Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Bestiary 4 (OGL)

Statting overdeity like Cthulhu who is so powerful that the entire material plane is like a single fly is for a human as weak as an ordinary demigod seems really...inconsistent, to say the least. I suppose it could always just be an aspect of Cthulhu

You're thinking of the Outer Gods like Yog Sothoth. The Great Old ones are unkillable by normal mortals, but in a world like Golarion they might be killable by mythic heroes.

137ben wrote:

Statting overdeity like Cthulhu who is so powerful that the entire material plane is like a single fly is for a human as weak as an ordinary demigod seems really...inconsistent, to say the least. I suppose it could always just be an aspect of Cthulhu

You're thinking of the Outer Gods like Yog Sothoth. The Great Old ones are unkillable by normal mortals, but in a world like Golarion they might be killable by mythic heroes.

Gah, Lovecraft still confuses me after all these years...

Troodos wrote:

137ben wrote:

Statting overdeity like Cthulhu who is so powerful that the entire material plane is like a single fly is for a human as weak as an ordinary demigod seems really...inconsistent, to say the least. I suppose it could always just be an aspect of Cthulhu

You're thinking of the Outer Gods like Yog Sothoth. The Great Old ones are unkillable by normal mortals, but in a world like Golarion they might be killable by mythic heroes.

Gah, Lovecraft still confuses me after all these years...

but, "in a world like Golarion..." I thought this wasn't suppose to be a Golarion-specific book. Was I mistaken? Is this book going to be another pile of Golarion-fluff I can't use? That would basically guarantee that I wouldn't get it.
//tired in a grumpy mood.

No, it is going to be Golarion independent, but the Cthulhu mythos, like most forms of literature or mythology, evolved based on narrative needs, not the desire to make coherent mechanics. It seeks to tell stories, to evoke emotions, not to quantify or specify. As a result, any set of statistics for Cthulhu is a particular interpretation of his abilities, much like countless other creatures from mythology have been portrayed in ways quite different than their original appearances, for better or for worse. This is going to be a particular interpretation of Cthulhu as fits within the setting the developers are envisioning, where Cthulhu is indeed a mighty being, but not one as mighty as the gods, but rather on par with powerful demigods like archdevils, empyreal lords, demon lords, the four horsemen, and other such, while Azathoth, Nyarlathotep, Shub-Niggurath, and Yog-Sothoth are on par with the gods, though not beyond them.

I was never a huge Lovecraft buff, but to my knowledge, Cthulhu was portrayed in many different ways as the story demanded, but usually less than the Great Old Ones whom he desired to usher in and 'all the earth would flame with a holocaust of ecstasy and freedom'. I don't think he was described as being beyond the entire material plane, just powerful and alien and different, it's that we humans are small and insignificant and cannot grasp the true workings of the cosmos as these alien, indifferent creatures can. But I could be wrong. Like I said, not really an expert on Lovecraft's works.

Regardless, if you have a different set of statistics you prefer for Cthulhu, or prefer to keep him as a purely narrative force capable of doing whatever the narrative of your game needs him to, you are, of course, welcome to do so, just as you are to alter or expunge any other creature you don't feel has a place in your particular setting. I imagine there will be things you can use regardless. Everything in here, however, is going to be something that could exist in the setting Golarion takes place in, but most of it should be broadly applicable if you want said things and like the way Paizo made them.

Tirisfal wrote:

Undead!

Sayona, CR 12

Special Attacks absorb blood, blood drain (1d4 Con), fear cone (60 ft., DC 23), paralysis (1d4 rounds, DC 23), staggering gaze

Wait Sayona? Like, La Sayona?

If Megaru is like Godzilla, Agyra is like Mothra, then what Godzilla monster do you hope Bezravnis is like?

Statting overdeity like Cthulhu who is so powerful that the entire material plane is like a single fly is for a human as weak as an ordinary demigod seems really...inconsistent, to say the least. I suppose it could always just be an aspect of Cthulhu

Cthulhu isn't a god. Both in Lovecraft's works and in the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, Cthulhu is very much a physical creature who dwells upon the Material Plane. Golarion actually assumes that Cthulhu is sleeping in the Pacific Oceans on Earth, exactly where Lovecraft says he is in The Call of Cthulhu.

Lovecraft actually calls Cthulhu a "priest of the Outer Gods" in his writings. The Outer Gods are beings like Yog-Sothoth, Nylarotep, and Azathoth. In this regard, Cthulhu's power level is akin to a Demon Lord or an Empyreal Lord. If you note his entry in Inner Sea World Guide, he only grants four domains, which is typical of Empyreal Lords, Demon Lords, and Archdevils.

Gah, Lovecraft still confuses me after all these years...

but, "in a world like Golarion..." I thought this wasn't suppose to be a Golarion-specific book. Was I mistaken? Is this book going to be another pile of Golarion-fluff I can't use? That would basically guarantee that I wouldn't get it.
//tired in a grumpy mood.

I'm having a hard time understanding your logic here. First, the posted said "in a world like Golarion, implying that this book was not Golarion, but similar to it. So no, you're not mistaken, but "Golarion-fluff that you can't use" has been in the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game core rules line for years. Their gods are mentioned in the Core Rulebook, Advanced Player's Guide, and in Ultimate Magic, easily one-fifth of the monsters found in every Bestiary prior to this one are reprinted from Golarion Adventure Paths, and almost all of the races found in the Uncommon section of the Advanced Race Guide had their start in Golarion-exclusive books.

I'm not going to judge how you spend your money, but if you are ignoring game crunch on the grounds that its part of a different product line than the Core Rules, you're seriously missing out. Off the top of my head, the Pathfinder Society Field Guide has paid for itself at least ten times over for the number of times I've used the Lore Warden archetype and the Comfort and Dueling magic item abilities.

I was never a huge Lovecraft buff, but to my knowledge, Cthulhu was portrayed in many different ways as the story demanded, but usually less than the Great Old Ones whom he desired to usher in and 'all the earth would flame with a holocaust of ecstasy and...

Actually, as Lovecraft wrote it, the Great Old Ones were simply Cthulhu's race (ie, the Star Spawn). They didn't become the eclectic group of demigod level aliens until other authors started adding to the Mythos.

And in Lovecraft's writing, it's pretty clear that Cthulhu is only a mid-level power. They warred against the Elder Things, and only to a stalemate.

If Megaru is like Godzilla, Agyra is like Mothra, then what Godzilla monster do you hope Bezravnis is like?

I really hope Bez is King Ghidorah. That'd be so cool!

Based on the illustration on page 37 of Mythic Realms, I figured King Mogaru was King Kong.

King Kong's "merely" gargantuan or so. He's big, but he ain't Kaiju big.

King Kong's "merely" gargantuan or so. He's big, but he ain't Kaiju big.

Well it depends. He was significantly bigger in Godzilla vs King Kong. Also, admittedly, Godzilla has grown in size since his debut a long time ago.

Zhangar wrote:

King Kong's "merely" gargantuan or so. He's big, but he ain't Kaiju big.

Well it depends. He was significantly bigger in Godzilla vs King Kong. Also, admittedly, Godzilla has grown in size since his debut a long time ago.

Hell, Toho turned Frankenstein's Monster into a kaiju at one point. ;)

He was significantly bigger in Godzilla vs King Kong.

If he hadn't been, it would have been a very short movie.

Whether or not King Mogaru is a giant gorilla, there is, in fact, a giant gorilla kaiju. And given the whole "king" thing, it fits.

Vildeis

shudders and clutches his shoulders

I am not so certain most are prepared to see Her Ruined Countenance. The Saint of the Screaming Shadow is going to be difficult for even the most devout to witness.

She...is frightening. Some will look upon Her bloodied form an pull away, but it is the reason for Her state that weighs upon you. It is both humbling and horrifying.

Those who seek and strive to do good, from the peasant to the archangel, do what they can and they still reach limits in what they can do. At some point, each of us must find rest, some solace, even as we know that there are those who still need our help. These limitations are imposed upon us in order to preserve our flesh and sanity.

But She... She was so appalled by the mere existence of evil that She gouged out Her eyes. And even then Her boundless empathy would not let Her find refuge from the universe. So long as even one soul in reality suffers, She suffers in kind. And She must, because if She turned away even for a moment to find solace and comfort in the heart of Paradise, Her sanity would be shattered.

And not one of Heaven's angels can comfort Her. She will not allow it. She cannot allow it.

unknowingly sheds tears

How small our troubles and sacrifices seem when faced with the suffering of the Sacred Martyr. So terrible to behold, when Her blind gaze and ragged voice remind us that no matter what we have done in the name of Good, perhaps we should be doing so much more than we are. So much more.

Is it too late to submit requests for the Bestiary 4? Because I am hoping for more Tarn and Qlippoth.

>Is it too late to submit requests for the Bestiary 4? Because I am hoping for more Tarn and Qlippoth.

yeah, way too late. Maybe Bestiary 5?

I'm a bit confused about Cernunnos. He's not expanded in Chronicles of the Righteous, except a minor excerpt in the back about being a lesser empyreal lord. Yet, he's a higher CR than Korada and Vildeis. Is he just a "lesser lord" in that he doesn't have a large group of worshipers?

I'm a bit confused about Cernunnos. He's not expanded in Chronicles of the Righteous, except a minor excerpt in the back about being a lesser empyreal lord. Yet, he's a higher CR than Korada and Vildeis. Is he just a "lesser lord" in that he doesn't have a large group of worshipers?

Well, based on the descriptive text, "lesser empyreal lord" is more a statement on how well known they are on the Material Plane. Cernunnos must be one of those who "focus on their divine duties and rarely receive notice on other planes." He's an azata also known as the Stag Lord who indulges his fiery passions, so from that we can infer... pretty much nothing at all. Hmm.

I wish they said something about the Elohim.

I am really happy that we will be getting Fomorians, plus Formians but already knew about them. I wonder if they are going to make Fomorians to be fey, giant, monstrous humanoid, etc..

I would like Bezravnis to be like Hedorah(the Smog Monster).

Also the store blog for Bestiary 4 mentions Qallupilluks, Snallygasters, Fomorian Titan, Soulbound Mannequins, Junk Golems, 13 new templates, and 20+ creatures with mythic power.

Oh man, Hedorah would be awesome. Though they'd have to change up the pollution part a bit since Golarion isn't really industrial. Still, I approve of this!

Can't wait for the pdf. I don't get too many books as they take up too much room.
BTW, love The Nightmare Before Christmas references from This Is Halloween... my favorite song from the movie (and of course loved Marilyn Manson's cover)

I wish they said something about the Elohim.

I am really happy that we will be getting Fomorians, plus Formians but already knew about them. I wonder if they are going to make Fomorians to be fey, giant, monstrous humanoid, etc..

I would like Bezravnis to be like Hedorah(the Smog Monster).

Also the store blog for Bestiary 4 mentions Qallupilluks, Snallygasters, Fomorian Titan, Soulbound Mannequins, Junk Golems, 13 new templates, and 20+ creatures with mythic power.

With you on Elohim.

Now which ones are the Formians and Formorians? I believe one of them is the conquering ant people from 3.5 but I cannot remember which one and I have no clue who the second one is.

Bezravnis makes me think Anguiris expy...but a part of me also kinda hopes it's Gamera.

Fomorian Titan? Oh man, it sounds like they used my idea for fomorians!!

*stoked face*

Dragon78 wrote:

I wish they said something about the Elohim.

I am really happy that we will be getting Fomorians, plus Formians but already knew about them. I wonder if they are going to make Fomorians to be fey, giant, monstrous humanoid, etc..

I would like Bezravnis to be like Hedorah(the Smog Monster).

Also the store blog for Bestiary 4 mentions Qallupilluks, Snallygasters, Fomorian Titan, Soulbound Mannequins, Junk Golems, 13 new templates, and 20+ creatures with mythic power.

With you on Elohim.

Now which ones are the Formians and Formorians? I believe one of them is the conquering ant people from 3.5 but I cannot remember which one and I have no clue who the second one is.

Formians were the ant people.

Fomorians were the ugly fey giants from the Feywild.

Dragon78 wrote:

If Megaru is like Godzilla, Agyra is like Mothra, then what Godzilla monster do you hope Bezravnis is like?

I really hope Bez is King Ghidorah. That'd be so cool!

Exactly what I was thinking/hoping.

If not, then Gigan, Biolantte (either form, though I prefer the monstrous one over the flower, or with the ability to shift back and forth), Bagan, or Destoroyah.

I'd be down with Biolantte. Something unique from the classic giant reptile would be cool. Between those three and the Star Titan in Mythic Realms, I may want to run a Kaiju game.

doc the grey wrote:

Dragon78 wrote:

I wish they said something about the Elohim.

I am really happy that we will be getting Fomorians, plus Formians but already knew about them. I wonder if they are going to make Fomorians to be fey, giant, monstrous humanoid, etc..

I would like Bezravnis to be like Hedorah(the Smog Monster).

Also the store blog for Bestiary 4 mentions Qallupilluks, Snallygasters, Fomorian Titan, Soulbound Mannequins, Junk Golems, 13 new templates, and 20+ creatures with mythic power.

With you on Elohim.

Now which ones are the Formians and Formorians? I believe one of them is the conquering ant people from 3.5 but I cannot remember which one and I have no clue who the second one is.

Formians were the ant people.

Fomorians were the ugly fey giants from the Feywild.

Ohh god those dudes?! Awesome! I loved those horrible hunchbacks from MM2 back in the day and I'm totally down to get them back.

Liiiiiiiiiiiiz!

I just checked my online banking and it appears that my "transaction pending" notification for this book has vanished! As in, my account isn't recognizing that Paizo wants my money! What gives!?

Really glad to see the Formians will be included, as they are all over the plane of Law, but we haven't seen the Pathfinder version yet.

Odraude wrote:

Dragon78 wrote:

If Megaru is like Godzilla, Agyra is like Mothra, then what Godzilla monster do you hope Bezravnis is like?

I really hope Bez is King Ghidorah. That'd be so cool!

Exactly what I was thinking/hoping.

If not, then Gigan, Biolantte (either form, though I prefer the monstrous one over the flower, or with the ability to shift back and forth), Bagan, or Destoroyah.

My guess on those 3 are

1. Godzilla
2. Mothra
3. King Kong

They are some of the most iconic kaiju creatures (kong is small but he counts and considering his size compared to Godzilla in both their original movies and kongs lack of sequels his size tracks pretty well). On top of that I know that there are posts here of one of the editors liking mothra so I think that rounds out the team.

That being said my second string of monster guesses would probably be Gigan, King Ghidorah, or an Angilus/Gamorah expy as they are probably the next most iconic after those 3.

Really glad to see the Formians will be included, as they are all over the plane of Law, but we haven't seen the Pathfinder version yet.

From what I remember they aren't associated directly with the planes anymore and instead are more focused on the conquering portion of their portfolio. That being said I think they are still outsiders.

Guang wrote:

Really glad to see the Formians will be included, as they are all over the plane of Law, but we haven't seen the Pathfinder version yet.

From what I remember they aren't associated directly with the planes anymore and instead are more focused on the conquering portion of their portfolio. That being said I think they are still outsiders.

The Pathfinder Formians are basically giant, alien ant monsters. I can't remember which novel that they draw inspiration from, but I'm almost certain that they're either monstrous humanoids or magical beasts now. Leaning towards the former. James Jacobs commented on it a while ago.

Liiiiiiiiiiiiz!

I just checked my online banking and it appears that my "transaction pending" notification for this book has vanished! As in, my account isn't recognizing that Paizo wants my money! What gives!?

Yeah, same with me. It happens each month. Chances are, you aren't getting it today.

From The Great Beyond:
"Axis: The plane of unyielding law, the perfect city of Axis is home to the mathematics-obsessed Axiomites, the underground kingdoms and floating hives of Formians, and numerous gods of law."

Is this being superseded with the B4 then? Dare I hope for an updated cosmology sourcebook?

Formians live there, but they are not native to there, nor are they only there.

So the Great Beyond book is correct, but not exclusively so.

Formians live there, but they are not native to there, nor are they only there.

So the Great Beyond book is correct, but not exclusively so.

This.

Also does anyone know if they are shipping today? Or has anyone gotten their copy yet?

I'd be down with Biolantte. Something unique from the classic giant reptile would be cool. Between those three and the Star Titan in Mythic Realms, I may want to run a Kaiju game.

I predict once we have the book out, 90% of Godzilla movie monsters will be statted in the Homebrew forum within a couple of weeks.

Formians are now aliens from Castrovel. I'm cool with that honestly.

Formians are now aliens from Castrovel. I'm cool with that honestly.

Very nice. Would love to have a Castrovel sourcebook too.

Odraude wrote:

Formians are now aliens from Castrovel. I'm cool with that honestly.

Very nice. Would love to have a Castrovel sourcebook too.

You and me both. Or at least a 256-page expansion on Distant Worlds :D

Wasn't the Great Beyond book still in 3.5. Regardless we do need an updated hardcover for this book one day.

I wouldn't mind the third Kaiju to be Biolantte, Gigan, Rodan, Baragon, or Anguiris. I would think that King Ghidorah would be a CR29-30 Kaiju. I am not a fan of Gamera but whatever floats your boat.

I would love a source book for Castrovel and we might get it one day.

Didn't anyone notice that were getting 13 templates?

Wasn't the Great Beyond book still in 3.5. Regardless we do need an updated hardcover for this book one day.

I wouldn't mind the third Kaiju to be Biolantte, Gigan, Rodan, Baragon, or Anguiris. I would think that King Ghidorah would be a CR29-30 Kaiju. I am not a fan of Gamera but whatever floats your boat.

I would love a source book for Castrovel and we might get it one day.

Didn't anyone notice that were getting 13 templates?

I definitely noticed. I think one is for the body snatchers. I hope one is something akin to the Living Spell template.

I definitely noticed the 13 templates, and really look forward to seeing what they are. I love templates because players almost always know what something is, and adding on a template and saying the creature did something different, and the player saying "That creature can't do that!" always puts a smile on my face.

Anything that messes with a player's knowledge of monsters is always a good thing, in my opinion. Especially when the player inserts his knowledge on something into his character's knowledge. Always annoys me.

Well we know about the templates of nosferatu, shadow, mummified, divine guardian, and fungel creature.

Any new Inevitable or LN outsider?

I'm happy Jinmenju and Qallipallik are in the book! But nobody cares about those probably.

I'm happy Jinmenju and Qallipallik are in the book! But nobody cares about those probably.

You mean a horrible goblin fish monster that tempts people to the waters edge, drowns them, and then turns them into its monster babies? No... noone wants to use that thing...

Trust me, I have just as many plans for the new world monsters as I do for the modern ones, and I'm sure I am not the only one.

I would have been tempted to buy it, but then you went and made a Nightmare Before Christmas reference. Now I damn well have to buy it.