Anyone who has seen movies such as [u]American Ninja[/u] knows that ninjas come in huge numbers at very low level and thus really obviously aren't a prestige class. Of course, you can pretty much do the same thing with a Rogue chassis.
What should probably happen is for there to be a "Rogue Weapon Proficiencies in Other Cultures" sidebar where it talks about how hobgoblin ninjas are proficient with masterwork bastard swords.
-Frank
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Ninja is a Prestiege Class.Mike should make a ninja class if he wants to, I reckon.I've always felt that the "ninja" archetype was best served by the rogue class--with out without multiclassing.
In OA, yes. But as a profession or concept, the rogue works really well. As for ninja PrCes, there should be several (regardless of if they have "ninja" in their name or not)--the assassin is good one, as is the shadowdancer, or the ninja spy in OA, etc.
I don't see a problem with a ninja class... actually sorta used to it as Might & Magic II had one in the old Commodore days... a bit more combative than a rogue though.
I've often thought the assassin should have been a core class rather than a prestige class.
Mike should make a ninja class if he wants to
...he should leave his friends behind...
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Anyone who has seen movies such as [u]American Ninja[/u] knows that ninjas come in huge numbers at very low level and thus really obviously aren't a prestige class. Of course, you can pretty much do the same thing with a Rogue chassis.
What should probably happen is for there to be a "Rogue Weapon Proficiencies in Other Cultures" sidebar where it talks about how hobgoblin ninjas are proficient with masterwork bastard swords.
-Frank
Fine: NINJA is a Cultural Template you put over Core Classes.
Rogue: The Ninja with a Sword and Bow and a lot of stealth and disguise.
Fighter: the Ninja with the Sword and just enough stealth to creep up on the PCs in a Band of fifty Ninja.
Magicuser: The Ninja with Autohit MAGIC MISSILE Shruiken, and a blowpipe used to dish out WEB and SLEEP.
Mike should make a ninja class if he wants to...he should leave his friends behind...
...and if his friends aren't ninjas and don't use katana then they're no friends of mine...
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I don't see a problem with a ninja class... actually sorta used to it as Might & Magic II had one in the old Commodore days... a bit more combative than a rogue though.
I've often thought the assassin should have been a core class rather than a prestige class.
Shadowblade (Thief-Fighter Metaclass) is Thug, Assassin, Executioner, Bountyhunter.
Ninja is pretty much a cultural template you put over the top.
In my opinion if there is a ninja class it should be a more mystical one. The mundane ninja can be handled by the rogue.
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Fine: NINJA is a Cultural Template you put over Core Classes.
Rogue: The Ninja with a Sword and Bow and a lot of stealth and disguise.
Fighter: the Ninja with the Sword and just enough stealth to creep up on the PCs in a Band of fifty Ninja.
Magicuser: The Ninja with Autohit MAGIC MISSILE Shruiken, and a blowpipe used to dish out WEB and SLEEP.
Exactly!
Ninja is a Prestiege Class.
Ninja Scout is a PrC. Ninja is a base class from Dragon. And from Complete Adventurer. And from Rokugan d20. And probably from other sources.
If they ever make their own "oriental adventures" expansion to go with some Minkai adventures, they can make their own version of ninja (and shugenja, wu-jen, samurai, courtier, sohei, berserker,.... - maybe one variant for every base class, not even a full class, but a variant), but before that, I'm all for them doing other stuff first.
Until then, the rogue can do the ninja's work, and I think he'll do just fine. That rogue's an adabtable little bastard.
Yay! Gninjas!
I favor the prestige class idea, largely because it would allow for modeling the different types of ninja portrayed in legends, movies, and anime.
Some ninja are said to possess vast magical powers, some where spys and assassins, some where skilled bodyguards, and others were military scouts (and part of samurai families).
Different presitge classes would allow for monks, rangers, rogues, and sorcerers to fill the position of ninja, depending on the needs of a ninja family.
The rogue can already fill most of the roles a ninja has in many tales: spy, assassin, saboteur, scout...
The magical stuff, and maybe the yojimbo part, might require multiclassing.
But all in all I still say that unless they do something on the more orientally-flavoured parts of Golarion, a separate ninja class isn't that much of a concern (with more important stuff further up the list).
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In 2E there were 'ninja-curious' versions of the core classes called 'Shinobe' in The Complete Ninja's Handbook. The rogue works fine for the endless hordes of ninja cannon-fodder and the Prc's allow the ones who survived payin' their dues as sword and spell bait to specialize as assassins, spies or whatnot.
I hated the Dragon/Adventurer version with the exception of the 'Ki' concept. I liked the Rokugan version and even expanded on it by adding in the 'Ki' concept but I have no idea where in the Nine Hecks I put that build. The are a couple of really good ninja classes on the wizards boards as well as some well thought out explanations of what a ninja is or isn't and what place they had in Japanese society. It's good reading so check it out.
Peace, etc.
SM
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The new rogue pseudo-feat class abilities could probably cover any Ninja abilities in the future. Heck, they've even got light spell-like abilities that you can choose that can cover invisibility and such.
I don't see too much need to add Ninjas in right now either; there's enough other stuff to do, and it's not too hard to just swap some class features on the new Rogue to make your very own Ninja. ^_^