Oooh, I just can't resist a trivial debate about geeky topics like this. I feel like a character in a Judd Apatow movie.
First of all, they would be very difficult to keep covered in cold weather...a hat won't cut it...and therefore liable to frostbite.What about a woolen lined cloak with a woolen lined hood? Much like winter jackets today... who needs hats.
If they don't mind their hoods hanging six inches above the tops of their heads...
They'd also give an opponent in melee a tempting handle to grab onto and yank, or slice off with a sword.So do boobs and long hair.
Most women don't have breasts large enough to be useful as handholds in the heat of battle...and as for vulnerability, they're located right in the most well-defended part of a female fighter's body...right by her heart and vital organs, right between her weapon arm and shield arm.
As for long hair, hair usually hangs down against the body...if your opponent is in a position to cut your hair with his sword, he's probably also able to cut through your neck or arm. Also, getting your hair sliced won't result in debilitating pain, severe blood loss, or permanent disfigurement.
There are a lot of near misses in melee combat...avoiding a hit just by ducking or turning your head an inch or so in the nick of time. An elf would have to duck lower and turn further to avoid getting his ears hacked.
The real question is, why would the elves have evolved ears like that? What benefits do they gain from it? Hearing acuity would be a function of ear shape, not length. Do they vent excess body heat through their ears, like rabbits do?
Seems to me like the Golarion version of Charles Darwin has some explaining to do on this one.
|
Even though this is a thread about a dead subject. I've never really cared for long ears so I would vote for short ears. Except I absolutely love Merisiel as pictured here:
So if those are "Long Ears" then I guess I'm in the long ear crowd.
Now the only question that remains is: "Are the tips of the ears erogenous zones?"
-- Dennis
Creative Director
|
The real question is, why would the elves have evolved ears like that? What benefits do they gain from it? Hearing acuity would be a function of ear shape, not length. Do they vent excess body heat through their ears, like rabbits do?
Actually... elves being one of the more magically-infused races, it's easier to use the "it's magic" defense there. In other words... magic is a monkey-wrench in real-world things like evolution, and sometimes its effects are unpredictable. Pointed ears have long been used in fantasy games to denote "close to nature," so maybe just as someone with demonic blood in their lineage might have red eyes or vestigial horns, elves just have pointed ears because that's part of their lineage for being closely tied to nature (although elves aren't really fey creatures... like gnomes are... and gnomes don't have pointed ears... ).
That said... if there HAS to be a reason for elves to have evolved, my vote is that elves are more attracted to longer eared mates, and that more or less makes a self-fulfilling legacy as a result. So, what benefits do they gain from long ears? They get more dates!
|
Creative Director
|
Even though this is a thread about a dead subject. I've never really cared for long ears so I would vote for short ears. Except I absolutely love Merisiel as pictured here:
So if those are "Long Ears" then I guess I'm in the long ear crowd.
Now the only question that remains is: "Are the tips of the ears erogenous zones?"
-- Dennis
Merisiel and her ears and her eyes is pretty much "ground zero" on elves for Golarion. I try to make sure that our elves generally have long ears and big colorful (or dark) eyes like her but now and then (especially in the early days of Pathfinder) some elves slip through with ears that go more sideways and eyes that look more human. It's frustrating.
|
|
Merisiel and her ears and her eyes is pretty much "ground zero" on elves for Golarion. I try to make sure that our elves generally have long ears and big colorful (or dark) eyes like her but now and then (especially in the early days of Pathfinder) some elves slip through with ears that go more sideways and eyes that look more human. It's frustrating.
With the massive amount of art you guys commission I can understand some slipping by.
Incidentally I want to compliment you guys for having some of the best artwork in the community. Even more, I want to compliment you for sharing that artwork in a way that your fans can truly enjoy it. Posting nice print quality jpgs of your iconics and other art is awesome. Most companies with artwork like this hoard it and release tiny 500x400 pixel copies for their fans. I love your blog and all your great art there.
In fact your fan-friendly views regarding artwork and trusting your fans with DRM free PDFs is one of the things that drew me in to Paizo to begin with.
Thanks for being one of the most fan-friendly RPG companies in the market!
-- Dennis
So then does he have to do some splaining on every large pointy eared animal in nature, say dogs and horses?
Seems to me like the Golarion version of Charles Darwin has some explaining to do on this one.
Rabbits? They have a bit in common with elves, you know. They're both usually considered quite cute. ;-)
So then does he have to do some splaining on every large pointy eared animal in nature, say dogs and horses?
Seems to me like the Golarion version of Charles Darwin has some explaining to do on this one.
We already know the reasons why those animals have ears the way they do. My question about the elves was based on the length, not the pointiness.
That said... if there HAS to be a reason for elves to have evolved, my vote is that elves are more attracted to longer eared mates, and that more or less makes a self-fulfilling legacy as a result. So, what benefits do they gain from long ears? They get more dates!
I can picture the scene in a tavern in a cosmopolitan city...all the human males laughing at the comically long ears of the elf girls, and all the elf males laughing at the comically large breasts of the human girls.
|
|
We already know the reasons why those animals have ears the way they do. My question about the elves was based on the length, not the pointiness.
Large ears help with hearing and the shape helps locate the source of the sound. Elves stats reflect their better hearing.
The real question is why are human ears small when large ears are advantageous to survival?
-- Dennis
|
The question is now more or less past the point of no return. We've got an elf illustrated in Pathfinder #1. It's at the printer. She has long ears. They don't look like bunny ears to me, but they probably will to some folk. The vulcan ear look is pretty much reserved for our half elves, btw.
"Deedlit!!!"
I think the moderately long (Lodoss Style) ears of the Pathfinder elf in the 'Underwear Group Shot' of Alpha 3 looks fine.
-Uriel
Large ears help with hearing and the shape helps locate the source of the sound. Elves stats reflect their better hearing.
The real question is why are human ears small when large ears are advantageous to survival?
Beyond the first couple of inches, I don't see how the length of the ears would have any bearing on hearing. If it did, then we probably would have evolved ears like that.
I wonder...if you touch the two tips of an elf's ears together, do their brains short-circuit?
The real question is why are human ears small when large ears are advantageous to survival?
-- Dennis
Heh. I know this one. There are two reasons:
1) Larger ears are more directional than smaller ears. Since humans cannot control where their ears are pointing (The way, say, a housecat can), it is better to have mediocre hearing in all directions, rather than good hearing pointing one way and bad hearing everywhere else. It makes it harder to be snuck up upon, among other things.
2) There is an increased risk of injury to soft tissues with bigger ears. Once again, humans can't fold their ears out of the way when threatened, and a big ear does you no good if it is ripped off. This is especially true since humans tend to fight via grappling. Ears make good handles.
So why don't humans just have the ability to point their ears? Because our big brains force our ears to the sides, rather than top, of our heads.
I can picture the scene in a tavern in a cosmopolitan city...all the human males laughing at the comically long ears of the elf girls, and all the elf males laughing at the comically large breasts of the human girls.
In my hundreds of years of experience, the tavern scene usually goes something like this...
A group of dateless human men are laughing at the long pointy ears of the elven male. Meanwhile, the elven gentleman is doing their part to help increase the local half-elf population with the buxom human girls. |\~_^/|
|
|
I wonder...if you touch the two tips of an elf's ears together, do their brains short-circuit?
Well if the ears were that long I would rally against them. As it is you would have to cut the tips off if you wanted to touch them together.
@ Ross: That's cool, makes a lot of sense. So much for the whole evolutionary angle. Oh well, it is a fantasy game after all :)
-- Dennis
A group of dateless human men are laughing at the long pointy ears of the elven male. Meanwhile, the elven gentleman is doing their part to help increase the local half-elf population with the buxom human girls. |\~_^/|
So you've been to Korvosa.
|
|
In my hundreds of years of experience, the tavern scene usually goes something like this...
On the same site, I saw THIS...
...made me laugh.
2) There is an increased risk of injury to soft tissues with bigger ears. Once again, humans can't fold their ears out of the way when threatened, and a big ear does you no good if it is ripped off.The real question is why are human ears small when large ears are advantageous to survival?
-- Dennis
Big ears are usually not for hearing, but for temperature regulation.
Big ears are usually not for hearing, but for temperature regulation.
True for rabbits, elephants, and various other critters. But in cats, dogs, most rodents, bats, equines, and other creatures with pointed ears, there exist to more effectively channel sound.
Also for long ears.
Elves ears are erogenous zones. They like the twigs to brush their ears. Ever heard an elven druid talking about "nature's caress"? And that wasn't sap.
:D
|
|
Big ears are usually not for hearing, but for temperature regulation.
As has been pointed out it's for one or the other purpose, or in some animals both. Shaped ears channel sounds directionally. Ears as big as those in your avatar are probably that size for temperature regulation.
That's an interesting idea though, maybe arctic elves have much smaller ears while rain forest elves have large ears to help cooling. During the winter time they would likely flatten their ears against their head or wear hoods to keep the heat in.
-- Dennis
Elves ears are erogenous zones. They like the twigs to brush their ears. Ever heard an elven druid talking about "nature's caress"? And that wasn't sap.
:D
Ah, I see You managed to find a copy of the Quenya-Sutra. I was wondering where the copy I lost at Dragon*Con ended up...
True for rabbits, elephants, and various other critters. But in cats, dogs, most rodents, bats, equines, and other creatures with pointed ears, there exist to more effectively channel sound.
Big ears are usually not for hearing, but for temperature regulation.
But those I wouldn't call overly large.
I have no clue how they managed to make that idea look awesome... but there it is. Lucky Japanese gaming companies with their superhero concept artists (mutter mutter).
|
http://paizo.com/paizo/v5748eaic9l8v&source=rss
Floppy ears are in danger, see, she got one of her's cut off! :)
|
|
I don't particularly mind either way. Lodoss ears are fine, they are classic, but my internal vision of elves has always come down to something a little more slicked back along the head (long but angled back/up).
But really, nobody is forcing you to use these images - it has no in-game impact. Paizo could say that elves are flourescent purple and I wouldn't care (not that they would do something so egregious).
Funky, WoW-style loppy donkey-ears are an abomination that should be eradicated like a cancer.
I'm all for that. Anything that is taller then the top of the elf's head or sticks out more than an inch or two sideways is irritating though.
I do find it quite amusing that this thread is so ancient and the point long since decided by Paizo yet this thread lives on.
Funky, WoW-style loppy donkey-ears are an abomination that should be eradicated like a cancer.I'm all for that. Anything that is taller then the top of the elf's head or sticks out more than an inch or two sideways is irritating though.
I do find it quite amusing that this thread is so ancient and the point long since decided by Paizo yet this thread lives on.
I love the style in that pic btw and am happy paizo went that way
Like others here, as long as the ears don't look like they are used for steering purposes I'm indifferent....
I prefer short ears. Long anime-style long ears make me want to cry "MULE TRAIN!"
I loved the "alternate way" Merisiel was depicted, with a more fey-like style. Pinkish skin, large eyes, large pupils, shape of the face and, yes, ears. It might have been described as so before in other books, but there are not many illustrations that really give elves that "not-humans-with-pointy-ears"-look
Now... the elf in the Races section of Pathfinder Alpha... Ok, why make his ears that long? I know the style of the races illustration is quite anime, but Id rather not see something like that exactly where people go to figure out what this or that race looks like.
I showed the PDF to friends at work (all rpgers, all game designers, btw), and their first impression was exactly the same "Oh... their using anime elves..? Ug... Why dos everyone copies WoW now?")
So, yes, an elf can be very different from an human and a half-elf can be very different from both, as Wayne showed with Merisiel. We dont need excessively exaggerated ears... especially not in the "Races" section
|
I can picture the scene in a tavern in a cosmopolitan city...all the human males laughing at the comically long ears of the elf girls, and all the elf males laughing at the comically large breasts of the human girls.In my hundreds of years of experience, the tavern scene usually goes something like this...
A group of dateless human men are laughing at the long pointy ears of the elven male. Meanwhile, the elven gentleman is doing their part to help increase the local half-elf population with the buxom human girls. |\~_^/|
Actually the longer ears are great handles while producing half-elves.
Actually the longer ears are great handles while producing half-elves.I can picture the scene in a tavern in a cosmopolitan city...all the human males laughing at the comically long ears of the elf girls, and all the elf males laughing at the comically large breasts of the human girls.In my hundreds of years of experience, the tavern scene usually goes something like this...
A group of dateless human men are laughing at the long pointy ears of the elven male. Meanwhile, the elven gentleman is doing their part to help increase the local half-elf population with the buxom human girls. |\~_^/|
Correct all all accounts. I know. I sired a daughter with an elven woman.
Actually the longer ears are great handles while producing half-elves.
Even better than a dwarvess's beard!
I never got the floppy eared elf thing. They tend to live in woods... hunters. Not good for the move silent thing when your ears are getting snagged on low hanging twigs.
The ones in the Merisiel pic are ok. a little long for my tastes, but not too bad.
And yes! bring back bearded female dwarves!
Dude, that's just wrong.Even better than a dwarvess's beard!
Actually the longer ears are great handles while producing half-elves.
I knew it was a good idea to blow a feat on Craft Disturbing Mental Image :D
I never got the floppy eared elf thing. They tend to live in woods... hunters. Not good for the move silent thing when your ears are getting snagged on low hanging twigs.
They're stealthy even with the ears. They're that good.
Plus, Corellon/Calistria (whoever you prefer being in charge of elves) probably doesn't care about Darvin.
Which splat book is that in?
I knew it was a good idea to blow a feat on Craft Disturbing Mental Image :D
Isn't it in the core rules? It should be!
Calistria even has long ears if I remember right.
Calistria is basically elven, so she looks elven.
Long ears are bigger and sturdier, and so are easier to string on a necklace. On the other hand, they make the necklace bigger, bulkier, and more likely to interfere with swinging a greataxe in a rage.
So, it's pretty much a wash.