trade Prince's daughter or a warmongering Duke's son. Gold and richs vs soldiers and arms.
No rules for harems in this Pathfinder. We'll have to look into covering harem rules in a later volume.
I know. I figured that it would be in the Katapesh or Qadira books, but no.
No rules for harems in this Pathfinder. We'll have to look into covering harem rules in a later volume.Let's get Gwen Kestrel on that ASAP. ;-)
+5 ;D
Your Friendly Neighborhood Dalesman
"Bringing Big D**n Justice to the Bad Guys Since 1369 DR"
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No rules for harems in this Pathfinder. We'll have to look into covering harem rules in a later volume.
Let's home so!
Why does everything have to have rules? Just treat the first wife as your queen and every other wife is just another fun evening in the week.
Yes but what if you're not playing the King/Queen. What if you're a lowly harem girl looking for advancement. Talk about drama, intrigue, and backstabbing!
Then there's the flipside of being the King/Queen. Making one, making it socially acceptable, negotiation bonuses, etc.
And lastly there's being the outsider. How does the King/Queen of an outside nation deal with a King/Queen with a harem? How does one go about offering a daughter/son and what kind of bonuses go with having a daughter/son in another King/Queen's harem grant you.
You're pretty hung up on all that...perhaps you should wait for Kingmaker pt. 2 to come out, then write up some Harem rules if what they provide doesn't fit what your group needs. Half of what you talked about is roleplaying anyways.
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You're pretty hung up on all that...perhaps you should wait for Kingmaker pt. 2 to come out, then write up some Harem rules if what they provide doesn't fit what your group needs. Half of what you talked about is roleplaying anyways.
As mentioned else where, there are many roles PCs can play in the kingdom in this AP. Hence why I asked about a Harem.
Person I replied to didn't seem to understand why there needs to be rules, I explained. There's no hang up.
I think even if a harem were culturally acceptable for the kingdom you are founding, by the rules only the position of the 1st wife/consort, the closest equivalent to queen, of the harem would be fillable by a PC or major NPC. All other members of the harem would be fluff, there for looks and fun but having no rules mechanics impact on the game.
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Creative Director
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There's two reasons we didn't go into great detail about harems. The second reason is probably why we'll NEVER do a big rules article about harems.
Reason 1: The "Cities and Kings" article is PACKED TIGHT. It's 10 or 12 pages long but there's pretty much no room for everything that'll happen in a kingdom, so we had to pick and choose the most important parts to detail.
Reason 2 (the BIG reason): Sex makes Americans squirm, for whatever reason, these days. It's OK to have horrific violence in our art, apparently; we've printed decapitated heads, bodies with guts hanging out, blood explosions, dismemberment, and all sorts of gore. We've actually had VERY little complaints about the gore. But whenever we do a picture that starts bordering on the sexual, or include elements in an adventure that are sexual (Hook Mountain Massacre's a good example), we get a lot of negative feedback.
Personally... I'm not sure why so many Americans are more disturbed by the process of creating life than they are by the process of creating death. I prefer mature-content entertainment, like you see on HBO or in R-rated movies, and as a result we DO include sex as elements in our products, but when we do, we tend to be a lot more subtle about it and, I guess, more responsible about HOW we handle the topic than we do things like dismemberment and murder. A big article about how to run a harem in a game would actually be pretty interesting, but I worry that it'd get us a lot of angry mail. (Shrug)
Reason 2 (the BIG reason): Sex makes Americans squirm, for whatever reason, these days. It's OK to have horrific violence in our art, apparently; we've printed decapitated heads, bodies with guts hanging out, blood explosions, dismemberment, and all sorts of gore. We've actually had VERY little complaints about the gore. But whenever we do a picture that starts bordering on the sexual, or include elements in an adventure that are sexual (Hook Mountain Massacre's a good example), we get a lot of negative feedback.Personally... I'm not sure why so many Americans are more disturbed by the process of creating life than they are by the process of creating death. I prefer mature-content entertainment, like you see on HBO or in R-rated movies, and as a result we DO include sex as elements in our products, but when we do, we tend to be a lot more subtle about it and, I guess, more responsible about HOW we handle the topic than we do things like dismemberment and murder. A big article about how to run a harem in a game would actually be pretty interesting, but I worry that it'd get us a lot of angry mail. (Shrug)
That is so wird, why the fear of sex and nudity, i simply dont get how the Amarican ppl think.
how is a torn of limb less desturbing than a naked body?|
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But whenever we do a picture that starts bordering on the sexual, or include elements in an adventure that are sexual (Hook Mountain Massacre's a good example), we get a lot of negative feedback.
Its not just the sex in HMM that bothers me, but the KIND of sex involved in it. Ever watch that X-files episode...
Personally... I'm not sure why so many Americans are more disturbed by the process of creating life than they are by the process of creating death. I prefer mature-content entertainment, like you see on HBO or in R-rated movies, and as a result we DO include sex as elements in our products, but when we do, we tend to be a lot more subtle about it and, I guess, more responsible about HOW we handle the topic than we do things like dismemberment and murder. A big article about how to run a harem in a game would actually be pretty interesting, but I worry that it'd get us a lot of angry mail. (Shrug)
Its probably better safe than sorry. Anything about creating, maintaining, and using a Harem would probably get a lot of negative attention unless it was in its own supplement (ala BoEF or that Quintessential whatever-the-word-was). Those same HBO shows are going to be nothing but content about sexuality, and so you can choose to not watch that programing instead of having to cookie cutter around it when it appears on screen. The same should work for adventures as well.
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That is so wird, why the fear of sex and nudity, i simply dont get how the Amarican ppl think.
how is a torn of limb less desturbing than a naked body?
I don't quite get it either. There seems to be a lot of emphasis on protecting children from exposure to things of a sexual nature; no one seems to want to take responsibility for when it happens... which can be bad for a product provider.
I'd guess it's something along the lines of, "This is a bad thing don't do it" when you see a disemboweled person, but when you see something sexual people think, "That's encouraging sex!"
I'm American and I don't get it either.
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Creative Director
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For James Jacobs Hook Horror Mountain Massacre was gruesome enough, and if I recall that was the edited version. I wonder what the directors cut was supposed to be:)
EVERY adventure you see in anything Paizo publishes is the "edited" version. ;-)
The original version was pretty much the same adventure but 150% longer. There was indeed additional material in that version that, were "hook Mountain" a movie, would have landed the thing an X rating and would have branded it as actual pornography. If someone's looking for that kind of material for their games, there are PLENTY of other options available on the internent. ;-)
The only significant cut was a gambling barge that Nick recycled more or less intact for inclusion in his later adventure, "Edge of Anarchy."
There was indeed additional material in that version that, were "hook Mountain" a movie, would have landed the thing an X rating and would have branded it as actual pornography.
I am quite sure that the amount of violence in HMM would get it an "adults only" rating in germany if ever translated (witch goes along with a ban of advertising)
Probably in most other european countries the same.We have very strikt rules about violence, the original highlander movie is "adults only" over here :-)
sex, on the other hand, no problem, nude man or women are common on german tv at every hour of the day
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Personally... I'm not sure why so many Americans are more disturbed by the process of creating life than they are by the process of creating death. I prefer mature-content entertainment, like you see on HBO or in R-rated movies, and as a result we DO include sex as elements in our products, but when we do, we tend to be a lot more subtle about it and, I guess, more responsible about HOW we handle the topic than we do things like dismemberment and murder. A big article about how to run a harem in a game would actually be pretty interesting, but I worry that it'd get us a lot of angry mail. (Shrug)
QFT. That's one of the things I've never understood about a large part of the US population, too.
The way the kingdom and city building stuff is built, ALL the players get to take part. And all of their characters help to bolster the kingdom and make it better. And in addition, you'll be able to change who serves in what leadership position pretty much every month. It might not be realistic to change the king every month or every year, but it does let everyone have a chance to sit on the throne and the rules themselves don't punish you for taking this route.
:)
Well, as its a game system with bonuses.. why not go for a meritocracy?
So annual competitions in the kingdom for every role. Diplomacy id presume to be the kings thing to do. So anyone can show up, and some basic pre-evaluation (..overseen by a paladin..?), and then the debate or whatever.. to be followed by an election.
Could turn wild.. hahah
...i promice to set a tax on adventure gear, 100%.. and divide this wealth to the people!! lol
Outrageous for them to carry stuff worth 1.000.000 copp... *fireball*
..quick end to the meritocratic democracy...
But atleast this adventure should be a major boost for those who like being productive mages, summoning workforces, stuffcreating djinni, LOTS of stonewalls -> bridges, castles, roads etc.. (too bad that is all so very highlevel), fabricate etc etc etc
Especially once organised into magical colleges. 100*W1 may not look like much. But im sure they can be turned into a mighty workforce.
If nothing else, then secret police. Making sure unhappy people get charmed until their problems are fixed :D
Noble service state? Could work..
Be a noble, get freedom from taxes, but be forced to serve.
Let alone temples. That part gets almost scary... creating water, food, healing, bringing back the dead. Curing the blind and deaf.
Reason 2 (the BIG reason): Sex makes Americans squirm, for whatever reason, these days.
Im pretty certain there are action groups out there that scream at all such. It comes via email from unknown addresses?
Why not ask them on their oppinion of Thac0 and whether wish would be better of with a xp component, than a gp component.
That should screen out the non-customers :p
Seems like there's some support in here for harem rules. I'm glad people don't see it as pervish and immature as others would. :PI wouldn't think you'd get a bad reaction from people here on harem rules, most of them would just yell "boobies" and reach out their hands longingly :P
Only to be bond and dragged away when the Queen (you pick the definition) decides more men are need in the reverse harem.
(Someone had to go there. XD)
No idea how i managed to miss the first page earlier :p
but..
hexes. sounds a lot like someone brought up my nr 1 gripe with savage tide. Like how to actually be rulers of this grand new land and extract wealth.
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Im very interested, ill tell you that much.
finally some way to turn labor into a vast kingdom that just might produce enough wealth to fund all those slotless rings of the elements etc fun stuff one might not find on mere adventuring ;)
Birthright GB:s (2000gp) making a comeback?
so a 80-100 provincer, each giving those 2-3 GB a season in pure profit... -maintenance, court, armies etc.. thats a bunch of shiny adventurers gear waiting to be manufactured!
Yeah, theocratic magocracy. Better get a priest worshipping a magic-god, and make that the one true and only legal faith. Should lessen trouble on that front. But maybe more via the many new colleges started and thousands of trained mages... some might think themselves better suited at ruling :p
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Regarding the sex versus violence thing, as an American the only explanation I can offer is that our society is sick in the brain. Our society is okay with death and violence, but terrified of sex. We tell people they should be happy with their appearance, then cram an extremely unnatural and unhealthy standard of beauty down people's throats. We worship actors and athletes as gods and dump on teachers and police officers. We're a really messed up society.
As to the idea of "harem rules" or something similar, I don't think they'd be necessary simply because I don't think a harem would come up in most people's games. Maybe I'm guessing wrong, but I think more games would include a king and queen than a king and concubines.
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In my HMM massacre the first thing my players had to handle after rescuing the Black Arrows was a prompt use of Heal skill to help Vale - the Grauls have had some "fun" with him, but because they found his physiology somewhat "limiting", they made a few "adjustments" using ogre hooks.
Including, you know, making some areas more "accesible".
The party designated healer (a Favoured Soul of Abadar) nearly got sick from this. There was no mercy at the Graul Farmstead that night.
But concubines are fun..
It's funny you say that. I'm working on an adventure involving three of them right now. And it's not fun at the moment. Lots of hard work, actually. ;-)
